Does the Roman Church focus on Peter too much

[chestertonrules]

Nice quote mine you found.

Luke 9:46Then there arose a reasoning among them, which of them should be greatest.
47And Jesus, perceiving the thought of their heart, took a child, and set him by him,
48And said unto them, Whosoever shall receive this child in my name receiveth me: and whosoever shall receive me receiveth him that sent me: for he that is least among you all, the same shall be great.
49And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
50And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.

Jesus confirms that casting out devils is a positive activity!!

However, denying the Eucharist or rejecting the Church is not.

Do you think Jesus would have had the same answer if the man was ripping off old ladies in his name?

 

[Hentenza]

Doesn't make it any less true, and of course you can't refute it.

Sure it does and sure I can but then all you are going to do is ignore my post anyway.

BTW- It also makes it plagiarism when you don't cite the source. You did know that is against the posting rules, right?

 

[chestertonrules]

Sure it does and sure I can but then all you are going to do is ignore my post anyway.

BTW- It also makes it plagiarism when you don't cite the source. You did know that is against the posting rules, right?

I was just in a hurry.

I've probably linked to that site 100 times or more!

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Hentenza Oh, look. A cut and paste from a biased source. lol

Scripture Catholic - THE PRIMACY OF PETER

Doesn't make it any less true, and of course you can't refute it.

Or any less biased

http://www.christiantruth.com/articles/mt16.html

The Church Fathers' Interpretation of the Rock of Matthew 16:18

An Historical Refutation of the Claims of Roman Catholicism

Includes a Critique of Jesus, Peter and the Keys

*snip*

Matthew 16:18 is the critical passage of Scripture for the establishment of the authority claims of the Roman Catholic Church. It is upon the interpretation of the rock and keys that the entire structure of the Church of Rome rests. And Vatican I plainly states that its interpretation of Matthew 16 is that which has been held by the Church from the very beginning and is therefore not a doctrinal development.................

 

[JacktheCatholic]

ECF: Firmilian


"But what is his error . . . who does not remain on the foundation of the one Church which was founded upon the rock by Christ [Matt. 16:18], can be learned from this, which Christ said to Peter alone: ‘Whatever things you shall bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth, they shall be loosed in heaven’ [Matt. 16:19]" (collected in Cyprian’s Letters 74[75]:16 [A.D. 253]).

"[Pope] Stephen . . . boasts of the place of his episcopate, and contends that he holds the succession from Peter, on whom the foundations of the Church were laid [Matt. 16:18]. . . . [Pope] Stephen . . . announces that he holds by succession the throne of Peter" (ibid., 74[75]:17).

 

[ivebeenshown]

The name "Peter" appears 184 times in the Bible. Combined with the instances of his given name, Simon, this is more than all the other apostles combined! So mabye you think the Bible foucuses to much on Peter too?

There is ample evidence in the New Testament that Peter was first in authority among the apostles. Whenever they were named, Peter headed the list (Matt. 10:1-4, Mark 3:16-19, Luke 6:14-16, Acts 1:13); sometimes the apostles were referred to as "Peter and those who were with him" (Luke 9:32). Peter was the one who generally spoke for the apostles (Matt. 18:21, Mark 8:29, Luke 12:41, John 6:68-69), and he figured in many of the most dramatic scenes (Matt. 14:28-32, Matt. 17:24-27, Mark 10:23-28). On Pentecost it was Peter who first preached to the crowds (Acts 2:14-40), and he worked the first healing in the Church age (Acts 3:6-7). It is Peter’s faith that will strengthen his brethren (Luke 22:32) and Peter is given Christ’s flock to shepherd (John 21:17). An angel was sent to announce the resurrection to Peter (Mark 16:7), and the risen Christ first appeared to Peter (Luke 24:34). He headed the meeting that elected Matthias to replace Judas (Acts 1:13-26), and he received the first converts (Acts 2:41). He inflicted the first punishment (Acts 5:1-11), and excommunicated the first heretic (Acts 8:18-23). He led the first council in Jerusalem (Acts 15), and announced the first dogmatic decision (Acts 15:7-11). It was to Peter that the revelation came that Gentiles were to be baptized and accepted as Christians (Acts 10:46-48).

I have a few things with some of this...

Jesus began the church age, seeing as he is the head of the church, and did the first healing....

Peter was told to strengthen his brethren... but we should also do the same...

Peter was told to feed the sheep of Christ, but not necessarily to herd them... "The LORD is my shepherd..."

And the risen Jesus first appeared to Mary Magdalene... (Mark 16:9)

 

[Hairy Tic]

Darn that Jesus for giving Peter the keys to the Kingdom of heaven.

## I think St. Peter gets almost no attention. Seriously. But St. Paul - people never shut up about him (Very understandably, BTW)

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

## I think St. Peter gets almost no attention. Seriously. But St. Paul - people never shut up about him (Very understandably, BTW)

Understandably how?

 

[yohonron]

I say "YES"! The Catholic Church does put to much emphesis on Peter. Don't Catholics believe that Peter was the first Pope in Rome? Yet, there is no Scriptural basis to prove that Peter even went to Rome, notwithstanding, establishing any churches in Rome. Yet, we know that Paul went to Rome and wrote to the believers in Rome. Peter had a "believing wife" (1 Cor 9:5)!
Of course, we are not to pick and choose either, like some that where in Corinth, saying, "I am of Paul" or "I am of Peter" (1 Cor 1:12; 3:4). That would be carnal and NOT the proper way to fellowship, right?

Cheers,
Yohonron

 

[luckyfredsdad]

The Romans have no choice but to go on about S.Peter, as someone else has said it is the basis for their whole organisation.
But I don't mind this desperation, it's understandable, the real question is, why don't they prove their contentions?

 

[yohonron]

Plus, I just heasrd that Benedict 16th has declared that Israel is NOT God's chosen people and that the Whole world is. That would be a MAJOR BLOW for Catholics to believe. Catholicism is just an offshoot of Judeo-Christianity.

Cheers,

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

The Romans have no choice but to go on about S.Peter, as someone else has said it is the basis for their whole organisation.
But I don't mind this desperation, it's understandable, the real question is, why don't they prove their contentions?

I would tend to agree

 

[Heavens]

This was mentioned in another thread by a RC concerning the Peter and Paul of the NC in the Bible.
Question does the Roman Church put too much focus on the Peter and not enough on the Paul. Thoughts?

Originally Posted by JacktheCatholic
I can understand why gentiles would hold a special affection towards Paul vs. Peter.

But we all know that Paul did not receive the Keys either in scripture.

Originally Posted by Albion
How in the world does no keys to Peter lead to no New Testament when the record of Christ speaking to Peter in in the New Testament? The one surest thing in all of Christianity is the Bible. It is eternal and never-changing, even if men may change their views of it. That is what everything comes from and why Protestantism, like it or not, is always relevant--that is to say, because it always can point back to the Word of God himself, the God who cannot be wrong in his revelation, and see what it says.

How much different is this from those churches which follow some constantly evolving stream of ideas and are cut loose from that which ultimately is our sure foundation.

Yes, that religion focuses on Peter in a severely toxic manner.
It is like the muslims focusing on mohammed. Or like Hindus focusing on cows. Or like budhists focusing on Buddha. But worse. It is bizarre to watch.

Christ's followers focus on Jesus. Not on Peter. Not on Paul. We read their writings, they are all words of God. John, James, Mark, Luke... all of them. One isn't "greater" than the other. Jesus told them that. Now we have a religion that thinks otherwise, oh brother.

Christ is a Christians "everything". A Christian needs no other "person" or "group". They only need and accept Jesus and His Word, and it is only by Scriptura Sola He guides us.

(1Th 5:21) Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

The fruit makes it quite evident who is of God and who isn't.

A Christian receives the Keys from Jesus, just as did Peter. It is to all of us who, as Peter, confess, "Thou art the Christ the Son of the Living God".
Whoever doesn't know that has no wisdom.

It is the means by which we have, each of us, been empowered to love and forgive others in preaching the gospel of salvation to Jews and gentiles by which they might be saved. In confessing the Name of the Son of God.

By the way, Paul had a much greater hand in "feeding Christ's sheep" than Peter ever did. Look at the writings...

 

[Notsure]

Generally speaking the Catholic church focus more on humans like Mary, Peter, and the pope than God Himself.

Go figure!!

 

[Tim Myers]

"Does the Roman Church focus on Peter too much"

How else can they make the claim of apostolic succession??......

 

[patricius79]

I don't think that the Biblical Church (the Catholic Church) focuses too much on Simon Rock, no.

the crucial issue between Catholics and Protestants is interpretation of Scripture, since both sides insist on sentences or phrases not in Scripture

the Church is built on Simon Rock, as DA Carson and RT France testify, with the early Church

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

I don't think that the Biblical Church (the Catholic Church) focuses too much on Simon Rock, no.

the crucial issue between Catholics and Protestants is interpretation of Scripture, since both sides insist on sentences or phrases not in Scripture

the Church is built on Simon Rock, as DA Carson and RT France testify, with the early Church

I would agree with that

..

 

[bbbbbbb]

I would agree with that

..

Welcome to Siberia, LLoJ!

 

[Albion]

The Romans have no choice but to go on about S.Peter, as someone else has said it is the basis for their whole organisation.

That sums it up.

 

[Michael David]

In the Bible, St. Peter exemplifies the Apostolic Leadership role of the Papacy:

• Isaiah 22:15-25 describes the office of a high priest underneath the Davidic King who has the ‘the key of the house of David,’ saying, ‘he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open,’ and ‘he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem and to the house of Judah.’ This God ordained structure of the Old Covenant is fulfilled in the New Covenant through the ‘fatherly’ (papal) apostolic office that St. Peter occupied under Jesus Christ, the eternal Davidic King. Jesus draws upon this passage in appointing St. Peter as the first pope:

• Matthew 16:15-19: “He [Jesus] said to them, “But who do you say that I am?” Simon Peter replied, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.” And Jesus answered him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jona! For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my Father who is in heaven. And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the powers of death shall not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.”

In Jesus day, neither the Koine Greek or Aramaic language that he possibly spoke made any distinction between the words ‘petros’ and ‘petra.’ They differed only in gender/object usage, and both meant simply ‘rock.’ As many Early Church Fathers testify, to claim that Christ will build the Church on Peter’s ‘confession of faith’ does not exclude the fact that it will also be built upon the person of Peter and his God given authority.

• Luke 22:31-32: “Simon, Simon, behold, Satan demanded to have you, that he might sift you like wheat, but I have prayed for you that your faith may not fail; and when you have turned again, strengthen your brethren.”

• John 21:17: “… Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Feed my lambs . . . Tend my sheep . . . Feed my sheep.”

• St. Peter is mentioned 191 times in the New Testament while all the other apostles’ names combined are mentioned only 130 times. After St. Peter, the next most commonly referenced apostle is St. John, whose name appears only 48 times. In Matthew 10:1-4, Mark 3:16-19, Luke 6:14-16, and Acts 1:13, St. Peter’s name heads the list of the apostles. In Luke 9:32, Luke 8:46, and Mark 16:7, the apostles are referred to as ‘Peter and his companions’ or ‘Peter and the other disciples’ (even by an angel). St. Peter speaks on behalf of the other apostles in Matthew 18:21, Mark 8:29, Luke 12:41, and John 6:69. Throughout the book of Acts, St. Peter is shown to lead the Church in numerous ways. He leads the meeting to elect a replacement apostle for Judas in Acts 1:13-26. He leads the apostles in preaching at Pentecost in Acts 2:14. He receives the first converts in Acts 2:41. He performs the first miracle after Pentecost in Acts 3:6-7. He exercises the first case of Church discipline in Acts 5:1-11. He excommunicates the first heretic in Acts 8:21. He receives the revelation to admit the Gentiles into the Church in Acts 10:44-46. He speaks with the most authority at the first Ecumenical Council in Acts 15. After St. Paul experienced his vision, he spent 3 years studying in Damascus and then he went to Jerusalem to seek out St. Peter before beginning his ministry (Galations 1:11-24).

As God saw fit to designate one earthly Apostle to be the chief shepherd of Christ’s flock, he fulfills Christ's prophecy regarding building an unfailing Church upon St. Peter by having the pope who has succeeded St. Peter lead the bishops that have succeeded the apostles. The testimony of numerous Early Church Fathers confirms this.

-May the peace of Christ be with you.