Adam and Eve

[Tiberius]

Not so. Waffles can't factor in a way to the occurance of the president's birthday. However, a supernatural God can bring forth a universe.

true. but the simply fact that a universe exists at all does not mean that the presence of a god is the only way the universe could have been formed.

I mean, I could say, "There are shoes made overnight, therefore there are shoe-making elves." I could justify that with the same logic that you used: shoe making elves can make the shoes overnight. but that doesn't mean that the shoe-making elves are the ONLY explanation.

Likewise, God is not the only explanation for the universe.

 

[AV1611VET]

Let me add to this conversation, had you been my student:

Conversations with my teachers in Christian school generally went like this.

Me: "Wow! Look at that cosmic phenomenon! How does it work? How did it start? What caused it?"

Teacher: "Well Mike, God did it! IsN't tHAt aMaZiNg?!?!"

Me: "Oh. Yeah that's pretty cool I guess."

AV: 'I guess'? What does that mean? Are you really familiar with the constellations like you think you are? Here, let me tell you Who Orion really is, and what happens when He brings that club down.

Then, if you're still bored...

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

Orion was a hunter from Greek Mythology. And was that a threat, or just your attempt at generating drama?

 

[AV1611VET]

Orion was a hunter from Greek Mythology.

Orion is a type of the Lord Jesus Christ in Hebrew prophecy.

A serpent is about to strike His heel, and He is about to crush its head.

Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

What are you talking about?

Orion (Greek: Ὠρίων[1] or Ωαρίων, Latin: Orion[2]) was a giant huntsman in Greek mythology whom Zeus placed among the stars as the constellation of Orion.
Ancient sources tell several different stories about Orion. There are two major versions of his birth and several versions of his death. The most important recorded episodes are his birth somewhere in Boeotia, his visit to Chios where he met Merope and was blinded by her father, Oenopion, the recovery of his sight at Lemnos, his hunting with Artemis on Crete, his death by the bow of Artemis or the sting of the giant scorpion which became Scorpio, and his elevation to the heavens. Most ancient sources omit some of these episodes and several tell only one. These various incidents may originally have been independent, unrelated stories and it is impossible to tell whether omissions are simple brevity or represent a real disagreement.
In Greek literature he first appears as a great hunter in Homer's epic the Odyssey, where Odysseus sees his shade in the underworld. The bare bones of his story are told by the Hellenistic and Roman collectors of myths, but there is no extant literary version of his adventures comparable, for example, to that of Jason in Apollonius of Rhodes' Argonautica or Euripides' Medea; the entry in Ovid's Fasti for May 11 is a poem on the birth of Orion, but that is one version of a single story. The surviving fragments of legend have provided a fertile field for speculation about Greek prehistory and myth.
Orion served several roles in ancient Greek culture. The story of the adventures of Orion, the hunter, is the one on which we have the most evidence (and even on that not very much); he is also the personification of the constellation of the same name; he was venerated as a hero, in the Greek sense, in the region of Boeotia; and there is one etiological passage which says that Orion was responsible for the present shape of the Straits of Sicily.

 

[AV1611VET]

What are you talking about?

Hebrew, Ezio -- Hebrew.

Put your Greek aside, the Hebrews came long before the Greeks did, and they recognized Orion as something else.

My favorite example is Aries.

Known as 'The Ram' in Greek, it was known as 'The Lamb' in Hebrew.

And in typology, it is The Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world; as John the [fundamental independent] Baptist attested:

John 1:29 ¶ The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

Now you know why the sun went dark from 12:00 to 3:00 on the day Jesus was crucified.

Neat, eh?

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

Ah, you were referring to the constellation, not the mythological figure. You should have mentioned that.

 

[AV1611VET]

Ah, you were referring to the constellation, not the mythological figure. You should have mentioned that.

You mean here?

Are you really familiar with the constellations like you think you are? Here, let me tell you Who Orion really is, and what happens when He brings that club down.

 

[Greg1234]

Now, when will you learn? Don't quote the Bible to someone who doesn't believe it, because it means nothing to them!

Well if there was the intention to override your belief that the bible writers and the Harry Potter writers were under the same conditions and had the same intents, then you have every reason to defend your belief. If there wasn't the intention, then the citation of your beliefs as a rebut means nothing to someone who doesn't believe in them("!"). There is only the neutral exchange.

I mean, I could say, "There are shoes made overnight, therefore there are shoe-making elves." I could justify that with the same logic that you used: shoe making elves can make the shoes overnight. but that doesn't mean that the shoe-making elves are the ONLY explanation.

Likewise, God is not the only explanation for the universe.[/quote]

And that would be the belief that God is comparable to shoe making elves in addition to the belief that the bible writers were under the same conditions as you are right now; "just saying" that life and its abode were created by an entity without actually experiencing anything. And that would go back to the manner of man present. Which would go back to Creationism/Darwinism. As an atheist who honors the belief that a universal intelligence emerged from ignorance, it is only natural that it is any explanation but an intelligence. This belief is not shared though. And the pinnacle of discoveries, is simultaneously at the beginning.

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

Well, you did refer to the constellation as Orion instead of it's Hebrew name. Here's something you might have said to make it a little clearer:

AV: "I guess?" To the Hebrew, the constellation Orion was Jesus crushing a serpent!" Or something of that sort.

 

[Son of the King]

Well if there was the intention to override your belief that the bible writers and the Harry Potter writers were under the same conditions and had the same intents, then you have every reason to defend your belief. If there wasn't the intention, then the citation of your beliefs as a rebut means nothing to someone who doesn't believe in them("!"). There is only the neutral exchange.




Likewise, God is not the only explanation for the universe.

And that would be the belief that God is comparable to shoe making elves in addition to the belief that the bible writers were under the same conditions as you are right now; "just saying" that life and its abode were created by an entity without actually experiencing anything. And that would go back to the manner of man present. Which would go back to Creationism/Darwinism. As an atheist who honors the belief that a universal intelligence emerged from ignorance, it is only natural that it is any explanation but an intelligence. This belief is not shared though. And the pinnacle of discoveries, is simultaneously at the beginning.[/quote]



Excellent points here. Dont you find it ironic that many in here can compare the living God with elves, pink unicorns santa clause Harry Potter and other obvious fairy tales? Comparing making shoes to the universe though is quite a stretch. That's like comparing a lobe finned fish with the aid of natural selection adding pressure to random mutations (most of which are detrimental) over an extensive period of time will produce humans to a metal scrap yard with the aid of a series of tornados adding pressure over the equivalent amount of time will produce a boing 747.

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

Look, when we find evidence of a god he'll be factored in to the equations and theories. But until we find a burning bush that sounds like Charleston Heston, we'll keep going where the evidence leads.

 

[AV1611VET]

Look, when we find evidence of a god he'll be factored in to the equations and theories. But until we find a burning bush that sounds like Charleston Heston, we'll keep going where the evidence leads.

The evidence is leading you down the wrong path.

It is leading you to thermal equilibrium, but the [written] signs say:

WARNING!

FIRE LAKE AHEAD
​

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

YouTube - AC/DC - Highway To Hell(with lyrics)

I'll have the best music at least. Great company too. Always wanted to party with Sagan and Wilde.

 

[AV1611VET]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0LDbf4ipWMI'll have the best music at least. Great company too.

I'm afraid they won't be able to entertain you; they'll be busy with other things:

Matthew 8:22 But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

[tanzanos]

I'll have to laugh if a meteorite DOES strike your toe in the next four minutes
Trouble is, would you survive that event, to let us know
Sorry, really, I probably shouldnt have asked how you know..I just like reading these threads.

This kid was actually hit by a meteor the size of a pea, albeit it only clipped his hand!

 

[tanzanos]

YouTube - Welcome to Hell

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

I'm afraid they won't be able to entertain you; they'll be busy with other things:

Matthew 8:22 But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Of course Hell doesn't exist and was only used to keep the peasants in line so that they didn't overthrow the "divinely chosen" king.

 

[Bushido216]

I make it a habit never to trust assassins.

 

[Ezio Auditore di Firenze]

Templar!