Putting gifts under an xmas tree is idolatry

[timewerx]

Please read:

Hebrew Roots/Neglected Commandments/Idolatry/Christmas trees - Wikibooks, open books for an open world

 

[Der Alte]

Please read:

Hebrew Roots/Neglected Commandments/Idolatry/Christmas trees - Wikibooks, open books for an open world

Your premise is nonsense and your source, Wiki is about as reliable as the graffiti scribbled on public facility walls. Every article at Wiki has multiple [Edit] links, anybody can change or post anything, at any time without review or control. I have done it several times to prove it can be done. Find a credible source and quote a paragraph or two you think is relevant and I will discuss it with you.

 

[apache1]

Please read:

Hebrew Roots/Neglected Commandments/Idolatry/Christmas trees - Wikibooks, open books for an open world

I like Christmas trees, and oh by gosh by golly, it's time for mistletoe and holly. P.S. A Christmas tree beats the hell out of a "holiday" tree, I hate worthless p.c. crap.

 

[apache1]

Instead of worrying what how pagan the tree or the presents are, I worry more about whether going to get Fraser fir, Douglas fir, spruce, or pine (cedar Christmas trees suck ) (I like live trees, though the new funky fiberoptic trees are cool), and the type of present I would like under tree is Betty Page (oh wait, I'm married, and my wife is gonna bonk me over head with skillet for that one).

 

[apache1]

Instead of worrying what how pagan the tree or the presents are, I worry more about whether going to get Fraser fir, Douglas fir, spruce, or pine (cedar Christmas trees suck ) (I like live trees, though the new funky fiberoptic trees are cool), and the type of present I would like under tree is Betty Page (oh wait, I'm married, and my wife is gonna bonk me over head with skillet for that one).

I guess thinking about Betty Page falls under adultery (at least with mind) as well as idolatry. I suppose if my wife found me with Betty Page under the tree (or anywhere) I would have to "Klaw" my way out.

 

[Der Alte]

I guess thinking about Betty Page falls under adultery (at least with mind) as well as idolatry. I suppose if my wife found me with Betty Page under the tree (or anywhere) I would have to "Klaw" my way out.

Unlike you, I'm of an age that, if that happened to me, I would have to figure out what to do. Kinda like the dog chasing a car, after he's caught it, what does he do with it?

 

[DrBubbaLove]

Probably knaw (or gum) on those.........oh never mind. Confession starts at 1500 Saturday.

 

[Phantasman]

I guess thinking about Betty Page falls under adultery (at least with mind) as well as idolatry. I suppose if my wife found me with Betty Page under the tree (or anywhere) I would have to "Klaw" my way out.

LOL...............Betty Page. (gift or fantasy?)

When I worked for a certain company, they gave out Christmas bonuses at the end of the year. My check would say "Christmas gift" and I accepted the check in the spirit it was given. My Jehovah Witness friend made them say "end of year bonus" when writing the check, as he didn't believe in Christmas. Maybe it made him feel better. But I see no difference. He wouldn't give up the money though.

It's all perception.

 

[Dusky Mouse]

Romans 14:5-6One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God

The gifts people put under the tree are symbolic of what was given Jesus the day he was born. So that he and his family could take the bounty and survive all the years until he was a man so as to begin his ministry.

Wiki doesn't speak for Christianity. And Christmas tree's and gifts do not speak to idolatry.

​

 

[Unix]

I would think most people on CF are brainwashed to like Christmas. I'm not going to celebrate it. The only decoration I have is as flat white "tree" silhouette with leds that cost a few $ which I bought a year ago at IKEA clearance sale. I'm not going to make any particular food. Not going to give gifts - nor receive. The only gift (from my parents but I don't know whether they are aware/remember that I wish for that) I would accept would be a pair of long underpants.
I'm not going to meet anyone during all of December, except my best friend, a new friend, plus another friend. But not during Christmas and most probably I'm not going to meet them at New Year and I'm not going to be the one asking.

 

[Der Alte]

I would think most people on CF are brainwashed to like Christmas. I'm not going to celebrate it. The only decoration I have is as flat white "tree" silhouette with leds that cost a few $ which I bought a year ago at IKEA clearance sale. I'm not going to make any particular food. Not going to give gifts - nor receive. The only gift (from my parents but I don't know whether they are aware/remember that I wish for that) I would accept would be a pair of long underpants.
I'm not going to meet anyone during all of December, except my best friend, a new friend, plus another friend. But not during Christmas and most probably I'm not going to meet them at New Year and I'm not going to be the one asking.

I disagree with your views but I'm not going to insult you by accusing you of being brainwashed, or some other insult.

 

[apache1]

LOL...............Betty Page. (gift or fantasy?)

When I worked for a certain company, they gave out Christmas bonuses at the end of the year. My check would say "Christmas gift" and I accepted the check in the spirit it was given. My Jehovah Witness friend made them say "end of year bonus" when writing the check, as he didn't believe in Christmas. Maybe it made him feel better. But I see no difference. He wouldn't give up the money though.

It's all perception.

Man, she was one classy lady in her day! My favorite old-school pin-up! By the way, I see you're from Tennessee. I read in a biography about her, she was from Kingsport in East Tennessee, although Wikipedia has Betty being born in Nashville. At any rate, good lookin', well built corn-fed country gal, not some skinny minnie that makes Twiggy or Kate Moss look obese. I also read she even later on became a born-again Christian and worked for Billy Graham Ministries! Talk about variety in her life (from working for Irving Klaw to Billy Graham).

 

[timewerx]

Romans 14:5-6One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. The one who observes the day, observes it in honor of the Lord. The one who eats, eats in honor of the Lord, since he gives thanks to God, while the one who abstains, abstains in honor of the Lord and gives thanks to God

The gifts people put under the tree are symbolic of what was given Jesus the day he was born. So that he and his family could take the bounty and survive all the years until he was a man so as to begin his ministry.

I'll have to point out you are quoting from one of the Epistles of Paul.

We've discussed quite recently about contradictions in the Bible and about Paul being possibly a counterfeit apostle.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7790537-2/#post64600120

There's tons of info regarding that subject matter. And yes, I believe Paul or at least many of his teachings are counterfeit/false gospel.

I did not just based my belief on logical conclusion with information available (including those in the Bible) but also based in real life applications and of my experiences with God's power. The teachings of Paul many of them has flawed logic - probably heavily influenced by human nature/animal instincts and just can't keep up with the manifestation of God's power.

That's another reason I don't pay attention to any worldly traditions, nothing comes close to what I'm getting from God!

 

[Unix]

timewerx, I pretty much disagree regarding Paul!

Regarding Christmas I think it's rude to celebrate it because it's a withdrawal from the world and reality. In reality You don't wait for a "special" day to give something or celebrate. Gathering with family (which is the tradition over here) resembles Jewishness and is a part of the withdrawal. In reality the relationship between parents and their children is much more like everyday life.

 

[timewerx]

Regarding Christmas I think it's rude to celebrate it because it's a withdrawal from the world and reality. In reality You don't wait for a "special" day to give something or celebrate. Gathering with family (which is the tradition over here) resembles Jewishness and is a part of the withdrawal. In reality the relationship between parents and their children is much more like everyday life.

I could only speak for myself and what you said is also my sentiment on worldly traditions!

With all the wonders God is showing me, why would I even observe things that are far inferior?

I'm not trying to mock those who cannot see God on a more intimate level. I'm just trying to show how you can catch God's attention base on my experience.

And based on my experience, I seemed to have caught God's attention when I stopped paying reverence to the ways of the world. And I mean that absolutely not just in my mind. I've lost a lot of friends, lost the love of relatives....

....I'm really dumbfounded how could people, Christians even would choose the ways of the world and the love of the world over God and His provisions like His love and attention, never getting sick (which frees me up from medical expenses/insurance), renewing my body in near perfect condition (my eyes restored to 20/20 vision, all bones restored, no more aching), able to have visions on a daily basis, have contentment like no other, the list goes on, some I won't share here - I'll leave that as a mystery to anyone who'll esteem God's ways over the ways of this world.

 

[Phantasman]

Is it not necessary for all those who possess everything to know themselves? Some indeed, if they do not know themselves, will not enjoy what they possess. But those who have come to know themselves will enjoy their possessions.-Gospel of Philip

Know yourself first, and through the anointing you will realize that possessions are where you put them. To use the parable of Jesus and rich man to tell people they must be poor, isn't correct, IMO.

One can have possessions and enjoy them, if he see's them as just that and they are thankful to God first for providing them. Some are just thankful for two eyes, while another is a mother that has a van that takes her five children to church.

Perception.

 

[timewerx]

One can have possessions and enjoy them, if he see's them as just that and they are thankful to God first for providing them. Some are just thankful for two eyes, while another is a mother that has a van that takes her five children to church.

Perception.

What if the he or she loses their possessions, what if one loses both their eyes, what if that mother loses her van?

I'm not trying to sound clever here. It actually happened to me. I was renting this little room, I had a cheap, old, tiny car, and a few things of very little value. There's quite a lot of people in my age and educational background that would hate to be in my situation and yet, I am very happy and content with my little room, my little old car and my few things.

But then my situation went for the worse, I had to sell my little old car, had to leave my room.. I was devastated....

....But I realized it was God finally teaching me about His Word. The things of worth against the things of no worth which could be blinding us to things of worth. To make the story short that was also the beginning of finally seeing the God's power in my life. My body practically restored to youth. I had back pains for years, imperfect vision, digestive issues for years too, all gone... Interestingly, I did not even have to pray/ask for healing. I was restored for simply trying to seek the Truth, to seek God.

 

[Phantasman]

Man, she was one classy lady in her day! My favorite old-school pin-up! By the way, I see you're from Tennessee. I read in a biography about her, she was from Kingsport in East Tennessee, although Wikipedia has Betty being born in Nashville. At any rate, good lookin', well built corn-fed country gal, not some skinny minnie that makes Twiggy or Kate Moss look obese. I also read she even later on became a born-again Christian and worked for Billy Graham Ministries! Talk about variety in her life (from working for Irving Klaw to Billy Graham).

I live about 25 miles from Kingsport (used to live there and Johnson City).

I also used to do work at Billy Grahams place in Montreat (Black Mountain, NC). Installed security systems there. Never met Brother Graham, though.

One thing I like about our area..........the ten commandments still appear in our courthouses, and the people (mostly conservative) still don't bow to the special interests that attempt to take God away from them. Everyone still (with emphasis) says Merry Christmas and aren't concerned about someone taking their guns away. And rarely does the Tricities have a murder, and when they do, it involves drinking and/or a family feud.

 

[Phantasman]

What if the he or she loses their possessions, what if one loses both their eyes, what if that mother loses her van?

I'm not trying to sound clever here. It actually happened to me. I was renting this little room, I had a cheap, old, tiny car, and a few things of very little value. There's quite a lot of people in my age and educational background that would hate to be in my situation and yet, I am very happy and content with my little room, my little old car and my few things.

But then my situation went for the worse, I had to sell my little old car, had to leave my room.. I was devastated....

....But I realized it was God finally teaching me about His Word. The things of worth against the things of no worth which could be blinding us to things of worth. To make the story short that was also the beginning of finally seeing the God's power in my life. My body practically restored to youth. I had back pains for years, imperfect vision, digestive issues for years too, all gone... Interestingly, I did not even have to pray/ask for healing. I was restored for simply trying to seek the Truth, to seek God.

Again, it's perception to you of your situation. I don't know your WHOLE story, just what you say. I have a 2010 Rogue. I live in a nice double wide (rented) and have worked hard all my life, never taking a penny from others. My health (for 63) is excellent, and only been in a hospital twice (once at 5 for polio).

But I have been in the beautiful house on the lake with 3 cars, a 28ft boat and camper as well. I also slept in my car for 6 months when I was 18 years old.

Peaks and valleys. In any case, the Lord was number one. But I never heard him say "live in the valleys". We enjoy what comes from God and understand when he takes it away or gives it freely.

I thank God for what I have every day, whether in the old car at 18, or the house on the lake. And I don't blame him if I lose something, like he's trying to teach me a lesson. I simply see him first and accept where I am because of it. As it may change, but my love for him doesn't.

 

[timewerx]

Peaks and valleys. In any case, the Lord was number one. But I never heard him say "live in the valleys". We enjoy what comes from God and understand when he takes it away or gives it freely.

Not what I meant. I actually don't consider poverty a valley.

You keep saying about perception. I actually used to think a lot like you. But God taught me not to put value in material things big or small. As if to treat things like the ground I'm stepping on or the gravity that's holding me down to the ground. I have gained a lot more through obedience.

What I've gained is not in material but some of the things Jesus promised.