Do you agree that christians should keep the 10 Commandments? (4)

[11822]

Was Paul saying that teaching abstinence from fornication, adultery, lying, stealing, idolatry and covetousness was vein Jangling that should be avoided? No he wasn't. He teaches these things multiple times himself throughout the NT. Was Paul calling himself a fool who jangled on about the law thinking himself a teacher? No he wasn't. He was saying things that Jesus or Paul doesn't teach are vein jangling and to be avoided.

And lets not forget that Paul also says this:

2Ti 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
2Ti 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

 

[Studious One]

Of course Timothy knew the Holy Scriptures from a child... his mother was a Jewess and taught him the Scriptures.

Notice that Paul told him the Scriptures were able to 'make you wise unto Salvation'? The Scriptures did not save him, they made him wise enough to realize his need for a Savior.

The Law cannot save, nor can it justify man. By the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified. It can only reveal to the lost soul his lost estate and then point that lost soul to Christ. This is one of the reasons Paul stated when the law came, sin revived and he died.... the Law brings death to man.

We are no longer bound to the Mosaic Law. We have been brought to life and liberty in Christ Jesus once we placed our faith in Him. The Law is not for the righteous, but for the ungodly; i.e., for those who have not come to faith in Christ.

If you wish to keep the Law, and be identified with the list of characters listed in 1 Timothy 1:9-10, have at it. As for me, I will continue to serve Christ by focusing on Him and being identified as one who is setting my affection on things above and not on things of the earth.

 

[11822]

Of course Timothy knew the Holy Scriptures from a child... his mother was a Jewess and taught him the Scriptures.

Notice that Paul told him the Scriptures were able to 'make you wise unto Salvation'? The Scriptures did not save him, they made him wise enough to realize his need for a Savior.

The Law cannot save, nor can it justify man. By the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified. It can only reveal to the lost soul his lost estate and then point that lost soul to Christ. This is one of the reasons Paul stated when the law came, sin revived and he died.... the Law brings death to man.

We are no longer bound to the Mosaic Law. We have been brought to life and liberty in Christ Jesus once we placed our faith in Him. The Law is not for the righteous, but for the ungodly; i.e., for those who have not come to faith in Christ.

And these scriptures are able to make others wise unto salvation as well. Whos saying the law justifies? NOT ME BROTHER!... as i already said multiple times. You say that teaching abstaining from fornication and adultery is vein jangling yet Paul, the rest of the apostles and most spirit lead preachers teach this same thing.

Is this thread not about Gods commandments and if a Christian should obey them? You already admitted that a Spirit filled man would not kill, steal fornicate and so on.

I ask where is the vein jangling actually coming from?

 

[Stryder06]

Of course Timothy knew the Holy Scriptures from a child... his mother was a Jewess and taught him the Scriptures.

Notice that Paul told him the Scriptures were able to 'make you wise unto Salvation'? The Scriptures did not save him, they made him wise enough to realize his need for a Savior.

The Law cannot save, nor can it justify man. By the deeds of the Law shall no flesh be justified. It can only reveal to the lost soul his lost estate and then point that lost soul to Christ. This is one of the reasons Paul stated when the law came, sin revived and he died.... the Law brings death to man.

We are no longer bound to the Mosaic Law. We have been brought to life and liberty in Christ Jesus once we placed our faith in Him. The Law is not for the righteous, but for the ungodly; i.e., for those who have not come to faith in Christ.

If you wish to keep the Law, and be identified with the list of characters listed in 1 Timothy 1:9-10, have at it. As for me, I will continue to serve Christ by focusing on Him and being identified as one who is setting my affection on things above and not on things of the earth.

Psalsm 19:7 says The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

I for one don't understand why people seem to attribute the law that was administered under the leadership of Moses, to Moses as if he was the author of that law. Every law given under Moses came from God for His people.

The law only brings death to those who are living in violation of it. If you are walking in harmony with the law, more specifically, the ten commandments, what is there to be afraid of? What condemnation is there? As Paul said: Who [is] he that condemneth? [It is] Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

What need is there to make intercession for us if there is no law? This goes back to the sanctuary service, where the high priest made intercession for the people, his actions symbolizing that which our actual High Priest is doing. He intercedes for us because the law is still in force, and because every now and then we slip up, but instead of being condemned when we slip, Christ stands between us and the Father and points to His righteousness. He points to His sacrifice and pleads "FATHER MY BLOOD", on behalf of the sinner.

 

[Studious One]

A cursory scan of your posts will answer your question for you.

 

[11822]

21 I charge thee before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.

 

[Elder 111]

The Law came from God to the Isrealites. The Spirit is Part of the Godhead. Being born again came from Christ. He takes our heart of stone and makes it new.. Gods Spirit has always been with His people. Since Christ now His Spirit lives in His people and there is no more temple to go to worship at for we are the Temple.

The law was for all men. Nothing has changed, same God Same method of saving men.

 

[Elder 111]

ok..let me ask u this elder, why..why..did the Holy Spirit say, the law was bondage, temporary, arouses sin, for children, causes division, works wrath, not for the children of Abraham, not of faith, not for those led by the Spirit, condemning etc?

Why? Give us all a simple answer. I don't thnk this question is unreasonable.

I can not say why, for it never did. That is a satanic invention.

 

[11822]

A cursory scan of your posts will answer your question for you.

We are talking about the will of God, not eating food and observing days. Please read the scripture below and tell me, do we not risk judging each other over the will of God instead of eating kosher meat or observing days? Surely if Paul tolerates people obeying laws about food and observing days then He would tolerate people obeying Gods laws of Holiness even more which is the commandment to abstain from fornication and adultery.

Romans 14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. 12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God. 13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather, that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way. 14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean. 15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably. Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died. 16 Let not then your good be evil spoken of: 17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost. 18 For he that in these things serveth Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men. 19 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another. 20 For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; (FOOD NOT FORNICATION) but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence. 21 It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak. 22 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth. 23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

 

[11822]

In Romans 14, Paul actually tolerates people observing days and eating only kosher meat. Why wouldn't he also tolerate any of the 10 Commandments? And why should He not tolerate obeying abstinence from fornication even more?

 

[bbbbbbb]

The law was for all men. Nothing has changed, same God Same method of saving men.

Please show me where, in the Old Testament, all men entered into the Sinaitic Covenant and thus became part of the nation of Israel.

Thank you.

 

[Stryder06]

In Romans 14, Paul actually tolerates people observing days and eating only kosher meat. Why should He not tolerate obeying abstinence from fornication or any of the 10 Commandments?

Paul's intention was never to teach against the ten commandments. He was trying to keep the gentiles from being forced into a life of bondage by following rules that weren't for salvation.

In a sense he didn't want folk to wind up like the Pharisees, having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof.

The law had been taken out of its rightful place and used to subject the people to the will of the leaders, while simultaneously allowing the leaders to appear more pious and holier than thou.

 

[11822]

Paul's intention was never to teach against the ten commandments. He was trying to keep the gentiles from being forced into a life of bondage by following rules that weren't for salvation.

In a sense he didn't want folk to wind up like the Pharisees, having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof.

The law had been taken out of its rightful place and used to subject the people to the will of the leaders, while simultaneously allowing the leaders to appear more pious and holier than thou.

I agree.

 

[from scratch]

I can not say why, for it never did. That is a satanic invention.

What in Frogsters post is a satanic invention? I'm looking for specific item(s).

 

[from scratch]

The law was for all men. Nothing has changed, same God Same method of saving men.

It certianly wasn't given to all mankind. But since you say it is inquiring minds wish to know. Please point us to an verse within the law that says the law isfor all men all the time.

 

[from scratch]

Was Paul saying that teaching abstinence from fornication, adultery, lying, stealing, idolatry and covetousness was vein Jangling that should be avoided? No he wasn't. He teaches these things multiple times himself throughout the NT. Was Paul calling himself a fool who jangled on about the law thinking himself a teacher? No he wasn't. He was saying things that Jesus or Paul doesn't teach are vein jangling and to be avoided.

And lets not forget that Paul also says this:

2Ti 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
2Ti 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

I see you still insist we follow a set of rules and not the leading of the Spirit. Why is this?

 

[from scratch]

Abstaing from fornication is Gods will. I wouldn't suggest calling that vain jangling. It would only serve to confuse, not edify. Thats why Paul teaches us to abstain from fornication over and over throughout the NT.

So does the Holy Spirit lead one to fornicate?

 

[from scratch]

My point to frogster was that I wasn't talking about Acts 15. He told me to read it and I told him that I had. The reason why the was law bondage was being demonstrated in my illustration. Thank you for explaining though. I would like to assume that we all know that the gentile believers, while not being converted to Judaism, were still taught the ten commandments though.

Plus the things that were to be given to the Gentiles were still apart of the law of Moses. The point that James was trying to make was that the gentiles didn't need to be given a hard time in their conversion to Christ.

S/N: Thought this was interesting: verse 15 says - Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name.

It appears to me that one must be taught what sin is after the tutor (the law) proved one needed Jesus Christ. Hmmm! wouldn't that mean that the law (tutor) wasn't doing its job? So how or when does one learn what sin is? Before or after conversion? If it is after conversion, what is one converted to?

I thought those were points in the Noaic covenant.

 

[from scratch]

The law isn't the issue. It never was. It was how the law was used. You can't seem to get that though. Show me one law, just one, that is bad.

Any law given is a reflection of the law giver. Keep that in mind.

Thou art not fooling us. We can read.

 

[11822]

So does the Holy Spirit lead one to fornicate?

No it leads them not to. Fornicators continue to fornicate until the word tells them its wrong and they receive forgiveness and are saved. If they receive Jesus by the Holy Spirit they don't live in fornication, the flee from it. They resist the devil and the flesh and allow themselves to be lead by the Spirit according to what the apostles teach.