Why do bad things happen to good people?

[Soulgazer]

If God is not involved in all our ativities, that thinking would be as Deist.
Deism is a religion where it is generally believed that God is not (wholly or in part) involved in the affairs of human history. They do believe that God created the world and everything in it. They do believe that there is one God, though they reject the trinity. However, for the most part, the Deists do not believe that God is involved with our lives. God created the world and basically gave it all that it needed to run itself. All, to the Deists, is governed by nature and natural laws. All we can know about God could be found in nature. They reject the Bible, revelations, and the like because those are man-made things invented through the superstition.
In any case the Deists believe that God is not concerned (though at various levels) with human history. Therefore, we are all headed towards whatever fate has for us and whatever our greed and superstition may take us.
This general idea about God’s relation to His creation is widespread, though not as popular as it was in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. As a matter of fact, some of the founding fathers of the United States of America were deists. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Paine were Deists.

Good post! The early U.S. was a Deist nation; our bill of rights was based on the Deist natural principles;

If you were alone on this continent what would your rights be? These are your God given rights, according to those principles. A Government cannot give you rights, only take them away.

There is a certain inherent truth to those principles, otherwise we would not have fought so hard to keep them.

Applying that to the thread, can we all agree that some bad things happen just because we are not alone on a continent?

 

[Evergreen48]

So, if you are walking down the street and trip on a crack in the sidewalk - then that is no accident or random event? Are you saying that God is repsonsible for that?

God might have been responsible for that if, say for instance, your tripping on a crack in the sidewalk slowed you up just enough that the piano that fell from a third story window above the sidewalk just missed you by inches when it fell right in front of you as you walked on down the sidewalk after you tripped. But I do believe that as a general rule God didn't care one way or the other about your tripping on the crack. That's just one of those things that might happen as we proceed through the normal course of activity in our daily lives . I believe God would definitely have a specific purpose in mind for deliberately causing something as common and insignificant as that to happen.

 

[Senecharnix]

Deism is not monolithic. The theological philosophies of its adherents range from nearly Christian to nearly atheistic. Though all of its theological philosophies are flawed, they tend to be far more sensible in some ways than do the theological philosophies spouted by most so-called Christians, which make God sound like a cosmic Machiavellian delighting in playing games with us mortals. It is absurd to assert that God has given us free will then suggest that He obsessively interfers in our affairs. Things are the way they are mostly because we humans have long chosen to mix folly with wisdom, while doing whatever pleases us. Both God and the Devil mostly influence us as voices of the heart and psyche, whispering counsel. Unfortunately, most of us choose to listen to the Devil's whispers....

 

[timewerx]

I would not count my chickens before they hatch.

Job 21:30 That the wicked is reserved to the day of destruction? they shall be brought forth to the day of wrath.

You misunderstood me. I said 'long and good life'

Implying just this life on Earth.

The wicked live long and good lives on Earth, and it's quite a common phenomenon. Not every wicked person's life is ended by wrath today.

But of course, those who die in wickedness will not be resurrected.

If God is not involved in all our ativities, that thinking would be as Deist.

Although you believe that God is involved in our activities, you keep pushing for the idea that those who are abundant in worldly wealth is a result of their good karma.

It actually opposes the teachings of Jesus on several accounts. First, Jesus treats worldly wealth as detestable, of no worth/value, 'food that spoils', and will actually endanger your salvation. Money/wealth is everything opposite of God.

Jesus demolishes the concept of karma by removing all value in the things of this world. The only reason to believe in karma is to value the things of this world and oppose the teachings of Jesus.

Wealth is for giving, not for keeping according to Jesus. You will literally end up poor if you really love Jesus and his people.

Here's your scriptural proof:

Luke 16:15 He said to them, "You are the ones who justify yourselves in the eyes of men, but God knows your hearts. What is highly valued among men is detestable in God's sight.

John 6:27 Do not work for food that spoils, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. For on him God the Father has placed his seal of approval.

Luke 12:33 Sell your possessions and give to the poor. Provide purses for yourselves that will not wear out, a treasure in heaven that will not be exhausted, where no thief comes near and no moth destroys.

Luke 3:11 John answered, “Anyone who has two shirts should share with the one who has none, and anyone who has food should do the same.”

Matthew 25:44-46 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ 45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”

Matthew 19:23 Then Jesus said to his disciples, “Truly I tell you, it is hard for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 6:24 “No one can serve two masters. Either you will hate the one and love the other, or you will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and money.

Luke 14:26 "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters--yes, even his own life--he cannot be my disciple.

Matthew 19:29 And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife[e] or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life

Matthew 10:37 Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me

Matthew 19:27 Peter answered him, “We have left everything to follow you! What then will there be for us?”

Matthew 28:19-20Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”

Matthew 8:19-20 Then a teacher of the law came to him and said, “Teacher, I will follow you wherever you go.”
20 Jesus replied, “Foxes have dens and birds have nests, but the Son of Man has no place to lay his head.”

James 4:4 You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.

1 John 2:15 Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

Matthew 7:22-23 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’

Revelations 20:13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.

 

[Ran77]

God might have been responsible for that if, say for instance, your tripping on a crack in the sidewalk slowed you up just enough that the piano that fell from a third story window above the sidewalk just missed you by inches when it fell right in front of you as you walked on down the sidewalk after you tripped. But I do believe that as a general rule God didn't care one way or the other about your tripping on the crack. That's just one of those things that might happen as we proceed through the normal course of activity in our daily lives . I believe God would definitely have a specific purpose in mind for deliberately causing something as common and insignificant as that to happen.

I agree.

 

[Ran77]

As the T-shirt says; Trips Happen

I haven't seen the t-shirt, but I agree that trips happen.

 

[Ran77]

If God is not involved in all our ativities, that thinking would be as Deist.

Okay.

In any case the Deists believe that God is not concerned (though at various levels) with human history. Therefore, we are all headed towards whatever fate has for us and whatever our greed and superstition may take us.
This general idea about God’s relation to His creation is widespread, though not as popular as it was in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. As a matter of fact, some of the founding fathers of the United States of America were deists. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Paine were Deists.

I'm not really seeing how this is relevant to my statement.

However, since you brought it up , I don't see how God not being responsible for people tripping over cracks in the sidewalk is an indication that He is unconcerned with human history. That's an incredibly big jump from a minor incident to a general apathy on His part. Isn't that a little bit extreme?

:o

 

[funtimes]

I agree.

If God has your hair numbered and knows when you lose one, He also cares about you tripping. We don't always know the reason why some would fall and break a leg and others just a warning to be aware.

God has placed angels to watch over us and record all good and bad we do...Exodus 23:20-23

 

[Ran77]

If God has your hair numbered and knows when you lose one, He also cares about you tripping. We don't always know the reason why some would fall and break a leg and others just a warning to be aware.

God has placed angels to watch over us and record all good and bad we do...Exodus 23:20-23

And how does that rule out that some things just happen?

 

[funtimes]

And how does that rule out that some things just happen?

That belief would make you a Diest and would put you in company with some of the founding fathers of the United States of America who were deists. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Paine were Deists.

 

[P1LGR1M]

That belief would make you a Diest and would put you in company with some of the founding fathers of the United States of America who were deists. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Paine were Deists.

Hello funtimes, nice to meet you. I won't intrude on the discussion except to mention a book recently put out by, I think, Greg Frazier. he looks at the faith of the founding fathers and terms them Rational Theists.

Some years ago my neice did a book report on Abigail Adams and she was quoted in the report, and you could not read her words without seeing she was monothieistic. I was amazed by this.

Okay, lol, that was it.

God bless.

 

[Ran77]

That belief would make you a Diest and would put you in company with some of the founding fathers of the United States of America who were deists. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Paine were Deists.

Not based on the description you gave. You stated: "Deists believe that God is not concerned (though at various levels) with human history."


God not being responsible for someone tripping over a crack in the cement is a looooooong cry from being unconcerned with human history. They aren't even remotely the same thing. God can be concerned with human history and not control the minutia in our lives. Both are possible at the same time.


:o

 

[he-man]

Deism is not monolithic. The theological philosophies of its adherents range from nearly Christian to nearly atheistic. Though all of its theological philosophies are flawed, they tend to be far more sensible in some ways than do the theological philosophies spouted by most so-called Christians, which make God sound like a cosmic Machiavellian delighting in playing games with us mortals. It is absurd to assert that God has given us free will then suggest that He obsessively interfers in our affairs. Things are the way they are mostly because we humans have long chosen to mix folly with wisdom, while doing whatever pleases us. Both God and the Devil mostly influence us as voices of the heart and psyche, whispering counsel. Unfortunately, most of us choose to listen to the Devil's whispers....

You cannot limit the power of God.
Pro 16:4 The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

The Satan doctrine is one of the most deceptive and corrupt doctrines to ever enter Christendom, and which has been embraced and promoted by false teachers for thousands of years.

Job 42:11 Then came there unto him all his brethren, and all his sisters, and all they that had been of his acquaintance before, and did eat bread with him in his house: and they bemoaned him, and comforted him over all the evil that the LORD had brought upon him

In mainstream Judaism there is no concept of a devil like in mainstream Christianity or Islam. In Hebrew, the biblical word ha-satan means "the adversary" or the obstacle, or even "the prosecutor" (recognizing that God is viewed as the ultimate Judge).

Much "Satanic" lore does not originate from actual Satanists, but from Christians. Best-known would be the medieval folklore and theology surrounding demons and witches.

Satan Sa'tan. The word itself, the Hebrew satan, is simply an "adversary," and is so used in 1 Sam 29:4; 2 Sam 19:22; 1 Kin 6:4; 11:14, 23, 25; Numb 22:22, 33; Psal 109:6

There is no unambiguous reference to the Devil in the Torah, the Prophets, or the Writings.
Carus P. History of the Devil and the Idea of Evil

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]Τhe same slander is imρlied rather than expessed in the temptations of our Lord, and is oνercome bγ the faith which trusts in Gods love even where its sign may be hidden from the eye (comρ. the unmasking of a similar slander by Peter in Acts 5, 4). [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]But in truth, the question touches on two mysteries, the relation of the infinite to the finite sρirit, and the permission of the existence of evil under the government of him whom is "the Good." As a part of these it must be viewed —to the latter esρecially it belongs; and this latter, while it is the great mystery of all, is also one in which the facts are proved to us by incontrovertible evidence.—Smith, s. v. [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]Lev. 17, 7, the word translated " deνil" is (sair', hairy), ordinarily a"goat," but rendered " satyr" in Isa. 34, 14 ; probably alluding to the wood-daemons, resembling he-goats, supposed to live in deserts, and which were an objects of idolatry and beast worship anon the Heathens[/FONT]​

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]The belief of the Hebrews down to the Babylonian exile seems but dimly to have recognized either Satan or demons, at least as a dogmatic tenet, nor had it many occasions for them, since it treated moral evils as a properly humans act (comp. Gen. 3), and always as subjective and concrete, but regarded misfortunes according to teleological axioms, as a punishment deserved on account of sin at the hand of a righteous God, who inflicted it especially by the agency of one of his angels(2 Sam. 24,16; comp. 2 kings xix, 35), and was according looked upon as the proper author of every afflictive disρensation (Amos 3, 64, Apparitions were part of the ρoρular creed : there were beings inimical to mankind inhabiting solitude, but not yet adopted in the association of religious ideas. [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]Earlier, indeed, a Satan, so called by way of eminence, occasionally appears as the malicious author of human misfortune, but only under the divine superintendence: e. g. incites David to a sinful act, (1 Chron. 21, 1); casts suspicions upon Job's piety (Job 1, 6' sq.), and, with Jehovah's permission, inflicts upon him a lot gradually more severe to the utmost point of endurance; appears as the mendacious impeacher (α κατηυωρ, Rey. 12, 10) οf the high-priest Joshua before the angel of God, but draws upon himself the divine malediction (Zech. 3, 1 sq.). Yet in all this he is as little like the Ahriman of the Zend Aνesta (Rhode, Heil. Sage, p. 182 sq.; Matthai, Religionsgloube d. Apostel, II, i, 171 sq.; Creuzer, Symbol. i. 705) as an indifferent prosecuting attorney general or judicial suρerintendent commissioned by Jehovah. [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif](in as much as from the hand of God only good can come, but against him, the Creator of the universe, no opposing being could originally exist) ; but through their own fault they fell (John 8, 44; 2 Pet. 2, 4; Jude 6);when Christ shall appear to overthrow the kingdom of [death] Satan (1 Cor. 15, 26; Heb. 2, 14; 1 John 2, 8). SEE Winer, 2, 385[/FONT]

 

[Senecharnix]

You cannot limit the power of God.
Pro 16:4 The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.

The Satan doctrine is one of the most deceptive and corrupt doctrines to ever enter Christendom, and which has been embraced and promoted by false teachers for thousands of years.

Job 42:11 Then came there unto him all his brethren, and all his sisters, and all they that had been of his acquaintance before, and did eat bread with him in his house: and they bemoaned him, and comforted him over all the evil that the LORD had brought upon him

In mainstream Judaism there is no concept of a devil like in mainstream Christianity or Islam. In Hebrew, the biblical word ha-satan means "the adversary" or the obstacle, or even "the prosecutor" (recognizing that God is viewed as the ultimate Judge).

Much "Satanic" lore does not originate from actual Satanists, but from Christians. Best-known would be the medieval folklore and theology surrounding demons and witches.

Satan Sa'tan. The word itself, the Hebrew satan, is simply an "adversary," and is so used in 1 Sam 29:4; 2 Sam 19:22; 1 Kin 6:4; 11:14, 23, 25; Numb 22:22, 33; Psal 109:6

There is no unambiguous reference to the Devil in the Torah, the Prophets, or the Writings.
Carus P. History of the Devil and the Idea of Evil

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]Τhe same slander is imρlied rather than expessed in the temptations of our Lord, and is oνercome bγ the faith which trusts in Gods love even where its sign may be hidden from the eye (comρ. the unmasking of a similar slander by Peter in Acts 5, 4). [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]But in truth, the question touches on two mysteries, the relation of the infinite to the finite sρirit, and the permission of the existence of evil under the government of him whom is "the Good." As a part of these it must be viewed —to the latter esρecially it belongs; and this latter, while it is the great mystery of all, is also one in which the facts are proved to us by incontrovertible evidence.—Smith, s. v. [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]Lev. 17, 7, the word translated " deνil" is (sair', hairy), ordinarily a"goat," but rendered " satyr" in Isa. 34, 14 ; probably alluding to the wood-daemons, resembling he-goats, supposed to live in deserts, and which were an objects of idolatry and beast worship anon the Heathens[/FONT]​

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]The belief of the Hebrews down to the Babylonian exile seems but dimly to have recognized either Satan or demons, at least as a dogmatic tenet, nor had it many occasions for them, since it treated moral evils as a properly humans act (comp. Gen. 3), and always as subjective and concrete, but regarded misfortunes according to teleological axioms, as a punishment deserved on account of sin at the hand of a righteous God, who inflicted it especially by the agency of one of his angels(2 Sam. 24,16; comp. 2 kings xix, 35), and was according looked upon as the proper author of every afflictive disρensation (Amos 3, 64, Apparitions were part of the ρoρular creed : there were beings inimical to mankind inhabiting solitude, but not yet adopted in the association of religious ideas. [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]Earlier, indeed, a Satan, so called by way of eminence, occasionally appears as the malicious author of human misfortune, but only under the divine superintendence: e. g. incites David to a sinful act, (1 Chron. 21, 1); casts suspicions upon Job's piety (Job 1, 6' sq.), and, with Jehovah's permission, inflicts upon him a lot gradually more severe to the utmost point of endurance; appears as the mendacious impeacher (α κατηυωρ, Rey. 12, 10) οf the high-priest Joshua before the angel of God, but draws upon himself the divine malediction (Zech. 3, 1 sq.). Yet in all this he is as little like the Ahriman of the Zend Aνesta (Rhode, Heil. Sage, p. 182 sq.; Matthai, Religionsgloube d. Apostel, II, i, 171 sq.; Creuzer, Symbol. i. 705) as an indifferent prosecuting attorney general or judicial suρerintendent commissioned by Jehovah. [/FONT]

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif](in as much as from the hand of God only good can come, but against him, the Creator of the universe, no opposing being could originally exist) ; but through their own fault they fell (John 8, 44; 2 Pet. 2, 4; Jude 6);when Christ shall appear to overthrow the kingdom of [death] Satan (1 Cor. 15, 26; Heb. 2, 14; 1 John 2, 8). SEE Winer, 2, 385[/FONT]

He-man, you are probably a fine fellow. I entertain no doubt that you mean well. But you are misguided by your knowledge and your desperation to understand things through an academic exploration of supposed truth. The problem for you is that no book—not even the Bible--reveals the full extent of the truth, or for that matter, very much of it compared to what there is to learn. Some of us on this forum have tried to testify about the truth to you only to have you wax academic ad nauseum. Believe it or not, some of us have learned various truths through God and through experience. You have no right to imply that we are crazy because we have encountered the Devil and demons, seen Heaven and/or Hell for ourselves, and received revelations and insights from God. Please, do not deny that you have done so. You are not nearly the only one to do so. But you are particularly bad about dressing your assertions and such in quotations from some supposed authority. It would be helpful if you could communicate from experience or revelation or at least use your own words most of the time rather than those of someone else….

I am not trying to limit God. The fact of the matter is that He (quite probably some other cosmic power) has limited Himself. Besides, as I previously suggested, it is ridiculous to assert that God gave us free will yet treats us like so many puppets. History has unfolded the way it has mostly because of the way that humans have thought and what they have done according to their own choices. We have lived and died according to the consequences of our decisions and actions. Sure, God intervenes some. He also protects and guides some individuals. But He has not played some silly, elaborate game at our expense and made a mocker of history by designing it. Enjoying free will means that we are responsible for what we do and how our history has unfolded. Otherwise, if God controls every aspect of our lives, every sin and mistake would be God’s fault. They are not His fault, however, because He had nothing to do with them. We are the captains of our own ships of fate and destiny….

By the way, despite your refusal to accept reality, the Devil is real and extremely powerful and influential. More humans listen to his song than listen to God's counsel. That is the main reason why we humans have made a mess out of our world. So, you can keep quoting scriptures and the opinions of supposed authorities until you turn blue. But Satan will still rule the nether regions and cause trouble in our reality. As I have said elsewhere in this forum, he has confronted me on three occasions. I have looked into his eyes. He exists and he is a monster....

 

[he-man]

He-man, you are probably a fine fellow. . Sure, God intervenes some. He also protects and guides some individuals. But He has not played some silly, elaborate game at our expense and made a mocker of history by designing it. . But Satan will still rule the nether regions and cause trouble in our reality. As I have said elsewhere in this forum, he has confronted me on three occasions. I have looked into his eyes. He exists and he is a monster....

Thanks for giving me the freewill choice to answer the way I choose to answer!

Τhe same slander is imρlied rather than expessed in the temptations of our Lord, and is oνercome bγ the faith which trusts in Gods love even where its sign may be hidden from the eye (comρ. the unmasking of a similar slander by Peter in Acts 5, 4).

People are the enemies of the cross, who disguise oneself as a false show or pretence claiming to be preachers of light, and to mask themselves hiding the real Jesus.

Matthew 13:28 (YLT) And he saith to them, A man, an enemy, did this; and the servants said to him, Wilt thou, then, that having gone away we may gather them up?

Rom. 9:22, where "fitted" is in the middle voice, indicating that the vessels of wrath fitted themselves for "destruction", of the adversaries of the Lord's people, Phil. 1:28 ("perdition"); of professing Christians, really enemies of the cross of Christ, Phil. 3:19

The present participle of the verb with the article, which is equivalent to a noun, signifies "an adversary," e.g., Luke 13:17; 21:15; 1 Cor. 16:9; Phil. 1:28; 1 Tim. 5:14. This construction is used of the Man of Sin, in 2 Thess. 2:4, and is translated "He that opposeth," where, adopting the noun form, we might render by "the opponent and self-exalter against...."

In Gal. 5:17 it is used of the antagonism between the Holy Spirit and the flesh in the believer; in 1 Tim. 1:10, of anything, in addition to persons, that is opposed to the doctrine of Christ. In these two places the word is rendered "contrary to.

In the Sept. it is used of [an opponent 7854] Satan, Zech. 3:1, 4 and of men, Job 13:24; Isa. 66:6.
Heb. 10:27, "adversaries." In each place a more violent form of opposition is suggested than in the case of enantios.
DEVIL, DEVILISH (διαβολος, 1228), "an accuser, a slanderer" (from diaballo, "to accuse, to malign"). The noun is applied to slanderers, false accusers, 1 Tim. 3:11; 2 Tim. 3:3; Titus 2:3.

Where then came the false belief of demons, devils, evil spirits?

As in after-ages, the heathens believed, that the world was governed by genii, hero-spirits, or daemons, by the appointment of the Deity; so in these earlier, and first ages of idolatry, they worshipped only the lights of Heaven, and the elements; allowing indeed a supreme Deity, but thinking these all had intelligence, and were appointed by him to govern the world.

Their kings and learned men did indeed know God, but they did not retain him so strictly in their knowledge as they ought to have done, but set up other deities besides, and instead of him. They thought that the Sun, Moon, Stars, and Elements, were appointed to govern the world'
THE CREATIONAND FALL OF M A N. By Samuel Shuckford D.D. Page 433

 

[funtimes]

Not based on the description you gave. You stated: "Deists believe that God is not concerned (though at various levels) with human history."


God not being responsible for someone tripping over a crack in the cement is a looooooong cry from being unconcerned with human history. They aren't even remotely the same thing. God can be concerned with human history and not control the minutia in our lives. Both are possible at the same time.


:o

If you broke your neck on the tripping, would you say God was responsible?
If God is aware of the hair on our head, He is aware of all our activies.

 

[eachallberg]

A few other verses to answer the OP...

Satan was given (/has) authority (Job).
So God's work can be done (Gospel).
Spiritual birth pains (Paul).

 

[Ran77]

If you broke your neck on the tripping, would you say God was responsible?
If God is aware of the hair on our head, He is aware of all our activies.

You are still relying on taking this to an extreme in order to justify your position.

 

[funtimes]

A few other verses to answer the OP...

Satan was given (/has) authority (Job).
So God's work can be done (Gospel).
Spiritual birth pains (Paul).

According to the bible, a devil only has the power that is allowed by God. God creates evil, not satan. Isaiah 45:7. In the amplified bible it says God creates physical evil and calamity. It seems most religious folks conveniently skip over this part of the bible.

I don't believe in a devil, but only regard it as a metaphor to explain unskillful living, or, an immature out of control ego is the devil.

To say that a satan has any power over God discredits God entirely. You do realize this right?

 

[eachallberg]

Peace and grace,

According to the bible, a devil only has the power that is allowed by God. God creates evil, not satan. Isaiah 45:7. In the amplified bible it says God creates physical evil and calamity. It seems most religious folks conveniently skip over this part of the bible.

The devil is known to pose as God and he claims it. The OT prophet says God creates good and evil. The NT prophet (author of 1 John) says God is good and NOT evil. I agree with the NT prophet.

Yahweh aka Yaldabaoth is a thief and destroyer (Christ in Gospel of John). I believe Yaldabaoth inspired Isaiah's skipped verse.

I don't believe in a devil, but only regard it as a metaphor to explain unskillful living, or, an immature out of control ego is the devil.

That's the best lie the devil has in the minds of people. Maybe one day you'll come face to face with the devil or one of his minions... I do agree with your attributes of the devil's work.
Possessions happen.

To say that a satan has any power over God discredits God entirely. You do realize this right?

When it comes to discrediting God for evil, there's nothing wrong.

I know the Light over comes darkness.
It's not Satan has power over God, but it's that the devil has got power like God.

Like the yin yang without the dots.