Homosexuality

[Phinehas2]

Jase,

So you chose to be heterosexual huh?

According to your worldview you may well thinks so, but I can be sure that Avneil believes in God and God’s word and thus purposes for people’s lives, man and woman were created to be in faithful union, your term heterosexual is opposite sex attraction, which could mean adulterous thoughts and actions, that’s not what God created people for.
The terms ‘heterosexual’ and ‘homosexual’ don’t reflect God’s purposes, they are human concepts which cut across God’s purposes.

You guys just don't want to admit that it could be biological, because then your whole anti-gay agenda goes out of the window, and you can't hate gays anymore for something they have no control over.

If it is biological it is stil wrong. What do you think disease and disability is the result of?
By the way, google ‘gay gene’ and ‘straight gene’, no-one seems to be searching desperately for a straight gene or even a gene that causes any sort of sexuality. Nor is anyone searching for genes that cause people to murder, steal. lie etc. Presumably if they found a murder gene they would treat it to change it, and if they found a gay gene they would say it justifies same sex relationships.

Do you seriously believe this non-sense? Orientation is a biological reference.

Sorry but that’s the word of God you are calling non-sense. Nor is there any consensus of agreement in science that proves orientation is biological.

I never said Jesus said anything about LGBTs. I merely said God created them, as sexual orientation is an inborn trait, and God created all humans, and knew them in the womb.

We know for sure God didn’t create LGBT’s as His word says He created man and woman to be united. LGBTS is a faulty human concept to try and make out an identity in a disordered and dysfunctional sin.
But Jesus is the Son of God and whilst on earth spoke the words of the Father, and He affirmed God’s word (Gen 2) that God created male and female, woman for man, so that man and woman could be united. Your statement suggests you don’t see Jesus as God or speaking the words of God. With reference to fundamentalist Christian, this issue is a core Christian belief, which suggest to me what you see as fundamentalist Christianity is actually Christianity itself.

I don't know why you guys keep using this as an argument against gays. [/quote[ because we are believers in God and His word. And incidentally where did you get the LGBT and gays and lesbians concept from as it certainly isnt from God.

 

[Phinehas2]

KCKID,

It's just a belief, however, no matter how firmly it might be entrenched. Not that you're doing so (yet) but please don't ever state that YOUR belief over-rides someone elses belief.

How does that work then? If someone’s belief is that God’s word is the truth and anything contrary to it is overriding as a lie, your statement would be denying another their belief unless it fell in line with your belief.

"I" don't believe that the Bible condemns homosexuality within the confines of a monogamous relationship any more than it condemns heterosexuality within the confines of a monogamous relationship. For "me" it's just as plain and simple.

we understand your view but we are challenging it as being baseless and contrary to the Christian view by the scriptures and explanation provided. To us your view is disbelief, it has no scriptural support and is contrary to what the scripture says.

 

[Phinehas2]

Zeena wrote

Being a Chritian is a God-given Identity, and, according to the majority of people who have such sexual relations with one another, homosexuality is ALSO and identity..

Therefore are they in conflict, one with another.. It's an identity crisis.

Meanwhile, there is only One Image of God, and that's Christ Jesus

Amen!! fantastic post.

 

[addo]

Lol, you obviously haven't read Genesis. The entire Adam and Eve story is an example of God setting humanity up for failure.

Really? I though God put them in a perfect place, they had all they needed and there was absolutely no reason to choose to disobey God. Actually, God set them to success for they had all they needed to fulfil their purpose, but He choose to also give them free will and b able to not choose God. But there was absolutely no reason for them to choose to disobey Him... or was it? Can you name an excuse for what they did?

I, however, don't believe that story is historical. So, since science and psychologists are not wrong on this issue, we are left with the possibility that God either set humans up to fail, or God doesn't have the same problem with these issues that you have. I'm going with the latter.

If God allowed someone to have 'attractions' to other people of the same sex and He does not will to 'convert' you, have you ever thought He called you to a life of celibacy as a "homosexual" witness for Him?

God allowed Nick Vujicic to be born without arms or legs, and now He is an inspiration for lots of people. No no no no no ... God cannot do this as well for homosexuals. I mean ... why would God want homosexuals to be a witness for Him how He helped them abandon the homosexual behavior? [/sarcasm] Just supposing you are born homosexual, this doesn't mean it is okay for you to practice.

So there is a third option: God wants these people to be a witness for Him in the world. Have you ever thought about it?

Being gay is not a sin, therefore in that regard there is nothing to repent of. Now please stop with the preaching.

Being gay means acting gay, and that is a sin.

 

[Zeena]

Really? I though God put them in a perfect place, they had all they needed and there was absolutely no reason to choose to disobey God. Actually, God set them to success for they had all they needed to fulfil their purpose, but He choose to also give them free will and b able to not choose God. But there was absolutely no reason for them to choose to disobey Him... or was it? Can you name an excuse for what they did?
*snip*

Genesis 3:1
Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?

Revelation 12:9
And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

 

[Avniel]

KCKID,
How does that work then? If someone’s belief is that God’s word is the truth and anything contrary to it is overriding as a lie, your statement would be denying another their belief unless it fell in line with your belief. we understand your view but we are challenging it as being baseless and contrary to the Christian view by the scriptures and explanation provided. To us your view is disbelief, it has no scriptural support and is contrary to what the scripture says.

Exactly, and I will say it again if he can 1 scripture that says differently just one then I will apologies and say I am wrong. I said that from the start of the argument.

KCKID we are not anti-gay we are just pro-word of God. If you can find in the word of God where it says that its ok to be homosexual, I am sure many ppl including me will not argue with you because its biblical. Everything you are saying is either discrediting the bible, insulting to Christians, and or cynical.

 

[Octorock]

Exactly, and I will say it again if he can 1 scripture that says differently just one then I will apologies and say I am wrong. I said that from the start of the argument.

KCKID we are not anti-gay we are just pro-word of God. If you can find in the word of God where it says that its ok to be homosexual, I am sure many ppl including me will not argue with you because its biblical. Everything you are saying is either discrediting the bible, insulting to Christians, and or cynical.

You can use a different term to make it seem less sinister, but it doesn't change the fact that you are still anti-gay, just like being pro-life is still anti-abortion.

 

[Avniel]

You can use a different term to make it seem less sinister, but it doesn't change the fact that you are still anti-gay, just like being pro-life is still anti-abortion.

Anti means against I am not against anyone I am just for God's word. I could careless who is gay and who is not, I will what the word of God says and if they do or dont accept it thats on them. I am not discriminator against homosexuals I just know what the word of God says.

 

[Octorock]

Anti means against I am not against anyone I am just for God's word. I could careless who is gay and who is not, I will what the word of God says and if they do or dont accept it thats on them. I am not discriminator against homosexuals I just know what the word of God says.

I'm not anti-murder. I'm just pro-letting people live.

Mars doesn't have 2 moons. Mars has -2*-1 moons.

 

[David Brider]

Being gay means acting gay...

No, being gay means being attracted to people of the same gender as oneself. It doesn't mean acting anything. Different gay people act in different ways. There's no "one size fits all" way of "acting gay".

David.

 

[razeontherock]

@ Octorock: No, it's not just semantics! To be anti-gay is to be against people. It's not the people the word is against. To be anti-abortion is to be against behavior. (Specifically killing innocent children)

The focus here is on behavior.

 

[Octorock]

@ Octorock: No, it's not just semantics! To be anti-gay is to be against people. It's not the people the word is against. To be anti-abortion is to be against behavior. (Specifically killing innocent children)

The focus here is on behavior.

But you're instance on labeling yourself as "pro-God" rather than "anti-gay" avoids the entire question of what your stance on homosexuality is without first defining God's stance. Are you saying that God is not against homosexuality?

 

[Jase]

@ Octorock: No, it's not just semantics! To be anti-gay is to be against people. It's not the people the word is against. To be anti-abortion is to be against behavior. (Specifically killing innocent children)

The focus here is on behavior.

There are many on these forums who claim that merely being gay is also a sin, and therefore, those most assuredly are against people - their very being, not just their actions.

 

[Avniel]

There are many on these forums who claim that merely being gay is also a sin, and therefore, those most assuredly are against people - their very being, not just their actions.

I hope the scripture bellow explains it.





Matthew 5:27-32 (King James Version)


27Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
28But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
31It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

If homosexuality is in your heart you have sinned if you practice it or not. Homosexuality is a sin therefore to think of it is also a sin...
I'm not making it up and as far as I'm concerned you can't argue with the Bible.

 

[Zeena]

There are many on these forums who claim that merely being gay is also a sin, and therefore, those most assuredly are against people - their very being, not just their actions.

God created everyone.

Romans 14:11
But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

 

[Jase]

If homosexuality is in your heart you have sinned if you practice it or not. Homosexuality is a sin therefore to think of it is also a sin...
I'm not making it up and as far as I'm concerned you can't argue with the Bible.

I've already shown you that the original language of the Bible does not condemn modern day homosexuality. You seem unwilling to even admit you may be wrong.

And you most certainly can argue with the Bible. The Bible is not God, nor is it flawless.

 

[Avniel]

I've already shown you that the original language of the Bible does not condemn modern day homosexuality. You seem unwilling to even admit you may be wrong.

And you most certainly can argue with the Bible. The Bible is not God, nor is it flawless.

No I have faith and am 100% sure that the bible is 100% correct. Also someone disproved you already in early post regarding translations I forgot who it was.

Everything written in the bible is correct. That is very convenient to believe that you can follow whatever part of the bible makes sense to you.

 

[OllieFranz]

I hope the scripture bellow explains it.




Matthew 5:27-32 (King James Version)


27Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
28But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
31It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement:
32But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

If homosexuality is in your heart you have sinned if you practice it or not. Homosexuality is a sin therefore to think of it is also a sin...
I'm not making it up and as far as I'm concerned you can't argue with the Bible.

I'm glad you can't argue with the Bible. Because the verse above speaks not of action but what is in the heart, and you confirmed it. And we are given a specific commands not to judge one another's hearts (The passage above , and most New Testament passages that focus on sin are given us to examine our own hearts, not to judge others.) because we do not know one another's hearts, and Jesus has determined not to judge our hearts until the final judgment in order to allow each of us every possible opportunity to come to Him:

Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
1 Corinthians 4:5
​

 

[Avniel]

I'm glad you can't argue with the Bible. Because the verse above speaks not of action but what is in the heart, and you confirmed it. And we are given a specific commands not to judge one another's hearts (The passage above , and most New Testament passages that focus on sin are given us to examine our own hearts, not to judge others.) because we do not know one another's hearts, and Jesus has determined not to judge our hearts until the final judgment in order to allow each of us every possible opportunity to come to Him:

Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.
1 Corinthians 4:5
​

So if someone tells me they are a homosexual(which is a sin) and they are not then they are telling me a lie. If someone says they are a homosexual but they dont act on it, they still are sinning..........correct.

I mean if I am married and I lust after a woman that's adultery weather I act on it or not. So then if someone comes to me and says "hey I lust after so and so" and they are married am I judging them when I say.......hey thats adultery.........when they say no its not am I then judging them when I pull out the scripture and show them where it says that..........And are the Christians if they reject the scripture and say "God made me a man its in my genes my daddy looked at women my granddaddy did too I can look at women all I want"? I dont think it's possible to love both sin and God.

 

[oi_antz]

I've already shown you that the original language of the Bible does not condemn modern day homosexuality. You seem unwilling to even admit you may be wrong.

And you most certainly can argue with the Bible. The Bible is not God, nor is it flawless.

Here we are seeing that human opinion is being presented as an argument against God's word, in context of this topic, the Christians are arguing that God states His will several times and it has been quoted several times.

Is this the point where we concede the human will prefers the ways of the world while God's will prefers the ways of heaven?.. or are there people here who don't belong to Jesus who think they should be arguing God's POV based on their own understanding? Or is it just that people don't like to hear God's POV and fight to reject it.

From a Christian POV Jase, we certainly don't argue with the Bible, for that would be arguing with God, who IS holy and who IS entitled to tell us the ways of righteousness (in His opinion).

It's a little short-sighted to trade our place in heaven for a place on earth, however we are entitled to make that decision in our daily lives. Why do you think we have been granted this much freedom to bask in the ways of the world?