Some Reasons I Don't Believe in Biblical Creation

[Davian]

Are you accusing scientists of deception?

Yup. They are deceiving themselves.

All of them? In every related field of study? And in the same fashion, so that they all appear to line up and support each other?

And just so I don't dismiss this as wishful thinking, you can proceed with substantiating your accusation.

Referencing your bible will be accepted as abdication.

 

[AV1611VET]

All of them? In every related field of study? And in the same fashion, so that they all appear to line up and support each other?

Yes -- like dominoes in a row -- (or a house built on sand) -- it comes crashing down because it takes years of work, and a computer to align these things up.

Then one domino falls -- (or a wind comes up) -- and the whole thing comes tumbling down.

 

[Davian]

All of them? In every related field of study? And in the same fashion, so that they all appear to line up and support each other?

And just so I don't dismiss this as wishful thinking, you can proceed with substantiating your accusation.

Referencing your bible will be accepted as abdication.

Yes -- like dominoes in a row -- (or a house built on sand) -- it comes crashing down because it takes years of work, and a computer to align these things up.

Then one domino falls -- (or a wind comes up) -- and the whole thing comes tumbling down.

I guess you think that deleting the 'substantiating' part of my post exempts you from doing so - lol.

And you have failed to show that these 'dominos' are falling. Perhaps they are interlocked, like brickwork.

So, I will slot your comments under "wishful thinking".

I will note that your assertions, and those of the other creationists, are very much unlike dominos. You seem unable to line them up. But they are easy enough to knock down, if they are not completely vapourous.

 

[Split Rock]

God did not make it look like common descent. Scientists made it look like common descent through their speculations.

You keep accusing God of things He never did. Why?

I keep saying a family tree is a family tree. If it isn't, it was made to look that way. Yes, your god is a deceiver, if he did what you claim he did.

You do realize none of this is in the Bible, right? This is just your interpretation of what is actually there.

But that's okay, I have my own interpretation too: Re-creation.

That's what you guys claim the bible says. Earth first, then the sun and the stars placed around it. Earth at the center of the universe. Its a typical geo-centric view that most human cultures had, until science came along and helped us understand the truth.

 

[Split Rock]

Yup. They are deceiving themselves.

Ah yes... the old "everyone else is deluded" argument...

 

[Split Rock]

Yes -- like dominoes in a row -- (or a house built on sand) -- it comes crashing down because it takes years of work, and a computer to align these things up.

Then one domino falls -- (or a wind comes up) -- and the whole thing comes tumbling down.

Sounds to me like creationism. Except, "Creation Science" came along to prop it up for a while. Then it started collapsing again, so I.D. came along to prop it up again. But it keeps sinking further into the mud.

 

[Nostromo]

It's not the Documentation that led them to the wrong conclusion in my hypothetical, it's the conclusion made after the star was triangulated and found to [correctly] be 50 light years out, viz. that the star is at least 50 years old.

(His first mistake though, is not believing the Documentation.)

I'm talking about back in the real world.

 

[AV1611VET]

I'm talking about back in the real world.

So as to derail the point?

 

[Belk]

Is that how it's done? :o

When the Big Bang theory does not fit the facts precisely, the theory ends up being modified and refined by sprinkling a little dark matter here and a little dark energy there?

Is that how it's done? :o

Yup. That's how it is done. Feel free to ignore modern society to pretend the method has an issue.

 

[Jazer]

Then one domino falls -- (or a wind comes up) -- and the whole thing comes tumbling down.

That was the theory in Viet Nam. They were concerned that Communism was going to take over the world.

 

[Jazer]

Yup. That's how it is done. Feel free to ignore modern society to pretend the method has an issue.

I say we take a vote to see just how much of "modern society" believes you can shrink the universe down to the size of a molecule. Or down to the size of a Mustard seed if you want to go with the origional Kabbalah. Some say the period at the end of a sentence.

 

[Belk]

I say we take a vote to see just how much of "modern society" believes you can shrink the universe down to the size of a molecule. Or down to the size of a Mustard seed if you want to go with the origional Kabbalah. Some say the period at the end of a sentence.

Why? Do you think personal incredulity on a large scale is a good argument? How about this? How about we ask modern society if they find it reasonable that the scientific method that has allowed our standard of living suddenly stops working when we look at the big bang or evolution?

 

[Doveaman]

Yup. That's how it is done. Feel free to ignore modern society to pretend the method has an issue.

If the development of a modern society depended upon dark matter and dark energy there would be no modern society, ever.

 

[Phred]

I say we take a vote to see just how much of "modern society" believes you can shrink the universe down to the size of a molecule. Or down to the size of a Mustard seed if you want to go with the origional Kabbalah. Some say the period at the end of a sentence.

Let's see... if we took a vote in July of 1945 and asked how many people believed that several pounds of material could wipe out a city, how many would have believed it was possible? You think a negative vote would have stopped Hiroshima and Nagasaki from being destroyed? You're under the impression that your opinion matters. You're wrong.

 

[Phred]

If the development of a modern society depended upon dark matter and dark energy there would be no modern society, ever.

Something is causing the universe to act the way it is. We don't know what. Our best guess is that this something is "dark" because it's unseen. It could be almost anything but it's not visible to our telescopes. What we do know is that the universe is acting as if there is something there. Just as Neptune acted as if there was something there and that's how they found Pluto.

If only you could find something that reacted to the existence of god so that you could prove he existed by inference. Sadly, you can't even do that.

 

[Belk]

If the development of a modern society depended upon dark matter and dark energy there would be no modern society, ever.

Ipsie dixit is so fun when you can't back it up isn't it?

 

[Doveaman]

I keep saying a family tree is a family tree. If it isn't, it was made to look that way. Yes, your god is a deceiver, if he did what you claim he did.

But your "family tree" does not exists in nature. It only exists in your imagination based on your fallible interpretation of observations. Stop accusing God of what you did.

No matter how hard I try I just can't figure out how this lady ended up in this tree:

That's what you guys claim the bible says.

And you actually believe us?

Since when did you start believing us? :o

 

[Doveaman]

Something is causing the universe to act the way it is. We don't know what. Our best guess is that this something is "dark" because it's unseen.

I think I know Who it is.

It could be almost anything but it's not visible to our telescopes. What we do know is that the universe is acting as if there is something there. Just as Neptune acted as if there was something there and that's how they found Pluto.

If only you could find something that reacted to the existence of god so that you could prove he existed by inference. Sadly, you can't even do that.

Oh, really?

I propose God-energy to be the cause of the expanding universe.

I even have a three thousand year old prediction of this recently observed expansion:

"I am the LORD, Who has made all things, Who alone stretched out the heavens...My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts." (Isa 44:24, 45:12).

Prediction confirmed.

 

[Belk]

I think I know Who it is.
Oh, really?

I propose God-energy to be the cause of the expanding universe.

I even have a three thousand year old prediction of this recently observed expansion:

"I am the LORD, Who has made all things, Who alone stretched out the heavens...My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts." (Isa 44:24, 45:12).

Prediction confirmed.

Cool. Now all you have to do is devise a test with explicit conditions for falsification. Let us know how it turns out. Good luck.

 

[chris4243]

I think I know Who it is.
Oh, really?

I propose God-energy to be the cause of the expanding universe.

I even have a three thousand year old prediction of this recently observed expansion:

"I am the LORD, Who has made all things, Who alone stretched out the heavens...My own hands stretched out the heavens; I marshaled their starry hosts." (Isa 44:24, 45:12).

Prediction confirmed.

It's hardly a prediction at all though. For one thing, it could mean almost anything, especially if you consider that maybe God could understand the people He was talking to, who would certainly not believe the Big Bang theory. Also, what's the "marshaled" about, do the stars need a leader or something? Also, where's the formula? There's not even any numbers, it would be a nearly worthless prediction if it were one.

Also, it's wrong. It's in the past tense. Per the prediction, the universe must have stopped expanding by the time of Isaiah. It hasn't.

All you get by pretending that figurative speech is a scientific prediction is egg on your face.