Christian Zionism - a modern-day heresy?

Christian Zionism = A modern heresy?

  • Yes

  • No


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LittleLambofJesus

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Christian Zionism is a movement to "usher in the end times".

I voted yes due to the simple fact that man has absolutely NO say in determining the will of GOD. :)
I would suppose some of their patience might be wearing a bit thin after almost 2000yrs

Luke 21:31 "Thus also ye whenever ye may be seeing these these becoming, ye are knowing that NIGH/egguV <1451> is the Kingdom of the God."

Reve 1:3 Happy the one reading and the ones hearing the Words of the Prophecy and keepings in it having been Written for the Time NIGH/egguV <1451>. [Reve 22:6,10]
 
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wayseer

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The 'let's make something happen' theology of many Christians in perhaps understandable - they are sick of waiting.

There are two possible alternatives - we have missed out on the 'end times' or that God's plan is yet to meet fruition.

Of course there is that 'other' explanation - the Kingdom of God is present but we just don't see it.
 
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Frogster

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What I always find strange is the fact that they cant wait to see,or they promote the temples or temples being built ,that will have animal sacrifices.I guess they never read this.

Heb 10:10 And by that will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

Heb 10:18 Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.

It may be rather funny to see something.Did they ever realize if they get this prefabricated temple they have up and running,that maybe nothing will happen.No antichrist may bother with it.:D

I think they are genetically trying to breed a red hiefer! Talk about a move of the flesh.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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The 'let's make something happen' theology of many Christians in perhaps understandable - they are sick of waiting.

There are two possible alternatives - we have missed out on the 'end times' or that God's plan is yet to meet fruition.

Of course there is that 'other' explanation - the Kingdom of God is present but we just don't see it.
:)
That is my "present" view :thumbsup: :pray:

Edit to add:I voted "yes", but I think "heresy" would best be substituted for "misleading"?.

Mark 1:15 And saying "has been filled the Time and has-NEARED the Kingdom of the God.
Be ye reforming/repenting! and be ye believing! in the Good-Message. [Luke 21:31/Reve 16:11]

Luke 21:31 Kingdom of God comes
Luke 21:31 Kingdom of God comes


.
 
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Hentenza

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Yes.

The Church is the New Israel, not the geopolitical State of Israel founded in 1948.

Please explain the parables depicted in Matthew 13 using what you posted.:scratch:
 
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Frogster

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The 'let's make something happen' theology of many Christians in perhaps understandable - they are sick of waiting.

There are two possible alternatives - we have missed out on the 'end times' or that God's plan is yet to meet fruition.

Of course there is that 'other' explanation - the Kingdom of God is present but we just don't see it.

:thumbsup:Yes,a spiritual temple,kingdom,people.
 
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Rhamiel

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When Pope Pius X met with the founder of Zionism, Theodore Herzel, he stated flat out that the Catholic Church could never EVER support the existence of a Jewish state in Palestine.
Catholics can support a Jewish state in Palestine, but on secular grounds and not the idea that this state represents in any way the OT Kingdom of Israel
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Originally Posted by E.C. Yes.

The Church is the New Israel, not the geopolitical State of Israel founded in 1948.
Please explain the parables depicted in Matthew 13 using what you posted.:scratch:
Interesting. I had heard something about Israel and 1948 before.
I did a google search on it and the link below was the first 1 showing.......I don't hold much stock in that myself though.



Bible Prophecy Fulfilled: Israel 1948


.
 
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Son of Israel

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The 'let's make something happen' theology of many Christians in perhaps understandable - they are sick of waiting.

There are two possible alternatives - we have missed out on the 'end times' or that God's plan is yet to meet fruition.

Of course there is that 'other' explanation - the Kingdom of God is present but we just don't see it.

Funny how that 'other' explanation is what Jesus got crucified by the Jews for teaching because they couldn't 'see it'...

But His disciples saw it and have been seeing it ever since...

(Mar 9:1) And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

(Mar 9:2) And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
(Mar 9:3) And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
(Mar 9:4) And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.
(Mar 9:5) And Peter answered and said to Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
(Mar 9:6) For he wist not what to say; for they were sore afraid.
(Mar 9:7) And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.

(Luk 17:20) And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
(Luk 17:21) Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

(Joh 9:39) And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
(Joh 9:40) And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
(Joh 9:41) Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

(Joh 14:19) Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

(Eph 3:9) And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

(Joh 1:9) That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
(Joh 1:10) He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
(Joh 1:11) He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

(Joh 1:12) But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

(1Co 4:20) For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.
 
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PaladinValer

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It is a heresy that doesn't even product rotten fruit. It only produces death, murder, hate, apathy, persecution, degradation of personal dignity, tears, homelessness, starvation, and war.

There is no rotten fruit. Just pure evil.
 
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Frogster

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Funny how that 'other' explanation is what Jesus got crucified by the Jews for teaching because they couldn't 'see it'...

But His disciples saw it and have been seeing it ever since...

(Mar 9:1) And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.

(Mar 9:2) And after six days Jesus taketh with him Peter, and James, and John, and leadeth them up into an high mountain apart by themselves: and he was transfigured before them.
(Mar 9:3) And his raiment became shining, exceeding white as snow; so as no fuller on earth can white them.
(Mar 9:4) And there appeared unto them Elias with Moses: and they were talking with Jesus.
(Mar 9:5) And Peter answered and said to Jesus, Master, it is good for us to be here: and let us make three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias.
(Mar 9:6) For he wist not what to say; for they were sore afraid.
(Mar 9:7) And there was a cloud that overshadowed them: and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: hear him.

(Luk 17:20) And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
(Luk 17:21) Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

(Joh 9:39) And Jesus said, For judgment I am come into this world, that they which see not might see; and that they which see might be made blind.
(Joh 9:40) And some of the Pharisees which were with him heard these words, and said unto him, Are we blind also?
(Joh 9:41) Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

(Joh 14:19) Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

(Eph 3:9) And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

(Joh 1:9) That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
(Joh 1:10) He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
(Joh 1:11) He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

(Joh 1:12) But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

(1Co 4:20) For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.
Hi dude!:wave:

It is a heresy that doesn't even product rotten fruit. It only produces death, murder, hate, apathy, persecution, degradation of personal dignity, tears, homelessness, starvation, and war.

There is no rotten fruit. Just pure evil.

This is all because Christians dont want to realize,his kingdom is NOT..NOT of this world!

Natural walls are Gone.

All natural barriers have been removed.Here is ample proof.

Romans 9:8 This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.


New Living Translation (NLT)

Romans 9:6-9 6 Well then, has God failed to fulfill his promise to Israel? No, for not all who are born into the nation of Israel are truly members of God’s people! 7 Being descendants of Abraham doesn’t make them truly Abraham’s children. For the Scriptures say, “Isaac is the son through whom your descendants will be counted,” though Abraham had other children, too. 8 This means that Abraham’s physical descendants are not necessarily children of God. Only the children of the promise are considered to be Abraham’s children.

Galatians 3:28
28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Colossians 3:11
11a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave and freeman, but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 10:12
12For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;

1 Corinthians 12:13
13For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.
ACTS 10:34 So Peter opened his mouth and said: “Truly I understand that God shows no partiality, 35 but in every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him.
Romans 2:9-11 There will be tribulation and distress for every human being who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek, 10 but glory and honor and peace for everyone who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek. 11 For God shows no partiality.

Acts 15:8-9 And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us,9 and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.



Eph 2:15-18
15by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, 16and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit.
 
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Son of Israel

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Hi dude!:wave:



This is all because Christians dont want to realize,his kingdom is NOT..NOT of this world!

Natural walls are Gone.

All natural barriers have been removed.Here is ample proof.

Romans 9:8 This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.


New Living Translation (NLT)

Romans 9:6-9 6 Well then, has God failed to fulfill his promise to Israel? No, for not all who are born into the nation of Israel are truly members of God’s people! 7 Being descendants of Abraham doesn’t make them truly Abraham’s children. For the Scriptures say, “Isaac is the son through whom your descendants will be counted,” though Abraham had other children, too. 8 This means that Abraham’s physical descendants are not necessarily children of God. Only the children of the promise are considered to be Abraham’s children.

Galatians 3:28
28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

Colossians 3:11
11a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave and freeman, but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 10:12
12For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him;

1 Corinthians 12:13
13For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.
ACTS 10:34 So Peter opened his mouth and said: “Truly I understand that God shows no partiality, 35 but in every nation anyone who fears him and does what is right is acceptable to him.
Romans 2:9-11 There will be tribulation and distress for every human being who does evil, the Jew first and also the Greek, 10 but glory and honor and peace for everyone who does good, the Jew first and also the Greek. 11 For God shows no partiality.

Acts 15:8-9 And God, who knows the heart, bore witness to them, by giving them the Holy Spirit just as he did to us,9 and he made no distinction between us and them, having cleansed their hearts by faith.



Eph 2:15-18
15by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, 16and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit.

HI FROGGY!:wave:
HI LITTLE LAMB!:wave:
You two are always a fortress of the Lord in your understanding of the things of the Kingdom of God! I really appreciate you guys :thumbsup:
 
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SummaScriptura

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Christian Zionism is a movement to "usher in the end times".

I voted yes due to the simple fact that man has absolutely NO say in determining the will of GOD. :)

If that's your definition of Zionism then, in addition to my being a chiliast, please count me among these heretics too. Along with the Apostles of the Lord.

2 Peter 3:11-13, Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn!

1 Corinthians 16:22, Come, O Lord!

It seems to me the Church is a movement to "usher in the end times".
 
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Frogster

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If that's your definition of Zionism then, in addition to my being a chiliast, please count me among these heretics too. Along with the Apostles of the Lord.

2 Peter 3:11-13, Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn!

1 Corinthians 16:22, Come, O Lord!

It seems to me the Church is a movement to "usher in the end times".

Hi.I can understand if people get excited about what they perceive to be a sign.It would be great,if they can pull back and observe only.But there are alot of Cz's who are trying to breed red heifers,and are trying to get a temple built.I beleive these are of the John Hagee crowd.My problem is ..why would one support a temple,that will trample the sacrifice,that did it all.It seems like some are trying to do that old addage,of justifying the means,to get an end,they are trying to obtain.Why would John hagee fund about 3 million bucks,for them to build a synagogue? Does he forget that paul preached jesus in those structures?


I dont mean this at you,or your views,just chatting with you.God bless.
 
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LiturgyInDMinor

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If that's your definition of Zionism then, in addition to my being a chiliast, please count me among these heretics too. Along with the Apostles of the Lord.

2 Peter 3:11-13, Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn!

1 Corinthians 16:22, Come, O Lord!

It seems to me the Church is a movement to "usher in the end times".

Sorry my friend...my definition describes modern day heresy.
You are not a heretic mind you...but the ideal that you said you hold is actually heresy.
Hoping and Praying for Jesus' second coming is not heresy mind you. :)
You and I have posted on and off together for a long time, so I hope you take my words for what they are worth(not much in the long run) and don't get offended here.
Honestly support of Christian Zionism is unorthodox theology and is just wrong exegetically.
Also, the Apostles did NOT ever want to rush things by man made ideals to promote an idea that in essence show a controling of the will of GOD Almighty to make the end times come "sooner".
They prayed and hoped beyond hope that Jesus would come again in their lifetimes, and promoted that idea.
There is a big difference between that and what is transpiring now with the building of the 3rd temple, etc.

I still love ya though! :)
 
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Son of Israel

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If that's your definition of Zionism then, in addition to my being a chiliast, please count me among these heretics too. Along with the Apostles of the Lord.

2 Peter 3:11-13, Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn!

1 Corinthians 16:22, Come, O Lord!

It seems to me the Church is a movement to "usher in the end times".

Actually I agree with these scriptures and perhaps also with Summa, providing of course, that praying for and hasting the coming of the day of the Lord was just as applicable for Peter in His day as it is to me in my day right now. For I pray continually for His Coming, morning noon and night to come into me, more and more and more!
IN ME!
It is individual and personal. Not corporate planet wide, for sure not on this planet lol! (As zionists think). Big difference.

I pray for His coming into my earthen ME! And into those who Love His appearing whoever, wherever and WHENever they are.

But I do Not pray for any Zionist "endtime" dispensational planetetoid thing though, as though Jesus is going to come back to the planet and enter into that city Jerusalem over in the Middle East. That would be plain nonsense.

We know that place is going to be nuked for her whoredoms once and for all, for Jesus will most certainly carry out His vengeance in grand finality, of which A.D. 70 was only a PTA meeting lol.

Son of Israel
 
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