The harlot of Babylon and the anti-christ.

[marlowe007]

And how does one reconcile the notion that Jerusalem is the Babylon of Revelation 14:8; 16:17-21, as well as Chapters 17 and 18 when this Babylon entity is described as being destroyed, never to be inhabited or lived in (not forget Jeremiah 51 indicating she is underwater, forever) when Jerusalem will be the seat of Christ and the capital city of the Millennial reign of Christ?

It is true that the notion cannot be reconciled with your faulty understanding of those passages.

Revelation 11:8 states that the "great city" is the place where Christ was crucified. Which city was Jesus crucified in?

 

[visionary]

Rev 11:8 has not happened.. and when the beast is in power, he will crucify Christ with what he says and he does, and from that "great city"... will come the fornication wine for the whole world.

 

[RND]

the beast sits on 7 hills, vatican hill is not one of the 7 hills of Rome, also the vatican is in Rome but not the city of Rome is not ruled by the Pope anymore but by the secular government of Italy

The city of Rome sits on 7 hills.

Seven hills of Rome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[B1inHim]

HOW could anyone honestly believe that anyone would use WMD in the backyards of that side of the world...
ONLY an idiot would set off the amount of nuclear weapons that it would take to take out a government out there. NOT to mention the fall out that would come in the jet streams back to the lands that they posses.

This kind of destruction will cause the light of the moon and sun to be darkened.
And many of you are all using the “old leaven theology” to figure this out?
Not real.

 

[B1inHim]

The city of Rome sits on 7 hills.

Seven hills of Rome - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

WE, those of "us" in JesUS will not be here to witness this

 

[RND]

WE, those of "us" in JesUS will not be here to witness this

Secretly whisked away before the time of trouble? That's an old wives tale, the kinda thing that Kurt Cameron movies and fiction books are made of.

The is no "secret rapture."

 

[Stryder06]

I'm pretty sure that the book of Revelation tells us that the 144,000 are those who are redeemed from the earth, having made their robes white in the blood of Christ, and are those who came out of great tribulation.

You can't come out of tribulation if you haven't gone through it.

 

[kotel]

Rev 11:8 has not happened.. and when the beast is in power, he will crucify Christ with what he says and he does, and from that "great city"... will come the fornication wine for the whole world.

Prophecy Watcher

It should be noted that there were many cities in the 1st Century A.D. called a 'great city' and usually were the capital cities of a nation or an empire.

The same as today. There are three great cities in Revelation:

Jerusalem - 11:8; 16:19

Vatican - 17:18

New York - 18:10, 16, 18, 19, 21

 

[RND]

New York - 18:10,

When Peter called Rome "Babylon" was he really thinking of New York?

1Pe 5:13 The [church that is] at Babylon, elected together with [you], saluteth you; and [so doth] Marcus my son.

16,

What evidence is there that New York was clothed in fine linen, purple and scarlet and decked (a thin veneer) of gold, stones and pearls?

Rev 18:16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!

18, 19, 21

How are the rest of the world supposed to "come out of her" if indeed this is referring to NY? Is this the same Babylon found in Revelation 14?

Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.

 

[B1inHim]

Secretly whisked away before the time of trouble? That's an old wives tale, the kinda thing that Kurt Cameron movies and fiction books are made of.

The is no "secret rapture."

You are correct...it is PRE-Wrath and there will be no secret to it at all...

 

[B1inHim]

I'm pretty sure that the book of Revelation tells us that the 144,000 are those who are redeemed from the earth, having made their robes white in the blood of Christ, and are those who came out of great tribulation.

You can't come out of tribulation if you haven't gone through it.

You have completely mixed two things into one.

The 144,000 are listed in chapter 7 firstly. THEN there are those peoples, kindreds, tongues and nations who are standing before the throne in white robes washed in the Blood of Jesus with palm braches... and the question was asked;” who are these people?" and the answer was. "These are they which have come out of the GT."
There is a BIG difference between the two.

Someone who is in something whither it be at the beginning or the middle are considered as "coming out" of that... OTHERWISE it would read;
"THESE are those who have gone through the Great Tribulation..."
That is not what the Word says…
And as far as those who are standing before the throne in chapter 7… Rev. 7:9 (KJV)
After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

144,000 is a countable number “a great multitude, which no man could number’ is not

 

[B1inHim]

When Peter called Rome "Babylon" was he really thinking of New York?

1Pe 5:13 The [church that is] at Babylon, elected together with [you], saluteth you; and [so doth] Marcus my son.


What evidence is there that New York was clothed in fine linen, purple and scarlet and decked (a thin veneer) of gold, stones and pearls?

Rev 18:16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!



How are the rest of the world supposed to "come out of her" if indeed this is referring to NY? Is this the same Babylon found in Revelation 14?

Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.

The very Statue of Liberty is a Roman goddes of freedom...

NY? nope! Try this entire country (USA).

The shoe fits

The classical appearance (Roman stola, sandals, facial expression) derives from Libertas, ancient Rome's goddess of freedom from slavery, oppression, and tyranny. Her raised right foot is on the move. This symbol of Liberty and Freedom is not standing still or at attention in the harbor, it is moving forward, as her left foot tramples broken shackles at her feet, in symbolism of the United States' wish to be free from oppression and tyranny.[12] Since the 1940s, it has been claimed that the seven spikes or diadem atop of the crown epitomize the Seven Seas and seven continents.[13] Her torch signifies enlightenment. The Keystone in her hand represents knowledge and shows the date of the United States Declaration of Independence, in roman numerals, July IV, MDCCLXXVI. The general appearance of the statue’s head approximates the Greek Sun-god Apollo or the Roman Sun-god Helios as preserved on an ancient marble tablet (today in the Archaeological Museum of Corinth, Corinth, Greece) - Apollo was represented as a solar deity, dressed in a similar robe and having on its head a "radiate crown" with the seven spiked rays of the Helios-Apollo's sun rays, like the Statue's nimbus or halo. The ancient Colossus of Rhodes, one of the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World, was a statue of Helios with a radiate crown. The Colossus is referred to in the 1883 sonnet The New Colossus by Emma Lazarus. Lazarus' poem was later engraved on a bronze plaque and mounted inside the Statue of Liberty in 1903.
The statue, also known affectionately as "Miss Liberty" (and "Lady Liberty") "the Lady", has become a symbol of freedom and liberty. Frédéric Auguste Bartholdi also created another "Lady Liberty" which is displayed in Paris, France.
Statue of Liberty - Wikipedia, the free encyclopediahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stola

 

[RND]

The very Statue of Liberty is a Roman goddes of freedom...

Based on Mithraism.

The Statue of Liberty is another brotherhood symbol highlighting the lighted torch, Statue of Liberty is actually the Statue of Liberties - the liberties perpetrated on the American people by the brotherhood. It was given by French freemasons, a mirror image stands on an island in the river seine in Paris.

Initiates into the rites of Mithra were called lions and were marked on their foreheads with the Egyptian cross. The first degree initiates had a golden crown placed on their heads, representing their spiritual self, and this crown, symbolizing the rays of the sun, can be found on the Statue of Liberty in NY harbor. All these rituals went back thousands of years to Babylon and the stories of Nimrod, Queen Semiramis, and Tammuz, their version of Jesus Mathra was said to be the son (Sun ) of god who died to save humanity and give them eternal life. One classic symbol of Mithra was a lion with a snake curled around his body, while he holds the keys to heaven.​

http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/chapter3/

NY? nope! Try this entire country (USA).

The shoe fits

The United States has made replica's of the pagan images of Rome.

Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
Washington DC has more pagan images in it and pagan sanctuary's than any other nation on the face of the earth. Capitol Hill in Washington DC is the exact image of the pagan house of Jupiter, Capitoline Hill in Rome, Capitol Hill thus is a replica of the house of Jupiter.

Capitoline Hill - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/capitol

 

[RND]

double posthttp://dictionary.reference.com/browse/capitol

 

[RND]

The very Statue of Liberty is a Roman goddes of freedom...

Based on Mithraism. Which is based on ancient Babylonian paganism.

The Statue of Liberty is another brotherhood symbol highlighting the lighted torch, Statue of Liberty is actually the Statue of Liberties - the liberties perpetrated on the American people by the brotherhood. It was given by French freemasons, a mirror image stands on an island in the river seine in Paris.

Initiates into the rites of Mithra were called lions and were marked on their foreheads with the Egyptian cross. The first degree initiates had a golden crown placed on their heads, representing their spiritual self, and this crown, symbolizing the rays of the sun, can be found on the Statue of Liberty in NY harbor. All these rituals went back thousands of years to Babylon and the stories of Nimrod, Queen Semiramis, and Tammuz, their version of Jesus Mathra was said to be the son (Sun ) of god who died to save humanity and give them eternal life. One classic symbol of Mithra was a lion with a snake curled around his body, while he holds the keys to heaven.​

You'll never think the same way again. . . The Revelation

NY? nope! Try this entire country (USA).

The shoe fits

The United States has made replica's of the pagan images of Rome.

Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
Washington DC has more pagan images in it and pagan sanctuary's than any other nation on the face of the earth. Capitol Hill in Washington DC is the exact image of the pagan house of Jupiter, Capitoline Hill in Rome, Capitol Hill thus is a replica of the house of Jupiter.

Capitoline Hill - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Capitol Definition | Definition of Capitol at Dictionary.com

 

[RND]

You are correct...it is PRE-Wrath and there will be no secret to it at all...

You are preaching a "secret/silent" rapture where the church is taken out of the way prior to the time of trouble - a notion which is never taught in the Bible.

In fact we as Christians are promised persecution. Those millions that were tortured and killed during the dark ages knew that. It is so sad to believe and even teach that God will whisk people away from the promised time of trouble when He didn't do those in Rwanda, the Cambodian massacre or the 6 million Jews murdered by the Nazi's.

 

[B1inHim]

You are preaching a "secret/silent" rapture where the church is taken out of the way prior to the time of trouble - a notion which is never taught in the Bible.

In fact we as Christians are promised persecution. Those millions that were tortured and killed during the dark ages knew that. It is so sad to believe and even teach that God will whisk people away from the promised time of trouble when He didn't do those in Rwanda, the Cambodian massacre or the 6 million Jews murdered by the Nazi's.

You keep inferring that I am promoting the “Great disappearing act” that has got the body of Christ living in lethargy; a state of drowsiness and indifference to getting closer to GOD.

If you believe that we are actually going to go through the Great Tribulation then you are incorrect as well.

We are NOT appointed to the wrath of GOD.

The later part of the GT is God’s terrible wrath being poured out on the inhabitants of this planet.

The people listed in chapter 7 of Revelation are 144,000 who will be in the GT for a while and then you have Rev. 7:9 (KJV)
After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;
Rev. 7:14 (KJV)
And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, “these are they, which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. “

Not before the GT started and not after the GT happened…

It happens after the opening of the sixth seal and before the opening of the seventh.

​

It is called PRE-WRATH​

Nowhere in Revelation is there this amount of Children of GOD accounted for except here.
Not before in Chapter 4 or 5 and not after chapter 7.

Your belief is based on an “old leaven theology” that is not correct and needs to be canceled out so that the New Wine can be placed in a new wine skin.

Your interpretation is contaminating the Truth with a theology that does not COMPLETELY agree with the Word of GOD ​

without the use of man-made teachings…​

​

Question?​

Are the gifts of GOD still in effect for today or have they ended with the death of the apostles and the cannon of scripture.​

​

Question?​

Is Mark 16:9-20 the Word of GOD and part of the writings included as being those of Mark?​

Question?​

Do believers still speak in other tongues?​

​

Accepted or reject?​

You cited different groups of people who have been martyred for Lord Jesus, the Word of GOD clearly tells us that they are in heaven with GOD and are given white robes and told to wait a while longer till the number of their fellow servants and brethren be completed.

Paul clearly told us about something that GOD is going to do… I Cor 15 and I Thes. 4 describe something that is beyond belief. Being transformed from mortal to immortal and then the words “caught up” are used.

Caught up is the word harpazo. harpazo, har-pad'-zo; from a derivative of Greek 138 (haireomai); to seize (in various applications) :- catch (away, up), pluck, pull, take ​

(by force).​

​

According to Lord Jesus in the gospels and Apostle Paul, Lord Jesus will appear among the clouds and give out a shout as of the trump of an arc angel​

(NOT to be confused with the LAST TRUMP).​

The dead in Christ will begin to rise and then the angels will then seize, catch away, up, pull, pluck and take by force those of us who are alive and remain and we will all be with Lord Jesus at that time.​

This is the harpazo, not to be confused with the first resurrection.​

​

Then according to Apostle John, Lord Jesus will return to this planet with a great army behind Him, he will take out all the bad guys, set foot on the Mount of Olives (ZECH14:4) splitting in two and set up ministry for 1,000 years.​

Those who are in the GT and are martyred during the GT for Lord Jesus and His Word will rule with Him during these 1,000 years.​

​

This is the first resurrection, not to be confused with the harpazo​

Then after all of this is done (1,000 years), Satan will be loosed for 90 days (a short season) and deceive as many people as are the sands of the sea into going against Lord Jesus.

Father GOD will then “blue flame torch” this planet and we will then go to the WTJ where those of us who are in Christ and names are written in the Lambs Book of Life will be standing on His right hand and those of us who tried to trick others into believing things that are not in the bible and those whose names are not written in the Lambs Book of Life will be standing on His left hand.
The books of everything that we, said did and thought and the Lambs Book of Life will be opened and we will be judged for them, if our name is in the Lambs Book of Life we will get our rewards and move on into where ever GOD has decided that we will do and go.
Those who are not written in the Lambs Book of Life will be tossed into a lake of fire prepared for the devil and his demons.

All of this planets precious and semi precious stones, gems, gold’s and silvers will have been refined in the “blue flame torch” fire the Father used to torch this planet with will be constructed into a 1,400 cubic mile New Jerusalem City. The walls will be 216 feet thick.

There will be wonderful things going on and no more indifferences concerning the second coming, the “rapture”, the gifts of God being passé, who will rule with Christ, the “falling away” before the man of sin is revealed…

Till then He gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ: That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
Ephes. 4:11-16 (KJV)

Now, IF you have read this and would please answer the two questions that I asked, I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[kotel]

RND

I’m reluctant to answer your questions because your views on prophecy are influenced by Ellen White which I consider a false prophet. But I will attempt it one more time.

When Peter called Rome "Babylon" was he really thinking of New York?

1Pe 5:13 The [church that is] at Babylon, elected together with [you], saluteth you; and [so doth] Marcus my son.

Peter wrote his letters while in Rome and considered it to be the Babylon in his day. When the Grecian Empire ruled the world, Athens would have been Babylon. Today America is the most powerful and wealthiest of all kingdoms, with New York as the financial and commercial center of the world. She is the city of Babylon in the country of Babylon.

What evidence is there that New York (is) clothed in fine linen, purple and scarlet and decked (a thin veneer) of gold, stones and pearls?

Rev 18:16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!

Verses 11-13 lists the merchandise bought by the city and country of Babylon. It should be obvious to you that America is the richest nation in the world. The purple and scarlet linen, gold, precious stones and pearls speak of the “great wealth” of Babylon (v.17).

How are the rest of the world supposed to "come out of her" if indeed this is referring to NY? Is this the same Babylon found in Revelation 14?

Forewarning is given to people to flee America before she is destroyed (Jer 51:6). Forewarning is given to God’s people, the Israelites to leave America from the “fierce anger of the Lord” and plagues that will overtake her in one day (50:8; 51:45; Rev 18:4, 8).

Same Babylon in Rev 14. This is not Rev 17 which is the apostate religious system of the RCC.

 

[RND]

You keep inferring that I am promoting the “Great disappearing act” that has got the body of Christ living in lethargy; a state of drowsiness and indifference to getting closer to GOD.

That's exactly what you are promoting, no matter how you try to posit it.

If you believe that we are actually going to go through the Great Tribulation then you are incorrect as well.

Act 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, [and] exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.

Question?
Are the gifts of GOD still in effect for today or have they ended with the death of the apostles and the cannon of scripture.​

Gifts of God? Fruit of the spirit?

Question?
Is Mark 16:9-20 the Word of GOD and part of the writings included as being those of Mark?​

​

In my Bible they are. They aren't in yours?

Question?
Do believers still speak in other tongues?
Accepted or reject?​

If people are speaking in a language no one else understands then I have to reject.

​

Now, IF you have read this and would please answer the two questions that I asked, I would greatly appreciate it.

Done.

 

[B1inHim]

That's exactly what you are promoting, no matter how you try to posit it.
Act 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, [and] exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.

Gifts of God? Fruit of the spirit?




In my Bible they are. They aren't in yours?

If people are speaking in a language no one else understands then I have to reject.

Done.

MUCH Tribulation
polus,

pol-oos'; including the forms from the alternate pollos; (singular) much (in any respect) or (plural) many; neuter (singular) as adverb largely; neuter (plural) as adverb or noun often, mostly, largely :- abundant, + altogether, common, + far (passed, spent), (+ be of a) great (age, deal, -ly, while), long, many, much, oft (-en [-times]), plenteous, sore, straitly. Compare Greek 4118 (pleistos), Greek 4119 (pleion).
IS not the tham as
GREAT Tribulation
megas,

meg'-as; [including the prolonged forms, feminine megale, plural megaloi, etc.; compare also Greek 3176 (megistos), Greek 3187 (meizon)]; big (literal or figurative, in a very wide application) :- (+ fear) exceedingly, great (-est), high, large, loud, mighty, + (be) sore (afraid), strong, × to years.

MUCH tribulation does NOT equate to the same as The Great Tribulation
Nope, you are not reading what is being said and simply put are in the wrong room.

Mark 16:15-18 (KJV)
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. [16] He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. [17] And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; [18] They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

According to Lord Jesus speaking in tongues is from him as a sign to follow believers; And these signs shall follow them that believe

The gifts of GOD are not the same as the fruit and the question is explicit in its design...

You are NOT reading what is being said... I do NOT believe in PRE Tribulation harpazo and not Post...
but you answered my question even though you didn't do so in your post.
Thank you...
We, those of us in Christ are told...2 Tim. 3:5 (KJV)
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.