Homosexuals and Bisexuals

[Andreusz]

The acronym NAMBLA stands for the National Man Boy Love Association. Seems to be gay centered.

SO you would agree that, because some heterosexuals are pederasts, we can conclude that all heterosexuals are pederasts?

 

[b&wpac4]

SO you would agree that, because some heterosexuals are pederasts, we can conclude that all heterosexuals are pederasts?

Obviously! If some part of group A exhibit trait B, ALL members of group A have to exhibit trait B!!!

 

[David Brider]

Kinsey? That study was so flawed I can't believe you even brought it up.

The study itself may have been flawed (and also, what, about 60 years old? So no doubt superseded by more recent studies) but the scale is a useful way of measuring sexual orientation.

 

[Andreusz]

^ It would be more useful if it had 7 notches rather than 6. As it is, it assumes there are no people who are perfectly bisexual.

 

[David Brider]

^ It would be more useful if it had 7 notches rather than 6. As it is, it assumes there are no people who are perfectly bisexual.

Well, there's always 3½.

But yes, fair point.

 

[FineLinen25]

God does not give intimate feelings toward the same sex. I believe those are something in the natural man, that are broght about by some by either influence(subconcious or other), or is learned.
It is a sin because men and women are to be joined as one, to multiply and feel the earth. Both a man and a women bring different things to a relationship that are important. A man brings strength, courage, protection, provision, and authority in love. A women brings nurture, understanding, support, steadiness, and communication in love as well.
This is GOD's Plan, it works perfectly this way, as does all HIS work. Praise Him.

 

[b&wpac4]

God does not give intimate feelings toward the same sex.

So we are to deny all the testimony from homosexual individuals that suggests otherwise? You think every single homosexual person is either lying or deluded?

 

[rosenherman]

SO you would agree that, because some heterosexuals are pederasts, we can conclude that all heterosexuals are pederasts?

No but we can conclude that all members of NAMBLA are pederasts and gay.

 

[KCKID]

God does not give intimate feelings toward the same sex.

Totally untrue. Ask any committed homosexual couple, particularly those ones that have been 'a couple' for an extended period of time. Besides, who can say what God gives and what He doesn't give? Who among us mere mortals can claim to speak for God?

I believe those are something in the natural man, that are broght about by some by either influence(subconcious or other), or is learned.

Well, I don't know about you but I'll be a 'natural man' until the day I die. No one will attain 'perfection' (whatever that might be) this side of the grave. That includes you. Right now we are human beings living on planet earth. We are not in heaven. What's so wrong with being a 'natural man' (or woman) anyway? You make it sound dirty.

It is a sin because men and women are to be joined as one, to multiply and feel the earth.

How can a feeling of attraction be considered a sin? Besides that, how much more 'multiplication' of the human species do you want ...standing room only? And, you know what? ...the more people we produce the more will be LOST according to the scriptures. FEW will go the distance. So, what's the point of bringing more and more 'lost' people into the world?

Both a man and a women bring different things to a relationship that are important. A man brings strength, courage, protection, provision, and authority in love. A women brings nurture, understanding, support, steadiness, and communication in love as well.

Really? Have you been watching reruns of Father Knows Best? The typical marriage today consists of a husband and wife who both have to work in order to make ends meet. Why? Because of greed. I want, I want, I want. And, all of the 'wants' cost money. Kids are shuttled off to day care centers where they are raised by strangers. When at home they are raised by the TV/video games/the Internet. The parents are too frazzled at the end of the day to care too much.

As for 'Bible marriage' ...do you really want to return to the good ol' days where the wife was the property of her husband?

This is GOD's Plan, it works perfectly this way, as does all HIS work. Praise Him.

No offense but, according to the Bible, we wouldn't be in the mess that we're in today had the marriage of Adam and Eve been one that was 'made in heaven'. Sorry to burst your bubble. Their kids didn't turn out too well either.

 

[Polycarp1]

^ It would be more useful if it had 7 notches rather than 6. As it is, it assumes there are no people who are perfectly bisexual.

It does, actually -- 0-6 inclusive, with 0 being completely heterosexual with absolutely no homosexual desires or contact, 6 being the reverse -- and 3 being the precise median, with approximately equal heterosexual and homosexual desires and/or contact. (There is probably a good reason why some scientist statisticians run scales starting at zero rather than one, but it predates electronic data processing, and I don't know what it might be. It's like ASCII having 256 characters numbered 000 through 255.)

 

[Polycarp1]

No but we can conclude that all members of NAMBLA are pederasts and gay.

No, we cannot. Pederasty is a paraphilia [psych. term for 'perversion'] characterized by sexual and/or dominance desires (the latter expressed sexually) for prepubescent boys. "Gay" is self-defined by the people who are gay as being a desire for people of the same sex and of approximately the same age, the acceptable relative age difference expanding with age.

If you want to draw a line and say "Every living thing is one sex or another, so any sexual act must be either heterosexual or homosexual," then you're privileged to do so -- but it vitiates the meanings of the terms.

(You know the sick old joke:
"That's old Seamus. He does it with his sheep, y'know."
"Really? Rams or ewes?"
"Oh, just ewes. There's nowt queer about Seamus." )

Which I think amply illustrates my point that the terms are diluted to meaninglessness by that usage.

Typically, if the man attracted to boys feels any desire for an adult, it is for a woman, typically a petite small-figured woman -- not for a man. (And yes, there are exceptions -- and this does not address ephebophilia, a quite separate paraphilia.)

 

[brightmorningstar]

To Polycarp1,

Gay" is self-defined by the people who are gay as being a desire for people of the same sex and of approximately the same age, the acceptable relative age difference expanding with age.

not quite. What sort of desire? I may have a desire for friendship with someone of my own sex but not be gay. Gay is a sexual attraction. You need to specify this or it becomes a deception.
But this is all contrary to God's purposes in the scripture, we need to be talking about having our identity in Christ and not in pour sexual desires.

 

[Shane Roach]

My point in raising Nambla was pretty straight forward. When gays decided Nambla was holding their movement back, they ditched it, but from the beginning this movement was part and parcel of the "sexual revolution". There is fundamentally no difference in the arguments used by Nambla and the arguments used by gay activists.

You will note that while many studies will be broken down in such a way as to separate out bisexuals from gays, that there are a plethora of associations that conflate them all into one group for increased political power.

CenterLink: The Community of LGBT Centers

So when gays attempt to separate themselves out from specific other groups that they claim they are not a part of, they only do that just for long enough to make a point they perceive as useful, then they happily join back in with the generalized movement among socialists to simply do away with any sort of sexual restrictions or expectations whatsoever.

If you listen to BDSM advocates, the arguments are again very much the same. There is basically no sexual practice that the generalized arguments used by gays could not be applied to.

That's the point.

 

[Shane Roach]

No, we cannot. Pederasty is a paraphilia [psych. term for 'perversion'] characterized by sexual and/or dominance desires (the latter expressed sexually) for prepubescent boys. "Gay" is self-defined by the people who are gay as being a desire for people of the same sex and of approximately the same age, the acceptable relative age difference expanding with age.

If you want to draw a line and say "Every living thing is one sex or another, so any sexual act must be either heterosexual or homosexual," then you're privileged to do so -- but it vitiates the meanings of the terms.

(You know the sick old joke:
"That's old Seamus. He does it with his sheep, y'know."
"Really? Rams or ewes?"
"Oh, just ewes. There's nowt queer about Seamus." )

Which I think amply illustrates my point that the terms are diluted to meaninglessness by that usage.

Typically, if the man attracted to boys feels any desire for an adult, it is for a woman, typically a petite small-figured woman -- not for a man. (And yes, there are exceptions -- and this does not address ephebophilia, a quite separate paraphilia.)

Homosexuality was a paraphilia as well. Please explain how it differs subtantively from anything else the APA has decided is still a paraphilia. Because that discussion does not appear to have been much of a point when they decided they did not want to treat homosexuality as a mental health issue any longer.

You are aware that there are people who are arguing that none of the paraphilias rightfully belong in the DSM, correct?

 

[Ben-AG]

Hi, this is my first post on this forum but I felt like I could offer some input. As many of us have witnessed, most homosexuals hate their desires and try to suppress them. Which leads us to the question of how one becomes gay?
- Personality/Temperament?
- Negative Body Image?
- Disfunction of Family Relationships?
- Sexual Violation at a Young Age?
- No affirmation from a father at a young age?
- Low self-esteem?
- A homosexual world that welcomes them in and encourages their behavior?
- A compliation of the list?

I can say I do not know for sure...I'm sure it is different in every situation. Here are some interesting facts to consider:

- Depression & Anxiety is 1.5x higher in homosexuals
- Homosexuals are 1.5x more likely to be alcoholics or to abuse substances
- 73% of psychiatrists say homosexuals are less happy than the average person, and of those psychiatrists, 70% say that the unhappiness is NOT due to social stigmatization
- Monogamy is virtually non-existent in homosexual relationships
- 78% of homosexuals have some kind of STD
- Average age of death amongst male homosexuals is 42...only 1% die of old age
- 50% of suicides can be attributed to homosexuals
- Homosexuals are 100 times more likely to be murdered (usually by another homosexual) than the average person

Whether you are okay with homosexuality or not, these stats are hard to ignore. There is something broken here and that is undeniable. Now you may say, "Well, as long as they aren't affecting me they can do whatever they want." That is a selfish statement. Even if you are not a Christian, you are human and thus should care about humanity.

But what does God say about it? (In my opininon)
- God created male and female (sexual terms: Female- "penetrated one") and created sex as a life-long convenant between them (MALE & FEMALE).

- Humanity rejects God, in that God doesn't suffer, humanity does. God doesn't need humanity, but humanity needs God. Thus, disarray & chaos resulted from that rejection:
Romans 1:24-25 - "Thereford God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather that the creator- who is forever praised. Amen.

- Homosexuality results from disobedience to God
Romans 1:27 - "In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty of their perversion."

Now, I am sure there is a lot I left out and loose ends I didn't cover and I'm sorry. I'm not trying impose my beliefs on anyone but just trying to offer another viewpoint- you can accept it or reject it. You also may want to go the verses I listed and read them in context to better understand them.

-Ben

 

[Polycarp1]

To Polycarp1,
not quite. What sort of desire? I may have a desire for friendship with someone of my own sex but not be gay. Gay is a sexual attraction. You need to specify this or it becomes a deception.
But this is all contrary to God's purposes in the scripture, we need to be talking about having our identity in Christ and not in pour sexual desires.

Most members of this forum are capable of reading the English language, and know that "love your mother" is not a command to be Oedipus Rex, and "desire for a same-sex partner" means a romantic and sexual love, not an agapetic or friendship-type love.

And yes, you are correct that we should seek our identity in Christ -- not in slavish adherence to illogical inferences from words that have changed meaning over the years.

 

[Ben-AG]

Wow, you have announced your presence with a blatant lie. But it's okay to lie if you're lying for Jesus, right?

I'm sorry, I should have made that point a little more clear. That observation is grounded upon what I and numerous other people I have spoken to about the subject have observed. It may not be the same as your observation, and, if it isn't, you may still be able to extrapulate something useful from the rest of the post.

 

[Skaloop]

Hi, this is my first post on this forum but I felt like I could offer some input. As many of us have witnessed, most homosexuals hate their desires and try to suppress them. Which leads us to the question of how one becomes gay?
- Personality/Temperament?
- Negative Body Image?
- Disfunction of Family Relationships?
- Sexual Violation at a Young Age?
- No affirmation from a father at a young age?
- Low self-esteem?
- A homosexual world that welcomes them in and encourages their behavior?
- A compliation of the list?

None of that. One does not "become" gay; one is gay.

I can say I do not know for sure...I'm sure it is different in every situation. Here are some interesting facts to consider:

- Depression & Anxiety is 1.5x higher in homosexuals
- Homosexuals are 1.5x more likely to be alcoholics or to abuse substances
- 73% of psychiatrists say homosexuals are less happy than the average person, and of those psychiatrists, 70% say that the unhappiness is NOT due to social stigmatization
- Monogamy is virtually non-existent in homosexual relationships
- 78% of homosexuals have some kind of STD
- Average age of death amongst male homosexuals is 42...only 1% die of old age
- 50% of suicides can be attributed to homosexuals
- Homosexuals are 100 times more likely to be murdered (usually by another homosexual) than the average person

Here's a hint; if you are going to post statistics, provide a source to back them up. Also, if you are going to post statistics, make sure they are not blatant lies and misrepresentations like the ones you used there.

I'm not trying impose my beliefs on anyone

So are you for or against giving homosexual couples the right to legally marry?

 

[Psudopod]

Originally Posted by Ben-AG

Hi, this is my first post on this forum but I felt like I could offer some input. As many of us have witnessed, most homosexuals hate their desires and try to suppress them.
​

Wow, you have announced your presence with a blatant lie. But it's okay to lie if you're lying for Jesus, right?

To be fair, he he doesn't realise it's wrong, he's not lying. I think I know the source, but could you let me know where you got these figures from Ben-AG?

Thankyou.

 

[David Brider]

Hi, this is my first post on this forum but I felt like I could offer some input. As many of us have witnessed, most homosexuals hate their desires and try to suppress them. Which leads us to the question of how one becomes gay?
- Personality/Temperament?
- Negative Body Image?
- Disfunction of Family Relationships?
- Sexual Violation at a Young Age?
- No affirmation from a father at a young age?
- Low self-esteem?
- A homosexual world that welcomes them in and encourages their behavior?
- A compliation of the list?

I can say I do not know for sure...I'm sure it is different in every situation. Here are some interesting facts to consider:

- Depression & Anxiety is 1.5x higher in homosexuals
- Homosexuals are 1.5x more likely to be alcoholics or to abuse substances
- 73% of psychiatrists say homosexuals are less happy than the average person, and of those psychiatrists, 70% say that the unhappiness is NOT due to social stigmatization
- Monogamy is virtually non-existent in homosexual relationships
- 78% of homosexuals have some kind of STD
- Average age of death amongst male homosexuals is 42...only 1% die of old age
- 50% of suicides can be attributed to homosexuals
- Homosexuals are 100 times more likely to be murdered (usually by another homosexual) than the average person

Well, the average age of death is a well-known fallacy. And the murder stat sounds a little too neat (not to mention ludicrously high) to take seriously. The suicide rate too. I've no doubt that it wouldn't be too difficult to research the real figures. I'll have a crack at it over the weekend, if nobody beats me to it.

As for why do people become gay...in my experience, they just are. There doesn't seem to be any particular reason. Some people just tend to be attracted to folks of the same gender as themselves, just as most people just tend to be attracted to folks of the opposite gender to themselves. Does there have to be a reason?

David.