Staff and Member discussion thread.

[Yahudim]

No I agree with you completely that's why I would like to restrict debate not encourage it ...I'm for less not more

Thanks Sis,

My whole point was in response to a whole thread possibly getting moved to a debate forum as opposed to surgically moving the debate to a debate forum and leave the OP intact. If the OPs intention is to discuss certain prophetic symbols and a debate develops over pre-millenialism vs post-millenialism, why should the OP get penalized, y'know? But you guys answered my concerns admirably, so -THANKS!!!

 

[Yahudim]

Hey, isn't there already a one-on-one debate forum somewhere on CF?

 

[Henaynei]

Let's talk about debate, some of you want it even after all we have seen here in its ability to take a fellowship forum down....I'm soooooo against it, what are the bennifits and what are the consequences ?

Let's make a list of pros and cons k?

Should we have a Midrash sub-forum instead?

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

 

[Yahudim]

Should we have a Midrash sub-forum instead?

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

With this group, would there be a difference?

 

[Henaynei]

With this group, would there be a difference?

Well, yes slightly, and that kinda' is the point.

Taking our Midrashic exchanges out to a non-Messianic part of CF would result in even more mayhem. (immediately thinks of those silly insurance commercials)

Midrash is fundamentally different that most debate. It is a uniquely Jewish form of worship and study. Most Christians are only capable of hearing raised voices and seeing strident faces; these things automatically to them mean "fruitless arguments." They become uncomfortable and start scripturally admonishing through their misunderstanding. It can really derail or take the wind out of a good Midrashic discussion.

In most non-official debates (i.e. the most prevalent on CF) agitated feelings remain after the debate is closed. In Midrashic exchanges we all go out and find a kosher pizza somewhere and good fellowship not only remains intact but is strengthened.

Can we not do this here (minus the pizza, of course )?

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

 

[Yahudim]

Well, yes slightly, and that kinda' is the point.

Taking our Midrashic exchanges out to a non-Messianic part of CF would result in even more mayhem. (immediately thinks of those silly insurance commercials)

Midrash is fundamentally different that most debate. It is a uniquely Jewish form of worship and study. Most Christians are only capable of hearing raised voices and seeing strident faces; these things automatically to them mean "fruitless arguments." They become uncomfortable and start scripturally admonishing through their misunderstanding. It can really derail or take the wind out of a good Midrashic discussion.

In most non-official debates (i.e. the most prevalent on CF) agitated feelings remain after the debate is closed. In Midrashic exchanges we all go out and find a kosher pizza somewhere and good fellowship not only remains intact but is strengthened.

Can we not do this here (minus the pizza, of course )?

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

I know Sis, and I agree. But the flip side of that coin are those members that are not familiar with the concept. So it leaves me a little room to poke some good-natured fun.

 

[Henaynei]

I know Sis, and I agree. But the flip side of that coin are those members that are not familiar with the concept. So it leaves me a little room to poke some good-natured fun.

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

 

[Yahudim]

I think I'm going to give up for today. No one is catching my jokes so I must not be funny right now.

 

[Henaynei]

I think I'm going to give up for today. No one is catching my jokes so I must not be funny right now.

Don't go...
I bet it is easier to "catch" them if one could hear your voice OR see your face

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Hey, isn't there already a one-on-one debate forum somewhere on CF?

Hi talmidim,

You and your opponent would propose the debate, discuss and set the stipulations in this Forum:

Formal Debate Proposals; once this is done, one of the staff (usually me) would set it up here:

Formal Debate

We set up a linked Peanut Gallery thread in GT so the casual observers may discuss and debate among themselves; you and your opponent are welcome to post there as well, but most do not... you don't want to show your hand too soon. Debate participants do often check it out to help with strategy, and to see how they are doing.

If you need help or have additional questions, I would be glad to answer them.
http://www.christianforums.com/f924/

 

[Yahudim]

Hi talmidim,

You and your opponent would propose the debate, discuss and set the stipulations in this Forum:

Formal Debate Proposals; once this is done, one of the staff (usually me) would set it up here:

Formal Debate

We set up a linked Peanut Gallery thread in GT so the casual observers may discuss and debate among themselves; you and your opponent are welcome to post there as well, but most do not... you don't want to show your hand too soon. Debate participants do often check it out to help with strategy, and to see how they are doing.

If you need help or have additional questions, I would be glad to answer them.
http://www.christianforums.com/f924/

Thanks Mark!

I was just thinking that a debate is a debate. No need to duplicate efforts if there is already a debate mechanism in place. Perhaps all we need is a sticky! What do you think?

 

[anisavta]

Hey gang.
I think us not being able to see each other - case in point Tal's joke shows why debate can be a problem. We couldn't see his face and his smile. In a faceless, nameless forum we forget we are dealing with people and feelings. At least in a synagogue midrashic debate, we can see when we've hit someone's nerve and back off. Hopefully we wouldn't tell someome to their face what we think we can in a forum setting. We tend to not use our filters. And in "real life" as opposed to forum life we don't rattle on page after page with our precious knowledge - because we'd be inturrupted long before we got on a roll. We tend not to know when to back off when we see we've gone too far.

 

[Tishri1]

Perhaps in Everything Torah we could have a tag for Midrashic Study, and a lesson stickied at the top with directions on how to participate

Well, yes slightly, and that kinda' is the point.

Taking our Midrashic exchanges out to a non-Messianic part of CF would result in even more mayhem. (immediately thinks of those silly insurance commercials)

Midrash is fundamentally different that most debate. It is a uniquely Jewish form of worship and study. Most Christians are only capable of hearing raised voices and seeing strident faces; these things automatically to them mean "fruitless arguments." They become uncomfortable and start scripturally admonishing through their misunderstanding. It can really derail or take the wind out of a good Midrashic discussion.

In most non-official debates (i.e. the most prevalent on CF) agitated feelings remain after the debate is closed. In Midrashic exchanges we all go out and find a kosher pizza somewhere and good fellowship not only remains intact but is strengthened.

Can we not do this here (minus the pizza, of course )?

b'Shalom {iPod touch w/CF app}

 

[Chaplain David]

Perhaps in Everything Torah we could have a tag for Midrashic Study, and a lesson stickied at the top with directions on how to participate

 

[Tishri1]

I think I'm going to give up for today. No one is catching my jokes so I must not be funny right now.

I just got here but I see your good nature shining thru

 

[Tishri1]

Wow now that's handy, see how Abba provides, Mark IS the only staffer doing this for CF, and look he showed up on the MJ 911 team too

Hi talmidim,

You and your opponent would propose the debate, discuss and set the stipulations in this Forum:

Formal Debate Proposals; once this is done, one of the staff (usually me) would set it up here:

Formal Debate

We set up a linked Peanut Gallery thread in GT so the casual observers may discuss and debate among themselves; you and your opponent are welcome to post there as well, but most do not... you don't want to show your hand too soon. Debate participants do often check it out to help with strategy, and to see how they are doing.

If you need help or have additional questions, I would be glad to answer them.
http://www.christianforums.com/f924/

 

[Tishri1]

Hey gang.
I think us not being able to see each other - case in point Tal's joke shows why debate can be a problem. We couldn't see his face and his smile. In a faceless, nameless forum we forget we are dealing with people and feelings. At least in a synagogue midrashic debate, we can see when we've hit someone's nerve and back off. Hopefully we wouldn't tell someome to their face what we think we can in a forum setting. We tend to not use our filters. And in "real life" as opposed to forum life we don't rattle on page after page with our precious knowledge - because we'd be inturrupted long before we got on a roll. We tend not to know when to back off when we see we've gone too far.

Good wisdom

It would be cool though to contribute midrashic debate in the formal debate forum someday to show others something special the MJ forum can do and teach the formal debate folks a new technique too......away from MJ in a controlled setting... "far away from MJ."...."all tucked away"....."farrrrrrrr away"

 

[Lulav]

I've finally caught up, sorry it took so long, I was out of town yesterday and today I awoke with an awful migraine that sent me back to bed but still didn't relieve it totally.

This is what I've been able to glean so far.

• Administration is against any kind of debating.
• Some have suggested we debate in the general debate area which will be the death of us (IMO)
• The main area (which at this point with the other thread I'm not sure what it's going to be called) will be debate free, only for fellowship
• We can't have two forums, one for Torah observant and the other for Messianic Jews/Hebrew Christians and Israel supporters that don't believe that the Torah is for now, because it didn't work for a completely different group of believers.
• I am supposed to write something up but I think I already did.

Here's a suggestion, why can't we have a forum where you click from the Main forum of CF to an area title 'Messianic', once in there, there is not 'Main forum, but instead a group of forums from which one can choose from by the description and beliefs?


You could have:



Messianic Judaism - 'For those who are Jewish believers in Jesus/Yeshua as the promised Messiah, and worship in a Jewish way and focus on Jewish Evangelism and for Gentiles that join them in this endevour.'
(This would include Jewish and Gentile Messianics as well as Hebrew Christians of similar beliefs)



Torah Keepers -' For both Jews and Gentiles who (and this is hard to word without offending someone) believe that G-ds Torah is everlasting till all things are fulfilled.'


Of course we may have those from other groups that are Christians and may want to come and have a place.



Messianic Movement -'Two House, Ephramitse, Sacred Name - this could be a forum for those groups.'



and all three of these would have their own formal debate area where those who want to debate the beliefs of that group can do so. Also this I think would cut down on all the squabbling and give each area a safe and comfortable area to have discussions. Of course all could go to any of the forums from any of these groups like other icons and make fellowship posts and ask questions.

 

[anisavta]

I've finally caught up, sorry it took so long, I was out of town yesterday and today I awoke with an awful migraine that sent me back to bed but still didn't relieve it totally.

This is what I've been able to glean so far.

• Administration is against any kind of debating.
• Some have suggested we debate in the general debate area which will be the death of us (IMO)
• The main area (which at this point with the other thread I'm not sure what it's going to be called) will be debate free, only for fellowship
• We can't have two forums, one for Torah observant and the other for Messianic Jews/Hebrew Christians and Israel supporters that don't believe that the Torah is for now, because it didn't work for a completely different group of believers.
• I am supposed to write something up but I think I already did.

Here's a suggestion, why can't we have a forum where you click from the Main forum of CF to an area title 'Messianic', once in there, there is not 'Main forum, but instead a group of forums from which one can choose from by the description and beliefs?


You could have:



Messianic Judaism - 'For those who are Jewish believers in Jesus/Yeshua as the promised Messiah, and worship in a Jewish way and focus on Jewish Evangelism and for Gentiles that join them in this endevour.'
(This would include Jewish and Gentile Messianics as well as Hebrew Christians of similar beliefs)



Torah Keepers -' For both Jews and Gentiles who (and this is hard to word without offending someone) believe that G-ds Torah is everlasting till all things are fulfilled.'


Of course we may have those from other groups that are Christians and may want to come and have a place.



Messianic Movement -'Two House, Ephramitse, Sacred Name - this could be a forum for those groups.'



and all three of these would have their own formal debate area where those who want to debate the beliefs of that group can do so. Also this I think would cut down on all the squabbling and give each area a safe and comfortable area to have discussions. Of course all could go to any of the forums from any of these groups like other icons and make fellowship posts and ask questions.

I'd have to disagree with you Lulav on your bullet points. I didn't glean that at all.
Admin is not against debate - just cautious because of what we've seen happen in the past.
I do like your recommendations about the forum breakdown. And I would add that all three should still have a way to keep a thread MJ only if so desired to keep safe havens from "outsiders" from other denoms.

 

[Tishri1]

What does everyone think?

Course you know we gotta keep the names about beliefs not people , so Torah Keepers would become .....All things Torah or Torah keeping, or something like that