The "Final Authority" = the Bible

[JoshuaCh1v9]

The Bible is God’s word and forms the only basis for our faith and living.

 

[orthodoxy]

orthodoxy,

You can keep believing that the Orthodox church is the church.. it simply reveals how the Orthodox are confused as to what the church actually is, and it's too bad that you're all being taught this nonsense.. it's basically all I typically hear from Orthodox folks..

This is the same type of nonsense we hear from the RCC, the JW.. the Mormons etc etc etc.. all of them claim to be it.. while they're all oblivious to what the church actually is.. I guess that when you're lacking in the truth, ya'll need to claim Christ's church for yourself..

It's a shame really.. but it is a reality..

Day in, day out.. people claiming the same ol nonsense..

But hey.. it's what you folks do..

You can save the prognosticating platitudes of guilt. Gone down the convert them with "guilt due to ignorance" route. I used to use that one on people myself when I was a protestant. Been there, condemned others with it.

I can only hope the Lord will save me in my sin of arrogant pride planted deeply in the protestant faith I grew up with.

Good day sir.

the unworthy,

kyril

 

[ETide]

Lutherans are by far better than other protestants

You folks are too funny... and ya'll serious while you're at it..

 

[orthodoxy]

The Bible is God’s word and forms the only basis for our faith and living.

Yet the foundation is in the Apostles not a book. umm

 

[JoshuaCh1v9]

Yet the foundation is in the Apostles not a book. umm

Nope. The Foundation is in God, and in Jesus.

 

[ETide]

You can save the prognosticating platitudes of guilt.

..it's a little beyond guilt..

 

[ETide]

I can only hope the Lord will save me in my sin of arrogant pride planted deeply in the protestant faith I grew up with.

Well, now that you're in the one true church.. you can tell everyone else where to go..

Definitely a move in the right direction..

 

[orthodoxy]

Well, now that you're in the one true church.. you can tell everyone else where to go..

Definitely a move in the right direction..

You forgot the "you'll be sorry" condemation line from your prognotications.

kyril

 

[ETide]

You can tell them all your nice little stories about following the rules.. stuff like that..

 

[ETide]

..what's there to be sorry about.. YOU'RE IN THE ONE TRUE ORTHODOX CHURCH..

Now that's something to be proud of ! ! !

 

[JF5000]

Let the Bible speak for itself...

In the days of Jesus, what was the name for the Bible?
"Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?" Matthew 21:42.
What other Biblical name is given to this important book?
"And he answered and said unto them, My mother and my brethren are these which hear the word of God, and do it." Luke 8:21.
How were the Scriptures given to mankind?
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness." 2 Timothy 3:16.
By whom were the prophets of old guided as they thus spake for God?
"For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost." 2 Peter 1:21.
What specific example of this is mentioned by Peter?
"Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus." Acts 1:16.
Who was it, then, who spoke through these men?
"God, who at sundry times and divers manners spake in past unto the fathers by the prophets." Hebrews 1:1.
For what purpose were the Holy Scriptures written?
"For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope." Romans 15:4.
What are the four ways in which Scripture can help us?
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness." 2 Timothy 3:16.
What was God's plan in thus giving the Bible to us?
"That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." 2 Timothy 3:17.
How does God intend that His Word shall help us in this dark world of sin and death?
"Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path." Psalm 119:105.
What were the three divisions of Scripture in the days of Christ?
"And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me." Luke 24:44.
Upon what evidence did Jesus base the fact of His Messiahship?
"And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning Himself." Luke 24:27.
What is one of the names of God in the Bible?
"He is the Rock, His work is perfect: for all His ways are judgment: a God of truth and without iniquity, just and right is he." Deuteronomy 32:4.
What, therefore, must be the character of His Holy Word?
"Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth." John 17:17.
To what extent has God magnified His Word?
"I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified thy word above all thy name." Psalms 138:2.
What value did Job place upon the words of God?
"Neither have I gone back from the commandment of his lips; I have esteemed the words of his mouth more than my necessary food." Job 23:12.
How firm was the prophet Isaiah's faith in God's Word?
"The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever." Isaiah 40:8.

 

[a_ntv]

Let the Bible speak for itself...

In the days of Jesus, what was the name for the Bible?
"Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?" Matthew 21:42...

I'm sorry, but ALL verses you quoted are about the OT.

But we consider also the NT.

There is no reference of the NT as inspired book in the Bible

 

[Rdr Iakovos]

Let the Bible speak for itself...

But you see, that is the problem, the bible does not speak for itself. It has need of a reader, an interpreter, and a preacher.

Even the horribly misused 2 Timothy verse refers to correction, rebuke, and instruction. The bible is used to do those very things by humans- or more accurately, by humans who are reading and interpreting.

Perhaps the irony of you stating 'let the bible speak for itself' as you went on to type, choose, and interpret escaped you?
It didn't escape me.
Regards
James

 

[JoshuaCh1v9]

Perhaps if we spent a little more time FOLLOWING it and a little less time trying to INTERPRET it, then the Christian church would be in better shape than it is.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

I'm sorry, but ALL verses you quoted are about the OT.

But we consider also the NT.

There is no reference of the NT as inspired book in the Bible

I respectfully disagree...

None of the verses offered speak of the Bible at all. They speak of the Word of God, the Holy Scriptures. "OT" "NT" and "Bible" are our labels. This thread isn't about the NT Canon - which we all completely agree on, so there is zero reason to discuss that in this forum where we discuss issues where consensus is lacking.

Back to the topic?

 

[Lynn73]

Where did Jesus Christ "ordain and send" the bible into all the world to preach the gospel?

What do you think those He sent then and us also now preach and teach from? The Bible. Where is the gospel of Jesus Christ revealed to us? The Bible! Is the Bible the word of God which He holds even above His own name as He says? Yes, it is, and that makes it the final authority.

Where did Jesus Christ proclaim the scripture as the "final authroity" in a Christians life?

See above. God isn't the final authority, is that what you're saying?

How can a book that is not complete in the stories and teachings of Jesus Christ be the "final authority" in anything?

It has in it everything we need and is complete as far as God is concerned or He would have had more in it. It's sufficient for us. All the books in the world couldn't contain all Jesus said or did but God has given us all we need. I see you saying that God's word the Holy Scrpiputres are any authority in anything and I think He would disagree with that.

What makes the protestant faith think the RCC is the Church to rebel and protest against?

pondering

kyril

Well, we look at what they say is so and then we look at what the Bible, the word of God, says is so and we don't find a match.

 

[ETide]

But you see, that is the problem, the bible does not speak for itself. It has need of a reader, an interpreter, and a preacher.

So how in the world do the Orthodox interpreters come up with the claim that the Orthodox church is the church..?

How is scripture interpreted in order to make this claim.. ?

Is it the same way that the RCC does, as they claim that they're the church.. or the JWs..? or the mormons..? ..or whoever else claims that their organization is the church of God..

 

[L3g3nd]

The very fact that the Bible exists in a single collection is due to church tradition. Any number of books could have made it into the canon, after all.

The concept of sola scriptura has produced some downright dangerous ideas. Luther himself, guided by his new doctrine, would have done away with the book of James, writing in his preface to the 1522 Luther Bible that "St. James' Epistle is really an epistle of straw; for it has nothing of the nature of the Gospel about it."

The legacy of erroneous, out-of-context interpretation set forward by Luther continues to this day. Without tradition, we cannot properly understand the words of the Bible. Scripture and tradition are irrevocably intwined, and one cannot stand without the other.

 

[lilymarie]

Jesus said in Matthew 6:2-3 "when thou doest thine alms" and "when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth"

Alms are "works" above and beyond the tithe. Jesus never condemned the tithe as a matter of fact one would do well to keep them as well add good works to them.

Faith and works go together. It is not a "works vs faith" thing or a "traditions vs the bible" thing. They work together in unity.

This is a major problem in the protestant faith....everything is working against another "works vs faith" "tradition vs scripture" etc etc etc.....

kyril

There are major fables in the catholic church...It's like Mary worship, when the Bible directly states there was NO one born of man greater than John.

We are now the truest church because we are established firmly upon the truth of the word of God. We don't make up things.

Nor bow to any man, nor pray to saints when the Bible says we are all saints. I could go on and on about the false teachings of the catholic church, but most of us know already.

If the word of God says there was no one greater born of man than John, then why are catholics worshipping Mary?

And now we've got all these pedophiles in the catholic church.

It's very sad; these pedophile priests were just alive to dead works. Why didn't that eucharist work for these pedophiles?

Hey, dontcha think all that gold paving at the vatican could help a lot of poor people? I do.

I also recently read in the Bible don't worship a golden cup. Sounds like these are all empty traditions to me, made up for monies. Catholism is based on a lot of idol worship.

As far as faith and works, both go hand in hand, but we don't believe we can buy our dead relatives a stairway to heaven by indulgences to make the rich richer.

As far as all the protestants churches I've been, they are right on. No false teachings whatsoever. And, if there are changes in the church, that comes from Anglican-protestants who work much like the catholic church. This pope or leader says one thing about the Bible, the next says another. Catholism is not on very solid ground then as it constantly changes according to what the pope says, as opposed to worshipping God and trusting his word. Anglicans work a bit like that, but not really. They have a heirarchy, but not like the pope, and they have a clearer understanding of the word as far as orthodox and conservative Anglicans as opposed to liberal anglicans. As far as non-denominational, we have no authority other than God's word and his Holy Spirit inside us.

Where in scripture does it say we need anything else? Jesus said "my father's house is a house of prayer!" Right? That's what church gatherings are for.

And also people keep bringing up this "tell it to the church" thing... well, I asked what are you going to tell to the church if you don't know what the Bible says? Catholics have only recently been reading the Bible as far as I know, as where I grew up the services for catholicism were all still in Latin, and people here don't speak Latin, they speak English. My family has had catholic friends and they all say "they don't believe in reading the Bible"? But, they like to go to church to hear a service in a language they don't even understand???????????

I think the catholic church has survived on mystisms and somewhat like Islam terriorists in that they say if you leave the church you will not go to heaven and you have to wait in purgatory to be judged. What hogwash and how sad to terrorize and ensalve people like that for centuries.

 

[lilymarie]

So how in the world do the Orthodox interpreters come up with the claim that the Orthodox church is the church..?

How is scripture interpreted in order to make this claim.. ?

Is it the same way that the RCC does, as they claim that they're the church.. or the JWs..? or the mormons..? ..or whoever else claims that their organization is the church of God..

Well, according to some catholics on this forum and from what I went on to study, they believe they are the one true church because the catholic church teaches if you leave the catholic church or are not part of the RCC, you have to go to purgatory to wait for God to judge you.

That makes it more like a church based on terror and fear, and that's not what Christ intended his church to be.

This is a Gospel of good news, not enslavary.

We give our hearts to Jesus and follow his way because we love him and we believe he is the sinless lamb of God.

Oh yes, hear this, anyone not of the catholic church has to go to purgatory to await judgment for not being part of the catholic church.

Oookie dookie.

Here's the scripture about John, and this references to John the Baptist, not John the Apostle. Other scriptures can back this up, too.

(Luke 7:28 NIV) I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he."