how can you be sure that the devil is evil and the bible is correct?

[Ken-1122]

The only way to know if a textbook has the right information is to STUDY it.

Are you kidding me? I can study the book "Tom Sayer" all day long, the only thing I will accomplish is becomming an expert on the story of Tom Sayer; as far as if there is any truth to the story I will have to use an outside source to confirm that.

I study the Bible. And I, not another book or another man; it is I, who confirm the Bible. It is MY business. I don't really care who says what about it

You know; if that is your standard for determining the truth, that's fine! I ain't trying to take that away from you; but don't expect that standard to work for everyone else.

Ken

 

[ThinkForYourself]

God == Good == True

The above is a definition.
...

God == Good is a definition?

Not unless you think murdering children is good.

 

[elliott95]

....

 

[KWCrazy]

If only most atheists were so passionate as to oppose the murder of 50 million American babies in the last generation.

They see nothing wrong with the murder of 3,500 babies per day in America and think we should pay for infanticide throughout the world.

 

[ThinkForYourself]

If only most atheists were so passionate as to oppose the murder of 50 million American babies in the last generation.

If you are against murdering babies, would you agree that God does not equal Good by definition, as juvenissun posited?

 

[elliott95]

....

 

[elliott95]

....

 

[ThinkForYourself]

I am most certainly in favor of throwing any biblical interpretation that posits God as a murderer of babies under the bus. Images of God sucking the flesh off of babies and using their bones as toothpicks are in my mind as evil as they are for most people.

...

God murdered a lot of babies when he flooded the earth.

God also murdered a lot of babies when he killed all the first born in Egypt.

This isn't interpretation, this is what is written in the bible.

 

[elliott95]

....

 

[ThinkForYourself]

The Bible is a written work, expressed in words. All words are subject to interpretation. For words are symbolic expressions, and as such must be interpreted.
The Bible is a spiritual work, and God is not Joe Blow who lives down the street according to any interpretation.
As well, God is the author of life and death, and creator of all things visible and invisible. He alone has the full picture of what is the ultimate fate of the innocent.
Nothing, absolutely nothing written in the Bible is laid out in plain sight. Everything becomes visible only after years of search, struggle, and striviing.

You come up with your superficial reading of the Bible, and demand to know if we reject God as a murderer of innocent children. My answer is yes, if that is the only fact that we know about God, then yes, we must reject that depiction of God as a monster who sucks the flesh off of babies and gleefully uses their bones for toothpicks as a depiction of horrific evil.

But I also left you with a question, and it has remained unanswered. Is the soulless murder of innocents really an issue with most atheists, or you in particular? Or is it just a talking point that you use against God?

I fully agree that if the image of God as a murderer is the only interpretation that an atheist can authentically come up with about God, then the moral thing to do is to reject that as God. I think that you are correct to see that there is something evil about that. This is not the conclusion that I draw from the Bible, and if it was, then I would likewise reject it. Instead, I think it is a superficial understanding, and look deeper. If there were no deeper answers, then I concur that this is not the image of goodness.
For murdering of innocent babies is always a bad thing, right?

Alrighty then.

The text seems very clear in the following passages. God kills, or instructs to kill, babies.

Please give an interpretation where that is not what is said:

Numbers:
15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the Lord in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the Lord’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

Exodus:
4 So Moses said, “This is what the Lord says: ‘About midnight I will go throughout Egypt. 5 Every firstborn son in Egypt will die, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sits on the throne, to the firstborn son of the female slave, who is at her hand mill, and all the firstborn of the cattle as well.

=====================

As for your comments on the abortion issue: I don't see the anti-abortion American Christians lining up demanding health care for all children. Children die in the USA because they don't get proper healthcare.

 

[juvenissun]

Are you kidding me? I can study the book "Tom Sayer" all day long, the only thing I will accomplish is becomming an expert on the story of Tom Sayer; as far as if there is any truth to the story I will have to use an outside source to confirm that.

You know; if that is your standard for determining the truth, that's fine! I ain't trying to take that away from you; but don't expect that standard to work for everyone else.

Ken

You trust others more than trust yourself. No wonder you can not tell good from bad.

 

[juvenissun]

God == Good is a definition?

Not unless you think murdering children is good.

Here it goes again. What murder are you talking about?

 

[juvenissun]

God murdered a lot of babies when he flooded the earth.

God also murdered a lot of babies when he killed all the first born in Egypt.

This isn't interpretation, this is what is written in the bible.

They are not murders. It is simply "kill", for excellent purposes. God is doing "good" things. Every human beings should thanks God for that.

 

[juvenissun]

Alrighty then.

The text seems very clear in the following passages. God kills, or instructs to kill, babies.

Please give an interpretation where that is not what is said:

Numbers:
15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the Lord in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the Lord’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

Exodus:
4 So Moses said, “This is what the Lord says: ‘About midnight I will go throughout Egypt. 5 Every firstborn son in Egypt will die, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sits on the throne, to the firstborn son of the female slave, who is at her hand mill, and all the firstborn of the cattle as well.

Do you understand why would God allow that to take place?
Please say you don't.

 

[Ken-1122]

If only most atheists were so passionate as to oppose the murder of 50 million American babies in the last generation.

You need to realize, not all Christians are like you, there are Christians on both sides of the abortion debate; as are there atheists.

Ken

 

[Ken-1122]

You trust others more than trust yourself. .

I didn't say that, I said in order to confirm the truth of a book, you need an outside source; something other than that book. Do you agree?

Ken

 

[Ken-1122]

Do you understand why would God allow that to take place?
Please say you don't.

Are you seriously trying to justify the atrocities of Moses? Didn't one of his own commandments say "Thou shalt not kill"???

Ken

 

[KWCrazy]

Are you seriously trying to justify the atrocities of Moses? Didn't one of his own commandments say "Thou shalt not kill"???

Moses only killed one person, and for that he was never allowed to enter the promised land.

The wages of sin are death, and the the sins of the pharaoh resulted in the death of the firstborn of Egypt. It was perfectly justified. The Lord who gives life also takes it way. From dust we come, and to dust we return.

 

[Ken-1122]

Moses only killed one person, and for that he was never allowed to enter the promised land.

The wages of sin are death, and the the sins of the pharaoh resulted in the death of the firstborn of Egypt. It was perfectly justified. The Lord who gives life also takes it way. From dust we come, and to dust we return.

He had his army slaughter the surrendering Midinites during war; women, children and all.

Ken

 

[ThinkForYourself]

Do you understand why would God allow that to take place?
Please say you don't.

No. No I don't. He could have blinked everything to perfection without killing.

But he chose not to, even though one of his commandments is Thou Shall Not Kill. Why did he choose the path of maximum violence and murder?

Also, you said it was impossible for God to order you kill someone because it would be against his commandment. Why was it OK for God to order Moses to kill against his commandment?