Taking every thought captive? An impossibility? Not on your life!

[Frogster]

But then one couldn't yell and scream in bold and red!

 

[mrhappy3]

Well our bro will tell us it took him 38 years to finally NAIL IT.

That to me indicates it aint as cut and dried.

Some people ain't ready to go down that NARROW road, and some never will.

Its a choice - a daily one - to believe, live by faith, and live above sin.

Some may never hit 38 years to get there, some will get there quicker, some longer !

All our bro is saying is..............IT IS WRITTEN ! that is his message..we might as well get used to it.

 

[gideons300]

Just as quick as they come we can recognize that a "negative" thought is not our thought.

A thought that is not my thought can be and is instantly rejected.

May I then humbly ask...is a temptation to sin considered a negative thought? And then the next question. Is that temptation to sin originating from you or from the enemy of your soul?

Blessings,

Gideon

 

[Watchman4hm]

Ok then...Those who stoned Stephen were "well versed" in the scriptures they had at the time..We know he was speaking for God, but the hearers didnt...What makes you think your not stiff-necked like them?..When I see people here on CF who have "A" truth, but thats all they see I wonder why the WHOLE gospel isnt looked at.....Some claim that with Gideon...But what about YOU???...Is it possible that YOU have a problem seeing any worth in others because YOUR one sided theology doesn't jive with another?

 

[gideons300]

Well our bro will tell us it took him 38 years to finally NAIL IT.

That to me indicates it aint as cut and dried.

Some people ain't ready to go down that NARROW road, and some never will.

Its a choice - a daily one - to believe, live by faith, and live above sin.

Some may never hit 38 years to get there, some will get there quicker, some longer !

All our bro is saying is..............IT IS WRITTEN ! that is his message..we might as well get used to it.

Well said, Hap. Yes, it did take me 38 years, and i would have given my right arm if someone had sat me down and shared with me the way out of the rut I had become entrenched in.

All I can say is the truth that I am led to share is simply what God has plainly promised. What we do or do not do with that is up to us. But I will say this. Dark days are approaching, darker than any we have ever witnessed. Half-heartedness, "comfortable" costless Christianity, salvation that does not require that we hate our old nature that refuses to bow the knee, a salvation that does not expect us to walk as living sacrifices, all will be washed away when the storm finally hits. The time is now for us to "dig deep" and make sure He is both fuy Lord as well as savior. How many of us are still in possession of part if not all of our pearl collection, wanting all the goodies God offers us as long as it is on the time payment plan? It may have worked up till now. Soon it will not at all. Sand foundations will fail.

When push comes to shove and it will cost us our very lives to continue to follow the Lord, are we so sure that we have the wherewithal to stand firm, no matter the cost? If so, wonderful, but let's make sure that we realize that if we are not wanting to pay that cost now, and God is calling for it, what makes us think on that day we will all of a sudden find the inner strength to lose our lives for His kingdom, and all of a sudden miraculously develop a deep desire for personal holiness?

The blessing i share also comes with another side, one that warns. May will be so caught up in their own lives, their treasure, their goals, their "self", that when the call goes forth to drop all and run into Him, they will simply be otherwise occupied. Will grace somehow cover this? Not according to scripture. The fact we do not want to believe it true has no bearing on the results.

Plain and simple, God wants to set us free from US. Funny how it is the same five or six posters who seem to get agitated at what is shared. Each seems to embolden the other to take their shot and join in piling on, but that is ok. I pray bystanding readers can see that this is not a "them vs. me" or "me vs. them" argument as they would try to make it. It is us disbelieving God's word, or us trusting in it.

God's word still says that He promises to "cause us" to walk in full obedience and that our shields of faith are guaranteed to quench ALL the fiery arrows that the enemy of our souls casts at us. If we do not want that (hard to fathom) or simply do not think that is possible, it changes nothing in reality....nothing. In the end, the words of God alone will stand, nothing else. All else will be shaken, and those on the fence will either be shaken fully into the kingdom of God or fully out of it. I urge all to simply believe His amazing promises, for our God will not fail us.

Blessings, Hap

Gids

 

[mrhappy3]

As I said to my mum, my sister and my best friend today.........REPENT ! I didnt hold back, as Jesus said, when the tower fell on those people it wasnt because they were the worst sinners - NO - nor those dear 10,000 or so who have just lost their lives in the Philipines, NO....unless you repent, you will all likewise perish. I was talking to those who don;t know the Lord today. Forget excuses, repent, hold your hands up and for those that have repented - confess, and keep confessing, until this thing is NAILED and people see the difference in what this BORN AGAIN experience has really achieved in us.

 

[Optimax]

May I then humbly ask...is a temptation to sin considered a negative thought? And then the next question. Is that temptation to sin originating from you or from the enemy of your soul?

Blessings,

Gideon

How about learning to converse without yelling.

 

[Frogster]

Well our bro will tell us it took him 38 years to finally NAIL IT.

That to me indicates it aint as cut and dried.

Some people ain't ready to go down that NARROW road, and some never will.

Its a choice - a daily one - to believe, live by faith, and live above sin.

Some may never hit 38 years to get there, some will get there quicker, some longer !

All our bro is saying is..............IT IS WRITTEN ! that is his message..we might as well get used to it.

Hi bro, well..what is written, is often wrongly interpreted. Do we snap a finger at wounded people, and quote rom 7 at them? The letter kills, and that was written, 2 cor 3:6.

 

[hislegacy]

May I then humbly ask...is a temptation to sin considered a negative thought? And then the next question. Is that temptation to sin originating from you or from the enemy of your soul?

Blessings,

Gideon

May I humbly submit the Word of God to answer your question:

14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. 15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.

 

[gideons300]

May I humbly submit the Word of God to answer your question:

14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. 15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.

Excellent! Now, what if it is no more us that live, but Christ who lives in us? Who then is the instigator? If we still think it is us, then we are a house divided and it is no wonder we cannot stand. We are told to make our tree good. Why? Because a good tree CANNOT bear bad fruits. If we are a mix, so will our faith be, and what are we told as to results from such faith? We are told we will not receive anything from our requests.

What happens to our spirits if there is still "two of us" living inside? We will live out our lives in Romans 7, as wretched men, and the end result of the battle within? Lukewarmness. Worldliness. There is but one way to escape. Get rid of the black dog. God asks we do this by a radical act of faith, and never going backwards into unbelief.

Blessings,

Gideon

 

[Messy]

1) Prayer- Would you say that our prayer lives as a whole rival our TV watching? Do people as a whole look forward to shutting the world out and spending deep time of abiding in Him? I can make no judgements here, as I do not know how it is with others, but I have my suspicions.

2) Burden- Most will agree that we are living in the end times. At that time, the die will be cast, the fates sealed, and billions will find their choice was the wrong one. We have the answer, yet for the most part, even with members of our our household, friends, co-workers, do we beseech the Lord on their behalf interceding for them?

3) Quality of marriage- The divorce rate among the lost is a bit over 50%. The body of Christ here in the west? The very same. If we cannot love our mate, and show the world the benefit of how to live in loving union, why? God has made His feelings and will known on divorce. This is in no way meant to condemn, but to take stock only.

4) Love for brothers and sisters- We are told that in the early church, they were willing to live out the "Love others as you love yourself" and the world took note. I am sure there are some amazing singular examples today an for those I praise God, but let's be honest here. We are not walking in the same spirit that they did in the book of Acts.

5) Love of the world- We are called to walk out our lives as living sacrifices, and to not love the world nor the things it offers, yet as a whole, we are inot the same baubles that occupy the world. Television is a drug against boredom just as it is for the lost.

Brother, I could go on and on, but I am not sure if it will do much good. When defenses are up, truth takes a back seat to minds made up. But I challenge any here to honestly look at these five areas in their own church, even in their own hearts and tell me that I am completely in error and that there is nothing to what I say. Npne have touched on the real acid test we have not found working, that our shields of faith are promised to work, so that sin no longer has dominion over us. When tempted to stray and commit sin, we are promised that God will not allow us to be tempted above our ability to resist, yet we as a whole do not even qurtion why this is not coming true in our lives. Until it bothers us that we are not walking in "the glorious liberty of the children of God", we will never seek Him with all of our hearts to be given the answer. Do you not see that?

The last thing I want to share is that my "purpose" in sharing as I do has never been simply to put down the church or make people feel bad. I am not mean spirited or angry or unkind. I do say things hard to hear, I admit, but the sole purpose is to shock our systems that have slowly grown cold to our state, because the blessing of walking in the new nature can only come when we are desperate for it in our walks at any cost. It is not something we can "add" to what we have. It is no small thing. It is coming to the point that we look at our situation that is simply not what God promised us and cry out as wretched men for a deliverer to come deliver us. I know some here think I am simply a troublemaker, but my heart is for us, every single one here.

There are many posts I have penned that simply lift up the Lord, with no critical views of the church as we know it. Other times, such as how this one has drifted, harder words of truth have been shared. I apologize for the angst I have caused, and yet it seems it is at times a necessary byproduct of an act of love. I do not expect some to accept that statement or believe me, but I speak the truth. I am angry at none here. I am frustrated and saddened that satan has so blinded us that we cannot see what should be plain to us but is still hidden from our eyes. Either way, I will continue to share as the Lord leads, and I pray that He is more and more seen as the God who can save us to the uttermost from the power of the enemy.

Blessings, SP

Gideon

Sounds like what Michael Brown says too:
http://www.christianforums.com/t7786744/
We shouldn't feel accused by the message, the preaching in my church is about revival and people are getting saved, but there really is much more.

 

[Frogster]

Excellent! Now, what if it is no more us that live, but Christ who lives in us? Who then is the instigator? If we still think it is us, then we are a house divided and it is no wonder we cannot stand. We are told to make our tree good. Why? Because a good tree CANNOT bear bad fruits. If we are a mix, so will our faith be, and what are we told as to results from such faith? We are told we will not receive anything from our requests.

What happens to our spirits if there is still "two of us" living inside? We will live out our lives in Romans 7, as wretched men, and the end result of the battle within? Lukewarmness. Worldliness. There is but one way to escape. Get rid of the black dog. God asks we do this by a radical act of faith, and never going backwards into unbelief.

Blessings,

Gideon

2 things come to mind here.

#1, there always seemd to be a built in accusatory mindset in your posts, you seem to presume, people want to be lukewarm, and not only that, Paul wrote rom 7, as a Christian, i proved it to you, and what you actually are doing, by turning faith into a work, is putting this "radical faith" as a perfectionism, setting people up for a fall, because you are turning it into a Rom 7, putting every thing on them to fix, which is law, you put the sin, and the answer on them, so you are creating the rom 7 thing anyway, because true grace points to Jesus, not the sin, nor the man to fix it.




#2. With all due respect, no offense, but as you and others have said, you had a rom 7 thing for 38 years with your issue, as you have openly dicusssed here. So you lived under mercy, yet, now, you seem to have a snap the finger, be good now tone with others, all while you struggled for 38 years, so you need to give their rom 7 time mercy, as you received mercy, he who is forgiven much, loved much, see the text below.


Paul learned mercy, that CHRIST MIGHT DISPLAY HIS PERFECT PATIENCE AS AN EXAMPLE...

You do not display that with perfectionism, and a snap the finger kind of teaching, a "do it now" thing...

Present tense, on the "I am the foremost sinner".



1 Tim 1:13 though formerly I was a blasphemer, persecutor, and insolent opponent. But I received mercy because I had acted ignorantly in unbelief, 14 and the grace of our Lord overflowed for me with the faith and love that are in Christ Jesus. 15 The saying is trustworthy and deserving of full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the foremost. 16 But I received mercy for this reason, that in me, as the foremost, Jesus Christ might display his perfect patience as an example to those who were to believe in him for eternal life.




This post is said in repsect, courtesy, and seeks to help and teach you, as you try to teach. Ideas and doctrine are open to a healthy respectful challenge, thanks, be blessed, frog.

 

[hislegacy]

Excellent! Now, what if it is no more us that live, but Christ who lives in us? Who then is the instigator?But when you talk with him seems to have an answer for everything..Sometimes when he speaks though, things seem a bit hard to grasp, but you can tell hes just trying to help you the best way he can..But hes just hard to understand sometimes because he tries to tie so many scriptures together at once I cant seem to follow fast enough..It could be that what he has to say is over my head at times..I dont know.. still think it is us, then we are a house divided and it is no wonder we cannot stand. We are told to make our tree good. Why? Because a good tree CANNOT bear bad fruits. If we are a mix, so will our faith be, and what are we told as to results from such faith? We are told we will not receive anything from our requests.

What happens to our spirits if there is still "two of us" living inside? We will live out our lives in Romans 7, as wretched men, and the end result of the battle within? Lukewarmness. Worldliness. There is but one way to escape. Get rid of the black dog. God asks we do this by a radical act of faith, and never going backwards into unbelief.

Blessings,

Gideon

There is your error.

James was writing to those who were and are in Christ. The Word is the same regardless of you reasoning.

 

[Frogster]

Excellent! Now, what if it is no more us that live, but Christ who lives in us? Who then is the instigator? If we still think it is us, then we are a house divided and it is no wonder we cannot stand. We are told to make our tree good. Why? Because a good tree CANNOT bear bad fruits. If we are a mix, so will our faith be, and what are we told as to results from such faith? We are told we will not receive anything from our requests.

What happens to our spirits if there is still "two of us" living inside? We will live out our lives in Romans 7, as wretched men, and the end result of the battle within? Lukewarmness. Worldliness. There is but one way to escape. Get rid of the black dog. God asks we do this by a radical act of faith, and never going backwards into unbelief.

Blessings,

Gideon

red above, as far as this "black dog" thing..

Did you ever see a person say, "they are going to take the dog for a walk", and it is on a leash?

Then we see really the large strong dog is walking them, they are being pulled along, with their arms straight holding the leash, practially running behind the dog?

Who is walking who?

Ok, so if you're sitting around, controlling and guarding every thought, aren't you really being controlled by the thoughts, like how our dog walker is really controlled by the dog? Who has who?

If the thoughts become your focus every day, aren't the thoughts bigger than God, and you, whereby you are controlled, thinking you are controlling?

Think about it...

If the thoughts become the primary all the time, what or who is secondary?

What happens when thoughts become one's life? Who is center, Christ, or the thoughts? That is law in action, bro...

blessings, frog.

 

[gideons300]

Guys, I know what I share frustrates you, and I do understand. I just wish someone would explain to me and to other readers of these posts why we as the church today are so different from the early church. Personal holiness was a BIG deal. Zeal for the lost, eyes fixed on Jesus, walking out their lives as living sacrifices, , running our race with zeal and a single eye, putting off by faith our old man, is this what we hear in churches today?

I understand that there were rare but noted exceptions to the rule of how the early church functioned, but by and large our exceptions today are those who do actually seek God for a walk like that.

Until we can look at the example God gave us in the early church, and until we are look at the clear promises of God that no one expects to see fulfilled in them, and ask ourselves why, and seek God's face as to how to change it, we will simply march onward with the world by and large ignoring us, while the devil continues to plow under life after life and marriage after marriage, both in and out of the church.

I know you think my message negative and accusatory, but the sole purpose is to hopefully get us to examine if we really are "in the faith" that the Bible describes. Are we losing our lives to find His in us? Is it even a faint goal to want to walk out our lives as living sacrifices? It seems most here will do anything to try to avoid this discussion because they KNOW there is a wide gap between us and the early believers. Yet even then, God will bring us back to Him and cause us to make Him the sole object of our affections.

I love you guys.

Gideon

 

[Frogster]

so far we got Paul misunderstood in 2 cor 10, he waws not teaching us to sit around watching every thought, it was about the false apostles false theology, and for the most part, we have wounded people put into rom 7, calling wounds sins of the flesh, we have the ever inclusive "we" that was asked not to be used, and now we have people controlled by thoughts, as they think they are controlling, as they are actuallly being controlled by law, and perfectionism, and no mercy, as Paul learned mercy, not a snap the finger kind of thing.

Forgive me, no offense, just what I observe, with all due respect to all.

 

[gideons300]

I don't think you do understand and instead of beating the church with her failings maybe you could ask God to explain to you about the Church? because I suspect He would tell you what He thinks of the church - He loves her very much, He cherishes her and encourages her, protects and adores her, He laid down His life for her He loves her that much. I suspect He would tell you to encourage and lift her up, to protect and look out for His beloved bride. I suspect He would tell you to speak words of life over her that will lift her up in Him, to encourage the timid, to bind up the brokenhearted.

Again though in this post you instead hold up a long list of behaviors which the Church is failing in, there's usually a list of failings in most of your posts. it seems you don't even think the church has anything good in it or is even capable of anything anywhere remotely honoring to God. quote "Is it even a faint goal to want to walk out our lives as living sacrifices?" obviously by your tone you have put the church in the useless box that cant even get that right . yet you wonder why we think your posts are negative and accusatory? could it be because they actually are negative and accusatory maybe? not often is there encouragement in your posts for the church. and yet God encourages His people often.


then you put the 'I love you' on the end of that list that makes beating the church with her failings ok

I beat you and tell you how useless you guys are but hey .. "I love you guys" so that makes it ok
it would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

Sister, you have it in your mind that love and grace somehow mean that God does not care about the condition of the hearts of His people. Indeed, He does love us. And the fact that our lives are still our own, with little care that He calls us as a response to that love to lose our lives in Him, for Him, through Him, has been totally lost on this generation.

If you would be so kind, simply read this next few verses. It was written to God's church.... the church He died for.

"14 Write to Laodicea, to the Angel of the church. God’s Yes, the Faithful and Accurate Witness, the First of God’s creation, says:

15-17 “I know you inside and out, and find little to my liking. You’re not cold, you’re not hot—far better to be either cold or hot! You’re stale. You’re stagnant. You make me want to vomit. You brag, ‘I’m rich, I’ve got it made, I need nothing from anyone,’ oblivious that in fact you’re a pitiful, blind beggar, threadbare and homeless.

18 “Here’s what I want you to do: Buy your gold from me, gold that’s been through the refiner’s fire. Then you’ll be rich. Buy your clothes from me, clothes designed in Heaven. You’ve gone around half-naked long enough. And buy medicine for your eyes from me so you can see, really see.

19 “The people I love, I call to account—prod and correct and guide so that they’ll live at their best. Up on your feet, then! About face! Run after God!

20-21 “Look at me. I stand at the door. I knock. If you hear me call and open the door, I’ll come right in and sit down to supper with you. Conquerors will sit alongside me at the head table, just as I, having conquered, took the place of honor at the side of my Father. That’s my gift to the conquerors!

22 “Are your ears awake? Listen. Listen to the Wind Words, the Spirit blowing through the churches.”

Do you hear? There is accountability with God for what He has given us. Grace requires. It is not works, it is heart RESPONSE, proving we were really repentant when we asked Him in. Do we hate our old self centered life? No, we are taught that grace makes that unneeded. It is a false grace, a twisted grace and it leaves us healed only slightly, lukewarm and content, yet without possessing godliness.

Again, instead of discussing what you feel about me personally, I would ask again, why the disparity between the power, the joy, the love, the single eyed service walking as living sacrifices in the early church and the one today. Why do you all avoid it? Someone, anyone, do you have a real Biblical explanation?

It is a simple request. Jesus promised that sin would not have dominion over us and that our shield of faith would work. Is this what you are experiencing? Is this what you hear preached? If not, explain it to me. Why do the promises not work, and why do we accept that they do not work without it even causing us to say "Why is that?" Simple. You take my holding up a mirror to show our lack as unloving. I know my motives and so does God.I want toyu to understand, typing heard words on the internet does not allow you to hear the tome of my voice, and this, you hear how you think I am sounding. The truth is, sadness and tears are my mindset, and yes, much love, as I care that satan has stolen from us.

If any can scripturally explain why the promises He has made are not expected to work, and that grace sonehow makes walking as living sacrifices no longer important or "our reasonable service", I will willingly alter what I say. But here is the truth. You cannot.

You think my words are meant to hurt. The truth is, my words are meant to make you think and examine. What God has for us .... it works! He promises to set us free indeed, not play-like, not positionally, but in reality so that we walk victorious over the world, the flesh and thr devil. But here is the deal. As long as we remain content with a religion that makes us feel assured, but does not lead us to become real overcomers, danger lurks.

No one likes to be awakened from a sound sleep being told their house is on fire. Attitudes like the ones displayed here against me are totally understandable. But what is the loving response to such attitudes. Is it to shut up and walk away, or to lay down and go back to sleep myself? How can I, if the Lord has asked me to speak, to warn, to encourage to share that the results of real grace leads us to real victory.

In love, whether or not you believe it....or me,

Gideon

 

[Frogster]

I don't think you do understand and instead of beating the church with her failings maybe you could ask God to explain to you about the Church? because I suspect He would tell you what He thinks of the church - He loves her very much, He cherishes her and encourages her, protects and adores her, He laid down His life for her He loves her that much. I suspect He would tell you to encourage and lift her up, to protect and look out for His beloved bride. I suspect He would tell you to speak words of life over her that will lift her up in Him, to encourage the timid, to bind up the brokenhearted.

Again though in this post you instead hold up a long list of behaviors which the Church is failing in, there's usually a list of failings in most of your posts. it seems you don't even think the church has anything good in it or is even capable of anything anywhere remotely honoring to God. quote "Is it even a faint goal to want to walk out our lives as living sacrifices?" obviously by your tone you have put the church in the useless box that cant even get that right . yet you wonder why we think your posts are negative and accusatory? could it be because they actually are negative and accusatory maybe? not often is there encouragement in your posts for the church. and yet God encourages His people often.


then you put the 'I love you' on the end of that list that makes beating the church with her failings ok

I beat you and tell you how useless you guys are but hey .. "I love you guys" so that makes it ok
it would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

to some, the church is awful, lukewarm, does not love God, makes excuses, no one is revived, no one is walking the right way...on and on...

Yet, HE sees us holy, Heb 10:10, Col 1:22, through the sacrifices, it just shows that some really don't understand the cross and what happened there.

 

[gideons300]

to some, the church is awful, lukewarm, does not love God, makes excuses, no one is revived, no one is walking the right way...on and on...

Yet, HE sees us holy, Heb 10:10, Col 1:22, through the sacrifices, it just shows that some really don't understand the cross and what happened there.

Funny but God must have overlooked that when He spoke to the Laodcians. They WERE the church, yet He told them what they needed to hear, like it or not. We may not be Laodecia but the similarities are staggering. God loves us and as He says to them:

"As many as I love I rebuke and chasten."

Let's actually re-read what he said to them. Was God seeing them as "holy" as you propose He must?

14 Write to Laodicea, to the Angel of the church. God’s Yes, the Faithful and Accurate Witness, the First of God’s creation, says:

15-17 “I know you inside and out, and find little to my liking. You’re not cold, you’re not hot—far better to be either cold or hot! You’re stale. You’re stagnant. You make me want to vomit. You brag, ‘I’m rich, I’ve got it made, I need nothing from anyone,’ oblivious that in fact you’re a pitiful, blind beggar, threadbare and homeless.

18 “Here’s what I want you to do: Buy your gold from me, gold that’s been through the refiner’s fire. Then you’ll be rich. Buy your clothes from me, clothes designed in Heaven. You’ve gone around half-naked long enough. And buy medicine for your eyes from me so you can see, really see.

19 “The people I love, I call to account—prod and correct and guide so that they’ll live at their best. Up on your feet, then! About face! Run after God!

20-21 “Look at me. I stand at the door. I knock. If you hear me call and open the door, I’ll come right in and sit down to supper with you. Conquerors will sit alongside me at the head table, just as I, having conquered, took the place of honor at the side of my Father. That’s my gift to the conquerors!

22 “Are your ears awake? Listen. Listen to the Wind Words, the Spirit blowing through the churches.”

So much for the theory that God sees us through pink-colored Jesus glasses no matter how we are living. If grace is not leading us to become living sacrifices, but to take advantage of the mercy of God while we continue on our own path with pardons of our sins, past present and future, in hand, it is not grace at all but an imposter. It is simply a license to continue to keep on sinning and living our own life, having our cake and eating it too.

The call of the gospel is clear. We are to hate OUR life, with US firmly at the tiller, and lose it so that He can reign in us and through us and 'cause us' to walk as holy, obedient children. If our walking as living sacrifices, holy, acceptable to God is indeed NOT what we consider a "reasonable" service back to Him, and is not even on our bucket list of things we are hoping to see happen in our lives, we better hope we do not kick that bucket any time soon.

Be blessed,

Gideon

 

[Frogster]

Funny but God must have overlooked that when He spoke to the Laodcians. They WERE the church, yet He told them what they needed to hear, like it or not. We may not be Laodecia but the similarities are staggering. God loves us and as He says to them:

"As many as I love I rebuke and chasten."

Let's actually re-read what he said to them. Was God seeing them as "holy" as you propose He must?

14 Write to Laodicea, to the Angel of the church. God’s Yes, the Faithful and Accurate Witness, the First of God’s creation, says:

15-17 “I know you inside and out, and find little to my liking. You’re not cold, you’re not hot—far better to be either cold or hot! You’re stale. You’re stagnant. You make me want to vomit. You brag, ‘I’m rich, I’ve got it made, I need nothing from anyone,’ oblivious that in fact you’re a pitiful, blind beggar, threadbare and homeless.

18 “Here’s what I want you to do: Buy your gold from me, gold that’s been through the refiner’s fire. Then you’ll be rich. Buy your clothes from me, clothes designed in Heaven. You’ve gone around half-naked long enough. And buy medicine for your eyes from me so you can see, really see.

19 “The people I love, I call to account—prod and correct and guide so that they’ll live at their best. Up on your feet, then! About face! Run after God!

20-21 “Look at me. I stand at the door. I knock. If you hear me call and open the door, I’ll come right in and sit down to supper with you. Conquerors will sit alongside me at the head table, just as I, having conquered, took the place of honor at the side of my Father. That’s my gift to the conquerors!

22 “Are your ears awake? Listen. Listen to the Wind Words, the Spirit blowing through the churches.”

So much for the theory that God sees us through pink-colored Jesus glasses no matter how we are living. If grace is not leading us to become living sacrifices, but to take advantage of the mercy of God while we continue on our own path with pardons of our sins, past present and future, in hand, it is not grace at all but an imposter. It is simply a license to continue to keep on sinning and living our own life, having our cake and eating it too.

The call of the gospel is clear. We are to hate OUR life, with US firmly at the tiller, and lose it so that He can reign in us and through us and 'cause us' to walk as holy, obedient children. If our walking as living sacrifices, holy, acceptable to God is indeed NOT what we consider a "reasonable" service back to Him, and is not even on our bucket list of things we are hoping to see happen in our lives, we better hope we do not kick that bucket any time soon.

Be blessed,

Gideon

funny how some just see that, ignoring all of the wonderous things in the bible also...then, have the nerve to call people they don't know, laodecians...and presume all are like that...

God said that to them, but you take their word, and paste it on everyone..

see the difference?

by the way, do you know the difference between a rhema word, from the logos?