Discussion on Arab/Israeli conflict, split from {Islam doesn't condone terror]

[Servant of Jesus]

I agree. However Israel continues peace talks. They are not mutually exclusive.

But whether the peace talks are meaningful is questionable as long as the Palestinians continue to make bottom line demands that are an absolute non-starter for the Israelis.

However, on the other hand- they were able to negotiate a lasting peace with Egypt, so I guess there is some hope.

All bets are off, though, once the Iranians have their nuclear weapons and the missiles to deliver them, and have fully re-armed Hezbollah in Lebanon.

 

[lucaspa]

But whether the peace talks are meaningful is questionable as long as the Palestinians continue to make bottom line demands that are an absolute non-starter for the Israelis.

And why did the Israelis make them non-starters? You do realize that the Israelis make bottom line demands that are absolute non-starters for the Palestinians, don't you?

However, on the other hand- they were able to negotiate a lasting peace with Egypt, so I guess there is some hope.

I don't think so, because Israel has broken every peace deal negotiated with the Palestinians. I can see no indication that Israel wants any type of peace in the occupied territories. Instead, it wants all Palestinians dead.

 

[b&wpac7]

I don't think so, because Israel has broken every peace deal negotiated with the Palestinians. I can see no indication that Israel wants any type of peace in the occupied territories. Instead, it wants all Palestinians dead.

No, I'm sorry, that is just wrong. To suggest that the Palestinians have never broken the peace deals is, at best mistaken and at worst deceptive.

You know the sad thing? With each concession Israel has made in the past decades, the calls for the country being horrible have increased.

 

[Servant of Jesus]

People forget that Palestinians make up 20% of the population in Israel- and overall, they get along fine with their fellow Jewish citizens. Most Palestinians in Israel want nothing to do with their violent brothers and sisters in Gaza and the West Bank- they very much appreciate their freedom, security, jobs, and relatively good standard of living. I'm not aware of a single Jihadist attack committed by a Palestinian living within Israel.

 

[PHenry42]

But whether the peace talks are meaningful is questionable as long as the Palestinians continue to make bottom line demands that are an absolute non-starter for the Israelis.

And if Israel declares a certain demand a non-starter, it's the Palestinians' fault how? If the realization of the inherent human rights of the Palestinians are a non-starter for Israel, it is Israel who is, by the standards of international conduct, in the wrong and at fault for the perpetuation of the conflict.

 

[PHenry42]

People forget that Palestinians make up 20% of the population in Israel- and overall, they get along fine with their fellow Jewish citizens. Most Palestinians in Israel want nothing to do with their violent brothers and sisters in Gaza and the West Bank- they very much appreciate their freedom, security, jobs, and relatively good standard of living. I'm not aware of a single Jihadist attack committed by a Palestinian living within Israel.

Oh yes, those few who were lucky enough not to be forcibly displaced in 1948.

 

[FRM48]

Oh yes, those few who were lucky enough not to be forcibly displaced in 1948.

Why do the Palestinians have a right to land that was never theirs in the first place?

 

[b&wpac7]

Oh yes, those few who were lucky enough not to be forcibly displaced in 1948.

I see you flying the US flag. Please go find a Native American and give him or her your land, if you own any. Since they were also displaced.

 

[AskTheFamily]

I see you flying the US flag. Please go find a Native American and give him or her your land, if you own any. Since they were also displaced.

Are you suggesting what was done to the natives was ok?

They were both wrong.

 

[b&wpac7]

Are you suggesting what was done to the natives was ok?

They were both wrong.

It's amazing how many people call for Israel to return the land when they would be unwilling to give up their own, almost as if the land they are on holds some sort of important value to them.

It's not our fault a much bigger army couldn't, how was it put, "push the Jews into the sea".

 

[b&wpac7]

How about the massacre at Hebron? Way before Israel was a state and in a settlement that had been Jewish for a long, long time.
The Hebron Massacre of 1929

Both sides have blood on their hands.

 

[Montalban]

Oh yes, those few who were lucky enough not to be forcibly displaced in 1948.

In 1948 what is now Israel was to be partitioned into Arab and a Jewish states.

The Arabs didn't want that. They went to war and lost.

 

[Servant of Jesus]

I see you flying the US flag. Please go find a Native American and give him or her your land, if you own any. Since they were also displaced.

Bingo.

 

[razeontherock]

Israel has broken every peace deal negotiated with the Palestinians.

Interesting info I have not encountered before. Fodder for it's own thread, unrelated here though ...

 

[razeontherock]

And if Israel declares a certain demand a non-starter, it's the Palestinians' fault how? If the realization of the inherent human rights of the Palestinians are a non-starter for Israel, it is Israel who is, by the standards of international conduct, in the wrong and at fault for the perpetuation of the conflict.

Playing the blame game in an issue as old and as large as the Israel / Palestinian conflict really isn't going to help anything

And certainly won't be solved in a thread on CF

 

[PHenry42]

I see you flying the US flag. Please go find a Native American and give him or her your land, if you own any. Since they were also displaced.

And that is relevant for the topic how? How does the fact that another completely unrelated group of people were dispossessed in another place, another time imply that the dispossession of the group in question (Palestinians) is just and legal?

Does the fact that Stalin's Terror happened and he got away with it imply that it was wrong for Hitler to have his holocaust stopped and him to be punished for it?

Or, if we accept the absurd notion that one dispossessment makes all others legal and unobjectionable, how do you have any basis to object to any "driving of the Jews into the sea"?

Can you stand to let Israel and its conflict with the Palestinians be allowed to be regarded on its own, with nothing but the actual facts of the situation?

But as for the Native Americans, since you asked, last time I checked they had all been granted full and equal citizenship, and quite extensive privileges too. They have all that we have, and more. The injustice that was done them has been thoroughly rectified. Light-years from what Israel has ever offered the Palestinians.

 

[PHenry42]

In 1948 what is now Israel was to be partitioned into Arab and a Jewish states.

The Arabs didn't want that. They went to war and lost.

Relevance?

Is there an article of international law that says that if a country goes to war, the human rights of all people belonging to its ethnic group (even ones not involved in the war) have their human rights indefinitely suspended and can legally be inflicted any indignity?

 

[b&wpac7]

Actually, I hate discussing the entire conflict. There are way too many strong feelings on both sides and it will only lead to flames here. I'm out.

 

[b&wpac7]

Actually, I hate discussing the entire conflict. There are way too many strong feelings on both sides and it will only lead to flames here. I'm out.

 

[PHenry42]

Why do the Palestinians have a right to land that was never theirs in the first place?

Basic property rights disagree with you, a right that is a staple of civilization everywhere. What land and other assets they owned, they had acquired legally under the rules set by whatever outside power ruled the area at the time.

There is no such thing as ethnic privilege to land; basic civil rights are not dependent on being a member of a group that is legally upheld as the primary nation of the state.