the unpardonable sin

[Bluelion]

Please read the passages in question again.

"But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
2 And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet.
3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.
6 And the young men arose, wound him up, and carried him out, and buried him.
7 And it was about the space of three hours after, when his wife, not knowing what was done, came in.
8 And Peter answered unto her, Tell me whether ye sold the land for so much? And she said, Yea, for so much.
9 Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord? behold, the feet of them which have buried thy husband are at the door, and shall carry thee out.
10 Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband." -Acts 5:1-10 (KJV)

There is a difference in lying to the Holy Spirit, and committing the sin the Pharisees did.

God Bless

Till all are one.

But like no faith quoted, anything against the Holy Spirit shall not be forgiven. The Son Yes The Father Yes. The pharisees did much worse. But if The Holy Spirit was speaking through a person could not a non believer commit the same act?

 

[Mikaeri]

According to scripture, and all I have studied, and of course, you can take my opinion and $1.50 and buy a Coke, but the unpardonable sin cannot be committed today.

In the first century, during Christ's time here, the Pharisees accused Christ of casting out demons by the power of Belzebub.

This is attributing the works of the Holy Spirit to the devil.

But take heart, even if I am wrong, all scripture says is it will not be forgiven in this life, nor the life to come. It does not say it will cost you your eternal life.

God Bless

Till all are one.

If I may correct you there, have you forgotten the scripture:

Blaspheme the Father, you shall be forgiven
Blaspheme the Son, you shall be forgiven
Blaspheme the Holy Spirit, you shall not be forgiven

Here are 2 ways this Sin could be committed by a Christian:

A Christaian has been a faithful and obedient follower of jesus Christ for many years, God has blessed him/her with all the gifts of the Holy Spirit, effective in witnessing, evangelism, the fruits of the spirit are ado apparent.
After many years, he/she meets a non Christian and fall into an ungodly relationship..he/she makes a conscious decision..

1***I am in love with ??? I don't need you anymore in my life.

2***I reject all that I knew to be a load of rubbish and reject you as well god.

Another way for a person to commit this Sin could well be..a tragedy has happened in a Christian's life, say a death of a loved one?
This person like the example above has been blessed with Gods love, gifts and is knowledgeable of scripture with a personal relationship with Jesus Christ..through the death, instead of seeking comfort of fellow Christians and more importantly Jesus..this person with hate and forgiveness turns to the living God and shouts..I hate you for taking away my ???? a short while he/she commits suicide..

That's my thoughts and I believe is backed up on the word as both Christians had chosen to reject what they knew and as a result reject the Holy Spirit.

 

[DeaconDean]

But like no faith quoted, anything against the Holy Spirit shall not be forgiven. The Son Yes The Father Yes. The pharisees did much worse. But if The Holy Spirit was speaking through a person could not a non believer commit the same act?

If I may correct you there, have you forgotten the scripture:

Blaspheme the Father, you shall be forgiven
Blaspheme the Son, you shall be forgiven
Blaspheme the Holy Spirit, you shall not be forgiven

Here are 2 ways this Sin could be committed by a Christian:

A Christaian has been a faithful and obedient follower of jesus Christ for many years, God has blessed him/her with all the gifts of the Holy Spirit, effective in witnessing, evangelism, the fruits of the spirit are ado apparent.
After many years, he/she meets a non Christian and fall into an ungodly relationship..he/she makes a conscious decision..

1***I am in love with ??? I don't need you anymore in my life.

2***I reject all that I knew to be a load of rubbish and reject you as well god.

Another way for a person to commit this Sin could well be..a tragedy has happened in a Christian's life, say a death of a loved one?
This person like the example above has been blessed with Gods love, gifts and is knowledgeable of scripture with a personal relationship with Jesus Christ..through the death, instead of seeking comfort of fellow Christians and more importantly Jesus..this person with hate and forgiveness turns to the living God and shouts..I hate you for taking away my ???? a short while he/she commits suicide..

That's my thoughts and I believe is backed up on the word as both Christians had chosen to reject what they knew and as a result reject the Holy Spirit.

Like I said:

and of course, you can take my opinion and $1.50 and buy a Coke

Evidently, I am not allowed my opinion.

I will excuse myself from this thread.

God Bless

Till all are one.

 

[Bluelion]

Like I said:



Evidently, I am not allowed my opinion.

I will excuse myself from this thread.

God Bless

Till all are one.

I was just seeking to understand you, sorry if I upset you.

 

[Petruchio]

But like no faith quoted, anything against the Holy Spirit shall not be forgiven. The Son Yes The Father Yes. The pharisees did much worse. But if The Holy Spirit was speaking through a person could not a non believer commit the same act?

This is only a problem if you're a Pentecostal/Charismatic, but I'm pretty sure even they won't drop dead if they tell a lie to Benny Hinn or Creflo Dollar.

 

[now faith]

Like I said:



From an article at What is the unpardonable sin / unforgivable sin?:

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From Bible.org, we read:



Of course, like I said, that is just my opinion.

And opinions are like...noses, everybody has one.

God Bless

Till all are one.

If we apply that reasoning then everything he taught while on earth does not apply today.

At that time Christ had recieved the Holy Ghost.

After Pentecost many recieved the Holy Ghost.

It would be logical to assume that a Spirit filled person that does the work of the Holy Ghost as God wills,if a person accused him of being demonic they too would fall into this reference.

Even a Preacher who is anointed to Preach being criticized would place the critic in jeopardy.

So I am careful when it comes to critism of others,considering the gifts are irrevocable,a man could be hell bound and still and still have a anointing.

As Judas was and was foretold in psalms

 

[now faith]

This is only a problem if you're a Pentecostal/Charismatic, but I'm pretty sure even they won't drop dead if they tell a lie to Benny Hinn or Creflo Dollar.

I'm sure it wouldent be a problem,if you did not believe in the Trinity as well.

 

[Petruchio]

I'm sure it wouldent be a problem,if you did not believe in the Trinity as well.

They have bigger problems (those who deny the trinity) than those who get on the bad side of the Health and Wealth prophets. It's eternal damnation of the soul.

 

[Petruchio]

Even a Preacher who is anointed to Preach being criticized would place the critic in jeopardy.

So I am careful when it comes to critism of others,considering the gifts are irrevocable,a man could be hell bound and still and still have a anointing.

As Judas was and was foretold in psalms

Quite ridiculous, and dangerous too. The reason why the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit cannot be committed by Christians is, number one, because there are no Apostles going around healing people with their shadow, writing scripture, or having the authority to bind and loose doctrine. The blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is the act of seeing the truth of God's Holy Power, and yet refusing it and attributing it to the power of Satan.

To criticize a preacher, especially for his ill behavior, is not only correct, it is required, as preachers are to be "blameless" before men, and their doctrine is not founded upon their own authority, but on the demonstration of the Holy Scripture. There is also another logical problem, and that is, if it can be forgiven to men to blaspheme the Son, and the Son is filled with the Spirit beyond measure, then disrespecting the man (if he be good) can certainly be forgiven, provided God brings them to repentance.

The problem with your argument is that it leads to a denial of Sola Scriptura, and of the placing of men as higher authorities than the Holy Bible, and of the Holy Spirit even, since to "blaspheme" the man can render you guilty for all eternity. Thus we find ourselves living in terror of loser Televangelists who preach this trash to begin with, in order to get you to pay for their mansion.

 

[98cwitr]

counting numbers

where's the correlation?

 

[now faith]

Quite ridiculous, and dangerous too. The reason why the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit cannot be committed by Christians is, number one, because there are no Apostles going around healing people with their shadow, writing scripture, or having the authority to bind and loose doctrine. The blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is the act of seeing the truth of God's Holy Power, and yet refusing it and attributing it to the power of Satan.

To criticize a preacher, especially for his ill behavior, is not only correct, it is required, as preachers are to be "blameless" before men, and their doctrine is not founded upon their own authority, but on the demonstration of the Holy Scripture. There is also another logical problem, and that is, if it can be forgiven to men to blaspheme the Son, and the Son is filled with the Spirit beyond measure, then disrespecting the man (if he be good) can certainly be forgiven, provided God brings them to repentance.

The problem with your argument is that it leads to a denial of Sola Scriptura, and of the placing of men as higher authorities than the Holy Bible, and of the Holy Spirit even, since to "blaspheme" the man can render you guilty for all eternity. Thus we find ourselves living in terror of loser Televangelists who preach this trash to begin with, in order to get you to pay for their mansion.

That is the most inconceivable,interpetation I have ever heard.

It is presumptuous,and void of any Spiritual comparisions.

You do not nor care to know what a anointed Preacher is.

What does shadows or binding or loosing doctrine have to do with this Topic?

Yes you believe in the trinity but deny its power.

As far as televangelist go,when you Telecast Gods Word around the world you may have a opinion.

For now its past your pay grade or comprehensive ability to do so.

Thank God for his mercy,do you see any parallel in your last paragraph,with the topic and hand.

 

[Bluelion]

That is the most inconceivable,interpetation I have ever heard.

It is presumptuous,and void of any Spiritual comparisions.

You do not nor care to know what a anointed Preacher is.

What does shadows or binding or loosing doctrine have to do with this Topic?

Yes you believe in the trinity but deny its power.

As far as televangelist go,when you Telecast Gods Word around the world you may have a opinion.

For now its past your pay grade or comprehensive ability to do so.

Thank God for his mercy,do you see any parallel in your last paragraph,with the topic and hand.

I know Jesus has spoken through me in a dream. i mean I had no control. If Jesus can speak through me that strong The Holy Spirit can speak through any of His children just as strong. And if some was to speak against what that The Holy Spirit spoke they would have committed a grave sin.

That is why when someone is preaching the word of God, and it is right on target with scripture, it is best to watch what you say.

I think people will not admit an unforgivable sin can be committed today because they are afraid of it. That points to something wrong with their faith. No child of God can commit an unforgivable sin. God said i will not let you be found guilty(His children). A child of God can not commit it because we have a spirit from God by God. It's simple not in a child of God, the same way God can not sin. It is not in Him. And if a child was so trick to try to commit that sin, God would stop Him or Her.

That is what I believe, not sure if you agree with all that or not Now faith, but I thought i would show support.

Peace and Love
blu

 

[now faith]

I apologize Blue.

Sometimes these post get meanspirited,its just not they way we should converse.

Myself included.

We Miss out on good teaching by others,because of bantering.

I respect Deacon and should have never made the comments that got the ball rolling.

God Bless.

 

[98cwitr]

I know Jesus has spoken through me in a dream. i mean I had no control. If Jesus can speak through me that strong The Holy Spirit can speak through any of His children just as strong. And if some was to speak against what that The Holy Spirit spoke they would have committed a grave sin.

That is why when someone is preaching the word of God, and it is right on target with scripture, it is best to watch what you say.

I think people will not admit an unforgivable sin can be committed today because they are afraid of it. That points to something wrong with their faith. No child of God can commit an unforgivable sin. God said i will not let you be found guilty(His children). A child of God can not commit it because we have a spirit from God by God. It's simple not in a child of God, the same way God can not sin. It is not in Him. And if a child was so trick to try to commit that sin, God would stop Him or Her.

That is what I believe, not sure if you agree with all that or not Now faith, but I thought i would show support.

Peace and Love
blu

May I ask...what did He say?

 

[Bluelion]

I apologize Blue.

Sometimes these post get meanspirited,its just not they way we should converse.

Myself included.

We Miss out on good teaching by others,because of bantering.

I respect Deacon and should have never made the comments that got the ball rolling.

God Bless.

No need to apologize, deacon I suspect was just going through a rough time. Hey please pray for him would ya.

 

[Bluelion]

May I ask...what did He say?

sure if your asking sincerely.

He told a woman who was calling up demons, to"Please, don't say their name" the name of the demons. I understood then that their names were even an offense to God. She said it and the demons came and did unspeakable things to her. i realize way early i was dreaming. It was a lucid dream, but i was chain to a chair with my wife next to me. The demons then began to look for me. they new i was in the room but could not find me. I spoke they grabbed me. i had been calling the names of God and Jesus kept increasing His spirit in me, what was going on in the dream was horrific but I was at perfect peace. When they grabbed me i woke up, and a shadow was by my bed with its arm around me and with its other arm began to try to saw off my left arm. The bed shook, my wife woke up began to scream something is in the room with us. Jesus then said to me "all you have to do is speak". So I said "Hey" and this peace came out of my mouth and a white light and destroyed the shadow. I calm my wife down called my dog, but she would not enter the room. She kept putting one foot in and then backing out of the room like she was trying to build up the courage to answer my call. It was then I saw a second shadow in the closet and i told it to leave, it did, and my dog came running in.

So that is the story.

 

[now faith]

To try and clarify my thoughts.

I have always detested the TV guys who sell survival food,and claim if you give a certain amount blessing and wealth will be yours.

They are snake oil fear mongers,that are peddling God for a price.

Personally I have always thought them to be atheist.

Not my call to judge.

To me a sin against the Holy Ghost would be a man,claiming to have a gift manifested by the Holy Ghost.

Then that claim would be a fake,theatrical smoke and mirrors.

If such a man did this he would not have salvation,but this blasphemy would be the unforgivable.

People like this have nothing to do with prosperity teaching.

A good teaching on prosperity,is one by Charles Stanley.

He teaches it is a balance of fulfilment in Christ.

Peace,love,joy,health,and wealth,to what degree you have these things is according to your faith and obedience to God.

I respect the teaching of Kenneth Hagin senior,his views were close to the same.

He taught faith,and was full gospel.

He was a Baptist,then became full gospel,due to healing being manifested in his Baptist Church early on.

My back ground has a point I am not teaching history.

As the faith movement caught on,he rebuked those who were,begging and slandering the Word.

The snake oil folks do not represent all big time Preachers.

Would you put Billy Graham in that bunch?

At best I would not know how a Christian would blasphemy the Holy Ghost.

Maybe not for the reasons mentioned but here is my thought:

Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death. 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 8:4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 8:10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you. 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 8:13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

This text is Spiritual,it has no mention of Apostles,or another dispensation.

We I assume know the once in grace debate in Hebrews,it is hard to fathom but this would be the only way for the blasphemy to occur.

By the time such a thing would happen,a person would have been out of Gods Grace anyway.

Please I do not want to debate once in grace.

Thank You.

 

[Skala]

I am afraid i have committed the unpardonable sin because when i am counting sometimes these thoughts pop in to my head.

The unpardonable sin has a specific context. It is when Jesus is performing miracles right before your eyes to prove He is the messiah, but you are so bent on rejecting him (despite the evidence) that since you can't claim he is not supernatural (because you just saw that he is) you have no choice but to attribute his power to satan instead of the Holy spirit.

Since Jesus isn't in front of you physically performing miracles, you can't actually commit the unforgivable sin.

 

[Bluelion]

The unpardonable sin has a specific context. It is when Jesus is performing miracles right before your eyes to prove He is the messiah, but you are so bent on rejecting him (despite the evidence) that since you can't claim he is not supernatural (because you just saw that he is) you have no choice but to attribute his power to satan instead of the Holy spirit.

Since Jesus isn't in front of you physically performing miracles, you can't actually commit the unforgivable sin.

Paul cast out spirits by The Holy Spirit, if some one saw him and said he did it by the power of satan they would have in fact committed the same sin as the Pharisees. any one who cast out demons by the way of The Holy Spirit and if someone calls Good evil they have committed the same sin.

 

[Skala]

Paul cast out spirits by The Holy Spirit, if some one saw him and said he did it by the power of satan they would have in fact committed the same sin as the Pharisees. any one who cast out demons by the way of The Holy Spirit and if someone calls Good evil they have committed the same sin.

How do you come to that conclusion?