My TE Challenge

[variant]

Have a good day --- we're done.

Offended?

It's true. The Bible is a collection of stories written down by ancient goat herding societies. It is this book that informs you on the nature of the divine.

Do you find the truth offensive?

 

[Vene]

Yes --- you have scientific evidence confirming scientific theories --- circular logic.

Oh, now I get it. By adding the phrase "scientific" before every word you make it circular.

 

[Nathan Poe]

For me, it came as a flash of insight --- an epiphany.

So, you got an idea.

I don't --- but whether God gave it to me directly, or He jarred something loose in my cognition --- either way, He gets the credit.

Unless you're wrong -- in which case you have only yourself to blame.

Yes --- as the old saying goes ---

• Luck favors the learned.

But I don't attribute this to luck --- I attribute it to God.

And I don't see where "the learned" factors into it either.

Interesting quote: Except for the front half and the back half, it fits perfectly.

 

[BrainHertz]

Yes --- you have scientific evidence confirming scientific theories --- circular logic.

You keep using that phrase. I do not think it means what you think it means.

 

[BrainHertz]

Then why is science wrong all the time?


Phlogiston, air has mass, overpopulation, spontaneous generation, etc. --- all bogus.

Wait, "air has mass"?

 

[Vene]

Wait, "air has mass"?

You didn't know that? It's made (mostly) of nitrogen molecules which most definitely have mass and weight.

 

[MasterOfKrikkit]

You didn't know that? It's made (mostly) of nitrogen molecules which most definitely have mass and weight.

So why is AV listing it in the "science is wrong" list? (is BrainHertz's point, I assume). The obvious answer, of course, is that AV knows less about science than does the slightly funky cabbage in the bottom of my fridge.

 

[AV1611VET]

You didn't know that? It's made (mostly) of nitrogen molecules which most definitely have mass and weight.

I meant "no mass".

 

[MasterOfKrikkit]

Indeed I am --- and I sure don't need to repost to do that --- just ask around, newbie.

0) I was asking to be clear, so as not to misrepresent your position. Sorry I behaved properly.

1) I didn't ask you to repost it. Stop being pointlessly argumentative.

2) Just posting 300 times a day doesn't make someone right. Stop being patronizing.

3) Most importantly... So the Bible, which is inerrant and would therefore not contradict itself, of course, defines "fool" to be equivalent to "atheist". OK, then please explain the following:

A) Proverbs 12:15. I know atheists who have harkened unto counsel. That makes them wise, which is antithetical to being foolish.
B) Proverbs 8:5 and 9:13. Why did the AV translators use the word fool here? It's clearly (remember the Hebrew forms?) a reinforcement/synonym of the word "simple", not "atheist".
C) (My personal favorite) Job 1:22 and Psalm 74:22. I'll let you work those out on your own.

Edit to Add: Forgot to mention the other, and rather obvious, point: why did the AV translators use the word "fool", which has other connotations beyond "atheism" if the word is, in fact, equivalent to atheist?

 

[MasterOfKrikkit]

I meant "no mass".

So you're admitting that you can be wrong, but can correct yourself, and that's ok...?

 

[BrainHertz]

I meant "no mass".

Ah, ok. Thanks for clearing that up.

Anyhow, who thought air had no mass, and why? More importantly, what caused this view to change?

 

[AV1611VET]

Anyhow, who thought air had no mass, and why? More importantly, what caused this view to change?

Aristotle.

 

[MasterOfKrikkit]

Aristotle.

More importantly, what caused this view to change? (requoting BH)

 

[AV1611VET]

More importantly, what caused this view to change? (requoting BH)

I would say the discovery that air had mass --- wouldn't you?

 

[BrainHertz]

Aristotle.

What did Aristotle think mass was?

Oh, and the important part?

Edit: didn't see your reply. So how was air determined to have mass, and when?

 

[AV1611VET]

What did Aristotle think mass was?

Oh, and the important part?

Edit: didn't see your reply. So how was air determined to have mass, and when?

What is this, science class?

If I remember right (which is just fancy talk for "here comes a wrong answer"), wasn't it that guy that developed the concept of moles or something that determined that?

All this science stuff makes me nauseous.

 

[BrainHertz]

What is this, science class?

If I remember right (which is just fancy talk for "here comes a wrong answer"), wasn't it that guy that developed the concept of moles or something that determined that?

All this science stuff makes me nauseous.

I think you're missing the point of what I'm saying.

The point is that the way science works is by continual refinement of what we think we know in the light of a continuing accumulation of evidence. Some evidence reinforces accepted theory. Some evidence causes accepted theory to be revisited or replaced with a new theory which better explains the totality of evidence. That's just how it works and it appears to work rather well.


(PS Aside; my reason for asking about Aristotle was that AFAIK the concept of mass didn't exist at that time.)

 

[MasterOfKrikkit]

I would say the discovery that air had mass --- wouldn't you?

Yes. That's how science works: it corrects its mistakes (just like you did above). Neat, huh? Now do you have an actual point?

 

[MasterOfKrikkit]

All this science stuff makes me nauseous.

He said, using a computer. How ironic.

But OK, let's get back to biblical exegesis. I gave you some questions from your own field of expertise. You should have no problem explaining the contradictions.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yes. That's how science works: it corrects its mistakes (just like you did above). Neat, huh? Now do you have an actual point?

Now hold on a second. Correcting a typo is one thing, but as I understand it, Aristotle's "mistake" of defining reality as consisting of earth, air, fire, and water stunted the growth of science for 2000 years. It took other scientists to look Aristotle in the eye (I know, he was long gone) and say, "[Your] Science can take a hike," before science moved on.

I don't mind today's science pwning yesterday's, and tomorrow's science pwning today's; but when science sticks it paradigms into the realm of the divine and says, "Didn't happen" --- that's where God's people need to step in and put "science" in its place.

You want to know why the Tower of Babel incident took place? In my opinion, science was developing too fast for mankind, and God stepped in and shot it in the foot.