I support Israel[open]

[ChavaK]

Now, I never said I do not have a Rabbi but would like to point out that I do not need a Rabbi to help me follow Gods Law, I do not need someone elses interpretation of how to follow His Law when I can read it and understand it myself.

But what happens when people read and interpret
Torah in their own way....you run the risk of
having no consistency in belief or practice, or
people misinterpreting. How would you decide
things like what is a mezuzah, how to make
tzizit, etc? If you read and interpret on your
own, how would you come to a conclusion
of how to enact the mitzvot? Of does
everyone just decide for themselves?

chava

 

[Tishri1]

this is a very painful thread as well, can we stop the harsh judgements of our brothers and sisters now, and just walk in love


no mod hat here just me saying this please can we just love each other

 

[ChazakEmunah]

That's why I opened the other thread Tishri1. People can discuss and debate these issues there. But there has been very little discussion there. Oh well... The opportunity is there.

 

[ChavaK]

this is a very painful thread as well, can we stop the harsh judgements of our brothers and sisters now, and just walk in love


no mod hat here just me saying this please can we just love each other

Hi Tish, I have to respectfuly disagree...I don't think
the discussion of differences of view, beliefs and
observances are harsh judgements of others...
they are simply viewpoints of discussion. Actually
I find those who can discuss such issues in a
civilitzed manner much closer in heart than not...
because I really only care about the opinions/beliefs of the
people I care about...
does that make any sense?

 

[Bubbi]

Is it taking on "new" traditions or connecting with the roots of our faith? Gentile believers as adopted sons and daughters grafted in?

Many Christians have found main stream churches commited to replacement theology and feel this to be wrong teaching and have moved on in search of truth.

I cant speak to everyones intent but my support for Israel is from a deep love for her and her people.
Not traditions--the early church had this debate regarding gentile believers needing to participate in certain laws specific to the Hebrews.

Now 2000 plus years later there are those (Christians) who have fully embrassed what they deem a closer walk by participating in what they see as Gods commands.

I cant speak to that as I go to a full Gospel Church that at one time was rather silent but now have begun to recognize the importance of understanding the Jewish roots of their faith but in less overt ways.

I suppose it it is a matter of degrees but I have yet to meet anyone that is expressing their support for Israel for "show".

Support for Israel is more than wearing a ribbon or garments. Tangable support is much welcomed and needed.
Going to Israel is yet another way.

Is my wearing of a Star of David along with a cross an offense? My observant Jewish friends find it curious but not offensive. I wear this peice of jewlry is as a witness and an expression of my love for Israel and Yeshua.

Only God knows the heart and I get far more questions from Christians who have the wrong notion that Israel doesnt matter. This is an opening to point out Biblical truths they are not being taught.

I only know this--the history of Judaism and Christianity is not a good one and today it is essentual for Christians who want to bless Israel and her people to be gentle, loving and follow the spirit of freedom found in Yeshua.

The early Christian church distanced themselves from their messianic brothers and sisters and it was wrong. Out of that has come wrong teaching and even a nod to their pagen roots.

Now we see what I call an awakening of sorts--perhaps a bit over zealous in some cases but the alternative is not something the world can indulge anymore.

Just my opinion and please forgive me if I have misunderstood this thread.
Bubbi

 

[Henaynei]

I think the issue of "offense" is an individual one.

Personally, I, as a gentile, have been *given* a Magen Dovid and a Menorah, by Jews, *to wear* because of my connection and support of Israel...

There are Christians "offended" by someone wearing a Cross .... it is largely individual perception and the respect and honor with which the symbol is worn - in my experience....

 

[Ivy]

My Magen David necklaces and menorah were gifts, too, that a dear Jewish believer in my congregation gave me, and I like her to know that I appreciate the honor of receiving them.

 

[WildHeart75]

But what happens when people read and interpret
Torah in their own way....you run the risk of
having no consistency in belief or practice, or
people misinterpreting. How would you decide
things like what is a mezuzah, how to make
tzizit, etc? If you read and interpret on your
own, how would you come to a conclusion
of how to enact the mitzvot? Of does
everyone just decide for themselves?

chava

Allowing someone else to tell you what to believe and how to think is nonsense. A Rabbi or 'pastor' is just someone else giving you their interpretation of what is written, Yahweh gave me a brain so I can think, read and research those things myself. I will not follow someone elses teachings just because they hold the title of Rabbi, I believe there is scripture about the blind following the blind

 

[Henaynei]

Allowing someone else to tell you what to believe and how to think is nonsense. A Rabbi or 'pastor' is just someone else giving you their interpretation of what is written, Yahweh gave me a brain so I can think, read and research those things myself. I will not follow someone else's teachings just because they hold the title of Rabbi, I believe there is scripture about the blind following the blind

That is why Christianity has some 3000 denominations, each with their own "right" interpretation of scripture, and Judaism, some 3 times older, historically more traumatized and fragmented (pogrom, dispersions) than Christianity, has only 5.

And calling "blind" ("I will not follow someone else's teachings just because they hold the title of Rabbi, I believe there is scripture about the blind following the blind") those learned men over the last nearly 6000 years who have earnestly studied scripture and sought the face of HaShem is not the usual evidence of wisdom and grace.

b'Shalom
Henaynei

 

[WildHeart75]

That is why Christianity has some 3000 denominations, each with their own "right" interpretation of scripture, and Judaism, some 3 times older, historically more traumatized and fragmented (pogrom, dispersions) than Christianity, has only 5.

And calling "blind" ("I will not follow someone else's teachings just because they hold the title of Rabbi, I believe there is scripture about the blind following the blind") those learned men over the last nearly 6000 years who have earnestly studied scripture and sought the face of HaShem is not the usual evidence of wisdom and grace.

b'Shalom
Henaynei

I didn't call everyone who has earnestly studied scripture for the last 6,000 years blind. You are trying to twist my words here, what I was saying with that reference is that just because some have earnestly studied the word does not mean I should follow their same beliefs and practices. I am sure many would would agree that there are alot 'pastors' or Rabbi's that have earnestly studied the word but have really taken some things out of context or try to twist some meanings to better suit their needs and beliefs. Like I stated before having the title doesn't mean you know what you are talking about. I am not going to follow every single person who has earnestly studied the Word when I can earnestly study the Word myself.

 

[ChavaK]

I hope you don't mind me sidetracking things for a bit...just to mention not only is it important to
support Israel, but to fight antisemitism everywhere.
Ahavas Torah, our "sister" shul in Eugene Oregon
was broken into and vandelized last Friday AM.
They destroyed the ark, damaged two Torah
scrolls (one of which belongs to my shul),
damaged siddurim, and did other acts of senseless
hatred. Fortunately they caught the three men
while they were still in the midst of their
destructive acts.
What also bothers me is I did not hear of this
on any of the media outlets...something like
this should have made the local news, but I
did not see it mentioned anywhere...

 

[stone]

I hope you don't mind me sidetracking things for a bit...just to mention not only is it important to
support Israel, but to fight antisemitism everywhere.
Ahavas Torah, our "sister" shul in Eugene Oregon
was broken into and vandelized last Friday AM.
They destroyed the ark, damaged two Torah
scrolls (one of which belongs to my shul),
damaged siddurim, and did other acts of senseless
hatred. Fortunately they caught the three men
while they were still in the midst of their
destructive acts.
What also bothers me is I did not hear of this
on any of the media outlets...something like
this should have made the local news, but I
did not see it mentioned anywhere...

that's horrible.

 

[HaReb]

Sorry to cut across that important posting, Stone. It makes you feel sick that anyone could even think of acting in that way.

We are getting increasing numbers of anti semitic incidents here and very few make the news, either local or national.

Bless you all in Y'shua's precious name.

 

[Hadassah]

I hope you don't mind me sidetracking things for a bit...just to mention not only is it important to
support Israel, but to fight antisemitism everywhere.
Ahavas Torah, our "sister" shul in Eugene Oregon
was broken into and vandelized last Friday AM.
They destroyed the ark, damaged two Torah
scrolls (one of which belongs to my shul),
damaged siddurim, and did other acts of senseless
hatred. Fortunately they caught the three men
while they were still in the midst of their
destructive acts.
What also bothers me is I did not hear of this
on any of the media outlets...something like
this should have made the local news, but I
did not see it mentioned anywhere...

Is there any way we can get it on the news? call local news agencies? Call city hall and ask what is being done about this (tell them we have a friend in the area and heard something and were upset and wanted to know who to talk to?)?

This is just senseless hatred for that to be done.

I am so sorry to hear about this!

 

[Wags]

I hope you don't mind me sidetracking things for a bit...just to mention not only is it important to
support Israel, but to fight antisemitism everywhere.
Ahavas Torah, our "sister" shul in Eugene Oregon
was broken into and vandelized last Friday AM.
They destroyed the ark, damaged two Torah
scrolls (one of which belongs to my shul),
damaged siddurim, and did other acts of senseless
hatred. Fortunately they caught the three men
while they were still in the midst of their
destructive acts.
What also bothers me is I did not hear of this
on any of the media outlets...something like
this should have made the local news, but I
did not see it mentioned anywhere...

You are right about it not making the media - I live 45 minutes away from that shul and never heard a thing about it until you posted.

 

[ChavaK]

You are right about it not making the media - I live 45 minutes away from that shul and never heard a thing about it until you posted.

We have about 150 people at shul on shabbas...and
not one of us had heard about it til our rabbi announced
it. Guess it wasn't considered news worthy enough to
report on....

 

[Yusuphhai]

Hmm. I also feel the pressure of Antisemitism in the church of China. This is a kind of Consciousness hidden in heart when it doesn't act.

But "tooth for tooth" can not solve the problem. The relationship between Messianics and Christian should develope continually, also Jewish.

 

[ChavaK]

Hmm. I also feel the pressure of Antisemitism in the church of China. This is a kind of Consciousness hidden in heart when it doesn't act.

But "tooth for tooth" can not solve the problem. The relationship between Messianics and Christian should develope continually, also Jewish.

Just as a point of clarification (because this is a
pet peeve of mine ) you are aware that
"tooth for a tooth" refers to monetary compensation,
not vengance, yes?

 

[ChazakEmunah]

Amazing! I never heard about it on the news. Funny though, even when you do it's only a quick blurb. Seems that major media doesn't want these things getting out. I've also noticed that Anti-Semitic incidents are on the rise everywhere. Seems we should all be thinking about aliyah more and more as it looks like HaShem is goading us into going home.


Shalom,
Chazak Emunah

 

[Wags]

Hubby's boss said he saw it on the Portland news a couple of days ago. Just a quick blub was all. I finally found a news story on it at TV station for the area's website. The DA's office is debating whether or not to treat this as a hate crime.

Unfotuantely its not the first time synagogues in that city have been attacked and damaged.