HPV Vaccine

[3girls2dogs]

None of my girls will be getting it.

 

[Robinsegg]

I'll offer it to Elsa. HPV doesn't only come with sexual activity, and you as an adult in marrige can't keep your sexual partner faithful. I think people make this out to be too much about morals and not enough about health. I'll likely just present it as a vaccination to prevent some types of cancer and leave it at that without bringing morals into it.

For me, there just hasn't been enough research done . . .
R

 

[3girls2dogs]

For me, there just hasn't been enough research done . . .
R

That's my reasoning as well.

 

[Meshavrischika]

For me, there just hasn't been enough research done . . .
R

see, that's a valid reason. i just hate when people make it a moral thing when it doesn't have to be

 

[seamonster]

HPV doesn't only come with sexual activity

Yeah, it does. You don't have to have intercourse, but there has to be some sort of sexual touching or sharing of toys.

HPV is transmitted through sexual skin-to-skin contact from an infected partner. No penetration is required to contract HPV. HPV can be transmitted through:

• vaginal intercourse
• anal intercourse
• oral sex
• touching your infected partner's genitals and then your own
• sharing sex toys with an infected person without disinfecting first
• genital-to-genital contact (same or opposite sex)

• http://cancer.about.com/od/hpv/f/HPVtoiletseat.htm

 

[Meshavrischika]

Yeah, it does. You don't have to have intercourse, but there has to be some sort of sexual touching or sharing of toys.

• http://cancer.about.com/od/hpv/f/HPVtoiletseat.htm

you can also get it from unsterilized (not properly sterilized) surgical and office equipment and other not so common methods. It's not a moral issue. It's a health issue and should be examined as such.

 

[TexasSky]

Gardasil, from the Merck website:

VERY IMPORANT YOU TELL YOUR Health Care Professional if you or your child:
had an allergic reaction to the vaccine or its components.
Has a bleeding disorder.
Cannot receive injections in the arm.
Has a weakened immune system.
Is pregnant or planing to get pregnant.
Has any illness with a fever of more than 100 F or 37.8 C.
Take or plans to take any medicines, even those you can buy over the counter.

Common side effects:
pain, sweeling, itching, redness at injection site.
fever
nausea
dizziness
vomiting
fainting.

Allergic reactions include:
Difficulty breathing
Wheezing (bronchospasm)
Hives
Rash.
"Some of these reactions have been severe."

Additional side affects reported include:
Swollen glands (neck, armpit, or groin)
Guillain-Barre' Symdrome! (This is DANGEROUS!!!)
Headache
Joint pain
Aching Muscles
Unusual tiredness or weakness
Generally feeling unwell.

Ingredients of Gardasil:
Purified inactive proteins the come from HPV Types 6, 11, 16 and 18
Amorphous aluminum hydroxyphosphate sulfate
Sodium chloride
L-histidine
Polysorbate 80
Sodium borate
Water


From the National Institute of Health:


Guillain-Barre Syndrome is a disorder in which the body's immune system attacks part of the peripheral nervous sytem. The first symptoms of the disorder include varying degrees of weakness or tingling sensations in the legs. In many cases the weakness and abnormal sensations spread to the arm and upper body. These symptoms can increase in intensity until the muscles cannot be used at all and the patient is almost totally paralyzed. In these cases, the disorder is life-threatening and is considered a medical emergency. The patient is often put on a respirator to assist with breathing.

From me:

Now, what this article doesn't tell you about GBS, is that it acts just like polio acts. That patients who recover can suffer from the end results of it for the rest of their life. My sister had it. She had respirators, and wheelchairs and braces and back surgery, and still limps. Because the disease hit when she was in her growth stage, it was much, much more serious than it is when it hits an adult.

A dear family friend ended up with it a few years ago. He was paralyzed from the neck down for 2 full years!

 

[TexasSky]

According to the US Census there are 143.4 Million Women in the United States.

According to the Center for Disease Control, 11,070 women in the US will be diagnoses with cervical cancer this year.

I grant you, 11,000 is a lot, but - - - it is a very small percentage of the entire female population.

Compare this to the fact that 186,772 women in the US are expected to be diagnosed with breast cancer.

Or that 330,509 women in the US are exptected to die due to heart disease.

Another 91,272 of cerebrovascular disease.

Another 68,431 of lung cancer.

Another 63,341 of respiratory disease.

Of the 186,772 diagnosed with breast cancer, they estimate that 40,954 will die from it.

So, statistically, HPV related cancer is LOW on the list.

 

[Meshavrischika]

that's true... but if you're not at risk for complications, and you want to protect yourself whether it is low on the list or not it's still cancer...

 

[Robinsegg]

I may be totally off-base here . . . but isn't HPV only *one* way to get cervical cancer? And aren't there plenty of strains of HPV that *won't* be included in this vaccine . . . which *could* just as easily start causing cervical cancer?

Wouldn't it behoove us much *much* more to teach our kids of *both* genders proper hygiene and health procedures instead of medicating them? At least until they're old enough to decide for themselves if they wanna take the risk? Or until there's been more research done?

R

 

[TexasSky]

that's true... but if you're not at risk for complications, and you want to protect yourself whether it is low on the list or not it's still cancer...

Many people have no idea that they are at risk though.

If you have allergies, you have a weakened immune system.
Mono can give you one.
Strep, untreated, can give you one.
Diabetes can.
Not getting enough sleep can weaken it.
Not eating properly can weaken it.
Being overweight can weaken it.

They have not said, "impaired" immune system. They have said "weakened".

And honestly, I don't think cancer is any worse than Guillian Barre. I've seen both, up close and personal.

 

[TexasSky]

I may be totally off-base here . . . but isn't HPV only *one* way to get cervical cancer? And aren't there plenty of strains of HPV that *won't* be included in this vaccine . . . which *could* just as easily start causing cervical cancer?

Wouldn't it behoove us much *much* more to teach our kids of *both* genders proper hygiene and health procedures instead of medicating them? At least until they're old enough to decide for themselves if they wanna take the risk? Or until there's been more research done?

R

You aren't off base.
Gardasil "may" help with HPV 16 and 18.
30% of all cervical cancer is caused by strains of HPV that the vaccine cannot protect against.

10% of gential warts are from other strains.

The vaccine has been tested on 11,000 females world-wide. JUST 11,000 women worldwide.

Women who get the vaccine still need to do pap smears and cervical screenings.

 

[faithmom]

The first thought that comes to my mind is was the test of 11,000 women a double blind placebo controlled study...in other words, did they know what they were getting and what it could do, and did it offer a placebo to compare by?

I am picky about how tests are run, and that stated results include the parameters.

Here is the reason why. The moment you tell a woman that sexual contact can increase the possibility of contracting a type of HPV genital wart that can lead to cancer, she is immediately educated on sexual disease.

So, if you give her the vaccine, is she also, simultaneously going to begin making better judgements and choices just by the information alone? Probably if she was never aware of that risk before.

In which case, your rate of effectiveness is scewed by the posetive effect of education, she becomes more careful in behavior along with the vaccine in her body.

If it was a double bind placebo controlled study (where the subject is given no information, just provided with the vaccine/while others are given a fake vaccine, and subjected to tests), the results are far more accurate, but sadly much more unethical.

Just a thought about some of the stats we are seeing.

(this is what I meant earlier, that when a company quotes research, you often don't know all of the parameters of the study(ies), and how valid the conclusions are.)

 

[TexasSky]

that's true... but if you're not at risk for complications, and you want to protect yourself whether it is low on the list or not it's still cancer...

I don't trust it.
That's the bottom line.
And if I did trust it, it would be fine for me to risk my body, my life, my reproductive capabilities to give it a chance, but it is NOT okay for my to play Russian Roulette with my child's life.

When my mother was diagnosed with cancer they were so thrilled! They had this amazing new Chemo-Therapy that they were almost POSITIVE would cure her. It was made using estrogen, and her cancer was estrogen based, and they realized their mistake about 2 weeks before she died, and they called and said, "We're so very sorry!" They couldn't figure out why it had spread of fast when she went from radiation to chemo, and then they found out, they GOOFED.

After that, my doctors wouldn't let me touch estrogen. A few doctors, over time, would go, "Oh, the pill is safe. Don't worry." But even then, most of my own doctors would go, "I'd rather not play with your estrogen levels." Around me, women were popping estrogen like kids pop pez. Have an unpleasant period? Get on estrogen! Going throught menopause? Have some estrogen! Have a hysterectomy? We have the solution. Have a little estrogen!"

And this year, this year, the big "oopps" message went out to women. "Get off estrogen! Throw it out! Do NOT use it!"

When I was a child, they thought they had a great idea to prevent premature labor. Simple little shot they could give women. They were happy as little larks until woman, after woman, after woman born to those mothers found out she couldn't have healthy children. Then they went back and went "Ooops".

Anyone remember "Phen-Fen"? Wonderful little diet miracle that just happened to cause heart attacks. OPPS!

How about Trasylol? Trasylol is a drug that was used to to prevent bleeding, by causing clotting, during heart surgery. Unfortuantely, it caused kidney disease, heart and brain damage, and increased the risk of in-hospital death.

Ever hear of Lotronex? It was supposed to help with irritable bowel syndrome. Then they figured out it was causing ischemic colitis, and actually killing patients.

Ever hear of Zelnorm? Commonly called Tegaserod? It was a serotonin 5-HT4 receptor, also used to bowel problems. Unfortuately it was causing heart attacks, angina, and strokes.

Remember Paxil and the way it was supposed to help with mood disorders? And turned out to be causing kids to commit suicide?

Effexor was the one that ruined my life. After his accident they put my husband on it. After his paranoid schizophrenia and delusions someone realized, the majority of his insanity was an allergic reaction to Effexor.

 

[Meshavrischika]

I may be totally off-base here . . . but isn't HPV only *one* way to get cervical cancer? And aren't there plenty of strains of HPV that *won't* be included in this vaccine . . . which *could* just as easily start causing cervical cancer?

Wouldn't it behoove us much *much* more to teach our kids of *both* genders proper hygiene and health procedures instead of medicating them? At least until they're old enough to decide for themselves if they wanna take the risk? Or until there's been more research done?

R

right you are.

 

[Meshavrischika]

Many people have no idea that they are at risk though.

If you have allergies, you have a weakened immune system.
Mono can give you one.
Strep, untreated, can give you one.
Diabetes can.
Not getting enough sleep can weaken it.
Not eating properly can weaken it.
Being overweight can weaken it.

They have not said, "impaired" immune system. They have said "weakened".

And honestly, I don't think cancer is any worse than Guillian Barre. I've seen both, up close and personal.

I think it all depends on who has which (GBS or cancer)

 

[Meshavrischika]

I don't trust it.
That's the bottom line.
And if I did trust it, it would be fine for me to risk my body, my life, my reproductive capabilities to give it a chance, but it is NOT okay for my to play Russian Roulette with my child's life.

When my mother was diagnosed with cancer they were so thrilled! They had this amazing new Chemo-Therapy that they were almost POSITIVE would cure her. It was made using estrogen, and her cancer was estrogen based, and they realized their mistake about 2 weeks before she died, and they called and said, "We're so very sorry!" They couldn't figure out why it had spread of fast when she went from radiation to chemo, and then they found out, they GOOFED.

After that, my doctors wouldn't let me touch estrogen. A few doctors, over time, would go, "Oh, the pill is safe. Don't worry." But even then, most of my own doctors would go, "I'd rather not play with your estrogen levels." Around me, women were popping estrogen like kids pop pez. Have an unpleasant period? Get on estrogen! Going throught menopause? Have some estrogen! Have a hysterectomy? We have the solution. Have a little estrogen!"

And this year, this year, the big "oopps" message went out to women. "Get off estrogen! Throw it out! Do NOT use it!"

When I was a child, they thought they had a great idea to prevent premature labor. Simple little shot they could give women. They were happy as little larks until woman, after woman, after woman born to those mothers found out she couldn't have healthy children. Then they went back and went "Ooops".

Anyone remember "Phen-Fen"? Wonderful little diet miracle that just happened to cause heart attacks. OPPS!

How about Trasylol? Trasylol is a drug that was used to to prevent bleeding, by causing clotting, during heart surgery. Unfortuantely, it caused kidney disease, heart and brain damage, and increased the risk of in-hospital death.

Ever hear of Lotronex? It was supposed to help with irritable bowel syndrome. Then they figured out it was causing ischemic colitis, and actually killing patients.

Ever hear of Zelnorm? Commonly called Tegaserod? It was a serotonin 5-HT4 receptor, also used to bowel problems. Unfortuately it was causing heart attacks, angina, and strokes.

Remember Paxil and the way it was supposed to help with mood disorders? And turned out to be causing kids to commit suicide?

Effexor was the one that ruined my life. After his accident they put my husband on it. After his paranoid schizophrenia and delusions someone realized, the majority of his insanity was an allergic reaction to Effexor.

I appreciate all that and I never advocated forcing it on anyone. I was just saying that if you know the risks and accept them this is a viable option.

 

[HOPEOF9]

My daughter (13 1/2 yrs) won't be getting the HPV vaccine.

 

[lin1235]

We did the compulsory (in South Africa) vaccines and one non-compulsory but that one was only before I was informed enough about vaccines. I will not be doing any non-compulsory vaccines from here onward, and I'm delaying the MMR vaccine (and thinking of finding a way to avoid it totally).

So given that I'm not vaccinating for things that my daughter could be exposed to accidentally, it probably goes without saying that I won't vaccinate for something that she can most likely avoid through healthy and moral sexual choices.

 

[BananaCake]

I'm lucky that I have another 10 years before it would be time for my daughter to get this vaccine.... so maybe they will perfect it, or maybe they will trash it, or best yet maybe my daughter won't need it because she chooses monogamy with another man who has chosen the same.

Amen