Iconography in the Anglican Church

[calluna]

Let's see - if you considered these five characteristics as a baseline definition, then yes, they were/are evangelicals

How do we know that they considered those five characteristics as a baseline definition?

 

[karen freeinchristman]

How do we know that they considered those five characteristics as a baseline definition?

Because I personally know these people and we have discussed them.

 

[calluna]

Because I personally know these people and we have discussed them.

But we don't personally know you.

 

[Albion]

How can any evangelicals, whose obsession, according to others, is sola fide, accept icons? Can someone give a link to a congregation that calls itself conservative evangelical and uses icons? Do Peter Akinola's people, for instance, use them?

I don't know what the case is in Nigeria, but I do know particular Evangelical Anglican parishes in America which have a few icons.

Either way, sola fide has nothing at all to do with it, since sola fide refers to how one is saved, and no Anglican I know thinks that hanging an icon on the wall is going to affect one's salvation one way or the other. They aren't 'venerated' in those parishes. They are usually viewed, by Anglicans, as inspirational--not much different from the way Baptists or Pentecostals think about that famous picture of praying hands or one of the many "portraits" of Christ that I see in their homes or in their illustrated Bibles.

 

[calluna]

I don't know what the case is in Nigeria, but I do know particular Evangelical Anglican parishes in America which have a few icons.

Can you name them, please?

Either way, sola fide has nothing at all to do with it

That's a matter of opinion.

no Anglican I know thinks that hanging an icon on the wall is going to affect one's salvation one way or the other.

Perhaps. I have one myself, though not on a wall, lest it be a stumbling-block.

They are usually viewed, by Anglicans, as inspirational

By some Anglicans, I don't doubt it for an instant. But I doubt very much indeed whether genuine evangelicals regard icons as inspirational, except as art works. And they are certainly that, some of them.

--not much different from the way Baptists or Pentecostals think about that famous picture of praying hands

I don't think they do. The Dürer is very much a 'high church' artefact.

or one of the many "portraits" of Christ that I see in their homes or in their illustrated Bibles.

Illustration is quite a separate phenomenon.

 

[Albion]

Can you name them, please?

Sure. Are you planning to visit them for yourself to see if you can believe what we've been telling you?

That's a matter of opinion.

No, it isn't. It's a matter of knowing what sola fide means.

Perhaps. I have one myself, though not on a wall, lest it be a stumbling-block.

Yeh, I have one around here somewhere myself.

By some Anglicans, I don't doubt it for an instant. But I doubt very much indeed whether genuine evangelicals regard icons as inspirational, except as art works.

Well, that was my point.

I don't think they do.

You must just not be familiar with these examples. They are so widespread, however, that I assumed you would be.

 

[calluna]

Sure.

Then please do.

Well, that was my point.

How odd.

You must just not be familiar with these examples.

I'm not. I don't think they exist.

 

[Albion]

Are you an Anglican, calluna?

 

[New_Found_Faith]

Just answer the question.

I don't think non-Anglicans are allowed to participate in debate in an Anglican forum, according to the congrgation forum guidelines. Non-members are only allowed to post in fellowship, the way that I understand it.

(not an official "mod-hat" post, I'm just a mod in training right now! )

 

[TomUK]

How can any evangelicals, whose obsession, according to others, is sola fide, accept icons? Can someone give a link to a congregation that calls itself conservative evangelical and uses icons? Do Peter Akinola's people, for instance, use them?

To expand on my previous post, i'm not altogether with sharing the details of the specific over the internet but it is a member of the evangelical alliance and would definitely regard themselves as conservative evangelicals. As an example, if you were in a pre-marital sexual relationship you were not allowed to be a childrens/youth group leader.

The way in the icon was used in the service was that at various it was projected onto the screen and from what i recall we had a couple of guided meditations on it and then the sermon connected some of the imagery from the icon with the bible reading (it was quite a while ago and I can't remember the passage). I would send you the sermon but it's not one of the archived ones on the churches website.

Certainly it was unconventional use of an icon but goes to show that it can be used very comfortably.

 

[calluna]

To expand on my previous post, i'm not altogether with sharing the details of the specific over the internet but it is a member of the evangelical alliance and would definitely regard themselves as conservative evangelicals. As an example, if you were in a pre-marital sexual relationship you were not allowed to be a childrens/youth group leader.

The way in the icon was used in the service was that at various it was projected onto the screen and from what i recall we had a couple of guided meditations on it and then the sermon connected some of the imagery from the icon with the bible reading (it was quite a while ago and I can't remember the passage). I would send you the sermon but it's not one of the archived ones on the churches website.

Certainly it was unconventional use of an icon but goes to show that it can be used very comfortably.

But this shows that it is unusual for evangelicals to use an icon, and then not really as an icon, but as a visual aid, and I can see some possible validity in that. One can use an icon in a sermon to show that icons are not very good things.

 

[TomUK]

But this shows that it is unusual for evangelicals to use an icon, and then not really as an icon, but as a visual aid, and I can see some possible validity in that. One can use an icon in a sermon to show that icons are not very good things.

It was much more than a visual aid. It was an aid and focus to reflection.

 

[calluna]

It was much more than a visual aid. It was an aid and focus to reflection.

In what way?

 

[calluna]

I don't think non-Anglicans are allowed to participate in debate in an Anglican forum, according to the congrgation forum guidelines. Non-members are only allowed to post in fellowship, the way that I understand it.

(not an official "mod-hat" post, I'm just a mod in training right now! )

I've encountered two Eastern Orthodox and at least one Roman Catholic here, so if there is a rule, it does not seem to be observed. But this seems to apply here:

'Some congregational forums have opted not to have a forum-specific guideline with a Statement of Faith to identify members.'

 

[Timothy]

I've encountered two Eastern Orthodox and at least one Roman Catholic here, so if there is a rule, it does not seem to be observed. But this seems to apply here:

'Some congregational forums have opted not to have a forum-specific guideline with a Statement of Faith to identify members.'

There are a number of members here in STR who have been around for some time and who have unfailingly shown respect for a wide variety of different opinions, which, speaking as a long-term member of STR and former staff member here, is an absolute staple of STR membership. And basically, if we like someone, we don't report them, staff don't see it, staff don't do anything about it. We also have a habit of taking what people say on trust here. We may offer variant opinions, and offer our own experience, but it is almost unheard of in STR to demand names or evidence particularly in an abrasive fashion. Now if you are not an Anglican or an Old Catholic, you are a guest in this forum. Kindly remember so. If you are an Anglican or an Old Catholic, then let me be the first to tell you that you're not acting like one in any shape or form. We have a helpful sticky which gives you information on what we consider an Anglican and/or Old Catholic. It also gives some useful pointers on basic manners which have been traditionally respected within this forum.

 

[calluna]

a helpful sticky

Where, please?

 

[JasonV]

Where, please?

Let me show you the door...er...I mean the sticky: http://christianforums.com/showthread.php?t=6900226

 

[TomUK]

In what way?

I said- guided meditations.

 

[calluna]

I said- guided meditations.

What was learned from the icon?

 

[HandmaidenOfGod]

Why are you so hot on this issue? Why are you arguing in this thread? This is not your faith forum, and yet you come in here and attack these loving people. If you don't want to use icons, then don't. Nobody is forcing you to.