What Would Falsify the Flood?

[Loudmouth]

What's keeping me believing it, then?

You tell me. What causes you to hold on to a belief in the face of mountains of contradictory evidence?

 

[CabVet]

I explained why I did that.

So you would stop your pouting.

Yes you did, because it fits your interpretation, I get it.

 

[CabVet]

Why was the Gospel message easy for me to believe, then? why do children or aborigines have no problem with it?

In your specific case, I really don't know. But children or aborigines believe religious messages (not just the Christian one, but whoever gets there first) for the same reason they believe in Santa Claus and the easter bunny.

 

[AV1611VET]

You tell me. What causes you to hold on to a belief in the face of mountains of contradictory evidence?

The belief that those mountains are built on sand.

The belief that those mountains are going to flee and leave their lovers standing before the Creator of the universe at the Great White Throne Judgement.

The belief that our faith can move your mountains and cast them into the sea, where supposedly all life came from.

The belief that evolution is a lie of the devil.

For starters.

 

[AV1611VET]

In your specific case, I really don't know. But children or aborigines believe religious messages (not just the Christian one, but whoever gets there first) for the same reason they believe in Santa Claus and the easter bunny.

What converted Josh Macdowell and others who set out to dispel the Bible, but became believers?

 

[CabVet]

The belief that evolution is a lie of the devil.

Gravity contradicts Moses opening the Red Sea and Jesus walking on water, therefore gravity is ok.
Biology contradicts Jesus resurrecting Lazarus, therefore biology is ok.
Evolution contradicts Genesis, therefore evolution is a lie of the devil.

Double standard, for starters.

 

[Subduction Zone]

What's keeping me believing it, then?

Your gullibility.

Your gullibility set up a belief in Christianity. Once a belief system is adopted it is very hard to get rid of. That is why over 90% of the people out there are the same religion of their parents. And if you do end up switching the odds are again that you will switch to the most popular religion where you live.

 

[CabVet]

What converted Josh Macdowell and others who set out to dispel the Bible, but became believers?

No idea, but I can tell you without a doubt that it is not the same thing that leads children and aborigines to become believers. Anybody could convince children and aborigines to follow the flying spaghetti monster if they were insistent enough.

 

[Loudmouth]

The belief that those mountains are built on sand.

And yet they stand, and have stood after hundreds of years of challenges.

You are not talking about faith. You are talking about delusion. Faith is a belief held in the absence of evidence, not in contradiction to the evidence. Delusion is a belief held when the evidence indicates that it isn't true.

 

[Subduction Zone]

What converted Josh Macdowell and others who set out to dispel the Bible, but became believers?

His foolishness. Josh tried to prove a negative claim. That can be almost impossible. Instead he should have demanded that Christians prove a positive claim. The burden of proof is upon the Christians, it was not upon Josh.

 

[AV1611VET]

Your gullibility.

Somehow I get the impression you don't work for a psychiatrist.

Nor do I get the impression you know the difference between gullibility and faith.

 

[AV1611VET]

No idea, but I can tell you without a doubt that it is not the same thing that leads children and aborigines to become believers. Anybody could convince children and aborigines to follow the flying spaghetti monster if they were insistent enough.

And again, what (or more appropriately, Who) keeps them believing ... even to the point of martyrdom if it comes to that?

 

[EternalDragon]

You tell me. What causes you to hold on to a belief in the face of mountains of contradictory evidence?

Mountains of evidence?

Incomplete fossil record
Similarities in form
Similarities in DNA
E.Coli going backwards and losing function
that already had the gained ability in wild form

That's about the size of the mountain which fits creation a whole lot better.

 

[lasthero]

Incomplete fossil record

Yes, we will never find a fossil for every living thing that ever existed. So?

Similarities in form
Similarities in DNA

Yeah.

E.Coli going backwards and losing function

Going backwards? Explain.

That's about the size of the mountain which fits creation a whole lot better.

What wouldn't fit creation, in your mind? What evidence would, to you, speak against it?

 

[Loudmouth]

Mountains of evidence?

Incomplete fossil record

Every single fossil evidences evolution. That's all of them.

Similarities in form

We observe evolution producing similarities in form. We have never observed a deity producing two species with shared similarities.

Similarities in DNA

Same as above.

E.Coli going backwards and losing function
that already had the gained ability in wild form

So I guess all land animals have gone backwards because they lost the functions found in their fish ancestors. Right?

 

[Loudmouth]

And again, what (or more appropriately, Who) keeps them believing ... even to the point of martyrdom if it comes to that?

What keeps Hindus believing in their gods?

 

[bhsmte]

Your gullibility.

Your gullibility set up a belief in Christianity. Once a belief system is adopted it is very hard to get rid of. That is why over 90% of the people out there are the same religion of their parents. And if you do end up switching the odds are again that you will switch to the most popular religion where you live.

You nailed it and psychological studies have confirmed the same. Psychology of belief, is a powerful mechanism in many people and is driven by each person's own psychological needs.

This is why you see so many defense mechanisms kick in (cognitive dissonance, confirmation bias, etc.) when a belief is challenged with objective evidence. In some, the belief has to win out, no matter what the evidence shows and the hole just keeps getting deeper and deeper.

 

[Split Rock]

Mountains of evidence?

Incomplete fossil record
Similarities in form
Similarities in DNA
E.Coli going backwards and losing function
that already had the gained ability in wild form

That's about the size of the mountain which fits creation a whole lot better.

You forgot the embryology I mentioned to you. Like human tails, and dolphin leg buds. Or atavisms, like whales born with rear legs... or just the fact that whales have a pelvis with out any legs. Or how some snakes have vestigial legs? Or how about the panda's pseudo-thumb? Or biogeography? Or the lack of placental mammals indiginous to Australia? Or.... I can go on and on.

 

[EternalDragon]

You forgot the embryology I mentioned to you. Like human tails, and dolphin leg buds. Or atavisms, like whales born with rear legs... or just the fact that whales have a pelvis with out any legs. Or how some snakes have vestigial legs? Or how about the panda's pseudo-thumb? Or biogeography? Or the lack of placental mammals indiginous to Australia? Or.... I can go on and on.

Can you show me if any of that has become fixed in a species? It would seem what you are describing is something we could easily find in the fossil record in abundance as a gradual change. Or easily test and repeat?

A few of those are not as you describe though. The snake has those "legs" for sexual intercourse as well as the whales having a hip bone for certain muscle attachments. The vestigial "legs" that I saw were just extra flippers. The tails in humans are a lump of extra skin.

 

[Loudmouth]

A few of those are not as you describe though. The snake has those "legs" for sexual intercourse as well as the whales having a hip bone for certain muscle attachments. The vestigial "legs" that I saw were just extra flippers. The tails in humans are a lump of extra skin.

Vestigial organs can have function and still be vestigial. Vestigial does not mean "without function".