Why Sola Scriptura isn't God's plan

[Montalban]

Old Testament Canon. The Old Testament was collected by the Jews (Romans 3:1-2). All 39 books of the Old Testament are thought to have been finished by the time of Ezra (Luke 11:51).

New Testament Canon. The New Testament was written by the apostles (John 16:13). The New Testament was completed during the days of the apostles (Jude 1:3). The New Testament was received by the believers in the early churches (John 10:27; 1Thessalonians 2:13).

There's so many errors in logic in your position.

Firstly, 1 Thessalonians 2:13 doesn't refer to the written word. It says 'the word'. You assume it refers to the written word, because you do.

Secondly how could the Church accept a book such as 1 Thessalonians that hadn't been written?


How can Paul be referring in a book to a community accepting that book when he's writing in past tense to them accepting the word?

He's writing AFTER the event.

How can he be writing "They've accepted this book that I'm just writing now"?


In point of fact if you even read the whole passage you'd have noted that the word was NOT written...
1 Thessalonians 2:13 And we also thank God continually because, when you received the word of God, which you heard from us, you accepted it not as a human word, but as it actually is, the word of God, which is indeed at work in you who believe.

That is the word was spoken!
Thirdly, you've mistaken 'written the book' for 'compiling the bible'. Which are distinct events. The books we now have in the bible were written early on, but weren't collected together into the Bible until the 300s

It's also telling to me that a position so full of illogic is not of God.

 

[Thekla]

It sounds like Orthodox Christians do not have a high view of scripture. That's pretty bad. From the input of the EO Christians here, it seems as if they are more into their "traditions" rather than what the Word of God says. Sounds a lot like Roman Catholicism.

No, actually that is not at all the case

The Holy Scriptures are the most valued of the received Tradition handed over They were handed over within a context, not apart from a context; we honor all that was received.

 

[katherine2001]

Most baptists i've encountered or known growing up do not even consider Catholics as Christian...I would assume EO's are grouped along with them for the most part. Oh sweet irony...

Fortunately, Christ will be the one to decide that matter.

 

[Montalban]

No, actually that is not at all the case

The Holy Scriptures are the most valued of the received Tradition handed over They were handed over within a context, not apart from a context; we honor all that was received.

There's probabaly been 10 or more Protestants with the same straw-man

 

[Hentenza]

Wild and unsupported? Do you agree that Christ established a historical church on pentecost? What do you think happened to that church?

I believe that Christ church is the invisible church with the local churches being the visible manifestation of His church. The ONLY church that has not fallen at one point is the invisible church. All churches in the NT and beyond are local churches.

 

[Hentenza]

From the link:



For example, he lists greek orthodox and russian orthodox as different denominations. Of course the faith is the same (they are in communion with each other) yet they are separated only by country and nationality so he lists them differently.

But this is the main study that many here use to incorrectly claim that there are over 30000 protestant denominations so what's good for the geese is good for the gander.

 

[Montalban]

I believe that Christ church is the invisible church with the local churches being the visible manifestation of His church. The ONLY church that has not fallen at one point is the invisible church. All churches in the NT and beyond are local churches.

Then why did Paul tell us to obey our elders, and what type of man should be a bishop?

Also, if we're all believers then you're refuting yourself by arguing against us here.

 

[Hentenza]

At least per the EO info. he gives, it's ill informed
(Hope no-one tries to pass this off as "scholarship" )

It is indeed terrible scholarship but that doesn't stop many here from using it as absolute proof that there are sooooooooooooooooo many protestant denominations.

 

[Montalban]

It is indeed terrible scholarship but that doesn't stop many here from using it as absolute proof that there are sooooooooooooooooo many protestant denominations.

There are many Protestant denominations

What that matters, and you're all part of an invisible church of all-believers is another issue.

It's indesputable that there's many Protestant denominations

 

[Hentenza]

Show from scripture why you have your position. Oh, I remember! I've asked you and you've replied that you just believe it to be so.

Apparently that's not unsupported!

What? Now I have to prove that YOUR church didn't write the bible? Is your claim not mine. Is your burden of proof not mine.

 

[Hentenza]

There are many Protestant denominations

What that matters, and you're all part of an invisible church of all-believers is another issue.

It's indesputable that there's many Protestant denominations

How many protestant denominations are there?

 

[Hentenza]

Of course, most of those groups listed aren't separate "denominations" at all, which is rather amusing. That's a poorly put together list.

Yep. I'm glad that you picked up on that.

 

[Montalban]

How many protestant denominations are there?

I don't know.

I can see where your illogic is leading.

By the fact that I don't know how many grains of sand there are on a beach, there aren't 'many'. They must all constitute a single grain, as they all form one beach.

Same with knowing stars in the sky.

The fact your ID has "Baptist" rather than "Christian" is another case of you not seeing evidence right in front of you

 

[Montalban]

Yep. I'm glad that you picked up on that.

So am I. The claim that the EO are divided is rather poorly put together

 

[Ortho_Cat]

But this is the main study that many here use to incorrectly claim that there are over 30000 protestant denominations so what's good for the geese is good for the gander.

fair enough.

 

[Hentenza]

I don't know.

I can see where your illogic is leading.

By the fact that I don't know how many grains of sand there are on a beach, there aren't 'many'. They must all constitute a single grain, as they all form one beach.

Same with knowing stars in the sky.

Psalm 147
4He counts the number of the stars;
He gives names to all of them.

The fact your ID has "Baptist" rather than "Christian" is another case of you not seeing evidence right in front of you

The fact your ID has "Eastern Orthodox" rather than "Christian" is another case of you not seeing evidence right in front of you. Back at cha.

And you still can't quantify your denomination's Traditions.

 

[Montalban]

Psalm 147
4He counts the number of the stars;
He gives names to all of them.

That's a strange one.

I never said that God doesn't know.

I stated I don't. Are you confusing me with God?

The fact your ID has "Eastern Orthodox" rather than "Christian" is another case of you not seeing evidence right in front of you. Back at cha.

Except I don't believe that you're in the same invisible church I am

Not only are you confusing me with God you're confusing my argument with yours

And you still can't quantify your denomination's Traditions.

No. That's false. EVEN YOU said you know what I believe.

What you asked was for them in list format.

I don't have them in *ppd format either. Therefore the beliefs don't exist?

Well as you said you know what I believe, then you've undermined your own argument

 

[Hentenza]

Except I don't believe that you're in the same invisible church I am

What? Do you belong to a private country club?

Hint: Christ established ONLY one universal church.

Not only are you confusing me with God you're confusing my argument with yours

No. That's false. EVEN YOU said you know what I believe.

What you asked was for them in list format.

I don't have them in *ppd format either. Therefore the beliefs don't exist?

Well as you said you know what I believe, then you've undermined your own argument

Deflecting does not help your argument. Quantify your Traditions or you are just blowing hot air.

Both your denomination and the RC claim to be the "one true" church but you have radically different "T"raditions including the "apostolic succession". Both of your traditions can not be true so how do you know which one (if any) is true?

 

[laconicstudent]

What? Do you belong to a private country club?

Hint: Christ established ONLY one universal church.

Indeed.

YouTube - Elder paisios: 'On common prayer with the heterodox'

 

[Hentenza]

Indeed.

Heterodox definition.

1. Not in agreement with accepted beliefs, especially in church doctrine or dogma.
2. Holding unorthodox opinions.

heterodox - Dictionary definition and pronunciation - Yahoo! Education

I have never considered myself a heterodox. I am an orthodox Christian.