Why the 'obsession' with homosexuality?

[PetersKeys]

No need to celebrate adultery with a parade, adulterers got rid of the price paid for adultery when they achieved no fault divorce in every state of the union (except NY... I'm not sure if NY passed their law allowing it yet) In states that have had adultery laws on the books they've been trashed. Adulterers don't have to fight for their rights.. they've been allowed to remarry after divorce... in both civil AND religious ceremonies.

The Catholic and Orthodox don't support remarriage, and getting an annulment is only under extreme conditions. Don't tag that on all christians simply because a few denominations re-marry people like its nothing.

 

[HannahBanana]

Seeker, I think what you need to realize is that telling someone homosexuality is a sin is not condemning them. If my friend was doing cocaine he would obviously still be my friend, but I wouldn't justify his using of cocaine. I know a few gay people, and I treat them like people, but I don't justify their sleeping with men, and my wife constantly worries about their health and wellbeing.

Actually, it is condemning them, since you're faulting them for something they didn't even choose (just like I didn't choose to be a bisexual).

And drug addictions are harmful. Since when is homosexuality or bisexuality harmful? Do you honestly think that all homosexuals or bisexuals will eventually get AIDS? Do you not realize that AIDS is being spread within the straight community, too?

Also, why does your wife worry about your gay friends' health and well-being? Does she have any reason to think that they'll end up being irresponsible about either their health or their well-being? Gay men are adults, you know, and they have just as much of an ability to take care of themselves as anyone else does. They don't need anyone worrying about them just because they're gay. That just stinks of arrogance, and it will just make them dislike you.

 

[wanderingone]

The Catholic and Orthodox don't support remarriage, and getting an annulment is only under extreme conditions. Don't tag that on all christians simply because a few denominations re-marry people like its nothing.

Getting an annulment costs a couple hundred bucks.
Adulterers rarely face discrimination in the church and face none in secular life.

 

[wanderingone]

, and my wife constantly worries about their health and wellbeing.

Why, do they have medical problems?

My cousin has been with the same guy for a couple decades -- his sleeping with a man has no impact on his health and well being. A friend of mine at work has been with the same man for about 15 years ... maybe more.. I'm terrible at the anniversary thing. They're as healthy as any other middle aged white guy with upper middle class incomes and insurance who take generally good care of their health.

Should we even address how lesbians have even less to worry about when it comes to their health than most of us "straight" people.

 

[HaloHope]

Should we even address how lesbians have even less to worry about when it comes to their health than most of us "straight" people.

Of course we shouldn't! That would.. completely debunk the whole "being gay is a risk to your health argument! Don't you know that anal-sex is the only thing crossing the minds of the people opposed to same-sex relationships?

 

[WhatThe]

Of course we shouldn't! That would.. completely debunk the whole "being gay is a risk to your health argument! Don't you know that anal-sex is the only thing crossing the minds of the people opposed to same-sex relationships?

Lol it's so true! So many people get up on their soap box and start yelling "Gay is WRONG! Gay is EVIL!.....oh, but lesbians are ok."

 

[BigBadWlf]

Seeker, I think what you need to realize is that telling someone homosexuality is a sin is not condemning them. If my friend was doing cocaine he would obviously still be my friend, but I wouldn't justify his using of cocaine. I know a few gay people, and I treat them like people, but I don't justify their sleeping with men, and my wife constantly worries about their health and wellbeing.

So you claim but here you treat minorities with hatred and contempt.

 

[seeker777]

Seeker, I think what you need to realize is that telling someone homosexuality is a sin is not condemning them. If my friend was doing cocaine he would obviously still be my friend, but I wouldn't justify his using of cocaine. I know a few gay people, and I treat them like people, but I don't justify their sleeping with men, and my wife constantly worries about their health and wellbeing.

That's the whole point....they are people and deserve to be treated as such, regardless of their same sex attraction.

Why can't two lesbians or two homosexuals commit to each other in a monogamous relationship without having complete strangers telling them that they are evil sinners?

Your wife is putting to much pressure on her self by worrying about the health and safety of homosexuals.

 

[LittleNipper]

Getting an annulment costs a couple hundred bucks.
Adulterers rarely face discrimination in the church and face none in secular life.

An adulterer could never be a minister and likely not a deacon in the church I attend. I know of an instance where a choir director was asked to resign and leave, because he was divorcing his wife. Don't kid yourself. There are reprocussions. A person who molested a child would NEVER even be allowed to work in the church nursery, knowingly.

 

[cantata]

two lesbians or two homosexuals

Dude, lesbians are homosexuals.

 

[TheManeki]

An adulterer could never be a minister and likely not a deacon in the church I attend. I know of an instance where a choir director was asked to resign and leave, because he was divorcing his wife. Don't kid yourself. There are reprocussions.

And yet, there would be no repercussions in their civil life outside church. They would still have civil equality, unlike most homosexuals currently. This is where the double standard lies.

 

[Aeris]

Seeker, I think what you need to realize is that telling someone homosexuality is a sin is not condemning them. If my friend was doing cocaine he would obviously still be my friend, but I wouldn't justify his using of cocaine. I know a few gay people, and I treat them like people, but I don't justify their sleeping with men, and my wife constantly worries about their health and wellbeing.

The problem with this comparision is anybody, no matter what their religious beliefs, can easily see the problem with cocaine use, can easily see that you would be trying to help the person by trying to stop their cocaine use. What is the problem with homosexuality? How would you be helping them by stopping them from being homosexual? The only "consequences" are religious ones that cannot be proven to even exist. You dont need to justify what they are doing, if it was wrong it would be for them to justify not you. Why does your wife worry so much about them?

 

[HannahBanana]

An adulterer could never be a minister and likely not a deacon in the church I attend. I know of an instance where a choir director was asked to resign and leave, because he was divorcing his wife. Don't kid yourself. There are reprocussions. A person who molested a child would NEVER even be allowed to work in the church nursery, knowingly.

So you're saying that God doesn't forgive adulterers of their sins, as long as they don't commit adultery again? Have you ever even read the Bible?

 

[wanderingone]

An adulterer could never be a minister and likely not a deacon in the church I attend. I know of an instance where a choir director was asked to resign and leave, because he was divorcing his wife. Don't kid yourself. There are reprocussions. A person who molested a child would NEVER even be allowed to work in the church nursery, knowingly.

That's fine but the adulterer can freely marry in a civil ceremony provided he or she is not homosexual. The homosexual individual cannot marry even in a legal ceremony in 48 states nor can their marriage be federally recognized. I take no issue with the church deciding who can and cannot marry in their church, I take issue with the church attempting to stop the legalization of same sex marriage. The church does nothing to stop the legal remarriage of adulterers, why stop the legal marriage of same sex couples? The point I was making originally is that adulterers have no need to demand equal civil rights by "flaunting" their affairs in the street, no fault divorce has insured not only that they are free to remarry with no legal restrictions once the divorce is final, but that there is also no need for knock down drag em out prove what I did and didn't do in the courthouse during the divorce. There are no legal restrictions on the adulterer as a result of their choosing not to be monogamous. The homosexual couple that wants to get married is asking to be ALLOWED to make a legal vow to each other. The adulterer has already proven they can't keep the vow and still they are allowed to legally marry.

 

[Maren]

The Catholic and Orthodox don't support remarriage, and getting an annulment is only under extreme conditions. Don't tag that on all christians simply because a few denominations re-marry people like its nothing.

But there are still Catholic and Orthodox that do remarry, even if it without the permission of the church. Though that is ignoring there are processes for people to get there marriages "annulled", even in cases where the couple has been married for a number of years, so in truth Catholics do remarry people.

And as has been previously pointed out, why is there such a push to deny homosexuals legal rights but not a similar push against adulterers and those that wish to remarry? Seems like a double standard.

 

[seeker777]

But there are still Catholic and Orthodox that do remarry, even if it without the permission of the church. Though that is ignoring there are processes for people to get there marriages "annulled", even in cases where the couple has been married for a number of years, so in truth Catholics do remarry people.

And as has been previously pointed out, why is there such a push to deny homosexuals legal rights but not a similar push against adulterers and those that wish to remarry? Seems like a double standard.

It is a double standard....historically ( and still today, especially outside of North America) homosexuals have been vilified and condemned for their same sex attraction....there is a vocal minority that is holding on to the past and still wants to see the rights of homosexuals withheld...that's how I see it.

There is an article in the Globe and Mail today ( globeandmail.com) in which it outlines how homosexuals are still beaten to death in the streets of Jamaica.

I don't think the vocal Christians on these boards that condemn homosexuality so viciously can even comprehend the fear that Gay people live daily all over the world....all because they were born with a same sex attraction?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080623.wlhannon23/BNStory/lifeMain/home

 

[wanderingone]

It is a double standard....historically ( and still today, especially outside of North America) homosexuals have been vilified and condemned for their same sex attraction....there is a vocal minority that is holding on to the past and still wants to see the rights of homosexuals withheld...that's how I see it.

There is an article in the Globe and Mail today ( globeandmail.com) in which it outlines how homosexuals are still beaten to death in the streets of Jamaica.

I don't think the vocal Christians on these boards that condemn homosexuality so viciously can even comprehend the fear that Gay people live daily all over the world....all because they were born with a same sex attraction?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080623.wlhannon23/BNStory/lifeMain/home

Honestly while I believe most people on these boards would not openly support violence against people who are gay I'm afraid most people do not view these assaults as anything more than your usual muggings. Many people on CF are vocally opposed to "hate" crime legislation of any kind.

I also suspect that many people react to attacks on gay men and women in the same way many people in the past reacted to attacks on my husband and myself -- "what do you expect when you put it out there?" As if people are responsible for being victims just by being themselves. If only they would stay in the closet they wouldn't have anything to fear right?

 

[wanderingone]

But there are still Catholic and Orthodox that do remarry, even if it without the permission of the church. Though that is ignoring there are processes for people to get there marriages "annulled", even in cases where the couple has been married for a number of years, so in truth Catholics do remarry people.

Exactly. My sister was not raised Catholic, and was not Catholic when she planned to marry my brother in law, she was already enrolled in RCIA classes and planned to become Catholic and raise any children in the church. The priest informed them they could marry, but only if she got her first marriage (to a Jewish man) annulled. My sister volunteered that while she was sorry she had married the man there had been no false promises made, that while he turned out to be a dud she had really known that on marrying him. She also didn't understand why the church should annul a marriage it had not performed. The priest told her exactly what she needed to say and indicated the cost of the process. My sister and brother in law considered this and decided that this notion of paying for the privilige to ignore a church teaching was not agreeable to them and she stopped going to RCIA, he left the church and they returned to the church we were raised in.

I cannot for the life of me figure out how this annullment process is somehow less damaging to marriage than a same sex marriage performed outside of the churches opposed to it.

 

[Big Empty Circle]

It is a double standard....historically ( and still today, especially outside of North America) homosexuals have been vilified and condemned for their same sex attraction....there is a vocal minority that is holding on to the past and still wants to see the rights of homosexuals withheld...that's how I see it.

There is an article in the Globe and Mail today ( globeandmail.com) in which it outlines how homosexuals are still beaten to death in the streets of Jamaica.

I don't think the vocal Christians on these boards that condemn homosexuality so viciously can even comprehend the fear that Gay people live daily all over the world....all because they were born with a same sex attraction?

I have heard that Jamaica is about the most dangerous place in the world for queer people. You can even hear it in a lot of dancehall reggae and caribbean hip-hop, which music I happen to enjoy regardless... artists singing about lynching lesbians and "batty boys."

It's a lot of places, though... In Zimbabwe homosexual acts carry a death sentence. In South Africa gay marriage is legal but people still get stoned to death by mobs for being gay. For a while there was a video up on YouTube of a man in Iran, tied up and being beaten with a rod in front of a crowd of spectators for the crime of being gay. And I read a case about a lesbian woman in Colombia who was working on some of the first major gay rights activism in that country... until one day she came home and found that paramilitaries had broken into her house, threatened her children (and cut one young son across the face with a knife) and told her kids to tell her that they were going to come back and rape her. She had to flee and apply for refugee status in the States. I don't think that in their hearts most heterosexists, at least not most Christian ones, want this kind of society that so brutally punishes innocent gay people... I think they don't realize that this is the logical product of trying to eliminate homosexuality from society as many of them vocally would like to do. Perhaps fooled by the myth of "ex-gays" who have "recovered with God's help," people just don't realize that exterminating homosexuality means exterminating homosexuals.

Whether you're straight or queer, think of this the next time you put your arms around your lover and nestle against his/her shoulder: what if people wanted to (and easily could) break down my door, arrest, torture, and kill me... for this?

Sadly, it hasn't always been this way. Chalk it up to Euro-Christian imperialism and resultant cultural hegemony... I can't post the link for my low post count, but anyone can do a Google Scholar search for "The Evolution of Human Homosexual Behavior" by Kirkpatrick and see that many non-Western societies were openly accepting of same-sex love and relationships before European colonists came along. Ironic that now Europe and the US are generally the safest places for queer people.

 

[seeker777]

... I think they don't realize that this is the logical product of trying to eliminate homosexuality from society as many of them vocally would like to do. Perhaps fooled by the myth of "ex-gays" who have "recovered with God's help," people just don't realize that exterminating homosexuality means exterminating homosexuals.

I agree....the vocalization about abomination and sinfulness of homosexuality, only fuels the fires of hatred....perhaps an unintended consequence, but a consequence all the same.