What is time?

[Gracchus]

To recap:

Whenever we ponder Minkowski space-time we are thinking about the universe from "outside space-time". So if we can conceive of such a state, then why could not an entity (God) exist in such a state?

No, when we "ponder Minkowski space-time" we are pondering the interchangeability of space and time according to the relative motion of the observer to the observed phenomenon.
You may be overestimating your understanding of physics. See, for instance: The Dunning-Kruger Effect.

Well, not quite, but close enough. My understanding of physics is perfectly adequate thank you. (But I'm always hungry to learn more.)
I am more than happy to discuss and learn. But I'll never trade insults or make assumptions.

1. We do not think of the universe from "outside space-time". We are inside space-time and this is where we think.
2. Believing one's understanding is adequate is the hallmark of the Dunning-Kruger Effect. (Which you should Google.) Science begins with the admission of inadequate knowledge. Without that admission, there is no science. Thus: "If you think you understand quantum mechanics, you don't understand quantum mechanics." --- Richard Feynman
To learn, one must acknowledge one's own ignorance.
3. One may take a simple observation or opinion as an insult. People take insult because they are insecure. I do not offer insult, so you take it from yourself. Feeling insulted is your reaction; causing it is not my intent.
4. We all make assumptions. Some of us test them against observation and reason. Others ... not so much!

 

[Hoghead1]

I don't think that is quite what the Bible has in mind, Dysert. I view time as change, movement, something happening. I find it hard to believe God was in some inert state, absolutely motionless, doing nothing prior to creation. I think God is eternally creative. I think, then, before this universe, God chad crated another, different one, and so on, ad infinitum.

 

[greenguzzi]

Please provide an update.

http://www.astro.puc.cl/~rparra/tools/PAPERS/e_mc2.pdf

 

[Gracchus]

Einstein went to aitch when he died.

Well, be sure to give him my regards.

 

[Gracchus]

http://www.astro.puc.cl/~rparra/tools/PAPERS/e_mc2.pdf

Oh my! I read that paper years ago. It has been around even longer than I have. It's kind of famous.
What it says is that mass and energy are interchangeable. A body (mass, inertia) radiating electromagnetic will lose mass (inertia) , and a body absorbing electromagnetic energy will gain mass (inertia).The change energy (ΔE) equals (=) the change in mass (inertia) (Δm) times a constant, which happens to be the value of the speed of light squared (c^2). That is what E=mc^2 means. Perhaps you have heard of it? Or maybe you missed it?

 

[dad]

The math they use for the GPS is the same math they use for the Hubble Space telescope.

It applies here. Not in deep space unless time exists there. Prove it.

 

[dad]

I don't think that is quite what the Bible has in mind, Dysert. I view time as change, movement, something happening. I find it hard to believe God was in some inert state, absolutely motionless, doing nothing prior to creation. I think God is eternally creative. I think, then, before this universe, God chad crated another, different one, and so on, ad infinitum.

One interesting thought I had was that time could possibly exist in many universes. If this universe was just a week's work for God, one assumes there is more. If time is some form existed in all of them, then time would not be something that is unique to our created universe. Nor would it fit relativity.

 

[Gracchus]

One interesting thought I had was that time could possibly exist in many universes.

And another interesting thought is that purple might smell like Camembert cheese. If pig farts might be a language, that would also be interesting.

If this universe was just a week's work for God, one assumes there is more.

I don't think any condition is necessary to assume. All you had to say was "one assumes".

If time is some form existed in all of them, then time would not be something that is unique to our created universe.

Nor would it fit relativity.

 

[joshua 1 9]

It applies here. Not in deep space unless time exists there. Prove it.

According to Einstein's theory time is relative.

 

[dad]

And another interesting thought is....

It depends on how closely to Scripture one makes educated guesses and deductions. Since God made the world and heavens and life in six days, and there was a day before there was even a sun and moon or stars, one can deduce that time existed before all this. Elementary.
.

 

[dad]

According to Einstein's theory time is relative.

Einstein didn't know at all. He did not know the earth was here before the stars. That days were here before the sun and moon. He did not know if time as we know it exited in the universe far from earth. His theories are absolutely relegated to present state earth and area. The gravitational lensing so called, by the way is not proof of relativity existing in the universe. That is proof something bends light for some reason, we know not how big or far away anything in deep space is either unless time existed.

 

[joshua 1 9]

It applies here. Not in deep space unless time exists there. Prove it.

The Sun, Stars and Moon were given to measure time.

1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

 

[dad]

The Sun, Stars and Moon were given to measure time.

1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

Hey maybe more than that. God talked about influences from stars. Also, the verse does not say measure! For all I know the stars may have been to also regulate or determine time for us somehow. Not just mark it. Like a big clock, with cogs.
But even if all the stars were just to mark time for us (then why so many we could not see even back then?) how come they will all fall and roll up like a scroll one day and there will still be time??!!!!

 

[Oafman]

The Sun, Stars and Moon were given to measure time.

1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

If that were the case, wouldn't you expect one of Earth's orbits to be precisely 365 days, and one of Earth's rotations to be precisely 24 hours, and one lunar orbit to be precisely 1/12 of a year?

But they're all off, to varying degrees.

 

[tulipbee]

Time is the expansion of the universe. What happens when the universe stops expanding and starts reversing? What would the world be like during the reversed time?

 

[dad]

Time is the expansion of the universe. What happens when the universe stops expanding and starts reversing? What would the world be like during the reversed time?

That doesn't cut it. How about your life? Don't you realize time is involved? The expansion of the universe depend on what redshift is. Not a lot more. Redshifting is time dependent. That means that unless time as we know it here exited, the moves are not what they think. In addition, if the stars were created into an already expanded space (that stretched time also) then they didn't move that far anyhow! In all ways the expanding universe and big bang are only beliefs.

 

[greenguzzi]

I missed this earlier:

One may take a simple observation or opinion as an insult. People take insult because they are insecure. I do not offer insult, so you take it from yourself. Feeling insulted is your reaction; causing it is not my intent.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to imply that I took insult. I stopped caring about what strangers thought of me about 40 years ago.

 

[tulipbee]

That doesn't cut it. How about your life? Don't you realize time is involved? The expansion of the universe depend on what redshift is. Not a lot more. Redshifting is time dependent. That means that unless time as we know it here exited, the moves are not what they think. In addition, if the stars were created into an already expanded space (that stretched time also) then they didn't move that far anyhow! In all ways the expanding universe and big bang are only beliefs.

Explain God being past, present and future at the same time

 

[greenguzzi]

Oh my! I read that paper years ago. It has been around even longer than I have. It's kind of famous.
What it says is that mass and energy are interchangeable. A body (mass, inertia) radiating electromagnetic will lose mass (inertia) , and a body absorbing electromagnetic energy will gain mass (inertia).The change energy (ΔE) equals (=) the change in mass (inertia) (Δm) times a constant, which happens to be the value of the speed of light squared (c^2). That is what E=mc^2 means. Perhaps you have heard of it? Or maybe you missed it?

You have glossed over the aspect most relevant to the discussion. Maybe you did so to avoid admitting that I'm right, or maybe you don't really understand special relativity as well as you seem to think you do. If it's the latter, then...

the Dunning-Kruger Effect. (Which you should Google.)

 

[Gracchus]

You have glossed over the aspect most relevant to the discussion. Maybe you did so to avoid admitting that I'm right, or maybe you don't really understand special relativity as well as you seem to think you do. If it's the latter, then...

Actually, I hardly understand General Relativity at all, as the equations involve tensors and non-linear partial differentials, and I am still working through the math. Einstein took some time and needed help, and I am not Einstein.
But what aspect do you think is most relevant to the discussion?
As I understand it: Matter and energy are just two ways of interpreting the same thing, and how one perceives it depends on relative motion. And space and time also can be interchangeable as long as symmetry is preserved. Am I in error?