Zechariah 14

[Houly]

Has Zechariah 14 already been fulfilled, or will it be fulfilled in the future?

Zechariah 14 NIV - The LORD Comes and Reigns - A day of - Bible Gateway

 

[HannibalFlavius]

Has Zechariah 14 already been fulfilled, or will it be fulfilled in the future?

Zechariah 14 NIV - The LORD Comes and Reigns - A day of - Bible Gateway

No, Of course not.

When you see God strengthen Judah, and the Christians see it.

When you see Christians flooding to the feast of Tabernacles.

The feast of Tabernacles is the fall rain which Jesus comes to fulfill.

Zechariah is implying that a day will come to judge people who are not already celebrating the feast of Tabernacles.

And then a time that if they don't celebrate it, it brings plagues on the nation that doesn't.

 

[hiscosmicgoldfish]

It's talking about the day of the Lord, and after, but seems to be anachronistic, with mention of Canaanites, which no longer exist as a people group, and is before the revelation of Christ, when such people as Canaanites (some of them) are grafted into the new covenant.. if they were assimilated into the invading Arab-Muslim hoard, (much like the Borg) and are now called 'Arabs'.

I'm not sure what it's about really. I doubt it is literally so. But I don't know what to make of it.
It might be talking about a new situation, where the religion of the Israelites is respected and such, by the Egyptians and other peoples around the world, like during the Christian era and after, but framed in the language of the ancient Israelites. That's the best I can do.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

It's talking about the day of the Lord, and after, but seems to be anachronistic, with mention of Canaanites, which no longer exist as a people group, and is before the revelation of Christ, when such people as Canaanites (some of them) are grafted into the new covenant.. if they were assimilated into the invading Arab-Muslim hoard, (much like the Borg) and are now called 'Arabs'.

I'm not sure what it's about really. I doubt it is literally so. But I don't know what to make of it.
It might be talking about a new situation, where the religion of the Israelites is respected and such, by the Egyptians and other peoples around the world, like during the Christian era and after, but framed in the language of the ancient Israelites. That's the best I can do.

The prophets teach of a Passover for the Egyptians and the Assyrians.

They wander in a desert for 40 years{symbolic} and they take on the exact same Feast days in common with Israel.

The Egyptians, the Assyrians and the Israelites become ONE.

The 3 ARE one.

They represent body, soul and spirit.

A Philistine represents flesh just as Esau does, just as Ishmael does, just as Cain did.


But the prophets do speak of another Passover and another feast of Tabernacles for non Jews.

The Jews know of this later Passover of Egyptians and Assyrians but they claim it speaks of Jews who were living in that area because they cant admit what the real truth is.

That the whole world becomes one.

 

[Interplanner]

There is already a list here of the NT uses of Zechariah. It delves beyond the simple focus of this question. Generally, the NT says these things were fulfilled in the Christ event, and does not provide tiny scissors and tweezers to the reader for splitting out phrases and particles here and there.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

There is already a list here of the NT uses of Zechariah. It delves beyond the simple focus of this question. Generally, the NT says these things were fulfilled in the Christ event, and does not provide tiny scissors and tweezers to the reader for splitting out phrases and particles here and there.

So the whole world celebrates the feast of Tabernacles Interplanner?

I have seen people try to rationalize saying it means something else, but most people say its for the Messianic age.

But it HAS NOT HAPPENED.

 

[Codger]

Zechariah 14 has not happened yet? Only if you interpret this book literally.

Dr. David L. Cooper, the founder of The Biblical Research Society, was proficient in the Biblical languages. He studied Greek under Dr. A. T. Robertson. Dr. Cooper is known for his “Golden Rule of Interpretation” which is as follows:

When the plain sense of Scripture​

makes common sense,​

seek no other sense;​

Therefore, take every word​

at its primary, ordinary,​

usual, literal meaning​

Unless the facts​

of the immediate context,​

studied in the light​

Of related passages and​

axiomatic and fundamental truths​

indicate clearly otherwise.​

This is the adopted interpretive doctrine of Futurism; and it is one of the more serious errors of the Church today. This hermeneutic can never apply to Apocalyptic books of the Bible - never.

Ezekiel, Zechariah, Daniel and most of Revelation are all fulfilled. This can be seen if you interpret them as apocalyptic - they cannot be literal. Zechariah 9-14 is all about the coming Messiah (Zechariah lived about 500 years before the time of Jesus.) his bringing in of the New Covenant.

 

[hiscosmicgoldfish]

8 I saw by night, and behold, a man riding on a red horse, and it stood among the myrtle trees in the hollow; and behind him were horses: red, sorrel, and white. 9 Then I said, “My lord, what are these?” So the angel who talked with me said to me, “I will show you what they are.”
10 And the man who stood among the myrtle trees answered and said, “These are the ones whom the Lord has sent to walk to and fro throughout the earth.”
11 So they answered the Angel of the Lord, who stood among the myrtle trees, and said, “We have walked to and fro throughout the earth, and behold, all the earth is resting quietly.

two red horses, a white horse, and a sorrel (chestnut coloured) horse. what is this all about? anybody?

 

[ebedmelech]

The poll ignores a category! Which would be partially fulfilled and partially future.

That would be the case of Zechariah 14! However understanding this begins with Zechariah 12.

Zechariah 14 has portions to yet be fulfilled. Especially when it comes to the Feast of Booths (Tabernacles), which is symbolic of God living among us.

That would be found in Revelation 21: 3, 4:
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and He will dwell among them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself will be among them,
4 and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be any death; there will no longer be any mourning, or crying, or pain; the first things have passed away.”

It points to eternity!

 

[HannibalFlavius]

The poll ignores a category! Which would be partially fulfilled and partially future.

That would be the case of Zechariah 14! However understanding this begins with Zechariah 12.

Zechariah 14 has portions to yet be fulfilled. Especially when it comes to the Feast of Booths (Tabernacles), which is symbolic of God living among us.

That would be found in Revelation 21: 3, 4:
3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne, saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is among men, and He will dwell among them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself will be among them,
4 and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be any death; there will no longer be any mourning, or crying, or pain; the first things have passed away.”

It points to eternity!

It points to a day when all Israel are to be gathered together.

God comes to the Jews when the time of the gentiles is fulfilled.

When all the gentiles have come into the covenant that are supposed to come, it is then that God turns back to Judah and opens his eyes within them.

God comes to Judah FIRST, so that the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem cannot boast above Judah.

God then saves the lost tents of Joseph and brings them back from Paganism and they take on the feast of Tabernacles or they are punished.

When God comes to strengthen Judah, the whole world will take notice because God says he will turn all Jews back to the one who was pierced.

It is at this time that 10 gentile Christians will reach out to grab ahold of a Jewish man saying,'' Let us also go up with you.''

Joseph is found and the children of Joseph become very proud because they are gentiles who are considered to be true Israel.

Then Judah and Joseph together will fight the whole world and people will tremble at just the mention of the name Judah.

This has NEVER happened.

Then the gentiles bring the wealth of the nations to the combined Joseph and Judah.

These are Christians and Jews who have now become believers.

The scriptures of Joseph under the name of Ephraim combined with Judah to become kings of the world has never happened.

It will happen when Christians come back to the religion of God.

The 15th of Nisan is set apart for the birth of the Messiah just as Passover is set for the death of the Messiah.

Jesus was born in a Booth on the first day of the feast of Booths, and on the GREAT 8th day, he was circumcised and this day of Simchat Torah is set for circumcision.

Simchat Torah is the day that gentiles are cut away from Israel.

7 days of camping in booths for all the nations. 70 bulls sacrificed for the 70 nations. But the gentiles are sent home on the 7th day, and the 8th day is ONLY for true Israel.

Gentiles leaving Christmas and taking on the feast of Tabernacles is what is taking place in Zechariah.


We know that the Jews will be turned to God, and we know that Christians and Jews will become one people.

But the Jews are not going to except the Pagan festivals that they are warned never to keep.

The Jews will be even more zealous for the ways of God and the Torah when they believe in Jesus, just as the first believers did.


But the end is about Gentiles coming back to the feasts of God and leaving the Pagan feasts of Pagan Gods behind.


..

 

[Interplanner]

you're half and half, Hanni. Half Christian and half Judaism. Does that sound like the letter of Hebrews mindset to you?

 

[ebedmelech]

It points to a day when all Israel are to be gathered together.

God comes to the Jews when the time of the gentiles is fulfilled.

When all the gentiles have come into the covenant that are supposed to come, it is then that God turns back to Judah and opens his eyes within them.

God comes to Judah FIRST, so that the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem cannot boast above Judah.

God then saves the lost tents of Joseph and brings them back from Paganism and they take on the feast of Tabernacles or they are punished.

When God comes to strengthen Judah, the whole world will take notice because God says he will turn all Jews back to the one who was pierced.

It is at this time that 10 gentile Christians will reach out to grab ahold of a Jewish man saying,'' Let us also go up with you.''

Joseph is found and the children of Joseph become very proud because they are gentiles who are considered to be true Israel.

Then Judah and Joseph together will fight the whole world and people will tremble at just the mention of the name Judah.

This has NEVER happened.

Then the gentiles bring the wealth of the nations to the combined Joseph and Judah.

These are Christians and Jews who have now become believers.

The scriptures of Joseph under the name of Ephraim combined with Judah to become kings of the world has never happened.

It will happen when Christians come back to the religion of God.

The 15th of Nisan is set apart for the birth of the Messiah just as Passover is set for the death of the Messiah.

Jesus was born in a Booth on the first day of the feast of Booths, and on the GREAT 8th day, he was circumcised and this day of Simchat Torah is set for circumcision.

Simchat Torah is the day that gentiles are cut away from Israel.

7 days of camping in booths for all the nations. 70 bulls sacrificed for the 70 nations. But the gentiles are sent home on the 7th day, and the 8th day is ONLY for true Israel.

Gentiles leaving Christmas and taking on the feast of Tabernacles is what is taking place in Zechariah.


We know that the Jews will be turned to God, and we know that Christians and Jews will become one people.

But the Jews are not going to except the Pagan festivals that they are warned never to keep.

The Jews will be even more zealous for the ways of God and the Torah when they believe in Jesus, just as the first believers did.


But the end is about Gentiles coming back to the feasts of God and leaving the Pagan feasts of Pagan Gods behind.


..

There's only one Israel God is concerned with...it is a spiritual Israel known as the Israel of God or true Israel.

God made the TWO (Jews and Gentiles) int ONE NEW MAN!!! (Ephesians 2:15).

Peter tell us this as he says believers are A HOLY NATION!!! That is the Israel of God!!!

 

[vinsight4u]

/

 

[Manasseh_]

when I first read this prophecy I found a number of obvious reasons why it's yet to be fulfilled but what really caught my attention was the fact that Egypt is mentioned as coming to give homage to the King of kings and to keep the feast.............this caught my attention because at the time Egypt had the highest muslim population although I think now its about 4th or 5th and Indonesia is the higest...........but here was a nation that still exists and most of this nation believing in Alah and Muhaamad but now renouncing them and believing the true God and Christ

 

[HannibalFlavius]

There's only one Israel God is concerned with...it is a spiritual Israel known as the Israel of God or true Israel.

God made the TWO (Jews and Gentiles) int ONE NEW MAN!!! (Ephesians 2:15).

Peter tell us this as he says believers are A HOLY NATION!!! That is the Israel of God!!!

The first Pagans dropped all their Pagan ways for the ways of God.

They were tortured, killed, taxed, persecuted by all of Rome because they refused the Saturnalia and the other Pagan feasts of Baal and other Pagan Gods.

Those gentile died but they in fact became the family of God.


Did the first converts do this for nothing?

Were the first Pagan converts killed and tortured for nothing?


The persecution was so bad that by the time Revelation was written, they were already going back to their Pagan ways.

In 135 A.d., a great number of Christians made a deal to accept the Saturnalia and to do away with these new ways of God.

So were the first converts stupid when they were being killed for abandoning all their Pagan ways?


Or does God demand that his people not involve themselves in the ways of Pagan Gods?

I don't see a conversion taking place if a Pagan takes all his Pagan Sabbaths and feasts, and rituals and traditions and then keeps them, and tosses the religion of God out the window.

If this were so easy, then the first Pagan converts had no reason to die because they believed in Jesus.

So I ask,'' Did the first Pagan Converts leave all their Paganism behind for nothing?''

Were they killed for no reason?

No, They will rule and reign with Christ because they gave their life up in refusing their old Pagan ways.

Those people were adopted because they left Paganism behind, or else the adoption would have never taken place.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

This is why we see the whole world accepting the feast of Tabernacles in the end.


Converts must come back to God, or get punished.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

I would say that the gentile who believes in Jesus has gained salvation.

But I would also say that whoever does not practice the ways of God, and whoever teaches other people not to practice the ways of God will be called,'' Least in the kingdom of Heaven.''


I would also say that the word,'' Stranger'' means,'' Gentile.''

That the gentile is adopted and becomes a part of the true Israel because he converted to the ways of God even if it killed him and his family. Even when he had to watch his children being killed before he died, he never denied Christ.

He made up his mind that he should follow the Passover lamb and no other God.

But there is a day when the gentile believers will be split from the gentiles who have gained true adoption.


This is the outer court of Gentiles, and it is for people who remain gentiles.

It is a court of darkness that people are sent to because they changed the times and seasons of God.

There is still salvation but this is in darkness with weeping and gnashing of teeth and fear of the second death.

 

[ebedmelech]

I would say that the gentile who believes in Jesus has gained salvation.

But I would also say that whoever does not practice the ways of God, and whoever teaches other people not to practice the ways of God will be called,'' Least in the kingdom of Heaven.''


I would also say that the word,'' Stranger'' means,'' Gentile.''

That the gentile is adopted and becomes a part of the true Israel because he converted to the ways of God even if it killed him and his family. Even when he had to watch his children being killed before he died, he never denied Christ.

He made up his mind that he should follow the Passover lamb and no other God.

But there is a day when the gentile believers will be split from the gentiles who have gained true adoption.


This is the outer court of Gentiles, and it is for people who remain gentiles.

It is a court of darkness that people are sent to because they changed the times and seasons of God.

There is still salvation but this is in darkness with weeping and gnashing of teeth and fear of the second death.

Read this carefully:
Romans 9:6-8:
6 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel;
7 nor are they all children because they are Abraham’s descendants, but: “through Isaac your descendants will be named.”
8 That is, it is not the children of the flesh who are children of God, but the children of the promise are regarded as descendants.

The apostle just told you who true Israel is!!!

 

[HannibalFlavius]

Read this carefully:
Romans 9:6-8:
6 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel;
7 nor are they all children because they are Abraham’s descendants, but: “through Isaac your descendants will be named.”
8 That is, it is not the children of the flesh who are children of God, but the children of the promise are regarded as descendants.

The apostle just told you who true Israel is!!!

And I completely agree, I AM of Israel{But not grafted through Judah} although I was born a gentile.

But I would tell you this--- I stood in the gentile court of darkness all my life because I never converted to God's ways until recent times.

The first gentiles that this scripture spoke about is not the same Christians we see today.

These adopted gentiles absolutely left the religion they were in.

They went about telling their fellow Romans that they could no longer take part in Traditions and rituals of Pagan Gods.

They were tortured and killed just because they left the Saturnalia.


The Roman Pagans 100 years later who never changed their ways are not the same as the first gentiles who changed their ways and died.

The first were converts and they truly converted and were truly adopted and they died for it.

300 years later there was no reason whatsoever for a gentile to die for Christ.

The gentiles no longer converted to the religion of God.

They created laws against any gentile keeping the traditions of God.

They no longer converted, they took all their Sabbaths, all the feast days and Holy Pagan traditions and they simply said,'' These are our Gods''


This is not the same gentile converts as the first converts who truly converted.




..

 

[ebedmelech]

And I completely agree, I AM of Israel{But not grafted through Judah} although I was born a gentile.

But I would tell you this--- I stood in the gentile court of darkness all my life because I never converted to God's ways until recent times.

The first gentiles that this scripture spoke about is not the same Christians we see today.

These adopted gentiles absolutely left the religion they were in.

They went about telling their fellow Romans that they could no longer take part in Traditions and rituals of Pagan Gods.

They were tortured and killed just because they left the Saturnalia.


The Roman Pagans 100 years later who never changed their ways are not the same as the first gentiles who changed their ways and died.

The first were converts and they truly converted and were truly adopted and they died for it.

300 years later there was no reason whatsoever for a gentile to die for Christ.

The gentiles no longer converted to the religion of God.

They created laws against any gentile keeping the traditions of God.

They no longer converted, they took all their Sabbaths, all the feast days and Holy Pagan traditions and they simply said,'' These are our Gods''


This is not the same gentile converts as the first converts who truly converted.

..

Paul doesn't agree with you:
27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.
28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.

Notice " There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female"...when you make a difference...you depart from the truth of scripture.