6 point proof for the post trib rapture

[Hismessenger]

There ARE two resurrections, not three as the pre trib rapture doctrine would have you to believe. The first occurs after the two witnesses are killed for their testimony and then resurrected to eternal life. This is the first resurrection there is no other before this. They are taken up in a cloud to be with Christ for the thousand year reign. The rest of the dead remain in their graves until this thousand years is complete. Is this so hard to understand for it is written clearly in the word.

Then comes the second resurrection to judgment. Some to eternal life and others to eternal death. Two different resurrections but not any pre trib resurrection as preached. It is a fable and false doctrine.

hismessenger

 

[ezek33]

There ARE two resurrections, not three as the pre trib rapture doctrine would have you to believe. The first occurs after the two witnesses are killed for their testimony and then resurrected to eternal life. This is the first resurrection there is no other before this. They are taken up in a cloud to be with Christ for the thousand year reign. The rest of the dead remain in their graves until this thousand years is complete. Is this so hard to understand for it is written clearly in the word.

Then comes the second resurrection to judgment. Some to eternal life and others to eternal death. Two different resurrections but not any pre trib resurrection as preached. It is a fable and false doctrine.

hismessenger

I cannot agree with this do you believe the rapture is post millennial? and if so what do you do with Revelation 20:4-6?

Revelation 20:4-6
4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands,; and they lived and reigned with Christ for a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousands years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

This clearly shows that more than just the 2 witness are resurrection at the first resurrection, and the rapture immediately follows this resurrection of the just ''1st Thess 4:15-17''.

 

[ezek33]

so if different food laws

why not different resurrections

Are you joking? You are trying now to use the food laws to support the pretrib rapture. Well I guess it is a desperate move by a desperate man. Why don't you just accept that the Bible teaches the rapture is post trib?

 

[A Brother In Christ]

What I am showing that there are different group told different thing, get different things, but whatever

 

[Terral]

Hi Ezek33, Brother In Christ and Hismessenger:

The right answer to Onwing’s OP Topic was presented in Post #6 and Post #9 almost a year ago and all I see on the last two pages is more one-liner drivel from CF.com members without one clue. Seriously guys: If all you can add is one sentence of nothing, then wisdom says to remain silent and appear wise to somebody. Proverb 17:28. The pre, midweek and post Tribulation Rapture interpretations are ALL WRONG by the same 1000 Years contained inside the “Day of the Lord” itself. And “no,” this topic does NOT belong in the Eschatology Forum (Holdon in Post #10), because our Mystery (1Cor. 15:51-53) Rapture (1Thes. 4:15-17) takes place 1000 Years BEFORE the END of the Age events of Matthew 24 like this:

Your Bible is laid out according to this Prophecy/Mystery Timeline ‘and’ a map of the triune Tabernacle of Moses and the Temple (diagram = Fig 2). You have 4000 years from Adam’s fall (Gen. 3:21) to the end of the Old Testament when God began fulfilling His promises to Israel of the flesh by offering the “Gospel of the Kingdom” (Gospel #1) through which Peter’s Early Rains ‘Bride’ (Church #1) was gathered some 2000 years ago. Find ‘Today’ on the timeline to realize we are living near the END of the “2000 Year Mystery Time” that the OT prophets were NOT allowed to see ‘and’ that our mystery rapture BEGINS the upcoming 1000 Year Day of the Lord shown here also in blue:

Find “Today” again to realize the “First Resurrection” is about to take place with our mystery rapture to ‘start’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord. This marks the time that Elijah returns to restore ‘all things’ (Matt. 17:10-11) as the ‘prophet’ of Acts 3:22-23, which includes the ‘Tabernacle of David’ (Acts 15:16-18) once our ‘Body of Christ’ is taken to assume the heavenly seats vacated by Satan’s chaining (Rev. 20:2 = Rev. 1:10). We rule with Christ IN HEAVEN for the entire 1000 Year Day of the Lord (Rev. 1-20), until we return with Him in glory (Col. 3:4) at the END of the Age still 1000 Years in the future. Those of you GUILTY of breaking down the ‘First Veil’ of God’s Living Word (pic) have mixed Kingdom Doctrine (diagram* = water witness in blue) and Grace Doctrine (blood witness in red*) together and now cannot distinguish between the END of this 2000 Year Mystery Time ‘and’ the END of the Age still 1000 Years away in the future. Now let’s address some of the one-liner statements being passed back and forth on this already-killed Topic:

I agree totally, the witnesses are killed at the end of the trib not the middle and the rapture is post trib

Nonsense! While the Two Witnesses (Rev. 11 = Adam/Elijah and Eve/Moses) are killed and raised up very near the END of the Age, our mystery rapture (1Thes. 4:15-17) ‘started’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord just about 1000 years EARLIER. :0) Paul is describing how the 1000 Year Day of the Lord BEGINS (comes = 2Thes. 2:1-2), while Christ (Matt. 24) and John (Revelation 4-20) and Peter (2Peter 3:8-12) are describing how the same 1000 Year Period ENDS. You guys are mixing together things that God Himself has separated, which is common among those blinded by the ‘deluding influence’ (2Thes. 2:10-12) teaching the dogma of their manmade Denominationalism. Post #’s 132 – 134 represent nothing but this Topic being transformed into your private chit-chat room, as if the private messaging system is broken. Then we see more vain babbling from Hismessenger and Brother In Christ in Post #135-140. Then we see more unsupported opinion from Hismessenger in Post #141 using no Scripture, but perhaps we can quote that and allow these readers some benefit by applying ‘the truth’ of God’s Living Word with the ‘right’ interpretation:

There ARE two resurrections, not three as the pre trib rapture doctrine would have you to believe.

The ‘two’ resurrections ‘start’ (1Thes. 4:15-17) and ‘end’ (Rev. 20:11-15) the 1000 Year Day of the Lord where ‘our’ mystery translation to immortality (1Cor. 15:51-53) marks the ‘first’ resurrection.’ Since the pre, midweek and post Tribulation Rapture interpretations are all DEAD WRONG, then basing your assumptions on errant explanations is throwing effort after foolishness. Any Rapture explanation connected to the “Great Tribulation” (Matt. 24:21 = Rev. 7:14-16) is OFF by the same 1000 Years contained within the “Day of the Lord” itself that has a ‘beginning’ AND an ‘end’ some 1000 years LATER.

The first occurs after the two witnesses are killed for their testimony and then resurrected to eternal life.

Nonsense! These two witnesses (Rev. 11) appear at the END of the Age and just about 1000 Years ‘after’ our mystery Rapture ‘starts’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord. The 1000 Year Day of the Lord (diagram) starts with our mystery rapture (left) and ends 1000 years later when we return with Christ in glory (Col. 3:4) at the END of the Age over on the far right. This means the 1000 Year Day of the Lord is contained within the first three chapters of Revelation with the final END of the Age events (Matt. 24:3-31) retold from various perspectives in Revelation 4-20. Our mystery trumpet (1Cor. 15:52, 1Thes. 4:16) sounds off ‘behind’ John in Revelation 1:10, when Satan and all the members of his evil body are ‘chained’ (Rev. 20:2) to START the 1000 Year Day of the Lord right here in Revelation 1!!! Our mystery ‘Body of Christ’ appears before John in Revelation 1:10-19, as we rule with the Lamb IN HEAVEN for the entire 1000 Year Day of the Lord ‘and’ while ‘David himself’ (Eze. 34:23-25) rules on the earth in the Kingdom of God “on earth AS IT IS in heaven.”

This is the first resurrection there is no other before this.

Wrong! :0) We are raised up to put on immortality (1Cor. 15:51-53) some 1000 Years ‘before’ these two witnesses are ever sent by God very near the END of the Age.

They are taken up in a cloud to be with Christ for the thousand year reign.

No. By this time (Rev. 11), the 1000 Year Day of the Lord is almost OVER and ‘we’ (Body of Christ) have already been with the Lamb in the ‘center of the throne’ (Rev. 7:17) for just about 1000 years.

The rest of the dead remain in their graves until this thousand years is complete. Is this so hard to understand for it is written clearly in the word.

No. There is no such thing as what is ‘clearly’ written in God’s Living Word, because every syllable requires the ‘rightly divided’ (2Tim. 2:15) ‘interpretation’ in the form of our explanation. This is especially true when the ‘deluding influence’ is forcing people to ‘believe what is false’ (2Thes. 2:11) and the ‘servants of righteousness’ serving their ‘angel of light’ are strutting around this CF.com Forum with kabillions in Reps (heh) and without one clue as to what they are even talking about.

Then comes the second resurrection to judgment. Some to eternal life and others to eternal death. Two different resurrections but not any pre trib resurrection as preached. It is a fable and false doctrine.

And yet, the ‘pre-tribulation’ Rapture of our ‘mystery’ church is 100 Percent Truth, when you allow the ‘pre’ prefix to make reference to the 1000 Years contained within the Day of the Lord itself! :0) Those of you trying to affix ‘our’ mystery translation to immortality to the END of the Age events of Matthew 24 are ALL OFF by the same 1000 Years contained inside the 1000 Year Day of the Lord, because what Peter teaches in 2Peter 3:8 has escaped your notice . . .

I cannot agree with this do you believe the rapture is post millennial? and if so what do you do with Revelation 20:4-6?

Revelation 20 is an ‘overview’ of the entire 1000 Year Day of the Lord from the devil’s perspective where his ‘chaining’ (Rev. 20:2) actually takes place way back in Revelation 1:10 with the ‘voice of the archangel’ (1Thes. 4:16) ‘starting’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (in blue here) that ‘ends’ here in Revelation 20. Peter, John and James with their Early Rains Kingdom ‘Bride’ are raised up with us (diagram = in blue) to rule with Christ on thrones judging ‘Israel’ (Luke 22:30) for the 1000 Years spanning Revelation 1-3 (pic). Our mystery Body of Christ is “IN” the Lamb in the ‘center of the throne’ from all the way back in Revelation 1, while Peter and the Kingdom Bride reigns ‘with’ the Lamb from the ‘sea of glass’ (Rev. 4:6, 15:2), singing the ‘son of Moses/Eve,’ very much ‘before the throne’ having yet to be found IN Christ Jesus (like us). Many people commonly misinterpret the truth right out of Revelation 20:4-6 to invent their own 1000 Year Temporary Kingdom where Jesus Christ rules on this earth (the LIE = Christ's Throne is HEAVEN = my thread), when the Lamb is in ‘Heaven’ throughout Revelation. I am,

In Christ Jesus even now,

Terral

 

[A Brother In Christ]

terral been put on the ignore list

 

[Terral]

Hi Brother In Christ:

terral been put on the ignore list

GL,

Terral

 

[ezek33]

terral been put on the ignore list

I very seldom agree with you or anything but on this one i must agree ignoring Terral is a good idea.

 

[Terral]

Hi Eze33, Brother In Christ, HisMessenger and All:

Brother In Christ >> terral been put on the ignore list.

I very seldom agree with you or anything but on this one i must agree ignoring Terral is a good idea.

In other words: Come out to this fine CF.com Forum and spread your errant ‘wrongly divided’ propaganda everywhere ‘and’ when a member of Christ’s Body comes along and backs you into a corner, then just place him on your ridiculous ‘ignore’ list. :0) Please note that 'cowards' are placed at the 'front' of the line leading into the 'lake of fire.' Rev. 21:8. Right here is ‘the truth’ of God’s Living Word looking you guys directly in the face:

“For there MUST also be factions [divisions] among you, so that those who ‘ARE’ approved [2Tim. 2:15] may become evident among you.” 1Corinthians 11:19.

Showing yourself approved TO GOD and these CF.com registered members and readers means quoting God’s Word to offer our ‘rightly divided’ (accurately handled) commentary like a workman building a house brick by brick and precept upon precept. I presented ‘the truth’ of this “Rapture” Topic in Post #145 above, under the thesis that the Pre, Midweek and Post Tribulation interpretations are all DEAD WRONG. My post was addressed to Ezek33, Brother In Christ and HisMessenger who I ‘quoted >>’ word-for-word, before proving your statements FALSE using Scripture and ‘my’ version of rightly divided commentary. Just how many of my statements did Brother In Christ and Ezek33 and HisMessenger manage to ‘quote >>’ and prove errant using Scripture? Zero! :0)

The Post-Tribulation Rapture theory of our ‘mystery church’ is perhaps the most ridiculous concoction any man has ever invented and that point is easy to prove using Paul’s statements to the Thessalonians. Paul is leading up to describing ‘our’ mystery translation to immortality (like 1Cor. 15:51-53) by saying,

“Now as to the love of the brethren, you have no need for anyone to write to you, for you yourselves are taught by God to love one another; for indeed you do practice it toward all the brethren who are in all Macedonia. But we urge you, brethren, to excel still more, and to make it your ambition to lead A QUIET LIFE and attend to your own business and work with your hands, just as we commanded you, so that you will behave properly toward outsiders and not be in any need.” 1Thessalonians 4:9-12.

Paul tells these Thessalonians to ‘lead a quiet life’ and to ‘work with your hands’ in leading up to descriptions of our Rapture, which YOU SAY takes place ‘after’ all the events of Matthew 24:3-29* in Christ’s Olivet Discourse describing the END of the Age (Matt. 24:3*) at Christ’s Glorious Coming (Matt. 24:30-31). Someone help me explain what is WRONG with this picture! :0)

1. Christ says “For many will come in My name, saying, “I am the Christ’ and will mislead many.” Matt. 24:5. Okay, so where is Paul’s warning to ensure these Thessalonians are not caught up in the error of THE MANY? :0) Paul is describing how the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (pic = in blue) BEGINS, while Jesus Christ is describing how the same 1000 Year Period ENDS some 1000 years LATER.

2. Christ says, “Then they will deliver you to tribulation, and WILL KILL YOU, and you will be hated by all nations because of My name.” Matt 24:9. Again, where is Paul’s warning that these Thessalonians will be delivered over to tribulation and be killed? Paul says exactly the OPPOSITE in describing our mystery Rapture saying,

“Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will NOT ALL SLEEP, but we will all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.” 1Corinthians 15:51-53.

“For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. Therefore comfort one another with these words.” 1Thessalonians 4:15-18.

The difference is that ALL the disciples of Elijah’s “late rains” Kingdom ‘Bride’ obeying the “Gospel of the Kingdom” (Matt. 24:14) WILL BE KILLED to join Peter and his ‘early rains’ Bride on the ‘sea of glass’ (Rev. 4:6, 15:2), before they head off to the ‘Marriage Supper of the Lamb’ (Rev. 19:5-10) to seal their perpetual ‘betrothal’ to the Lord. The members of Christ’s Body (that’s us) are in the world today and many will remain alive when the 1000 Year Day of the Lord ‘begins’ with our mystery Rapture. If Paul were telling these Thessalonians about a Rapture at the END of the Age (not), then his Epistles would be filled with the same warnings you see from Christ in Matthew 24!! Instead we see Paul telling these members of Christ’s Body to ‘comfort one another with these words,’ when Christ is saying something very different:

3. Christ says “Gospel of the Kingdom” will be preached to the whole world and ‘then’ the end will come:

"Because lawlessness is increased, most people's love will grow cold. But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved. This Gospel of the Kingdom (#1 here) shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.” Matthew 24:12-14.

The members of Paul’s “Body of Christ” Church preach his “Word of the Cross” (Gospel #2) gospel message, but Elijah will be preaching the “Gospel of the Kingdom” when our Rapture finally takes place ‘and’ he is sent ONLY to the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel (like Christ = Matt. 15:24) to ‘start’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (in blue again). There will be no more preaching of Paul’s “my gospel” (#2), because all the members of Christ’s Body (Church #2 = that’s us) will be IN HEAVEN and there will be no ‘evangelists’ with “Christ IN you” (Fig 2) to make the ‘faith to faith’ (Rom. 1:17) transaction even possible. In short: Christ is giving His Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24) to these Kingdom Disciples (Kingdom Bride) as if our mystery Body of Christ WOULD NEVER EXIST. Our 2000 Year Mystery Time (in red) is a ‘parenthetical’ period (dispensational shift diagram) contained inside the 1000 Year Day of the Lord that actually began with John the Baptist (Matt. 11:13) heralding the ‘Gospel of the Kingdom’ to Israel of the flesh about 2000 years ago. Christ continues:

"Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation’ [Dan. 11:31, 12:11-13] which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains.” Matthew 24:15-16.

Again, where is Paul’s warning to anyone near Judea fleeing to the mountains and away from the ‘son of destruction’ (2Thes. 2:3-4) and his ‘abomination of desolation’?? Again, Paul just told these Thessalonians to lead quiet lives and to work with their hands, because he is describing how the 1000 Year Day of the Lord 'begins' and Christ is telling these Kingdom Jews how the same 1000 Year Period ‘ends.’

4. Paul teaches that 'we' return with Christ in glory!

"Therefore if you have been raised up with Christ, keep seeking the things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God. Set your mind on the things above, not on the things that are on earth. For you have died and your life is hidden with Christ in God. When Christ, who is our life, is revealed, then 'you also' will be revealed with Him in glory." Colossians 3:1-4.

Christ's coming for 'our' mystery church is NOT SEEN by the world (my thread), but His Prophetic Return (seen = Zech. 14) IS SEEN by the world 'and' we (Body of Christ) return with Him IN GLORY. Since we are returning with Christ as this 'glorious' return, then obviously 'we' cannot possibly be Raptured at this Matthew 24:30-31 coming. :0)

Some people running around this CF.com Board have TORN DOWN the ‘First Veil’ (diagram) of God’s Living Word and now cannot distinguish between Christ’s ‘water’ ministry for the Prophetic Kingdom ‘Bride’ and His ‘blood’ ministry for the Mystery “Body of Christ” still very much in the world today. They merge the ‘two gospels’ and ‘two churches’ AND the ‘end’ of this current Dispensation of God’s Grace (Eph. 3:2) and the END of the Age, because quite frankly they are NOT spiritually prepared to see the difference. The vast majority of ‘professing’ Christians are deceived by the ‘god of this world’ (2Cor. 4:3-4) and under the power of his ‘deluding influence’ and forced to regurgitate ‘what is false’ (2Thes. 2:11), because that is the way ‘servants of righteousness’ serve their ‘angel of light’ (2Cor. 11:14-15) and nothing anyone says or does will change their minds one way or the other. That is the very reason that posting their denominational propaganda and ‘ignoring’ my opposing arguments is their only choice, because NONE of them can ‘quote >>’ from my work to point out any errors using Scripture. :0)

If anyone can find a single place in my work where I deviate one iota from the truth of God’s Living Word, then please “quote that >>” and help remove the splinter from my eye. 2Tim. 2:15. I will kill the fatted calf and stand you before God, His Son and Their mighty angels and adorn you with every form of gold and silver and precious stone granting you access to the deepest passageways, corridors and doorways to God’s Hidden Wisdom in the ‘True Tabernacle’ established FAR above all the heavens of this universe.

But of course, that would require someone here to find at least one error in my testimony where these critics can do nothing more than run away and place this son of God on ignore. :0)

In Christ Jesus even now,

Terral

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Is he justifing himself.... if so
2 tim 2:22-26, titus 3:9-10

 

[BratFace]

There are alot of great points to this thread, but I don't believe God honors arguing over his word. What remains fact for me personally is Matthew 24:36-44

36"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[a] but only the Father. 37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.
42"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.


This is ultimately what it means. We don't know when. What a scripture that has been God breathed may mean in His infinate wisdom may not understood by man 100%... We have an "idea" of when this may take place because we believe God's word to be true on this event to happen... however, to argue about it isn't Godly in my opinion to the point of putting someone down, arguing or making one person feel inferior.
We simply do not know when this will take place, we can only go on what the Holy Spirit reveals to each of us and we also have to be very VERY careful what we teach. Our interpretations aren't always on key. This is where faith comes in.

Now, where's the popcorn? heehee

 

[A Brother In Christ]

There are alot of great points to this thread, but I don't believe God honors arguing over his word. What remains fact for me personally is Matthew 24:36-44

36"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[a] but only the Father. 37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left.
42"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.


This is ultimately what it means. We don't know when. What a scripture that has been God breathed may mean in His infinate wisdom may not understood by man 100%... We have an "idea" of when this may take place because we believe God's word to be true on this event to happen... however, to argue about it isn't Godly in my opinion to the point of putting someone down, arguing or making one person feel inferior.
We simply do not know when this will take place, we can only go on what the Holy Spirit reveals to each of us and we also have to be very VERY careful what we teach. Our interpretations aren't always on key. This is where faith comes in.

Now, where's the popcorn? heehee

Yet God has given us the time frame during the Great Trib

When the Beast does the abomination of desolation... matt 24:15-20, 2 thes 2:4, Dan 9:27

that Christ coming is 1260 days after this event ... rev 12:6

What is the problem ....

earth speeds up rev 8:12, Matt 24:22
darkness.. rev 16:10 cannot tell time
clocks destroyed with Great Erathquake... rev 16:18-20

God has even given the time that OT saints get eternal life ... dan 12:2,11-12

 

[Hismessenger]

Terral,

The only thing you have correct in your post is that Rev. 20 is an overview of the rest of the book. It takes in the 1000 year reign but it also shows you when the true rapture occurs and who is involved in it.

It states in no uncertain are speculative terms that those who face the beast and are beheaded for their witness are the first ones resurrected to reign with christ for the 1000 years. It goes on to say that the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This occurs during the tribulation and the rapture ends the tribulation. Come up Hither is said to the witnesses who are made up of Jew and gentile church members. This is shown in chapter 11 but it is explained in chapter 20.

This is confirmed in Prov, Joel and Acts where it is said

Pro 1:23
Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

Joe 2:28
And it shall come to pass afterward, [that] I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions:

Joe 2:29
And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.

Act 2:17
And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

Act 2:18
And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

This is talking about those who witness for Christ, who have been given the truth. The two edged sword and they wield this sword with the power of the Holy Spirit until their season which God has ordained is complete. I could show you scripture to confirm this also but I leave that up to all who seek the truth to look for themselves

The rest of the dead means all who have died before the comes to pass, church and gentile, whether they are saved or not. They remain in the grave until the 1000 years are over and then come the end time events. Satan is release for His final curtain call and then Christ comes to judge the earth.

It is truly about finding the right time line to see the picture clearly. This same thing is done in the old testament in the book of Dueteronomy. It relates the story of Israel from Adam to the end if you have ears and eyes to hear and see.

Ezeke,

The rapture is post tribulation for as I said before and in this post, it brings an end to the tribulation and begins the 1000 year reign of Christ and with Christ. The kingdoms of the world have become the kingdoms of out lord and of His Christ is what the scripture says after the last angel sounds. This occurs shortly after the saints are raptured and leads to the final judgment.

Terral, put away your charts and human knowledge for they are worthless in the spirit. Only He can give you true understanding and it comes by being in Him, not just His written word.

hismessenger

 

[Hismessenger]

Bratface,

no one knows the hour but God has shown us the order of events when it is time.

hismessenger

 

[Hismessenger]

Terral,

I went back and looked at your posts #6 & 9 and I see we agree on the time frame but you need to leave off with the charts. They confuse the issue and the word makes it plain enough in Christ.

hismessenger

 

[A Brother In Christ]

We know the time of the 2nd coming... but they will not be able to know !!!

Yet God has given us the time frame during the Great Trib

When the Beast does the abomination of desolation... matt 24:15-20, 2 thes 2:4, Dan 9:27

that Christ coming is 1260 days after this event ... rev 12:6

What is the problem ....

earth speeds up rev 8:12, Matt 24:22
darkness.. rev 16:10 cannot tell time
clocks destroyed with Great Erathquake... rev 16:18-20

God has even given the time that OT saints get eternal life ... dan 12:2,11-12

 

[Terral]

Hi Hismessenger:

The only thing you have correct in your post is that Rev. 20 is an overview of the rest of the book.

How many errors in my work did Hismessenger ‘quote >>’ to show errant using Scripture? 2Tim. 2:15? Zero as usual. Revelation 20 is an overview of the 1000 Year Day of the Lord from the devil’s perspective, but his chaining takes place at the ‘trumpet’ (1Cor. 15:52, 1Thes. 4:16) sounding off ‘behind’ John in Revelation 1:10.

It takes in the 1000 year reign but it also shows you when the true rapture occurs and who is involved in it.

The “Lamb’s” 1000 Year Reign is IN HEAVEN, while David (Eze. 34:23-25) = "Tabernacle of David" = diagram) reigns as prince upon the earth in the Kingdom of God “on earth AS IT IS in heaven.” Matt. 6:10. Christ takes “His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, a Minister in the Sanctuary and in the True Tabernacle, which the Lord pitched ("Only True God"), not men.” Hebrews 8:1-2.

It states in no uncertain are speculative terms that those who face the beast and are beheaded for their witness are the first ones resurrected to reign with christ for the 1000 years.

No sir. Nobody is ‘beheaded’ in Revelation 20:4 (link), but Peter’s early rains Kingdom Bride (John 3:29) was ‘cut off’ (pelekizo #3390 = dispensational shift diagram) and ‘they’ will be raised with ‘us’ (Body of Christ = Church #2) to ‘start’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord back in Revelation 1. :0) Please forgive, but yours is the common misinterpretation of Revelation 20:4-6 and the source of much confusion among the members of Christ’s Body in the world today.

It goes on to say that the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This occurs during the tribulation and the rapture ends the tribulation.

No, no, no! Must Hismessenger make all the common mistakes of your fathers? :0) The 1000 Year Day of the Lord (in blue) ‘starts’ with ‘our’ mystery Rapture back in Revelation 1:10 with that ‘trumpet’ sounding off with the ‘voice of the archangel’ that Hismessenger cannot explain. In fact, the typical CF.com registered member has never thought to make the connection between this ‘trumpet’ sounding off ‘behind’ John ‘and’ the ‘trumpet’ sounding off at our Rapture in 1Cor. 15:52 and 1Thes. 4:16. Right? Of course. You errantly run into the trumpets of Revelation 8 and 9 and pretend those represent ‘our’ mystery trumpet, when we are already with Christ for 1000 years ‘before’ those END of the Age trumpets begin sounding. Our ‘mystery’ Rapture takes place some 1000 Years ‘BEFORE’ any of the events contained in Christ’s Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24) even begin, which means your calculations are still off by the same 1000 Years contained inside the 1000 Year Day of the Lord.

Come up Hither is said to the witnesses who are made up of Jew and gentile church members. This is shown in chapter 11 but it is explained in chapter 20.

No, no and no! :0) John hears “Come up here!” in Revelation 4:1 when he begins giving END of the Age accounts from the ‘heavenly’ perspectives, as the 1000 Year Day of the Lord PASSED through the first three chapters of this prophetic book (diagram again). Adam (Elijah) and Eve (Moses) are called “Come up here!” the very same way in Revelation 11:12, but, again, that event takes place very near the END of the Age still 1000 Years in the future.

This is confirmed in Prov, Joel and Acts where it is said Pro 1:23, Joel 2:28-29, Acts 2:17 . . .

No! The pouring out of My Spirit takes place when the 1000 Year Day of the Lord BEGINS and our Body of Christ is deposited in heaven at our Rapture (1Thes. 4:16-17). Only then will the Holy Spirit return to this earth to meet up with Elijah making ready to begin the process of restoring all things (Matt. 17:10-11) as the ‘prophet’ of Acts 3:22-23.

This is talking about those who witness for Christ, who have been given the truth. The two edged sword and they wield this sword with the power of the Holy Spirit until their season which God has ordained is complete. I could show you scripture to confirm this also but I leave that up to all who seek the truth to look for themselves.

Please stop patronizing me with this bullony and simply ‘quote >>’ anything in my work that appears off to show everyone your interpretations using Scripture. 2Tim. 2:15. Your side of this ‘Rapture’ debate has the ‘beginning’ (Paul = 1Thes. 4:16-17) and ‘end’ (Christ = Matt. 24 + John = Revelation) mixed together without knowing the difference and this side is showing you the difference using Scripture and a myriad of diagrams to boot. :0)

The rest of the dead means all who have died before the comes to pass, church and gentile, whether they are saved or not.

The rest of the dead? You quoted Acts 2 and Joel 2, but your commentary is apparently describing something in Revelation 20 concerning the Second Resurrection from Revelation 20:5. Please make up my mind! :0) Only our mystery ‘Body of Christ’ and the disciples from Peter’s early rains Kingdom Bride are raised at the ‘First Resurrection’ with the trumpet sounding off ‘behind’ John in Revelation 1. The ‘rest of the dead’ are raised up at the END of the Age for the Judgment in Revelation 20:11-15.

They remain in the grave until the 100 years are over and then come the end time events. Satan is release for His final curtain call and then Christ comes to judge the earth.

Lord-Have-Mercy . . . Satan is ‘chained’ way back in Revelation 1 to ‘start’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord. He is released when the 1000 Years is over right here in Revelation 20, which finds him in the lake of fire with his two witnesses (Rev. 19:20), BEFORE his little helpers are raised up and judged in Revelation 20:11-15.

It is truly about finding the right time line to see the picture clearly. This same thing is done in the old testament in the book of Dueteronomy. It relates the story of Israel from Adam to the end if you have ears and eyes to hear and see.

Please forgive, but someone is condescending to me again who cannot even spell Deuteronomy, and I have likely read Scripture cover to cover more times than anyone here. The right timeline looks exactly like God’s Living Word laid out to span 7000 years like this or like this, but only if you have eyes from God to see. :0)

The rapture is post tribulation for as I said before and in this post, it brings an end to the tribulation and begins the 1000 year reign of Christ and with Christ.

Nonsense. The ‘Great Tribulation’ (Matt. 24:21, Rev. 7:14-16) is just one events leading to the END of the Age, as Christ returns in Matthew 24:30-31 to judge the living (Matt. 25:31-34) and the dead (Rev. 20:11-15). The new age begins in Revelation 21:1+ and there is ‘no’ time for Christ to rule for yet another 1000 years, as the 1000 Year Day of the Lord by that time will indeed be OVER. Hismessenger is making the same mistake of the ‘professing’ Prophecy experts who fail to make the connection between ‘our’ mystery trumpet (1Cor. 15:52, 1Thes. 4:16) to the one sounding off ‘behind’ John in Revelation 1:10 where Satan and the evil members of his body are ‘chained’ (Rev. 20:2) to ‘start’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord. The Lamb has been ruling IN HEAVEN for the 1000 years spanning Revelation 1-20 and by the time He returns in glory (and us with Him = Col. 3:4), then the 1000 Year Day of the Lord will be finished.

The kingdoms of the world have become the kingdoms of out lord and of His Christ is what the scripture says after the last angel sounds. This occurs shortly after the saints are raptured and leads to the final judgment.

No. We have been with Christ for the entire 1000 years from Revelation 1 to Revelation 20, which Hismessenger seems unable to comprehend or understand.

Terral, put away your charts and human knowledge for they are worthless in the spirit. Only He can give you true understanding and it comes by being in Him, not just His written word.

This sounds funny coming from someone who cannot ‘quote >>’ a single error in my work ‘and’ from someone making the same old mistakes as the typical professing Prophecy expert regurgitating his homemade denominationalism. A picture is still worth a thousand words and I would love to see your Bible interpretations laid out in a series of diagrams. GL! :0)

In Christ Jesus,

Terral

 

[A Brother In Christ]

bump..

 

[Hismessenger]

Terral,

You asked for proof of your errant doctrine. Then put away this nonsense of a mystery rapture for the word clearly tells us that those killed by the beast in the tribulation are the first and only ones raptured until the thousand years be complete.If what you say is true then show us where their departure takes place in the word and not by supposition or enuendo.

You sound just like the one Paul warned about saying the resurrection has already come. Error upon error and you can't see for your charts and own understanding. The word is true and every man a liar who denies the truth of what is written. I didn't speculate but gave you the scripture to show my position in Christ . Show us where you get this mystery rapture theory from in plain scripture passages. You can't and won't. You will only try to sidestep the truth for more of your own theories.

hismessenger

 

[Terral]

Hi HisMessenger:

You asked for proof of your errant doctrine.

Let’s see . . . What did Hismessenger manage to ‘quote >>’ from my work to prove errant using Scripture in this recent reply? Nothing again, as usual. :0)

Then put away this nonsense of a mystery rapture for the word clearly tells us that those killed by the beast in the tribulation are the first and only ones raptured until the thousand years be complete.

No. You are regurgitating Hismessenger’s interpretation of some unknown Scriptural verses, because you also failed to quote God’s Word to allow the rest of us to know what in the heck Hismessenger is going on about. Just how many times does Paul use the term ‘tribulation’ in addressing the Corinthians where he describes our translation to immortality as a ‘mystery’ event (1Cor. 15:51)?? The answer is ZERO. Paul uses the term ‘tribulation’ just one time in addressing the Thessalonians saying, “You also became imitators of us and the Lord, having received the word in much tribulation with joy of the Holy Spirit.” 1Thes. 1:6. Therefore you are NOT citing anything from PAUL concerning our ‘mystery’ translation to immortality, or our gathering to the Lord that STARTS when the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (Day of Christ) is ‘at hand’ (2Thes. 2:2). You are describing the “Second Resurrection” that takes place only AFTER the 1000 Years Day of the Lord is OVER, as Satan is chained in his prison for the same 1000 Year Day of the Lord. Jesus Christ’s Olivet Discourse (Matt. 24) describes how the Age will END still 1000 Years in the future of this earth, because the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (in blue) is just now about to BEGIN.

If what you say is true then show us where their departure takes place in the word and not by supposition or enuendo.

Please be more specific ‘and’ send us a post that includes at least one reference TO SCRIPTURE. :0) Who in the heck is ‘their’ as in ‘their departure?’ Our mystery ‘Body of Christ’ (Church #2) is raised up to START the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (in blue again) where Satan and all the members of his evil body of darkness ARE CHAINED with the ‘voice of the archangel’ (1Thes. 4:16) sounding off with the trumpet ‘behind’ John in Revelation 1:10. If anyone here sees a problem with that interpretation, then simply ‘quote >> from my work’ and show us ‘your’ explanation for how this trumpet (Rev. 1:10 = 1Cor. 15:52 = 1Thes. 4:16) fits into your Rapture interpretations. Here is ‘the truth’ that most of you have never seen in this lifetime:

“I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day [Day of the Lord], and I heard behind me a loud voice [voice of the Archangel = 1Thes. 4:16] like the sound of a trumpet [1Cor. 15:52, 1Thes. 4:16] . . .”. Revelation 1:10.

John is standing INSIDE the “Lord’s Day” (1000 Year Day of the Lord), so that ‘our’ mystery trumpet (1Cor. 15:52) sounds off ‘BEHIND’ him; because OBVIOUSLY the 1000 Year Day of the Lord has ALREADY STARTED. Again, Paul tells ‘us’ (Body of Christ) through the Thessalonians that ‘our’ Rapture (1Thes. 4:17) takes place when the ‘times and epochs’ (1Thes. 5:1-2) period of the “Day of the Lord” actually BEGINS. This is the same exact ‘times and epochs’ that Jesus Christ connected directly to the Kingdom being restored TO ISRAEL in answer to His Disciple’s question:

“So when they had come together, they were asking Him, saying, "Lord, is it at this time You are restoring the kingdom to Israel?" He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or epochs which THE FATHER [Matt. 24:36] has fixed by HIS OWN AUTHORITY . . .”. Acts 1:6-7.

God has ‘postponed’ the ‘start’ of the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (in blue again = simple for first graders), so that the members to the “Body of Christ” (Church #2) can be gathered through this current “2000 Year Mystery Time” that ENDS with our mystery translation to immortality (1Cor. 15:51-53 again). Jesus Christ (Matt. 24) and John (Revelation) have nothing to say about ‘our’ mystery ‘Body of Christ,’ because BOTH are describing the ‘fulfillment of PROPHECY’ for Israel and the Prophetic Kingdom BRIDE (Church #1). When Jesus Christ is describing the END of the Age (Matt. 24:3, Daniel 12:13) in Matthew 24, then our mystery ‘Body of Christ’ has YET TO EVEN EXIST; until Paul is raised up and given our gospel in Acts 9. Then Paul is writing to these Thessalonians about the upcoming 1000 Year Day of the Lord (advanced diagram for the 'mature') and these same ‘times and epochs’ where the Kingdom is restored to Israel, when Elijah returns to restore ‘all things’ (Matt. 17:10-11) as the ‘prophet’ of Acts 3:22-23, saying,

“Now as to the times and the epochs, brethren, you have NO NEED of anything to be written to you. For you yourselves know full well that the Day of the Lord WILL COME [start/begin] just like a thief in the night.” 1Thessalonians 5:1-2.

All of these NT ‘prophets’ can tell you exactly how the 1000 Year Day of the Lord WILL END, which is exactly what Christ is describing in Matthew 24. However, THE FATHER ALONE (Matt. 24:36) knows the day and hour when the upcoming 1000 Year Day of the Lord BEGINS ‘and’ that moment includes our translation to immortality at the very same instant that Satan is CHAINED (Rev. 20:2) to START John’s account in Revelation 1:10. Elijah (David = Adam) then has the benefit of our ‘Body of Christ’ seated in the heavenly places IN Christ Jesus (Eph. 2:6) to begin the process of restoring ‘all things’ in the aftermath of Satan’s chaining where all the members of his evil body of darkness are also chained right along with him to START this ‘times and epochs’ period where the Kingdom is restored to Israel ON THIS EARTH with the “Tabernacle of David.” Acts 15:16-18. Paul had no need to write about 'these things' related to these 'times and epochs,' because 'we' will see all of that from 'heaven' IN the Lamb of Revelation. :0) The idea that ‘our’ mystery Church is raptured ‘after’ the 1000 Year Day of the Lord is OVER is completely ridiculous!!! With Satan and all the members of his body of darkness chained in the bottomless pit, then just who do you think is going to occupy those heavenly places where from ‘we’ will judge the world ‘and’ the angels? 1Cor. 6:2-3? :0) Elijah cannot even begin to restore ANYTHING, until the bad guys are CHAINED and that event takes place when the 1000 Year Day of the Lord BEGINS with our Rapture.

You sound just like the one Paul warned about saying the resurrection has already come.

How so? :0) This is just another foolish statement from my debating adversaries with no basis in reality whatsoever! The upcoming 1000 Year Day of the Lord has exactly ‘two’ resurrections: The first resurrection STARTS the 1000 Year Day of the Lord (1Thes. 4:16-17) where Peter and the ‘early rains’ BRIDE (John 3:29 = Church #1) are raised with us to rule with Christ for the same 1000 years (Rev. 20:4-6) that Satan is CHAINED. Then Satan is released ‘after’ the 1000 Years is over where he ‘cuts off’ the Messiah from Daniel 9:26 (David = installed in Eze. 34:23-25) and his boy child “son of destruction” (2Thes. 2:3-4*) is raised up to stand in the holy place (Matt. 24:15) displaying himself AS GOD*. The ‘Great Tribulation’ (Matt. 24:21 = Rev. 7:114-16) then takes place ‘and’ we return with Christ in GLORY (Col. 3:4) where the ‘Second Resurrection’ then takes place for the END of the Age Judgment (Matt. 25:31-34, Rev. 20:11-15). Our mystery translation has yet to take place, because that event is connected directly to the START of the upcoming 1000 Year Day of the Lord. :0)

Error upon error and you can't see for your charts and own understanding.

Please stop trying to flame me with your stupidity and simply address the substance of my interpretations that connect ‘our’ mystery translation to immortality to the ‘start’ of the upcoming 1000 Year Day of the Lord. Those three witnesses are pointing straight back at you. :0)

The word is true and every man a liar who denies the truth of what is written.

This side of the debate ‘is’ quoting your every errant word ‘and’ is quoting God’s Word ‘and’ providing ‘rightly divided’ (2Tim. 2:15) commentary that nobody here can refute.

I didn't speculate but gave you the scripture to show my position in Christ.

If you say so. The fact is that Hismessenger is sending me “Dear Terral” love letters quoting nobody in this debate and citing NOTHING from God’s Living Word. 2Tim. 3:16-17.

Show us where you get this mystery rapture theory from in plain scripture passages. You can't and won't. You will only try to sidestep the truth for more of your own theories.

I have shown you guys countless times and again in this post, but this is a ‘mystery’ topic (Vine’s definition) and many here cannot see our mystery rapture (1Thes. 4:17) for all the cotton picking “1000 Year Day of the Lord” trees. :0)

In Christ Jesus,

Terral