Why no music in the church of Christ?

[GrayMike91]

I mean, singing, playing instruments and worship are all in the bible. Why outlaw the practice?

 

[Trailltrader]

I mean, singing, playing instruments and worship are all in the bible. Why outlaw the practice?

The Church of Christ's idea is to worship God as the First Century Church was set up- which is to say you're on the run and the sounds of musical instruments carries for miles in some cases. (Hence the use of war drums) But voice's don't carry so far so it was one way to worship God without attracting the wrath of the Roman Legions

 

[Clickster]

The Churches of Christ sing.

Many in the Churches of Christ believe that God clearly did not authorize the use of instruments in a worship setting. They believe in singing acapella only while in a worship service. I am a member of the Church of Christ. However, I regularly visit a CoC with a piano and my home CoC doesn't use one. I personally could care less either way.

I do enjoy hearing the collective voices without the piano.

For many Church of Christ members...this really isn't an issue one way or the other. For some it is.

 

[Trailltrader]

The Churches of Christ sing.

Many in the Churches of Christ believe that God clearly did not authorize the use of instruments in a worship setting. They believe in singing acapella only while in a worship service. I am a member of the Church of Christ. However, I regularly visit a CoC with a piano and my home CoC doesn't use one. I personally could care less either way.

I do enjoy hearing the collective voices without the piano.

For many Church of Christ members...this really isn't an issue one way or the other. For some it is.

Like you, I happen to be a CoC member and I was quoting what I was taught at Columbia Christian College. But like you, I don't really care because God looks at the heart. I do however, draw the line when the music instruments is so loud that it drowns out peoples voices and takes the lead rather than being the accompaniment.

 

[Clickster]

Like you, I happen to be a CoC member and I was quoting what I was taught at Columbia Christian College. But like you, I don't really care because God looks at the heart. I do however, draw the line when the music instruments is so loud that it drowns out peoples voices and takes the lead rather than being the accompaniment.

I can agree with that.

 

[Knockinghard]

I mean, singing, playing instruments and worship are all in the bible. Why outlaw the practice?

Excerpts from the published book "Why I Am a Believer In Jesus"

I would like to consider one cult as an example. It is the ‘Church of Christ’! The first Jerusalem Church had all believers giving up their property and possession and sharing their needs in common. This particular denomination has given up musical instruments instead and has come with a claim that it represents the Church as envisaged by the Lord!

Its argument is that Jesus and the apostles never used any instruments in their worship and prayer! It is difficult to believe this whacky theory because they had swords with them (They resisted the arrest of Jesus), and, therefore, what makes them to think that they could not have had simple musical instruments in their ministry? Instruments are found in heaven! We are asked to pray for the will of God to prevail on earth as it is heaven (Matthew 6:10). Probably, these people may reject heaven because it is not free from musical instruments

“And He will send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other” (Matthew 24:31). Obviously these people may ignore the trumpet call, besides salvation! These people seem to claim that they are genuinely continuing with the first Jerusalem Church! They are a classic example of self-claims on nominal basis.

The funny part is that these people sing from hymnal books that have been composed and set for instrumental accompaniment!

Another serious flaw in their doctrine is that children are sinless! At what age they become sinners is not defined, I suppose!

It would be appropriate if they re-designated their congregation as ‘church of Paul’ in tune with Pauline Christianity instead of making a tall claim as ‘Church of Christ’ with their nominal beliefs!

 

[Trailltrader]

Knockinghard, I'd answer your post but I detect a mix of hostility and disbelief. I have been a member of the Church of Christ for 46 years. You have already made a decision when you cut and pasted from a book rather than accept our posts.

I've broken this following down into two parts:

Part "A":

So, lets cut right to the chase: what is it you want to know from us that you haven't found in this book?

What is your purpose of quoting from this book? What is it you are trying to accomplish?

Part "B":

I posted some 7 or 8 posts above why the Church of Christ doesn't believe in musical instruments- that is, the early church met on Sundays, they were persecuted by the different governments, and the sound of a musical instrument travels much farther than the human voice.

Let me rephrase it: if the early church used musical instruments it'd be a good way to be hunted down and killed.

 

[Knockinghard]

Knockinghard, I'd answer your post but I detect a mix of hostility and disbelief. I have been a member of the Church of Christ for 46 years. You have already made a decision when you cut and pasted from a book rather than accept our posts.

I am sorry if my posting hurted you and sounded harsh.

I've broken this following down into two parts:

Part "A":

So, lets cut right to the chase: what is it you want to know from us that you haven't found in this book?

I have come to know that there are churches of Christ that do use instruments. Am I correct?

What is your purpose of quoting from this book? What is it you are trying to accomplish?

Musical instruments are embellishments to singing and also to soothe us spiritually. David's playing of the harp helped king Saul when he was subjected to the influence of an evil spirit. But modern use of instruments with its blaring and deafening sounds are evil. I do not see any wisdom in avoiding them altogether that is not supported by the Bible.

Part "B":

I posted some 7 or 8 posts above why the Church of Christ doesn't believe in musical instruments- that is, the early church met on Sundays, they were persecuted by the different governments, and the sound of a musical instrument travels much farther than the human voice.

Let me rephrase it: if the early church used musical instruments it'd be a good way to be hunted down and killed.

Should we continue with the same assumed situation now?

 

[Trailltrader]

Should we continue with the same assumed situation now?

Only if its biblically and spiritually correct to emulate the first century church. Granted, King David danced with instruments, Sauls daughter said he looked like a fool, Dave agreed but essentially banished her for life.

The idea of the restoration movement was to go back to the kind of Church that Jesus set up with the Apostles and Disciples during the first century. Granted this could be taken to extremes- such as being crucified upside down like Peter, dragged and quartered like the Apostle Paul.

Its a tough call- I have personally not encountered a Church of Christ with instruments; I have seen them break off from CoC and then rename themselves, however. *Shrugs* G-d is so big its hard to say what he wants sometimes.

 

[Sasquatchit]

I mean, singing, playing instruments and worship are all in the bible. Why outlaw the practice?

They may be in the O.T. but they r not found to be part of the pattern in the New Testament.

 

[Sasquatchit]

The Church of Christ's idea is to worship God as the First Century Church was set up- which is to say you're on the run and the sounds of musical instruments carries for miles in some cases. (Hence the use of war drums) But voice's don't carry so far so it was one way to worship God without attracting the wrath of the Roman Legions

Where did u find that in the Scriptures?

 

[Knockinghard]

Only if its biblically and spiritually correct to emulate the first century church. Granted, King David danced with instruments, Sauls daughter said he looked like a fool, Dave agreed but essentially banished her for life.

Are we trying to imagine that we emulate first century Church by giving up musical instruments? It not a big deal compared to giving up all! David was an emotional man. God sees the heart, not our physical acts. Same David committed adultery and murder later!

The idea of the restoration movement was to go back to the kind of Church that Jesus set up with the Apostles and Disciples during the first century. Granted this could be taken to extremes- such as being crucified upside down like Peter, dragged and quartered like the Apostle Paul.

Is restoration movement a easy way out? Acts of Peter and Paul were of humility and submission even under adverse circumstances.

Its a tough call- I have personally not encountered a Church of Christ with instruments; I have seen them break off from CoC and then rename themselves, however. *Shrugs* G-d is so big its hard to say what he wants sometimes.

God wants a contrite heart.

 

[ace4]

I cant believe some folks think simple things are wrong...

 

[Trailltrader]

God wants a contrite heart.

And he wants obedience.

Some day, I'd like to try being obedient just to shock him..... (He did give us a sense of humor) Things I'd like to be obedient on: stop swearing- I'm (literally physically) brain damaged and theres some days I sound like I have Tourettes- the meds help, but they don't stop it. I'd like to be like it says in the book of James and learn how to be considerate of other peoples feelings when I speak instead of just blurting out the first thing my brain comes up with. I'd like to be a whole lot more loving and king and a whole lot less judgmental.

Seriously though- I'd just like to be obedient. I mean "Leading the Israelites into the promised land" kind of obedient.

 

[Knockinghard]

And he wants obedience.

Some day, I'd like to try being obedient just to shock him..... (He did give us a sense of humor) Things I'd like to be obedient on: stop swearing- I'm (literally physically) brain damaged and theres some days I sound like I have Tourettes- the meds help, but they don't stop it. I'd like to be like it says in the book of James and learn how to be considerate of other peoples feelings when I speak instead of just blurting out the first thing my brain comes up with. I'd like to be a whole lot more loving and king and a whole lot less judgmental.

Seriously though- I'd just like to be obedient. I mean "Leading the Israelites into the promised land" kind of obedient.

No, nothing--not even salvation-- without obedience!

 

[Sasquatchit]

U know, I've noticed a lot of hostility in someone here against what God has deemed good and right.

His church is His bride. He has told us (His people; those who follow the pattern) to do certain things and not to add or take away from this pattern and His word.

So, what I'm asking is....why defend things that r not in the pattern?

Jude 17 "But u, beloved, remember the words which were spoken before by the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ."

18 "...they told u that there would be mockers in the last time who would walk according to their own ungodley lusts."

19 "these r sensual persons, who cause divisions, not having the Spirit."

2 Tim. 1:13 "Hold fast the pattern of sound words...."

Titus 1:9 "holding fast the faithful word he has been taught, that he may be able, by sound doctrine, both to exhort and convict those who contradict."

1 Tim. 4:16 "Take heed to urself and to the doctrine. Continue in them...."

1 Cor. 11:2 "...remember me in all things and keep the traditions just as I delivered them to u."

Phil. 3:17 "Brethren, join in following my example and note those who so walk, as u have us for a pattern."

 

[Trailltrader]

U know, I've noticed a lot of hostility in someone here against what God has deemed good and right.

I haven't noticed that- I'm sorry you feel that way.

His church is His bride. He has told us (His people; those who follow the pattern) to do certain things and not to add or take away from this pattern and His word.

But we're not discussing his word per se; we're discussing why the Church of Christ doesn't have music.

So, what I'm asking is....why defend things that r not in the pattern?


Phil. 3:17 "Brethren, join in following my example and note those who so walk, as u have us for a pattern."

Very well, if you want a pattern..per the above scripture then I shall give you one.

It is a hard teaching to walk in the world and not be part of the world- curiously I've been studying the book "You Lost Me" which deals with situations similar to this!

The Senario:

Its Sunday morning, the year is AD30 and a group of Christians are in the catacombs below Rome praising God. They sing quietly because they know if they're discovered, its death.

Now, how far would you drag a drum, a piano, a harp, or lets face it- even a Kazoo if you knew it'd get you a spear in the back, or a sword in the side, or if the Centurion was REALLY upset decide to crucify you?

If you want an example of "common sense over scripture" from the Old Testament then use the example of where King David fed his troops from the Priests food? 1st Samuel 21:6

Context
David Takes the Consecrated Bread
…5David answered the priest and said to him, "Surely women have been kept from us as previously when I set out and the vessels of the young men were holy, though it was an ordinary journey; how much more then today will their vessels be holy?" 6So the priest gave him consecrated bread; for there was no bread there but the bread of the Presence which was removed from before the LORD, in order to put hot bread in its place when it was taken away. 7Now one of the servants of Saul was there that day, detained before the LORD; and his name was Doeg the Edomite, the chief of Saul's shepherds.…
Cross References

Matthew 12:3
He answered, "Haven't you read what David did when he and his companions were hungry?

Matthew 12:4
He entered the house of God, and he and his companions ate the consecrated bread--which was not lawful for them to do, but only for the priests.

Luke 6:3
Jesus answered them, "Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were hungry?

Luke 6:4
He entered the house of God, and taking the consecrated bread, he ate what is lawful only for priests to eat. And he also gave some to his companions."

I believe this is one good example of where God Grace comes into usage- because theres been a lot of discussion over this topic the past 500 years at least!

 

[abysmul]

I have some very dear friends that are members of Churches of Christ, and I love and respect them very much.

According to them it basically comes down to: where the Bible speaks we will speak, but where the Bible is silent, we will be silent.

They view that the NT evidence for musical instruments in worship is not there, so they do not use instruments. Note, not all CoC fall under this, there are many that use instruments.

One of my best friends admits that it sometimes feels like this "law of silence" can be dangerously close to becoming legalistic (for lack of a better word).

As long as someone is not pushing it as something salvation depends upon... I'm OK with it. It can make for beautiful services, but I tend to favor some music with my singing (because my voice sucks LOL).

 

[Sasquatchit]

According to them it basically comes down to: where the Bible speaks we will speak, but where the Bible is silent, we will be silent.



They view that the NT evidence for musical instruments in worship is not there, so they do not use instruments. Note, not all CoC fall under this, there are many that use instruments.

If they do have it, then they r NOT considered true CoC. They get labeled as digressive.

Since there r so many verses concerning the word "Pattern," don't u think we should be careful? This is why the CoC is big on the quote above.

If u r lenient with one thing, then soon other things start creeping in like youth groups, or kitchens, or funding the poor from the community, etc.

 

[Sasquatchit]

Very well, if you want a pattern..per the above scripture then I shall give you one.

It is a hard teaching to walk in the world and not be part of the world- curiously I've been studying the book "You Lost Me" which deals with situations similar to this!

If I were u, I would stay away from man made books which subverts the word to today's philosophical rationale.

Col 2:8 "Beware lest anyone cheat u through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and NOT according to Christ."


The Senario:

Its Sunday morning, the year is AD30 and a group of Christians are in the catacombs below Rome praising God. They sing quietly because they know if they're discovered, its death.

First of all, I believe Christ wasn't crucified until 33 A.D.
2nd. of all, the catacombs didn't really start until much, much later.

So u see, the pattern was already set as to what to do. We r to do as the disciples/apostles did when the church was being established. There r NO musical instruments in this set pattern, in the N.T.





Context
David Takes the Consecrated Bread
…5David answered the priest and said to him, "Surely women have been kept from us as previously when I set out and the vessels of the young men were holy, though it was an ordinary journey; how much more then today will their vessels be holy?" 6So the priest gave him consecrated bread; for there was no bread there but the bread of the Presence which was removed from before the LORD, in order to put hot bread in its place when it was taken away. 7Now one of the servants of Saul was there that day, detained before the LORD; and his name was Doeg the Edomite, the chief of Saul's shepherds.…
Cross References

Matthew 12:3
He answered, "Haven't you read what David did when he and his companions were hungry?

Matthew 12:4
He entered the house of God, and he and his companions ate the consecrated bread--which was not lawful for them to do, but only for the priests.

Luke 6:3
Jesus answered them, "Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were hungry?

Luke 6:4
He entered the house of God, and taking the consecrated bread, he ate what is lawful only for priests to eat. And he also gave some to his companions."

I believe this is one good example of where God Grace comes into usage- because theres been a lot of discussion over this topic the past 500 years at least!

I really don't see the point of the above Scriptures in this discussion. [?]
They were discussing O.T. things to the Jews, because they were being accused of violating the Law; this has nothing to do with the pattern.