Is contemporary christian music "conforming to the world"

[American Routes]

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[spiritman1]

This is a topic we're discussing in our church right now. Al Mohler has also tackled this issue a couple of times.

I went to our local Christian radio station's website and took a look at their playlist. Out of the top ten songs, not one of them say anything about repentance, the cross, the blood, or God's holiness.

The first song is called "Say What You Believe" and I can't find anything in the lyrics to indicate that it's a Christian song at all. The second song is just as bad. There's nothing in the lyrics to indicate that it's a Christian song. Neither one of them even mention Jesus.

The third song is called "The Shelter" and I guess it's at least a step in the right direction because it at least mentions God. But the theology in the song is horrible. According to the song, we don't come to Christ for forgiveness or to be reconciled to God, but because we're "broken" and want to have a better life. If I were a lost person, I'd have no idea from listening to this song how to come to Christ or why Christ should even matter, but I'd also come away thinking Christ is nothing more than a life enhancement program for a bunch of basket case whiners.

Going downhill from there is a song called "Take You Away". What makes this song Christian? The gist of the song is that you've had a really bad day and somebody's coming to get you and take you somewhere? Where? Who? For what purpose? What if we don't want to go? For all I know, they could be coming to take you to the local bar to get drunk and drown your sorrows.

Next is "Something Vague"...er, I mean, "Something Glorious." What makes this song Christian? The only reference to God is "the maker of it all". At least, I assume that's supposed to be God. But which God? Don't Muslims believe their god created it all? Don't Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses believe their god created it all? And what does any of this have to do with us? OK. God created everything. Now what?

That's just the top five. Sadly, it doesn't get any better.

Why can't CCM produce a song that glorifies God or that can at least be easily identified as a Christian song?

good post! begs repeating.......also these songs people want to offer up to God as a praise offering, if God is the same today as He was thousands of years ago, how accepting of an offering would He be, if it was offered on an altar designated for Gods enemies. Rock n roll was not designed to bring praise to God, but if you were to study the history it was designed to bring rebellion and promiscuity and every ungodly behavior. Now you want to take this same design make a few lyrical changes and repackage this sound and offer it up to the same God who we clearly see in every historical story to despise anything that was part of satanic worship, even meat offered to false gods wasn't to be eaten. and here in todays culture and todays Christianity somehow God has changed and nolonger cares what and where your praise music came from, change the words and some music once used in satanic rituals will all of a sudden be welcomed with open arms by an all knowing soveriegn God.

 

[Bella Vita]

good post! begs repeating.......also these songs people want to offer up to God as a praise offering, if God is the same today as He was thousands of years ago, how accepting of an offering would He be, if it was offered on an altar designated for Gods enemies. Rock n roll was not designed to bring praise to God, but if you were to study the history it was designed to bring rebellion and promiscuity and every ungodly behavior. Now you want to take this same design make a few lyrical changes and repackage this sound and offer it up to the same God who we clearly see in every historical story to despise anything that was part of satanic worship, even meat offered to false gods wasn't to be eaten. and here in todays culture and todays Christianity somehow God has changed and nolonger cares what and where your praise music came from, change the words and some music once used in satanic rituals will all of a sudden be welcomed with open arms by an all knowing soveriegn God.

I don't care what anyone says I will listen to my christen metal and my christian rap until the day I die. And I feel the lord moving through it and no one can tell me otherwise. You have your way or worshiping and I have mine none is better than any other if you are feeling the spirit move then I say go for it.

 

[spiritman1]

All the Bible says is to make a joyful noise for him it doesn't say anything about genre or style nothing just make music for the lord that's it plain and simple we as humans like to over think things wayyyyy to much in reality sometimes I think God wants us to just stick to the basics =]

And you can honestly say that all forms music are JOYFUL SOUNDING........even in the most sophisticated eloquent symphonies it is possible to make unjoyful sounds, just as death metal has no Joy in it at all

 

[spiritman1]

same here. I think if you can't understand the lyrics, if its drowned out by the music or the beat then it's conforming to the world.

I once went to a christian music festival (before I was really born again, although I was interested and was going to church for a while) and thought they'd be singing gospel style and there would be uplifiting music that really praised God I was so dissapointed it just souinded like ordinary rock/rap/dance/alternative music but with 'christian' sounding lyrics or stuff that made Jesus seem like a really good boyfriend/lover/buddy. It just made me really confused, also not ONE person ever explained the gospel to me the whole time I was there, there was no prayer..nothing. Maybe they just assumed that all the people there were already christians..it was all rather strange for me. Maybe if I went back there again this time as born again I would feel differently. I don't know..music never converted me.

Another important aspect is who is receiving all the glory, attention and recognition, just like secular concerts everyone is focused on the band and its players, clapping and praising them rather than corporately singing together as one body each giving praise to God as best they can, with the voice God gave them whether good or bad the praise from a humble spirit is accepting to God, more so than a very talented group who steals Gods praise and receives adoration

 

[His_disciple3]

Music or should I say the part of our services that we worship God with music. is like anything else in Church. if you are looking for something good, you will find it, if you are looking for something bad you will find it! seek and ye shall find it. if you are looking for a reason to truely praise and worship God you will find it. if you are looking for some reason to turn from worshipping God and even leave the Church you will find it, seek and ye shall find it. our Church plays the music a little too loud for me But i can still sit quietly and praise our Lord and Saviour. I got to help out with a Christian Rock Concert one night, our town shut down a side street and let a friend of mine put on this concert. at one point when I got to stop and listen to the music, I thought man this is just a bunch of screaming. this is wrong, then God directed my eyes to the the crowd and I saw 40 of 50 teenagers on a staurday night hands in the air, bouncing up and down praising and worshipping Our Lord and Saviour, and God said what would you rather them to be strung out on drugs around the corner than here worshipping me? Music has divided church all through time, there used to be psalms only allowed in Church I sure glad they changed that I love amazing Grace, one Church i went to would allowed southern gospel in their services man I sure glad they changed that I love Amazing Grace my chains are gone, by Chris Thomlin. if us old folks want the younger ones to sit through music we love then we ought to be willing to sit through the Music they love also. The Bible says not to look at the splinter in thine brother's eye while you have a beam in your eye. let's stop looking at what others are doing and trying to judge if they are really walking with God and examine our own hearts and motives on what we are doing!!

Psalms 139:23-24
23 Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts:
24 And see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting.
KJV

 

[spiritman1]

How is a particular style of music conforming to the world? Are Christians who listen to classical music conformed to the world? Were hymns written and listened to 300 years ago conformed to the world? Since they were modern back then? Or how about this, when music began to be accompanied in services, which was taken from pagan religions, were we conforming to the world then? Modern christianity has borrowed many things from pagan cultures and it's been that way for the past 1700 years.

basically your saying if something is done wrong, and it is done wrong for a really long time, then somehow it makes it OK! I personally am ok with people enjoying all types of music in their daily life. but when it comes to offering up music to God as a praise offering I'm not so sure you would want to take a pagan song (music) and regift it back to God, when it says He's a jealous God, it means HE is a JEALOUS GOD, and wants something original from your heart, not some repackaged music created for paganism.

 

[American Routes]

I don't care what anyone says I will listen to my christen metal and my christian rap until the day I die. And I feel the lord moving through it and no one can tell me otherwise. You have your way or worshiping and I have mine none is better than any other if you are feeling the spirit move then I say go for it.

What role do you believe Biblical instruction should play in our attitude toward worship?

 

[spiritman1]

I don't care what anyone says I will listen to my christen metal and my christian rap until the day I die. And I feel the lord moving through it and no one can tell me otherwise. You have your way or worshiping and I have mine none is better than any other if you are feeling the spirit move then I say go for it.

Actually I am very aware that you don't care what anyone says......do as thou wilt....is very much your motto in life, your Queen of your destiny and nobody will stop you.....Rock ON!

 

[spiritman1]

Music or should I say the part of our services that we worship God with music. is like anything else in Church. if you are looking for something good, you will find it, if you are looking for something bad you will find it! seek and ye shall find it. if you are looking for a reason to truely praise and worship God you will find it. if you are looking for some reason to turn from worshipping God and even leave the Church you will find it, seek and ye shall find it. our Church plays the music a little too loud for me But i can still sit quietly and praise our Lord and Saviour. I got to help out with a Christian Rock Concert one night, our town shut down a side street and let a friend of mine put on this concert. at one point when I got to stop and listen to the music, I thought man this is just a bunch of screaming. this is wrong, then God directed my eyes to the the crowd and I saw 40 of 50 teenagers on a staurday night hands in the air, bouncing up and down praising and worshipping Our Lord and Saviour, and God said what would you rather them to be strung out on drugs around the corner than here worshipping me? Music has divided church all through time, there used to be psalms only allowed in Church I sure glad they changed that I love amazing Grace, one Church i went to would allowed southern gospel in their services man I sure glad they changed that I love Amazing Grace my chains are gone, by Chris Thomlin. if us old folks want the younger ones to sit through music we love then we ought to be willing to sit through the Music they love also. The Bible says not to look at the splinter in thine brother's eye while you have a beam in your eye. let's stop looking at what others are doing and trying to judge if they are really walking with God and examine our own hearts and motives on what we are doing!!

Psalms 139:23-24
23 Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts:
24 And see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting.
KJV

Its very important to notice its all about the music YOU LIKE! everyone is going to church for THEIR NEEDS, for THEIR entertainment. interesting church theology its all about making it good for the those present. and alas in the bible its all done for God alone, how different church was then and how TODAY its all geared for those in seats.

 

[His_disciple3]

What role do you believe Biblical instruction should play in our attitude toward worship?

I not sure, maybe you could answer that for us, David danced in the street one time and it made someone mad, so was David wrong of the one that got mad???
KJV
Psalms 149:2
149 Praise ye the Lord. Sing unto the Lord a new song, and his praise in the congregation of saints.
KJV
does this say we can't ever change our songs?

Psalms 150:6
6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the Lord. Praise ye the Lord.
KJV

or does this say that Bella Vita has to worship like you or that I have to worship like Bella Vita, please guide us to the Bibical way that you speak of

 

[dies-l]

No form of music is inherently good our inherently evil. Out ability to appreciate and enjoy music its a giddy from God that can be used to honor Him or for self indulgence. It is not things like chord progressions or rhythms that make music honoring to God or not. It is the ideas thoughts and feelings that are expressed in it. Just like the time of amazing grace can be a beautiful song about God's restorative power or a self indulgent drinking song, so can any piece of contemporary music.

 

[FaithPleases]

Contemporary christian music is boring and depressing.

 

[His_disciple3]

Contemporary christian music is boring and depressing.

you find what you are seeking!!!

 

[FaithPleases]

you find what you are seeking!!!

Believe me I don't seek contemporary.

 

[biscuitfeatures]

I'd say that the modern church (big churches in particular) with their seeker-sensitive ways and admission of catering to the younger generation have twisted "worship" into something more akin to a rock concert. In fact, there are plenty of Christian rock concerts out there, where people go to cheer on a band singing "worship" songs! Now, I know that there will be plenty of young hipsters (20 may be young, but I'm not particularly hip - I'd rather rock it with the grannies in the pressy church, honestly) will disagree with me, but I don't think the idea of worship is to "get excited for God." How can you have a deep and meaningful moment while you're bouncing around with 150 decibels pumping through your skull? You can get that same feeling in a secular context.

The other day I was talking to my sister's boyfriend, a non-Christian. He stated what seemed to be an earnest belief that the worship service he had attended with us was meant to be a form of entertainment. Churches think they're appealing to the younger generation with their dangerously loud rock music, but in reality, it mostly just appeals to the young people who are already Christian. My non-Christian friends seem to think that the church is full of hypocrisy, and not much different from the world.

Maybe hymns aren't the way to go anymore, but surely we could think of some worship songs that aren't just the same phrases over and over (yes, God is awesome and holy, but perhaps we could squeeze a few extra adjectives and reflections in there?) set to repetitive rhythms and tunes. You know things have gone downhill when a Christian guy picks up a guitar, starts strumming a tune to a song he has in mind, and everyone around him starts singing different songs because they all have that same guitar riff.

 

[FaithPleases]

I'd say that the modern church (big churches in particular) with their seeker-sensitive ways and admission of catering to the younger generation have twisted "worship" into something more akin to a rock concert. In fact, there are plenty of Christian rock concerts out there, where people go to cheer on a band singing "worship" songs! Now, I know that there will be plenty of young hipsters (20 may be young, but I'm not particularly hip - I'd rather rock it with the grannies in the pressy church, honestly) will disagree with me, but I don't think the idea of worship is to "get excited for God." How can you have a deep and meaningful moment while you're bouncing around with 150 decibels pumping through your skull? You can get that same feeling in a secular context.

The other day I was talking to my sister's boyfriend, a non-Christian. He stated what seemed to be an earnest belief that the worship service he had attended with us was meant to be a form of entertainment. Churches think they're appealing to the younger generation with their dangerously loud rock music, but in reality, it mostly just appeals to the young people who are already Christian. My non-Christian friends seem to think that the church is full of hypocrisy, and not much different from the world.

Maybe hymns aren't the way to go anymore, but surely we could think of some worship songs that aren't just the same phrases over and over (yes, God is awesome and holy, but perhaps we could squeeze a few extra adjectives and reflections in there?) set to repetitive rhythms and tunes. You know things have gone downhill when a Christian guy picks up a guitar, starts strumming a tune to a song he has in mind, and everyone around him starts singing different songs because they all have that same guitar riff.

I never thought about this that deeply but I just don't like rock in general. I go to a church where "gospel" music is played and I am not particularly fond of that either.

One is quiet and dull, the other is loud and a danceoff.

I have grown accustom to the latter so it isn't too bad.

 

[biscuitfeatures]

I never thought about this that deeply but I just don't like rock in general. I go to a church where "gospel" music is played and I am not particularly fond of that either.

One is quiet and dull, the other is loud and a danceoff.

I have grown accustom to the latter so it isn't too bad.

I'm not really into gospel stuff either... seems to be no winning these days!

 

[spiritman1]

I not sure, maybe you could answer that for us, David danced in the street one time and it made someone mad, so was David wrong of the one that got mad???
KJV
Psalms 149:2
149 Praise ye the Lord. Sing unto the Lord a new song, and his praise in the congregation of saints.
KJV
does this say we can't ever change our songs?

Psalms 150:6
6 Let every thing that hath breath praise the Lord. Praise ye the Lord.
KJV

or does this say that Bella Vita has to worship like you or that I have to worship like Bella Vita, please guide us to the Bibical way that you speak of

good point! David wasn't concerned of what others thought of his worship his focus wasn't what those watching in the stands thought, it was completely focused on what he thought God would want. and this is exactly why God said David was a man after his heart. David never cared what the crowds thought, he was always determined to do what he thought God wanted..........this is completely different today, Its all done to the liking of those in the pews and seats, the focus is pleasing the crowds entertaining them, and making their experience a pleasurable one,.......hopfully God enjoyed it is only a secondary thought

 

[dies-l]

I'd say that the modern church (big churches in particular) with their seeker-sensitive ways and admission of catering to the younger generation have twisted "worship" into something more akin to a rock concert.

You talk about this like this is a new phenomenon. There was a time when churches would bend over backwards to get the "rockstar" composer of their day (e.g., Bach, Brahms) to come work for them so that they could draw all sorts of people to their church. Very few of the contemporary churches are doing anything anywhere near as brazen to attract crowds. Ultimately, all that has been done is that one style of music (e.g., classical hymns) has been replaced with another (contemporary).

In fact, there are plenty of Christian rock concerts out there, where people go to cheer on a band singing "worship" songs! Now, I know that there will be plenty of young hipsters (20 may be young, but I'm not particularly hip - I'd rather rock it with the grannies in the pressy church, honestly) will disagree with me, but I don't think the idea of worship is to "get excited for God." How can you have a deep and meaningful moment while you're bouncing around with 150 decibels pumping through your skull? You can get that same feeling in a secular context.

I don't have any problem with how you choose to worship. In fact, if it were completely my choice (I'm married, so it is a partnership decision, not mine alone), I would probably attend a church with more traditional music. But, what I have found is that, no matter what kind of music is playing, there will be people who are genuinely worshiping God and some who are there to critique the music. I have also found that people who are there to worship God, generally don't care what kind of music is playing; they would worship to Stomp if they had to.

The other day I was talking to my sister's boyfriend, a non-Christian. He stated what seemed to be an earnest belief that the worship service he had attended with us was meant to be a form of entertainment. Churches think they're appealing to the younger generation with their dangerously loud rock music, but in reality, it mostly just appeals to the young people who are already Christian. My non-Christian friends seem to think that the church is full of hypocrisy, and not much different from the world.

I'm sorry, but your assumptions here are just incorrect. I could point to dozens of committed Christians in my church alone who were nonbelievers, came at the invitation of a friend, were surprised to learn that church doesn't have to be like the stereotype, came back because they enjoyed being in church, heard the Gospel, came to Christ, and now serve him wholeheartedly. Granted, music alone would not cause this, but music, combined with a warm fellowship and a solid Gospel message can and does attract nonbelievers.

It sounds like your non-Christian friend is reacting to a church that is full of hypocrisy. This has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with the style of music that they worship with.

Maybe hymns aren't the way to go anymore, but surely we could think of some worship songs that aren't just the same phrases over and over (yes, God is awesome and holy, but perhaps we could squeeze a few extra adjectives and reflections in there?) set to repetitive rhythms and tunes.

Very few of the songs at my church are "just the same phrases over and over" and they are no more "set to repetitive rhythms and tunes" than are most traditional hymns.

You know things have gone downhill when a Christian guy picks up a guitar, starts strumming a tune to a song he has in mind, and everyone around him starts singing different songs because they all have that same guitar riff.

Interestingly, I have never seen that happen.

Let's be honest. Contemporary music is not your cup of tea. I get that, and that is fine. Please, keep going to the church that you enjoy worshiping at. But, if others choose to worship God differently than you, that is not a crime or sin, or even wrong. It is a matter of preference. I would much rather be in a room full of people genuinely worshiping to the loudest heavy metal I could imagine than with a bunch people just going through the motions with the most sacred of hymns. And, generally, I find that the people who complain the most about the music, whatever it may be, tend to be the ones who are least interested in genuine worship.