Was Rick Perry right on guns at the movies?

[Armoured]

The solution is guns, more guns, always guns. Anything less would be unpatriotic!

Q: How many NRA lobbyists does it take to change a light bulb?

A: More guns.

 

[Skaloop]

For once, I actually agree with Rick Perry. There's no doubt that if more movie goers carried guns for protection, mass shooters may not have such an easy time of killing them.

Really? So some guy with a plan storms into a dark theatre launching smoke bombs and shooting randomly with a machine gun is going to be taken out by some unsuspecting person with a handgun in his pants who's munching away on popcorn?

Sure, if everyone had a gun cocked and at the ready at all times, it might help. But otherwise, they're just sitting ducks trying to draw from their holster while a guy in a dark smokey theatre is mowing people down. Then, even if they get to draw their weapon, they are panicked and shooting blindly in a dark smokey theatre.

The very rare occasions where someone attacks a theatre, combined with the very rare occasions where someone else with a weapon would be able to stop it, makes it pretty pointless to carry a firearm to a theatre. Or really, anywhere else.

 

[Loudmouth]

I always think when these horrific mass shootings occur, 'what if just ONE person had been carrying a gun?'

At least one person was carrying a gun. Didn't turn out so good.

 

[Vylo]

It might stop people from using cellphones during the movie .

But yeah, I don't think flooding a dark crowded room with guns is the solution.

 

[Vylo]

I always think when these horrific mass shootings occur, 'what if just ONE person had been carrying a gun?'

Most likely: Everyone still dies.

 

[Loudmouth]

It would seem to me that Texas seceding from the union was one of Perry's better ideas. I would have no problem building a new and better border fence a few hundred miles farther north. Then we could see what Texans really think about immigrants.

 

[Skaloop]

Most likely: Everyone still dies.

Yeah, I wonder how many people who carry are super good at the range, in a controlled environment with ear protection and a stationary paper target , but would be useless in an actual situation that required them to defend themselves against another armed gunman (or gunmen).

 

[Skaloop]

It would seem to me that Texas seceding from the union was one of Perry's better ideas. I would have no problem building a new and better border fence a few hundred miles farther north. Then we could see what Texans really think about immigrants.

And even before that, they'd have war waged on them for their oil.

 

[zippy2]

And even before that, they'd have war waged on them for their oil.

Just give it a try, yank.

 

[zippy2]

At least one person was carrying a gun. Didn't turn out so good.

That wasn't a 'person' it was a monster.

 

[Skaloop]

Just give it a try, yank.

I ain't no Yankee. I'm Canadian! Sorry, my apologies, eh.

 

[Skaloop]

That wasn't a 'person' it was a monster.

No, it was a person.

 

[RDKirk]

If they are not willing they should not be carrying. Guns are not playthings to 'scare' bad guys. They are weapons to take the bad guys out.

Depends on what "willing" means.

If I'm in a movie theater, I will always be with my wife and/or daughter. If I am armed in such a circumstance, my sole responsibility and intent will be to get them out alive. I will usher them in an "armed retreat" and use my gun to ensure their evacuation if necessary, but I'm not going to draw fire toward them. It is not my responsibility to "take the bad guys out."

The military has a heck of a time preventing "friendly fire" when under the "fog of war." And that's with people who have the means and training to communicate with one another.

 

[RDKirk]

Yeah, I wonder how many people who carry are super good at the range, in a controlled environment with ear protection and a stationary paper target , but would be useless in an actual situation that required them to defend themselves against another armed gunman (or gunmen).

I spent some time in a combat pistolcraft club back in the late 70s. There were some SEALs and Air Force pararescue in the same club (it was "training" for me, just screwing around for them). The point of the club was to simulate civilian "street" situations, something that is done in a more formal way by the IDPA today.

First thing I learned was what "good" means. Those guys are the equivalent of Olympic athletes. Being in a pistol club with them was like playing a pickup game with LeBron James. Their speed and accuracy are superhuman--special forces accession training weeds out everyone who is not genetically gifted. You realize going up against them that it's not a matter of training and determination--you just don't have the genetic potential and never will.

Second thing I learned was that even for the genetically gifted, being effective in situations that presume the bad guy has the advantages of surprise and choice of venue still requires constant training (don't go more than three or four days--certainly not more than a week between training sessions) and constant situational awareness. It takes much more dedication to the gun that I am willing to make to be Jason Bourne. That means I--and pretty much everyone else--would really be depending on a whole lot of factors stacked in our favor.

First, we have to depend on the bad guy shooting at someone else first, preferably someone with a line of sight 180 degrees away from us. We also have to depend on him being a lot more tactically stupid and a lot less trained than we are. There was a case in which an armed citizen got the drop on an armed robber in a convenience store...and was shot in the back by the robber's girlfriend, whose job was to watch her boyfriend's back for any heroes.

We also have to depend on any other armed citizens being at least as smart or smarter than we are--smart enough to know we're not bad guys (I'm black, which is a strike against me on that issue).

In the Louisiana theater shooting, the two people killed were the two sitting directly in front of the shooter. They never knew what hit them--like the last scene of "The Sopranos." Being armed would not have done them a bit of good.

In the church shooting, I have heard that before Roof drew his gun, he got argumentative with the group. Maybe that was his way of stoking up determination...or maybe it was his way of scoping out the rams among the sheep---the ones he needed to shoot first when he drew his gun.

 

[wing2000]

Most likely: Everyone still dies.

.

Yep.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Depends on what "willing" means.

If I'm in a movie theater, I will always be with my wife and/or daughter. If I am armed in such a circumstance, my sole responsibility and intent will be to get them out alive. I will usher them in an "armed retreat" and use my gun to ensure their evacuation if necessary, but I'm not going to draw fire toward them. It is not my responsibility to "take the bad guys out."

The military has a heck of a time preventing "friendly fire" when under the "fog of war." And that's with people who have the means and training to communicate with one another.

I'm having trouble figuring out what you mean by...

"...and use my gun to ensure their evacuation if necessary..."

What did you mean by that?

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Pretty sure don't cut it. Sorry. Think 'school shootings'.

Which are usually committed by kids mad at their peers for constantly teasing and taunting them and the school doing virtually nothing about it and the teen having access to their parent's legal firearms.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

The history and mindset of the American people is unique in world history. Most places in the world have populations who are used to jumping when a government authority whistles. In contrast to these whipped dogs, the American colonies had to take care of themselves while England sparred with other European governments. When the king finally got back to whistling, we told him where to shove it.

In colonial Virginia, a law required colonists to bring their guns to church to guard against Indian (Native American) attacks.

Some Virginians still carry guns in church.

Most Americans now live in the 21st century.

 

[RDKirk]

I'm having trouble figuring out what you mean by...

"...and use my gun to ensure their evacuation if necessary..."

What did you mean by that?

"Retreat in force." If he looks our way, then make him keep his head down while my wife and daughter get out the door.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

No, it was a person.

For some it's easier to avoid reality.