Why do some people think Hell isn't real?

[dollarsbill]

Kinda confused about that...

Can someone who doesn't believe in Hell give me a simple list of reasons why?

Yes, but it would HAVE to TOTALLY ignore the NT.

 

[he-man]

Yes, but it would HAVE to TOTALLY ignore the NT.

Simple, no devil, no hell, no torture! Hell is :
γεέναv Gehenna, a valley W. and H. of Jerusalem, which as the site of fire-worship from the time of Ahaz, was desecrated by Josiah and became a dumping-place for the offal of the city prob. with ref. to fires of Moloch.
Manual Greek Lexicon of the New Testament P. 89 G. ABBOTT-SMITH, D.D., D.G.L

offal ME: prob. suggested by MDu. afval, from af 'off' + vallen 'to fall'.
© Oxford University Press, 2004

ha-Satan: Yet in all this he is as little like the Ahriman of the Zend Aνesta (Rhode, Heil. Sage, p. 182 sq.; Matthai, Religionsgloube d. Apostel, II, i, 171 sq.; Creuzer, Symbol. i. 705) as an indifferent prosecuting attorney general or judicial suρerintendent commissioned by Jehovah. [See Gen 19:24]

Daemons are not mentioned in the canonical books of the Old Test., unless (with many interpreters) we understand "the host of the high ones" in Isa. 24, 21 [the kings of the earth, comp. Dan. 8. 8), the “he goat”] (comp. Isa. 14, 12), and interpret the whole passage as referring to the punishment [of the King of Babylon].

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]In the Aρocrypha, the old Hebrew notion of Jehovah's angels who allot disasteroccurs not partially, and in the case mishap over takes the enemies of the pious, the angels are alluded to as Auxiliaries and friends of the latter (2 Μacc. 15, 23 sq.), although we may search in vain such passages for a single mention of daemons.

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]On the other hand, the books of Tobias and Baruch concerning them.. (δαιμόνιa), while they never refer to Σαταν.
These beings dwell in waste places (Sept. at Isa. 13, 21; 34, 14) ; also ruins Rabe's trans; “they are the heathen gods,”; comp. Seρt, at Psa. 115, 5; 1 Cor, 10, 20);
The Targυm of Jonathan actually names, at Gen. 3, 6, Sammael as ' the "angel of death," see Gerlách, De angelo rnortis, Hal. 1731),'

Josephus knows nothing of Satan, but dáémons

(in as much as from the hand of God only good can come, but against him, the Creator of the universe, no opposing being could originally exist)

DAEMON. Lev. 17, 7, the word translated " deνil" is (sair', hairy), ordinarily a"goat," but rendered " satyr" in Isa. 34, 14 ; probably alluding to the wood-daemons, resembling he-goats, supposed to live in deserts, and which were an objects of idolatry and beast worship anon the Heathens. See SÁTÕR.
The term rendered "devil" in Deut. 32,17; Psa. 106, 37, is a (shed. properly lord, Sept. and Vulg. Daemon),: an idol.​

The belief of the Hebrews down to the Babylonian exile seems but dimly to have recognized either Satan or demons, at least as a dogmatic tenet, nor had it many occasions for them, since it treated moral evils as a properly humans act (comp. Gen. 3), and always as subjective and concrete, but regarded misfortunes according to teleological axioms, as a punishment deserved on account of sin at the hand of a righteous God, who inflicted it especially by the agency of one of his angels(2 Sam. 24,16; comp. 2 kings xix, 35), and was according looked upon as the proper author of every afflictive disρensation
Cyclopedia of Bibical Literature, James Strong

[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[dollarsbill]

Simple, no devil, no hell, no torture!

Then why are they in all of our English Bibles?

 

[he-man]

Then why are they in all of our English Bibles?

In plain English:

Accuser מאשים, lashan', in Iliph. "accuse," Prov. xxx, 10; and other terms signifying to slander ; more properly denoted by some form of the verb 2"1 "!, rib, to plead a cause, also in defence ; Sept. and N. T.​

[FONT=Courier, monospace]Αντιδικος, opponent" or κατήγορος, accuser [prosecutor]. (1.) The original word, which bears this leading signification, means one who has a cause or matter of contention ; the accuser, opponent, or plaintiff in any suit (Judg. xii, 2; Matt, v, 25; Luke xii, 58). [/FONT]
[FONT=Courier, monospace](Lewis, Origines Hebram, i, 68)[/FONT]​

[FONT=Courier, monospace]1Ch 21:12 ..or else three days the sword of the LORD, even the pestilence, in the land, and the angel of the LORD destroying throughout all the coasts of Israel. Now therefore advise thyself what word I shall bring again to him that sent me.

Isa 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the destroyer to destroy.

[FONT=Courier, monospace]The word is also applied in Scripture, in the general sense, to any adversary or enemy (Luke xviii, 3 ; 1 Pet. v, 8). [/FONT]​

[FONT=Courier, monospace][FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]In the New Test. dragοn (δρακω&#957 is only found in the Αροcalypse (Rev. xii, 3, 4, 7, 9, 16, 17, etc.), as applied metaphorically to "the old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan," the description of the “ dragon" being dictated by the symbolical meaning of the image rather than by any reference to any actually existing creature. [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Courier, monospace][FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif] Cyclopedia of Bibical Literature, James Strong[/FONT][/FONT]​

2Sa 24:16 And when the angel stretched out his hand upon Jerusalem to destroy it, the LORD repented him of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed the people, It is enough: stay now thine hand. And the angel of the LORD was by the threshingplace of Araunah the Jebusite
[/FONT]

 

[Norah63]

The OP asked for a simple list. Instead they got miles of double speak.
A simple answer can not be given, because it is hard to explain away the new testiment.

There is no way to explain away heaven or hell. Men may twist the truth yet it can never be destroyed. The truth stands for all eternity.
Believe and recieve or doubt and do without.

 

[he-man]

The OP asked for a simple list. Believe and recieve or doubt and do without.

Mat 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the adversary.
11 Then the adversary leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

Fear Him whom can destroy your life and spirit, not a false bogeyman!

Destroyer mαshchith', Εxοd. Xii, 23; ολοθρευτου 1 Cοr. x, 10), an exterminator The Hebrews were accustomed by a figure to speak οf any superhuman agency as that οf an angel (see Bush, Note οn Exοd. iii, 2); and whenever this had a providential aspect it was attributed to a diνine messenger (2 Kings xix, 35; 2 Sam. xxiν, 15, 16; Psα. lxxνiii, 49; Acts xii, 23). See ANGEL. Ενen Satan's malignity is represented as thus employed (Job 2: 6, 7).

That God employs His Angels to carry out His vengeance:

Heb 11:28 Through faith he kept the passover, and the sprinkling of blood, lest He that destroyed the firstborn should touch them.
Exo 12:12 ForI will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will executejudgment: I amthe LORD.

Exo 12:23 For the LORD will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the LORD will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite.

2Sa 24:16 And when the angel stretched out his hand upon Jerusalem to destroy it, the LORD repented him of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed the people, It is enough: stay now thine hand. And the angel of the LORD was by the threshingplace of Araunah the Jebusite

 

[strangertoo]

Mat 4:1 Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the adversary.
11 Then the adversary leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

Fear Him whom can destroy your life and spirit, not a false bogeyman!

Destroyer mαshchith', Εxοd. Xii, 23; ολοθρευτου 1 Cοr. x, 10), an exterminator The Hebrews were accustomed by a figure to speak οf any superhuman agency as that οf an angel (see Bush, Note οn Exοd. iii, 2); and whenever this had a providential aspect it was attributed to a diνine messenger (2 Kings xix, 35; 2 Sam. xxiν, 15, 16; Psα. lxxνiii, 49; Acts xii, 23). See ANGEL. Ενen Satan's malignity is represented as thus employed (Job 2: 6, 7).

That God employs His Angels to carry out His vengeance:

Heb 11:28 Through faith he kept the passover, and the sprinkling of blood, lest He that destroyed the firstborn should touch them.
Exo 12:12 ForI will pass through the land of Egypt this night, and will smite all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the gods of Egypt I will executejudgment: I amthe LORD.

Exo 12:23 For the LORD will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the LORD will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite.

2Sa 24:16 And when the angel stretched out his hand upon Jerusalem to destroy it, the LORD repented him of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed the people, It is enough: stay now thine hand. And the angel of the LORD was by the threshingplace of Araunah the Jebusite

do you not realise that this is just innuendo, and easily disproven from scripture :-

Revelation 9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

this is not the name of the Satan of Eden or the Antichrist... you just cited the wrong messenger [Greek 'angelos'] one with a very different mission and message to carry ... and I have no idea why you keep ignoring the scripture to print this confused nonsense [mostly from other sinners] with your name attached to it ,wasting space and everyone's time ... please read all the scripture and understand it at least... FIRST...

Luke 4:4 And Jesus answered him, saying, It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word of God.

2 Corinthians 13:1 This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.

 

[dollarsbill]

In plain English:

Accuser מאשים, lashan', in Iliph. "accuse," Prov. xxx, 10; and other terms signifying to slander ; more properly denoted by some form of the verb 2"1 "!, rib, to plead a cause, also in defence ; Sept. and N. T.​

[FONT=Courier, monospace]Αντιδικος, opponent" or κατήγορος, accuser [prosecutor]. (1.) The original word, which bears this leading signification, means one who has a cause or matter of contention ; the accuser, opponent, or plaintiff in any suit (Judg. xii, 2; Matt, v, 25; Luke xii, 58). [/FONT]
[FONT=Courier, monospace](Lewis, Origines Hebram, i, 68)[/FONT]​

[FONT=Courier, monospace]1Ch 21:12 ..or else three days the sword of the LORD, even the pestilence, in the land, and the angel of the LORD destroying throughout all the coasts of Israel. Now therefore advise thyself what word I shall bring again to him that sent me.

Isa 54:16 Behold, I have created the smith that bloweth the coals in the fire, and that bringeth forth an instrument for his work; and I have created the destroyer to destroy.

[FONT=Courier, monospace]The word is also applied in Scripture, in the general sense, to any adversary or enemy (Luke xviii, 3 ; 1 Pet. v, 8). [/FONT]​

[FONT=Courier, monospace][FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]In the New Test. dragοn (δρακω&#957 is only found in the Αροcalypse (Rev. xii, 3, 4, 7, 9, 16, 17, etc.), as applied metaphorically to "the old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan," the description of the “ dragon" being dictated by the symbolical meaning of the image rather than by any reference to any actually existing creature. [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Courier, monospace][FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif] Cyclopedia of Bibical Literature, James Strong[/FONT][/FONT]​

2Sa 24:16 And when the angel stretched out his hand upon Jerusalem to destroy it, the LORD repented him of the evil, and said to the angel that destroyed the people, It is enough: stay now thine hand. And the angel of the LORD was by the threshingplace of Araunah the Jebusite
[/FONT]

In plain English?

 

[strangertoo]

Kinda confused about that...

Can someone who doesn't believe in Hell give me a simple list of reasons why?

-1-. 'hell' means a hole in the ground , usually used for storing potatoes in the Winter... one cannot really believe that all the billions of this earth who have died are in a single hole in the ground somewhere with the potatoes from last year... LOL?

-2-. 'Hell' in common parlance is the invention of Dante in his fictional work 'Inferno' which many have come to believe is real [ that's life, bizarre, superstitious ...LOLOL?]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferno_(Dante)

-3-. 'hell' in the bible is a bizarre collection of very different things , 'hades' and 'sheol' are not physical, but the somewhat poetic idea that life-force goes 'somewhere' in death even though one cannot see it or detect it in any way ... this 'hell' is the mythical , poetically creative but physically impossible 'place of all the dead' ...or as some have put it, the invisible state of dead ... the bible however also explains less cryptically that the body without the spirit is dead [and we often burn it in cremation, but not as a punishment in 'hell'] ... the spirit however always returns to God and carries all the info about a person as it alone is all God needs to resurrect all folks from 'hell' -Rev 20:13 - so there is no 'eternal hell' , hell is destroyed eventually, no more death , no more need for it - Rev 20:14

note though that Jesus went to hell , so it is clearly not what most people think it is :-
Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

-4-. 'gehenna' ,https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gehenna which is the Valley of the son of Hinnom outside Jerusalem , where the rubbish from the city is burned and where the bodies of criminals used to be cremated ... bizarrely this also is translated as 'hell' in many bible translations...

arguably it is an analogy to the 'lake of fire' in Revelation which is the final trial [baptism of fire] of those who have been freed of sin by a second death [Rom 6:7] and baptised of the spirit [Joel 2:28] to know all truth of God after death is denied in the final process of God's salvation of all men by the same method, but not all at the same time :-

Luke 3:16 John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire:

1 Peter 4:12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:

1 Peter 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

-5-. there is more , but hardly worthy of mention perhaps ... sufficient this perhaps to show that 'hell' is not understood by any but saints mostly ,but is used by sinners worldwide to scare folks into giving them money every Sunday...

sorry , but truly there is NOT one concept of 'hell', no simple list of reasons for rejecting the many ways the word is abused by sinners , but none of these can be said to be 'hell' in my understanding...

'hell' to me is simply the fact that the spirit 'saves' the knowledge of the soul with God until man is resurrected to life [soul] again, in a new viable body by means of the [indestructible as it is of God] spirit of a man ... as if teh soul had gone somewhere and returned... but life force does not go anywhere in death, it ends and begins again in resurrection... so 'hell'does not exist, but it is a poetic concept, just a way of speaking....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferno_(Dante)

 

[dollarsbill]

Matthew 18:9 (NASB)
9 "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.

 

[gasman64]

Matthew 18:9 (NASB)
9 "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.

You first!

 

[Tnmusicman]

Hell (Sheohl, Gehenna,Hades) The actual word hell means to "cover over" and is taken from the root words I have given in parentheses. These words actually mean "grave" or "pit" and do not refer to any fire. Throughout the ages men have influenced Biblical teachings (Dante, Milton, etc.) and the Catholics as well, till we wind up with all kinds of man made illusions intertwined with spiritual truth. Even Johns visions of the Apocalypse (which some refer to Constantine) are used to tell us the lake of fire is hell. At every turn, churches try to conform believers into their circles, using hell as a stick, with the ticket to heaven as a carrot. Some even thinking that they have the only way there.

There is only one theme for a Christian. "Love the Lord God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind and love your neighbor as yourself".

There is only one set of laws for a Christian: The Ten Commandments

There is only one person to follow: Jesus, who showed us that eternal life was real, who showed us that the Ten Commandments were now spiritual laws and not physical laws, showed us how to pray to our heavenly father for our salvation and taught us the need for baptisms through water and fire.

After that the Holy Spirit is your guide. Hell will be a place you will not have any concern with, nor will search about.

That's true. Hell is not something that will concern those of us that are saved.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Kinda confused about that...

Can someone who doesn't believe in Hell give me a simple list of reasons why?

Hell as we understand it through depictions and fictive works is a story constructed from a pagan myth that Saint Augustine believed in. This was then propagated through the latin translations of the bible.

later on . Dante added more "hot sauce" to the recipe.

Also the word used for eternal is a latin thing too. it comes from the word aeternam, the word Aionos is heavily debated as to its meaning but basically means an indefinite period of time.

The lake of fire, it is a real lake of fire. this lake of fire is actually the presence of God.

the word fire come from the greek word "pur" as in to purify, and is used when talking about a blacksmith's forge in which the metal is melted .. and the impurites are cleared off.

but enough about how the bible's been mistranslated. even with those issues . these passages caused me to question this

But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect. (Matthew 5:44-46)

God's really like that? really? he isn't some fickle God of greco-roman myths? that's nice .. maybe he's nicer than the church thinks he is then.

20 Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than all we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us, 21 to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, for ever and ever! Amen.(Ephesians 3:19-21)

So .. if he's able to do more that we can ask or imagine .. and all of us have imagined at one point all of the people we know .. knowing him .. then .. do you think he might surprise us and save all the people that we didn't have a chance to know either?

And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. (Ephesians 2:6-7)

So .. what we're getting now is just an appetizer? in the "coming ages" God's going to show the same grace he's shown to us in Christ Jesus .. to who .. hmmm .. well who's left .. O obedient son? where is your prodigal brother?

14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire. (Revelation 20:14-15)

Revelation 21

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. 2 I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. 4 He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away.”
5 He who was seated on the throne said, “I am making everything new!” Then he said, “Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true.”

It's good news afterall.

All things includes the contents of the lake of fire. it is nice that there is good news. and that Gospel actually means good news . but those are some of the passages that come to mind. there are many more .

i found these helpful too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=At3pkTrKeF8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=rbrSyLL4pxg

 

[Fascinated With God]

Your Hebrew is lacking:The word for Sheol is: שׁאול nm. Sheol H7585 and is not in Isa 14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave (H6913 קברה nm. grave, tomb, sepulcher) like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit (H953 בּור nm. hole, pit); as a carcase trodden under feet.

How is the Pit something different from Sheol?

NOW, as you can see from the following verses, the terms hell, pit, and grave are used synonymously:

Isa 14:15 none the less art thou brought down to Sheol, to the recesses of the pit.

Now you are arguing that the Pit is synonymous with Sheol. Which is it He-man? You can't seem to make up your mind.

Gen 37:35 And all his sons and all his daughters rose up to comfort him; but he refused to be comforted; and he said, For I will go down into the grave <Sheol H7585> unto my son mourning. Thus his father wept for him.

The fact that you translate Sheol as the grave does not demonstrate that Sheol only means a burial site.

Deu 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell <Sheol H7585>, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

So now explain what the lowest level of the grave is? Your own quote demonstrates the fallacy of your assertion, Sheol clearly does not refer to any burial site in this verse.

Psa 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell <Sheol H7585>, behold, thou art there.
15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lower parts of the
earth.

How is a shallow 6 foot deep grave or an above ground tomb in the lower parts of the earth?

Isn't it a little strange that the word Hades is never used in the OT? Where does God send GOG?

Tartarus classic Greek mythology (c. 400 BC) and was never used in the OT.

If it is strange that the Hebrews didn't use Greek in the OT, then show me a single example of Greek of any kind in the OT? You argument here is really out there in lala land, He-man.

Would you care to explain how Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them.

How does this in any way suggest that Sheol refers to a shallow grave? You are just trying to change the subject because your argument is paper thin.

Isa 14:15 none the less art thou brought down to Sheol, to the recesses of the pit.

Once again, you acknowldge that the Pit and Sheol are synonymous, an assertion that you also denied in this very same post. You are riot He-man!

 

[he-man]

How is the Pit something different from Sheol?

It isn't they are both one and the same and that is why I quoted

Originally Posted by he-man

NOW, as you can see from the following verses, the terms hell, pit, and grave are used synonymously: Isa 14:15 none the less art thou brought down to Sheol, to the recesses of the pit.
​

So now explain what the lowest level of the grave is? Your own quote demonstrates the fallacy of your assertion, Sheol clearly does not refer to any burial site in this verse.

They both mean the grave, burial site. 6' hole/pit in the ground.
​

Isa 14:15 none the less art thou brought down to Sheol, <Sheol H7585>, to the recesses of the pit

Deu 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell <Sheol H7585>, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

How is a shallow 6 foot deep grave or an above ground tomb in the lower parts of the earth?

You can't get any lower than DEAD.

If it is strange that the Hebrews didn't use Greek in the OT, then show me a single example of Greek of any kind in the OT? You argument here is really out there in lala land, He-man.

Address your response to the verse quoted and NOT to the poster! Originally Posted by he-man

​

Isn't it a little strange that the word Hades is never used in the OT? Where does God send GOG? Tartarus classic Greek mythology (c. 400 BC) and was never used in the OT.
​

How does this in any way suggest that Sheol refers to a shallow grave? You are just trying to change the subject because your argument is paper thin.

Hmnnn.. looks like Death and the Grave/Hades are both the same, but I can see why you side stepped that verse!

​

Originally Posted by he-man

Would you care to explain how Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them.
​

Once again, you acknowldge that the Pit and Sheol are synonymous, an assertion that you also denied in this very same post. You are riot He-man!

I have warned you once so knock off the personal puns and jabs, you are in violation of forum rules!
&#947;&#949;&#941;&#957;&#945;v Gehenna, a valley W. and H. of Jerusalem, which as the site of fire-worship from the time of Ahaz, was desecrated by Josiah and became a dumping-place for the offal of the city prob. with ref. to fires of Moloch.
​

Manual Greek Lexicon of the New Testament P. 89 G. ABBOTT-SMITH, D.D., D.G.L

ha-Satan: Yet in all this he is as little like the Ahriman of the Zend A&#957;esta (Rhode, Heil. Sage, p. 182 sq.; Matthai, Religionsgloube d. Apostel, II, i, 171 sq.; Creuzer, Symbol. i. 705) as an indifferent prosecuting attorney general or judicial su&#961;erintendent commissioned by Jehovah. [See Gen 19:24]

Daemons are not mentioned in the canonical books of the Old Test., unless (with many interpreters) we understand "the host of the high ones" in Isa. 24, 21 [the kings of the earth, comp. Dan. 8. 8), the &#8220;he goat&#8221;] (comp. Isa. 14, 12), and interpret the whole passage as referring to the punishment [of the King of Babylon].

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]In the A&#961;ocrypha, the old Hebrew notion of Jehovah's angels who allot disaster occurs not partially, and in the case mishap over takes the enemies of the pious, the angels are alluded to as Auxiliaries and friends of the latter (2 &#924;acc. 15, 23 sq.), although we may search in vain such passages for a single mention of daemons.

[FONT=Tahoma, sans-serif]On the other hand, the books of Tobias and Baruch concerning them.. (&#948;&#945;&#953;&#956;&#972;&#957;&#953;a), while they never refer to &#931;&#945;&#964;&#945;&#957;.
These beings dwell in waste places (Sept. at Isa. 13, 21; 34, 14) ; also ruins Rabe's trans; &#8220;they are the heathen gods,&#8221;; comp. Se&#961;t, at Psa. 115, 5; 1 Cor, 10, 20);
The Targ&#965;m of Jonathan actually names, at Gen. 3, 6, Sammael as ' the "angel of death," see Gerlách, De angelo rnortis, Hal. 1731),'

Josephus knows nothing of Satan, but dáémons

(in as much as from the hand of God only good can come, but against him, the Creator of the universe, no opposing being could originally exist)

DAEMON. Lev. 17, 7, the word translated " de&#957;il" is (sair', hairy), ordinarily a"goat," but rendered " satyr" in Isa. 34, 14 ; probably alluding to the wood-daemons, resembling he-goats, supposed to live in deserts, and which were an objects of idolatry and beast worship anon the Heathens. ​

satyr Greek Mythology one of a class of lustful, drunken woodland gods, represented as a man with a horse's ears and tail or (in Roman representations) with a goat's ears, tail, legs, and horns.
© Oxford University Press, 2004​

The term rendered "devil" in Deut. 32,17; Psa. 106, 37, is a (shed. properly lord, Sept. and Vulg. Daemon),: an idol.​

The belief of the Hebrews down to the Babylonian exile seems but dimly to have recognized either Satan or demons, at least as a dogmatic tenet, nor had it many occasions for them, since it treated moral evils as a properly humans act (comp. Gen. 3), and always as subjective and concrete, but regarded misfortunes according to teleological axioms, as a punishment deserved on account of sin at the hand of a righteous God, who inflicted it especially by the agency of one of his angels(2 Sam. 24,16; comp. 2 kings xix, 35), and was according looked upon as the proper author of every afflictive dis&#961;ensation
Cyclopedia of Bibical Literature, James Strong
[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[Stealth001]

For another explanation of why so many do not believe in the "traditional Hell" doctrine of endless torments, please download and read this book (.pdf) ....

Hope Beyond Hell
by Gerry Beauchemin

http://tentmaker.org/books/hope_beyond_hell.pdf

​

 

[he-man]

For another explanation of why so many do not believe in the "traditional Hell" doctrine of endless torments, please download and read this book (.pdf) ....Hope Beyond Hell
by Gerry Beauchemin http://tentmaker.org/books/hope_beyond_hell.pdf

Please read the Bible and not Beauchemin who argues against himself because there are many who do not believe there is a God

"Only if we do not believe God is all-powerful, impartial, and all-loving can we remain hopeless.
Yet the phrase, &#8213;eternal death,is nowhere to be found in Scripture!"

The problem with that quote is:
2Th 1:9 who shall pay the penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his might,

God will redeem my soul from the power of Sheol (Ps. 49:15 NAS). Hope Beyond Hell

That was addressed to Christ and is only extended to those who are BELIEVERS in Christ

Only those who repent and are believers will ever see the Kingdom of God.

 

[Stealth001]

Please read the Bible and not Beauchemin who argues against himself because there are many who do not believe there is a God

"Only if we do not believe God is all-powerful, impartial, and all-loving can we remain hopeless.
Yet the phrase, &#8213;eternal death,is nowhere to be found in Scripture!"

The problem with that quote is:
2Th 1:9 who shall pay the penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his might,

God will redeem my soul from the power of Sheol (Ps. 49:15 NAS). Hope Beyond Hell

That was addressed to Christ and is only extended to those who are BELIEVERS in Christ

Only those who repent and are believers will ever see the Kingdom of God.

There is a Universalist answer to what you've presented. Of course, one should seek it out and examine it. Often, there is more than one way to look at something. It's a temporal judgment. Just as Sodom suffered "eternal fire". However, the fires of Sodom haven't been burning for thousands of years now.

Also, God promised to even restore Sodom, the city that suffered from "eternal fire" (Ezekiel 16:53).

 

[he-man]

It's a temporal judgment. Just as Sodom suffered "eternal fire". However, the fires of Sodom haven't been burning for thousands of years now. Also, God promised to even restore Sodom, the city that suffered from "eternal fire" (Ezekiel 16:53).

You do greatly err! You must not resist the truth! You also avoided 2Th 1:9

2Ti 3:8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.

Eze 16:21 That thou hast slain my children, and delivered them to cause them to pass through the fire for them?
23 And it came to pass after all thy wickedness, (woe, woe unto thee! saith the Lord GOD

Eze 24:6 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the bloody city, to the pot whose scum is therein, and whose scum is not gone out of it! bring it out piece by piece; let no lot fall upon it.

Jer 6:29 The bellows are burned, the lead is consumed of the fire; the founder melteth in vain: for the wicked are not plucked away.
J
30 Reprobate silver shall men call them, because the LORD hath rejected them.

Be careful what you say on this forum, there are many listening who might be saved!

Mat 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

Gerry Beauchemin "Only if we do not believe God is all-powerful, impartial, and all-loving can we remain hopeless.
Yet the phrase, &#8213;eternal death, is nowhere to be found in Scripture!"

The problem with that quote is:
2Th 1:9 who shall pay the penalty of everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his might,

God will redeem my soul from the power of Sheol (Ps. 49:15 NAS). Hope Beyond Hell

That was addressed to Christ and is only extended to those who are BELIEVERS in Christ

Only those who repent and are believers will ever see the Kingdom of God.

 

[dollarsbill]

You do greatly err!

Or you.

2 Thessalonians 1:9 (NASB)
9 These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction,

Eternal, EXACT same Greek word for 'eternal life', NEVER ending.

away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,