If Evolution were true...

[Inan3]

Do you speak for all Christians?

Yes, all real Christians!

I though the masses believed in religion? Except for the parts of science that gives them computers, internet, and satellite TV.

Will you address my previous posts?

You will note I said science that is contrary to God's Word. I did not say all science.

Yes, I will address them but first I have to go look for them. I am sorry I didn't get to them yet.

 

[Inan3]

I am a Christian and I strongly believe the Bible is the word of God. I always had a bias for the Genesis account of creation. Over the years, I have been involved in many discussions regarding the question: evolution or creation? (at work, in Bible study groups, witnessing, and in blogs and chats such as this). As a result I have spent a lot of time researching and reading all I can find on the topic. I must admit that after listening to many arguments for the theory of evolution, at first I was attempting to find how God may have “used” evolutionary processes to accomplish the creation described in the Bible.

What I have found is that while the Bible is not a science book, it is scientifically accurate. I am not aware of any scientific evidence that contradicts the Bible. By that I do not mean that I believe in what the Bible reveals because I have found some scientific proposals that agree with it. It means, I believe, that science continues to support knowledge recorded in the Bible over three thousand years ago.

As we continue to grow our scientific knowledge of the information stored in our cells, I am sure we will find more evidence that supports a theory of intelligent design. As that happens I think everyone – scientists, theologians and lay people will gain a much bigger and more accurate picture of everything. Perhaps even something we all can agree on.

Deaver that is beautiful. Thank you.

 

[selfinflikted]

I keep seeing creationists say that science is steadily proving the Bible true. What science do you all keep talking about? Can't be genetics, biology, geology... I'm not quite sure what you are talking about?

 

[Inan3]

I believe you are afraid to test your god. Even AV evaded the subject.

I believe that your fear is based on the fact that the men that founded the Christian religion wrote into the text of of their book that testing of this god must not be done. In today's world, we would say "no flash photography" so as not to capture the wires and other trickery of the stage magician.

I believe this statement to be true:

"There's no reason, in theory, why god's presence couldn't be measured or detected in some way. The only reason that believers claim that god "can't" be detected in this way is because god *isn't* detected, and so a vast and intricate rationale has to be devised to explain this vast, loving, eternal, all-powerful "something" which is, in every external, objective respect, indistinguishable from nothing." -- NMS on alt.atheism

I believe that you are unable to demonstrate that gods, like those mentioned in the Christian Bible, are even possible.

Davian, Forty years... that's forty years. I've been young and now I'm not so young (in age that is) I've seen lots and lots in my life and been through lots and lots. I am a very open and honest person. I'm that way with God also. I say this because there is no way that I have not already tested God. He allows this because He would know I wasn't being honest if I didn't. Life brings us many things and questions along the way. That's one of the things my Father does. He answers my questions. I have never had a test or a question that I have not gone away from it believing MORE in God than I did before. I'm not afraid of God in ANY way. I LOVE God.

I don't know how to make you see or understand that over the internet. I'm not religious. I'm not just a mamby pamby Christian. I question everything and everyone, including myself, and if it doesn't line up with the scriptures I don't accept it. I don't SEE the Word of God as you do. I don't believe men COULD have written what has been written in the Bible WITHOUT the influence of the Holy Spirit. All these writings were by individuals who lived hundreds and thousands of years apart and they did not conspire with each other to form a doctrine to bring all us Christians under their control.

God does not work solely under some church building. He works in our individual lives. Yes, there may be some who fit your description but most true or mature Christians do not. When you are a true Christian you do not have to even know the person to know if they are a true Christian. I don't know AV or any of the other Christians here personally. I don't even know what their real names are or where they are from but I am one with them. I know exactly what they mean when they talk about the Bible and Christ. How can that be? I don't know them from Adam and yet, I know them. It's because we are one in the Spirit.... one in the family of God.... onne in Christ.

As to God's presence being measured or detected in some way there is a way but you must be born of the Spirit to experience it. God is a Spirit and to know Him you, too, must be alive in the spirit. You must be alive unto God. When we are born into this world in the physical/natural we are not alive unto God. We have to receive Jesus His Son to become sons and daughters ourselves.... THEN you can know God and His presence. You won't see Him yet, but you can know Him.

You told me what you think I believe. Now, let me tell you what I believe. I believe you are afraid to test God. I believe you can't move into the realm of the unseen because YOU are afraid that what you have been taught your whole life or what you have built your beliefs on will be shown to be false. Some of it IS false. You are afraid you will be mocked and ridiculed by possibly your family or friends ... and you just might be... but it's worth it to know the Lord. I think most atheists WANT us to PROVE God and SHOW us God and I wish I could but that is not how it works. YOU have to believe God is real or at least seek Him to find out for yourself. God wants you to KNOW Him. Other Christians are here to help and support you but if ones faith was all based on other Christians.... well, you know how that would go. Christians are not perfect just new creatures growing all the time. If we did not have GOD Christianity really wouldn't be much at all. God is the focus of it all. God is the reality of it all. God is the Life and Spirit of it all.

I hope this is the post you were asking me to answer. If not please let me know.

 

[Inan3]

But your definition is wrong.

Why are you trying to redefine a word that's already defined?

Faith is belief in something without evidence. That's it. If you believe something for which no evidence exists then you have faith.

Well, nice of you to share but where do you get that definition? Out of the atheist's manual?

 

[rjc34]

In your dreams!!! Where do you guys come up with this stuff?

Firstly, I only endorse Christianity!! Secondly, just because this world and probably some unbelievers posing as pseudo-christians, tried to put a definition to faith and religion (because they had no clue) and we might disagree with their definition does not mean that we in anyway try to denigrate the concepts of either and LAST of all to gain parity with science!!! Hello!!!

You are so blinded by your worship of science that you can't even see or hear for the matter what we are saying... Does the phrase "science can take a hike" sound ANYTHING like we want to gain parity with science.

You guys are so used to patting each other on the back and drooling all over yourselves that you have NO IDEA or CLUE that others standback and wonder just HOW you could not see the truth!! It is so clear!!

Here's a test to show you just where we stand with your views and so called science. Imagine this.... you are at 0 degrees and WAY over on the other side at 180 degrees is where we are... can you see that??? AND..... we DON'T .... that's a BIG DO NOT.... agree with nor WANT to agree with you on the science that does not agree with the BIBLE. We are not wishing or hoping that you can help us to see it better in any way.

The only ones who will do that are pseudo-christians or faux-chrisitians that are out there. They have no idea what faith, religion, God or Jesus is all about anyway. They build their religion on sand just as Jesus said because they do not do the things that He has told them. Science "so called" is part of that sandy ground and will someday crumble. ANYONE who bases their belief on science will fall with it. Kaboom!!

NO, NO, NO, we want no part of the devastation and destruction that inevitably will happen.

Our faith is built on nothing less than Jesus and HIS righteousness. On Christ the solid Rock we stand ALL other ground is sinking sand!!!

If you just going to preach, go do it in some other section. You came to the science section, and seemed to legitimately want to understand the evidence and the science behind evolution, but when backed into a corner you just went full on preach mode.

Basically, my advice is that both you, and us science folks, would be better off if you just left. And BTW I bet all of the science accepting Christians around here won't be taking kindly to you basically telling them all they're false Christians. How rude.

 

[Inan3]

I was just over at Wikipedia and it says there are over 38,000 Christian sects. Which one did you just endorse?

And what if Jesus was a myth?

The only one in the bible. The one where you give your life to Jesus and receive what He has done for you. The one where you believe all that He has taught and don't just pick and choose what fits your life. The one where JESUS CHRIST is LORD!!!

Oh by the way did I tell you ... I KNOW HIM. He's not a myth. So now you do not need to wonder but if you still do, why don't you aske Him.

 

[rjc34]

It's called A Creationist's View of DINOSAURS and the Theory Of Evolution by Jim Pinkoski

Pinkoski.com - Home

At the risk of running afoul of a certain well-known internet meme, I'm going to venture a guess that this guy's NOT a parody, but the genuine article.

Almost as good as Time Cube.

 

[Insane_Duck]

Let me clear that up for you, Crazy. I can see how you could have gotten that mixed up by my wording. I believe in the one true God, God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. They are ONE God. All of mankind was made in the image and likeness of the one true God. The Creator of all mankind. He therefore is our Common Ancestor. Of course, Adam and Eve are also, our common ancestors.


Allah has no part there. Allah is a false god. A lie.

Let me clear that up for you, Crazy. I can see how you could have gotten that mixed up by my wording. I believe in the one true God, Allah. He is the ONE true God. All of mankind was made in the image and likeness of the one true God. The Creator of all mankind. He therefore is our Common Ancestor. Of course, Adam and Eve are also, our common ancestors.


Yahweh has no part there. Yahweh is a false god. A lie.

 

[Inan3]

If Jesus died for our sins, why do people still get sent to hell?

Regarding your signature... People don't get sent to hell. They are going there through birth BUT because Jesus died for their sins, they don't HAVE to settle for that. All they have to do is believe and receive personally what He has done for them. It's only those who refuse or reject His provision to keep them out of Hell that go there.

 

[rjc34]

You will note I said science that is contrary to God's Word. I did not say all science.

You can't just 'pick and choose' your science, like you can with scripture. You ether accept the scientific method or you don't. When you become an evolution-denier, you reject the scientific method, and thus spit in the face of all scientific inquiry that benefits you every single day.

The scientific method used to discover and create the technology you use to post on this forum is the same scientific method that discovered evolution.

 

[rjc34]

Regarding your signature... People don't get sent to hell. They are going there through birth BUT because Jesus died for their sins, they don't HAVE to settle for that. All they have to do is believe and receive personally what He has done for them. It's only those who refuse or reject His provision to keep them out of Hell that go there.

So you believe in the Mafia boss God then?

You don't have to pay the protection racket. You have a choice. But if you don't, your legs are going to get broken.

Would you describe a mafia boss as 'all loving'?

 

[Inan3]

I can sort of understand it, though. I mean, for a great number of people, religion provides a "comfort zone." Because I don't need that particular crutch in my life, however "truth" reveals itself is fine and dandy with me. But for those folks who have to have that comfort zone, I can understand their hesitation to abandon it.

Oh thank you for being so understanding sf. (imaginary smilie with tongue stuck out and gagging)

 

[Inan3]

I wonder where you ever got the idea that anyone really cares what your opinion is. You actually think you are a god of some sort and the masses can't wait to follow your every word. I suppose in a sense and with some silly people you are right.

"With every day, and from both sides of my intelligence, the moral and the intellectual, I thus drew steadily nearer to the truth, by whose partial discovery I have been doomed to such a dreadful shipwreck: that man is not truly one, but truly two."

 

[rjc34]

I have a feeling Inan3 blocked me after realizing I backed her into a corner where the only way out was preaching.

 

[Insane_Duck]

I have a feeling Inan3 blocked me after realizing I backed her into a corner where the only way out was preaching.

How can you tell if someone has blocked you? Because she isn't responding to my Muslim evangelizing. How else will she hear the word of Allah?

 

[Deaver]

I keep seeing creationists say that science is steadily proving the Bible true. What science do you all keep talking about? Can't be genetics, biology, geology... I'm not quite sure what you are talking about?

Let me take a try at answering your question:

I believe I can show verses in the Bible that are consistent with the following disciplines: Paleontology, Astronomy, Meteorology, Biology, Anthropology, Hydrology, Geology, Physics.

Let’s take biology for example.

In Leviticus 17:11, written prior to 1400 BC the value of blood is described.

“For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.” (KJV)
​

Today, 3, 400 years later, we know that the blood carries water and nourishment to every cell, maintains the body’s temperature, and removes the waste material of the body’s cells. The blood also carries oxygen from the lungs throughout the body.

The Bible describes the development of living organisms from other living organisms (biogenesis) and the stability of each kind of living organism.

And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (Genesis 1:11-12 KJV)

And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (Genesis 1:21 KJV)

And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (Genesis 1:25 KJV)
​

The phrase “according to its kind” occurs repeatedly, stressing the reproductive integrity of each kind of animal and plant. Today we know this occurs because all of these reproductive systems are programmed by their genetic codes.

The Bible describes the chemical nature of flesh.

And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. (Genesis 2:7 KJV)

​

Today we know that a person’s mental and spiritual health is strongly correlated with physical health. As we search through scripture we find these scripture verses (and others) written by King Solomon about 950 BC.

A virtuous woman is a crown to her husband: but she that maketh ashamed is as rottenness in his bones. (Proverbs 12:4 KJV)

A sound heart is the life of the flesh: but envy the rottenness of the bones. (Proverbs 14:30 KJV)

The light of the eyes rejoiceth the heart: and a good report maketh the bones fat. (Proverbs 15:30 KJV)

Pleasant words are as an honeycomb, sweet to the soul, and health to the bones. (Proverbs 16:24 KJV)

A merry heart doeth good like a medicine: but a broken spirit drieth the bones. (Proverbs 17:22 KJV)
​

 

[Deaver]

Deaver that is beautiful. Thank you.

Thanks Inan!

 

[Deaver]

You can't just 'pick and choose' your science, like you can with scripture. You ether accept the scientific method or you don't. When you become an evolution-denier, you reject the scientific method, and thus spit in the face of all scientific inquiry that benefits you every single day.

The scientific method used to discover and create the technology you use to post on this forum is the same scientific method that discovered evolution.

Let me jump right to my point. I don’t believe there was a scientific method that discovered “evolution”. Darwin noticed the variation in the appearance of individual animals while studying wildlife. He assumed that this variation, given enough time, would allow those animals to change to the point that they looked different. The theory of evolution then developed through people writing books that typically contain two things (i) artist’s drawings that show the ages and names of the layers of the earth and (ii) artist’s drawings showing plants and animals arranged in a “family tree.” The continuous printing of them for more than a hundred years does not prove the theory.

What Darwin assumed was not really surprising. This process of changing an organism’s appearance through a series of small changes is correctly called “microevolution”. But let’s be real that is not what we are referring to when we use the term “the theory of evolution”.

Whenever I find myself in a discussion regarding whether the Bible’s creation account or the theory of evolution is correct, I find that we are really discussing “where did life come from?” and “did we descend from apelike ancestors?”

I will go out on a limb here by saying nothing has been dug out of the ground (or discovered anywhere else) that has proven the “theory of evolution”, which I maintain is a really a discussion of abiogenesis and macroevolution combined.

 

[Blayz]

The theory of evolution then developed through people writing books that typically contain two things (i) artist’s drawings that show the ages and names of the layers of the earth and (ii) artist’s drawings showing plants and animals arranged in a “family tree.” The continuous printing of them for more than a hundred years does not prove the theory.

Uh oh, our secret is out!

Here's sneak pic at one of those artists drawings, of which there are plenty, given that there are about 3 million biologists out there, all madly printing contiuous copies of these artistic drawings.