Three Questions about God's Law

[BobRyan]

Different times, conditions and circumstances require different covenants/contracts. The new covenant between the House of Israel and the House of Judah during the time of Christ’s future rule when Satan is bound and his followers are removed from power, is not going to be the same as the old covenant

The NEW Covenant is in place right now.

Jer 31:31-34

• 1. A NEW heart - the Law of God written on the heart
• 2. Adoption into the family of God.
• 3. God is our personal teacher
• 4. Sins forgiven.

Same as in Heb 8... the ONE Gospel "preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8

31 ... I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers on the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares the Lord. 33 “For this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the Lord:
1. “I will put My law within them and write it on their heart;
2. and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
3. 34 They will not teach again, each one his neighbor and each one his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the Lord,
4. “for I will forgive their wrongdoing, and their sin I will no longer remember.”

between God and the children of Israel during the times, conditions and circumstances of Moses, before they were divided into the house of Israel and a house of Judah, when the Lord, who became the Christ, ruled over them as a natio

The New Testament New Covenant in Heb 8 -- verbatim the same as in Jer 31.

there’s no scriptural evidence/record of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the children of Jacob up until the time of the manna, of a 7th day Sabbath observance/rest, or any other Sabbath observances.

And no record that any of them took a bath until Pharoah's daughter did in the book of Exodus.
And no record of "do not take God's name in vain" - until Ex 20:7

But by contrast -- Ex 20:11 the Sabbath commandment points directly at Gen 2:2-3 the 7th day made a holy day of worship, sanctified for holy use.

And so - it was made for all mankind in Gen 2:2-3
And Christ affirms this in Mark 2:27
So also Is 66:23 - "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before Me to worship"

Acts 15 is solid scriptural evidence backed by the Holy Spirit, that Christians are not required to burden themselves with circumcision

Gentiles were not commanded to be circumcised in OT or NT - to be saved.
It was never said in the OT that unless gentiles are circumcised they cannot be saved - how much less so in the New Testament.

This is the easy part.

and the law of Moses, which includes the Sabbath.

The Law of Moses includes
Ex 20:7 - Do not take God's name in vain (never quoted from in the NT)
Lev 19:18 Love your Neighbor as yourself
Deut 6:5 "Love God with all your heart".

Those who condemn God's commandments are not on solid ground when it comes to the Bible.

1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God"
Eph 6:2 where "the first commandment with a promise is - Honor your father and mother"

 

[Jan001]

BobRyan said:

Paul says we need not "wait" until the second century to see error springing up.
in Acts 20 -- His Caveat Emptor for Christians of the first century


25 “And now, behold, I know that all of you, among whom I went about preaching the kingdom, will no longer see my face. 26 Therefore, I testify to you this day that I am innocent of the blood of all men. 27 For I did not shrink from declaring to you the whole purpose of God. 28 Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood. 29 I know that after my departure savage wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; 30 and from among your own selves men will arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away the disciples after them. 31 Therefore be on the alert, remembering that night and day for a period of three years I did not cease to admonish each one with tears.

No doubt. Even to this very day we have strong opposition to the approved "sola scriptura" testing practice that we see in Acts 17:11

"they studied the SCRIPTURES daily TO SEE IF those things spoken to them by the APOSTLE Paul - WERE SO" Acts 17:11

These Scriptures that these Bereans studied daily were the Old Testament Scriptures (the Law, the Prophets, and the Psalms) to see if what Paul was teaching about Jesus Christ was true—that He was their prophesied Messiah.

Acts 17:10-11 Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. 11 These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.

Jesus' teachings were originally taught orally. Later, some of what was orally taught was written down and we call these writings the New Testament. Scripture shows us that not all of Jesus' teachings were written down. Jesus founded a Church (household of God) and He appointed its leaders to make all His teachings known throughout the whole world.

Matthew 16:18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.

Ephesians 2:19-21 Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, 21 in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord,

Jesus did not tell His apostles/disciples to write a Bible so that everyone can then restrict His teachings to just what can be written in a small book, or so that everyone can then simply interpret the written teachings of the apostles/disciples for themselves.

2 Thessalonians 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

John 21:25 And there are also many other things that Jesus did, which if they were written one by one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen.

Amen.

And Adios!

 

[BobRyan]

"they studied the SCRIPTURES daily TO SEE IF those things spoken to them by the APOSTLE Paul - WERE SO" Acts 17:11

If they had given any weight at all to the traditions of their magisterium -- the leaders of the one true nation-church started by God at Sinai was at that time informing them that Paul was a heretic , schismatic Pharisee whose teachings were to be rejected.

YET they chose to 'study the scriptures daily to SEE IF" the teaching of Paul was in fact "so"/.

These Scriptures that these Bereans studied daily were the Old Testament Scriptures (the Law, the Prophets, and the Psalms) to see if what Paul was teaching about Jesus Christ was true—that He was their prophesied Messiah.

Acts 17:10-11 Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. 11 These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.

Agreed. Paul's teaching about the Messiah, his doctrine etc - was to be tested against known scripture.

Jesus' teachings were originally taught orally. Later, some of what was orally taught was written down and we call these writings the New Testament.

Agreed.

Today we have both the OT and NT.

And that NT text shows us prime examples of sola-scriptura testing of all doctrine, tradition and practice.

Scripture shows us that not all of Jesus' teachings were written down.

Agreed.

Jesus founded a Church (household of God) and He appointed its leaders to make all His teachings known throughout the whole world.

True.

Matt 28: 19 Go, therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to follow all that I commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

And the result? -
We now have the gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John - and other NT writings of the Apostles contained in the NT. They were engaged in doing that very thing - "teaching them to follow all that I commanded you;"

Matthew 16:18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.

That is the same place where He addresses Peter as Satan saying "get thee behind me Satan" - so Peter had some capacity to make a mistake or two even then.

Ephesians 2:19-21 Now, therefore, you are no longer strangers and foreigners, but fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20 having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone, 21 in whom the whole building, being fitted together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord,

Amen !

Jesus did not tell His apostles/disciples to write a Bible so that everyone can then restrict His teachings

He told them to spread His teachings and in keeping with that -- they wrote the Gospels.

That included the example of Jesus in Mark 7:7-13 slam hammering the nation-church tradition of His day "sola scriptura".

My point is not that all tradition is bad... merely that all must be tested.

 

[Jan001]

Matt 28: 19 Go, therefore, and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to follow all that I commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.”

And the result? -
We now have the gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John - and other NT writings of the Apostles contained in the NT. They were engaged in doing that very thing - "teaching them to follow all that I commanded you;"

He told them to spread His teachings and in keeping with that -- they wrote the Gospels.

That included the example of Jesus in Mark 7:7-13 slam hammering the nation-church tradition of His day "sola scriptura".

My point is not that all tradition is bad... merely that all must be tested.

Mark 7:7-13 is not relevant to this discussion.

Where in Scripture does it state that all of Christ's teachings must be written in a book and that it must be named the New Testament Scriptures?

Where does it state in Scripture that all traditions must be tested by Scripture in order for them to be true?

These "doctrines" are not found anywhere in the Scriptures and yet people do believe they are true and they do insist that these "doctrines" should be believed by all people.

Scripture is indeed helpful/useful for the Church to use for teaching God's word, but Jesus' Church and its leaders are His authority on earth.

2 Timothy 3:16 Every scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for showing mistakes, for correcting, and for training character,

Jesus gave His authority to the men He appointed, to teach/preach His gospel. Those He appointed to preach/teach then later used letters to supplement their oral teachings. These letters were not written to replace their oral teachings.

Matthew 28:18-20 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.

Paul's additional instructions that he wrote to Bishop Titus and to Bishop Timothy:

Titus 2:11-15 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, 12 teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age, 13 looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, 14 who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works. 15 Speak these things, exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no one despise you.

2 Timothy 2:2 And the things that you have heard from me among many witnesses, commit these to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.

I find that Scripture is useful to show that Scripture alone is not Scriptural. It is important for people to accept the following because Jesus' Gospel and His worship instructions cannot be limited to simply what can be written in a small book:

2 Thessalonians 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.

John 21:25 And there are also many other things that Jesus did, which if they were written one by one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen.

Those of us who do believe these Scriptures to be true and also practice them cannot be swayed to believe anything contrary to them by any persons who do not believe them and do not practice them.

We don't want to be judged guilty of the following:

Acts 28:27 For the hearts of this people have grown dull. Their ears are hard of hearing, And their eyes they have closed, Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them.” ’

 

[Canuckster]

The NEW Covenant is in place right now.

Jer 31:31-34

• 1. A NEW heart - the Law of God written on the heart
• 2. Adoption into the family of God.
• 3. God is our personal teacher
• 4. Sins forgiven.

Same as in Heb 8... the ONE Gospel "preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8

31 ... I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers on the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares the Lord. 33 “For this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares the Lord:
1. “I will put My law within them and write it on their heart;
2. and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
3. 34 They will not teach again, each one his neighbor and each one his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares the Lord,
4. “for I will forgive their wrongdoing, and their sin I will no longer remember.”






The New Testament New Covenant in Heb 8 -- verbatim the same as in Jer 31.


And no record that any of them took a bath until Pharoah's daughter did in the book of Exodus.
And no record of "do not take God's name in vain" - until Ex 20:7

But by contrast -- Ex 20:11 the Sabbath commandment points directly at Gen 2:2-3 the 7th day made a holy day of worship, sanctified for holy use.

And so - it was made for all mankind in Gen 2:2-3
And Christ affirms this in Mark 2:27
So also Is 66:23 - "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before Me to worship"

Gentiles were not commanded to be circumcised in OT or NT - to be saved.
It was never said in the OT that unless gentiles are circumcised they cannot be saved - how much less so in the New Testament.

This is the easy part.

The Law of Moses includes
Ex 20:7 - Do not take God's name in vain (never quoted from in the NT)
Lev 19:18 Love your Neighbor as yourself
Deut 6:5 "Love God with all your heart".

Those who condemn God's commandments are not on solid ground when it comes to the Bible.

1 Cor 7:19 "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God"
Eph 6:2 where "the first commandment with a promise is - Honor your father and mother"

The new covenant in Christ’s blood between His Father and His Father’s children is in place right now. Not the new covenant with the House of Israel and the House of Judah where His laws are written on their hearts. That will take place after Christ returns and gathers the physical remnant of the house of Israel and Judah. There’s a difference between the children of God (Christians, God’s “elect”) and the remnant of the house of Israel and house Judah who are gathered after Christ returns and He establishes a new covenant with them. Christians (God’s elect”) will rule with Christ as spirit beings over the world, including over the House of Israel and the House of Judah. A thought most abhorrent to Jews.

Evidence of people taking baths and evidence of God ordering people to observe the Sabbath are two different things and a useless argument on your part. You need scriptural evidence of God ordering people to observe the Sabbath before the manna, before you can impose it on others. You haven’t provided any scriptural evidence cause there is none.

Yes…. The very easy part is that Christians don’t need the law of Moses to not take God's name in vain, love their neighbor as themselves and love God with all their heart".

Those who teach Christians that they have to observe the Sabbath to be saved and ignore the solid scriptural evidence provided in Acts 15 are not on solid ground when it comes to the Bible.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Please provide one new covenant scripture from after Jesus rose from the dead where the apostles/disciples demanded that Gentile Christians keep the Jewish sabbath.

Paul did command the Gentile Christians to pay no attention to the Judaizers who troubled them to keep the festivals, new moons, and sabbaths of the Jews.

Colossians 2:16 So let no one (Judaizer) judge you (Gentiles) in food or in drink, or regarding a (Jewish) festival or a new moon or sabbaths,

Acts 15:24 Since we have heard that some (Judaizers) who went out from us have troubled you (Gentiles) with words, unsettling your souls, saying, “You must be circumcised and keep the law”—to whom we gave no such commandment—

Galatians 1:7 which is not another; but there are some (Judaizers) who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ.

Galatians 5:12 I could wish that those (Judaizers) who trouble you (Gentiles) would even cut themselves off (castrate themselves)!

God claims the Sabbath as His holy day. God only said that about the seventh day Sabbath and not once ever mentioning any change to His Sabbath. God always identifies the Sabbath as His- and never said it is the Sabbath of the Jews. Man named it this way as a way of discrediting God's own Words.

Whose Sabbath is it?

Exodus 20:10
but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God

When did the Sabbath start?
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.
At Creation- God's perfect plan before sin- so not a shadow of anything as it points us back to the God of all Creation.

Whose holy day is it?

Isa 58:13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
And call the Sabbath a delight,
The holy day of the Lord honorable,
And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
Nor finding your own pleasure,
Nor speaking your own words,
Then you shall delight yourself in the Lord;
And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
The mouth of the Lord has spoken.”

Who was the Sabbath made for:
Mark 2:27 And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath.

When was the Sabbath made?
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

When was man made and in Whose image?
Gen 1:26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness;

What did God do after He made man in His image?
Exo 20:11 Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

The Sabbath was made for man, man was created on the sixth day in the image of God and God rested on the Sabbath day and hallowed it. We are made to follow God and not do our own thing, that separates us from God. Isa 59:2

Who was the Sabbath made for again?

Isaiah 56:1 Thus says the Lord:

“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
6. Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant

Every one of these scriptures has a thus saith the Lord. Jesus tells us to live by every Word that proceeds out of the mouth of God. Mat 4:4

How does God's Words compare to Paul's words in Col 2:16-17, which you left the context out which is in Col 2:14. Is Paul not a servant of God, does he not seek justice and to do righteous, did he not want to join himself and love Him? No, he was a faithful servant Romans 1:1 and what are we warned about Paul's writings?

2 Peter 3:16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

So when we take Paul's writings and pit them against the very Words that proceeds out of the mouth of God we are to live by, this warning is for those.

Did you know once God blesses something as He did His holy Sabbath day that is a commandment of God,, no man can reverse. Num 23:20. Can you please provide one scripture that has a thus saith the Lord that we no longer need to keep God's Sabbath day holy and we can forget and profane His Sabbath by doing our own thing instead? Every thus saith the Lord in scripture and there are many, I only referenced a few all tells us to keep holy and not profane.

Paul, a servant of Christ kept every Sabbath decades after the cross preaching to both Jews and Gentiles that Jesus said was made for everyone. The apostles were commissioned to observe everything Christ commanded of them Mat 28:18-20 , which is why they kept every Sabbath faithfully, just as Jesus did Luke 4:16 John 15:10.

Acts 13: 42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. 43 Now when the congregation had broken up, many of the Jews and devout proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas, who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.

Acts 13:44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God.

Acts 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.

So Col 2:14-17 does not reconcile with the teachings of Jesus or what the apostles did decades after the Cross not once mentioning of any change. If you want I can go into detail what Col 2:14-17 really means but its not about the weekly Sabbath as there is more than one Sabbath in scripture and Paul was very careful to describe the sabbath(s) he was referring to.

The Sabbath was changed as predicted but not by God Dan 7:25. Its up to us to continue in our false teachings or come out of them before its too late. Rev 18:4 Jesus tells us to keep the commandments of God over traditions of man. Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Only He can save us, so I recommend embracing His every Word as the Sabbath is His holy day that He made holy for us Exo 20:8-11 and continues for His saints for eternity Isa 66:23.

 

[sparow]

God’s law is most certainly good for all! But it is only required to be kept by those under the law.
The law was given to the Jews only. Gentiles were not under the law.
if the Jews were unable to keep the law then why would anyone expect the Gentiles to keep the law and why would any Gentile want to put himself under the law that’s called ‘the ministration of death”
It’s good for anyone to have at least one day of rest.

Under the Law isn't Biblical; "in covenant", is Biblical. Solomon said, even if an Atheist, it is still profitable to keep the Law.

 

[One God and Father of All]

Under the Law isn't Biblical; "in covenant", is Biblical. Solomon said, even if an Atheist, it is still profitable to keep the Law.

Rom 2:14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,

 

[One God and Father of All]

Under the Law isn't Biblical; "in covenant", is Biblical. Solomon said, even if an Atheist, it is still profitable to keep the Law.

Yes. Gentiles were never given God’s laws and are therefore not under them. If however he desires to be saved he must enter covenant with God.

 

[BobRyan]

Yes. Gentiles were never given God’s laws and are therefore not under them. If however he desires to be saved he must enter covenant with God.

It was always a sin for gentiles to take God's name in vain.

 

[One God and Father of All]

It was always a sin for gentiles to take God's name in vain.

It was always sin for anyone born of Adam.

 

[BobRyan]

It was always sin for anyone born of Adam.

yep!

"sin is transgression of the law" 1 John 3:4 even in the NT
And God's Commandments say "do not take God's name in vain" Ex 20:7

 

[sparow]

Rom 2:14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,

Some people depend on Jesus for their salvation, others depend on Paul.

Gentile means stranger to Israel or stranger to God, depending on context. The is a prophesy that says that the Law (covenant) will go to the Gentiles; If the accepted the Law they would no longer be strangers and no longer called Gentile.

Paul's words are always arguments in a debate, and require that context.

 

[sparow]

Yes. Gentiles were never given God’s laws and are therefore not under them. If however he desires to be saved he must enter covenant with God.

The only reason Israel received the Law and not some other tribe was because of the covenant God made with Abraham, and still Israel's fait depended on Esau selling his birthright for a plate of porridge; else the Law/Covenant would have gone to other people. The Law was given to Israel as a light to all nations, especially the descendants of Abraham.

 

[BobRyan]

Yes. Gentiles were never given God’s laws and are therefore not under them. If however he desires to be saved he must enter covenant with God.

Indeed - the "New Covenant" of Jer 31:31-34 -- the work of the Holy Spirit and that covenant is applicable to gentiles with no access to scripture at all according to Romans 2.

 

[Canuckster]

There is no scriptural evidence that anyone is required to observe the 7th day Sabbath to be saved, (receive eternal life and live in God's kingdom) but there's solid scriptural evidence to show that it's not required.

When Christ returns at the last trump with His holy army of angels (Matthew 25:31), all the dead in Christ (His holy elect/brethren) are raised first into spirit (1 Thes 4: 16 / 1 Cor 15: 44) and then those who are still alive in Christ (also His holy elect/brethren) when He returns, will be changed into spirit (1 Corinthians 15: 51-52) and will all together meet the Lord in the air (1 Thes 4:17) accompanied by His army of holy angels. They will all together with Christ descend to the earth as the army of angels in advance violently brings everything into submission. Then all the nations of the earth who were gathered by the angels and separated as sheep from goats, will be brought and presented before Christ the King, who will appear on His glorious throne, with His holy elect (brethren) by His side, all manifested physically in glorious royal splendor and attire.

The “goats” will be placed by His angels to His left and the “sheep” will be placed by His angels to His right.

“Then the King will say to those at His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you since the foundation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave Me food, I was thirsty and you gave Me drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in. I was naked and you clothed Me, I was sick and you visited Me, I was in prison and you came to Me.’

Notice, He did not say to the sheep on His right, you kept my Ten Commandments including the Sabbath, or the Holy days or the law of Moses.

“Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? And when did we see You sick or in prison and come to You?’

Notice, the righteous never knew of anything they did towards the King. For surely if they were versed in these most basic of scriptures (Matt 25), as most Christians are, they wouldn’t need to ask that question, they would know exactly what He was talking about. But they were completely ignorant of this.

“The King will answer, ‘Truly I say to you, as you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’

Now when He says “these brothers of mine”, who is He referring to? He’s gesturing to His holy elect (brethren) by His side, all in royal attire, those who were resurrected and changed at His coming. For when His brethren were living on the earth before His coming, these sheep did kind acts towards them not knowing that they were Christ’s brethren. And they didn’t even know the most basic of scriptures in the New Testament so how could they know anything about a 7th day Sabbath from Friday sunset to Saturday sunset, let alone the whole law of Moses.

“Then He will say to those at the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the eternal fire, prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave Me no food, I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink, I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, I was naked and you did not clothe Me, I was sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

“Then they also will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not serve You?’

So here we see the opposite situation. These goats thought they served the Lord and His brethren. For this is right after He praised the sheep in their very presence. They knew exactly what He meant when He said to the sheep, “you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’

So the goats believed that they did all these kind deeds to Him by doing them to His brethren. These goats are described in more detail in Matthew 7:22-23

“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day… [the day Christ’s judges the nations] ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

So we see the sheep, who didn’t even know the scriptures let alone sunset to sunset 7th day Sabbath observance, pleasing God the Father while these goats claiming to have done many great wonders in the name of Jesus, not pleasing to God the Father

There’s no doubt that being one of the elect (brethren of Christ) is of the highest calling and very few are chosen (“many are called, few are chosen”), but those who are not the elect of God, and do good, even if they know nothing about the scriptures, will still be saved and inherit the earth. For the sheep on the right will inherit the earth because they are "meek" not because they are 7th day Sabbath observers.

Acts 15 is solid scriptural evidence backed by the Holy Spirit, that Christians are not required to burden themselves with circumcision and the law of Moses, which includes the Sabbath.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

There is no scriptural evidence that anyone is required to observe the 7th day Sabbath to be saved, (receive eternal life and live in God's kingdom) but there's solid scriptural evidence to show that it's not required.

True. None of God’s commandments will save us- we are only saved by the blood of Christ through faith. The commandments are kept because Jesus changes us from the inside out and we want to do everything He asks through love and faith. John 14:15 Exo 20:6 1 John 5:3 Rom 3:31

When Christ returns at the last trump with His holy army of angels (Matthew 25:31), all the dead in Christ (His holy elect/brethren) are raised first into spirit (1 Thes 4: 16 / 1 Cor 15: 44) and then those who are still alive in Christ (also His holy elect/brethren) when He returns, will be changed into spirit (1 Corinthians 15: 51-52) and will all together meet the Lord in the air (1 Thes 4:17) accompanied by His army of holy angels. They will all together with Christ descend to the earth as the army of angels in advance violently brings everything into submission. Then all the nations of the earth who were gathered by the angels and separated as sheep from goats, will be brought and presented before Christ the King, who will appear on His glorious throne, with His holy elect (brethren) by His side, all manifested physically in glorious royal splendor and attire.

The “goats” will be placed by His angels to His left and the “sheep” will be placed by His angels to His right.

“Then the King will say to those at His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you since the foundation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave Me food, I was thirsty and you gave Me drink, I was a stranger and you took Me in. I was naked and you clothed Me, I was sick and you visited Me, I was in prison and you came to Me.’

Notice, He did not say to the sheep on His right, you kept my Ten Commandments including the Sabbath, or the Holy days or the law of Moses.

Scripture does not delete scripture. He already reveals through His Word what a saved person looks like.

Rev 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. If we have the same faith of Jesus we would feed the poor and hungry and that doesn’t just mean physical food, but Spiritual food as well. If Jesus was in us we would have the same faith of Him and live as He lived 1 John 2:6 who kept all of the commandments John 15:10 including the Sabbath commandment Luke 4:16 because Jesus taught not to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19-30 as breaking one is like breaking them all James 2:10-12 and when Jesus changes us from the inside out and we want to keep His holy law through faith which is what reconciles us Rev 22:14

. For when His brethren were living on the earth before His coming, these sheep did kind acts towards them not knowing that they were Christ’s brethren. And they didn’t even know the most basic of scriptures in the New Testament so how could they know anything about a 7th day Sabbath from Friday sunset to Saturday sunset, let alone the whole law of Moses.

We are held accountable for our knowledge Acts 17:30 and since we all have access to God’s Word we really have no excuse.

“Then He will say to those at the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the eternal fire, prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave Me no food, I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink, I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, I was naked and you did not clothe Me, I was sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’
“Then they also will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not serve You?’

So here we see the opposite situation. These goats thought they served the Lord and His brethren. For this is right after He praised the sheep in their very presence. They knew exactly what He meant when He said to the sheep, “you have done it for one of the least of these brothers of Mine, you have done it for Me.’

So the goats believed that they did all these kind deeds to Him by doing them to His brethren. These goats are described in more detail in Matthew 7:22-23

“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day… [the day Christ’s judges the nations] ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

He also says at His Second Coming those who practice lawlessness He won’t know and to depart from Him. His children hears His voice and He knows them and plain scripture says this is how He “knows” us:

1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

Revelation 22:14-15 is a correlation of Mat 7:21-23 and tells us what law Jesus is referring to in Mat 7:23. The same law Jesus said not to break the least of these commandments or teach others to break as one would be least in heaven quoting from the Ten Commandments Mat 5:19-30 and I don’t think least means one will be there is you read the next verse Mat 5:20. The same law Jesus quoted from saying when we keep our rules over the commandments of God again quoting from the Ten Commandments ones heart is far from Him Mat 15:3-14, the opposite of the New Covenant God’s law written in our heart Heb 8:10 as breaking one of God’s commandments is like breaking them all James 2:10-12 and one would be in fear of sin and judgement Mat 5:19-30 Ecc 12:13-14 Rev 22:14-15

So we see the sheep, who didn’t even know the scriptures let alone sunset to sunset 7th day Sabbath observance, pleasing God the Father while these goats claiming to have done many great wonders in the name of Jesus, not pleasing to God the Father

I can’t find the scripture that says this. I think these may be your words. Here are Christ’s Words right from His own mouth we are to live by every Word. Mat 4:4

The Sabbath was made for man Mark 2:27

Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant

Jesus in His own Words equates those who keep the Sabbath as those who love the name of the Lord and join themselves to the Lord (think an eternal sign between God and His people Eze 20:20) and they do what is righteous and justice and serve Him and He blesses us. Are those not His sheep? He says He brings those to His holy mountain which is Heaven. Similar to Rev 22:14

There’s no doubt that being one of the elect (brethren of Christ) is of the highest calling and very few are chosen (“many are called, few are chosen”), but those who are not the elect of God, and do good, even if they know nothing about the scriptures, will still be saved and inherit the earth. For the sheep on the right will inherit the earth because they are "meek" not because they are 7th day Sabbath observers.

That could apply to any of the commandments, not sure why pluck the Sabbath out of the Ten Commandments. God sure didn’t. In fact, its the one commandment God said to Remember and is holy and blessed by God, that no man has the Authority to reverse Num 23:20 Exo 20 Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28 God’s people keep all of His commandments through love and faith. Rev 14:12 John 14:15 Exo 20:6 1 John 5:3

Acts 15 is solid scriptural evidence backed by the Holy Spirit, that Christians are not required to burden themselves with circumcision and the law of Moses, which includes the Sabbath.

Acts 15 is about circumcision, the only reference to the Sabbath in this chapter was that it was being kept every Sabbath Acts 15:21 and in Acts 13:42-44 and Acts 18:4 etc. The apostles kept every Sabbath as they were commissioned by Jesus to observe everything He commanded Mat 28:18-20. Acts 15 doesn’t make reference to the greatest commandment to love God with our our heart, mind and soul and I hope because it wasn’t repeated in Acts 15 means according to your reasoning we can break this one too.

 

[HIM]

We are held accountable for our knowledge Acts 17:30 and since we all have access to God’s Word we really have no excuse.

Especially since we have His Spirit. Happy Sabbath!

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Especially since we have His Spirit. Happy Sabbath!

Happy Sabbath friend!

 

[Canuckster]

True. None of God’s commandments will save us- we are only saved by the blood of Christ through faith. The commandments are kept because Jesus changes us from the inside out and we want to do everything He asks through love and faith. John 14:15 Exo 20:6 1 John 5:3 Rom 3:31

Scripture does not delete scripture. He already reveals through His Word what a saved person looks like.

Rev 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus. If we have the same faith of Jesus we would feed the poor and hungry and that doesn’t just mean physical food, but Spiritual food as well. If Jesus was in us we would have the same faith of Him and live as He lived 1 John 2:6 who kept all of the commandments John 15:10 including the Sabbath commandment Luke 4:16 because Jesus taught not to break the least of these commandments Mat 5:19-30 as breaking one is like breaking them all James 2:10-12 and when Jesus changes us from the inside out and we want to keep His holy law through faith which is what reconciles us Rev 22:14



We are held accountable for our knowledge Acts 17:30 and since we all have access to God’s Word we really have no excuse.

He also says at His Second Coming those who practice lawlessness He won’t know and to depart from Him. His children hears His voice and He knows them and plain scripture says this is how He “knows” us:

1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God [a]is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

Revelation 22:14-15 is a correlation of Mat 7:21-23 and tells us what law Jesus is referring to in Mat 7:23. The same law Jesus said not to break the least of these commandments or teach others to break as one would be least in heaven quoting from the Ten Commandments Mat 5:19-30 and I don’t think least means one will be there is you read the next verse Mat 5:20. The same law Jesus quoted from saying when we keep our rules over the commandments of God again quoting from the Ten Commandments ones heart is far from Him Mat 15:3-14, the opposite of the New Covenant God’s law written in our heart Heb 8:10 as breaking one of God’s commandments is like breaking them all James 2:10-12 and one would be in fear of sin and judgement Mat 5:19-30 Ecc 12:13-14 Rev 22:14-15



I can’t find the scripture that says this. I think these may be your words. Here are Christ’s Words right from His own mouth we are to live by every Word. Mat 4:4

The Sabbath was made for man Mark 2:27

Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant

Jesus in His own Words equates those who keep the Sabbath as those who love the name of the Lord and join themselves to the Lord (think an eternal sign between God and His people Eze 20:20) and they do what is righteous and justice and serve Him and He blesses us. Are those not His sheep? He says He brings those to His holy mountain which is Heaven. Similar to Rev 22:14

That could apply to any of the commandments, not sure why pluck the Sabbath out of the Ten Commandments. God sure didn’t. In fact, its the one commandment God said to Remember and is holy and blessed by God, that no man has the Authority to reverse Num 23:20 Exo 20 Deut 4:13 Exo 34:28 God’s people keep all of His commandments through love and faith. Rev 14:12 John 14:15 Exo 20:6 1 John 5:3

Acts 15 is about circumcision, the only reference to the Sabbath in this chapter was that it was being kept every Sabbath Acts 15:21 and in Acts 13:42-44 and Acts 18:4 etc. The apostles kept every Sabbath as they were commissioned by Jesus to observe everything He commanded Mat 28:18-20. Acts 15 doesn’t make reference to the greatest commandment to love God with our our heart, mind and soul and I hope because it wasn’t repeated in Acts 15 means according to your reasoning we can break this one too.

All your points I’ve already dealt with in this thread.

Acts 15 does not deal with circumcision only and to say it does is a blatant falsehood. And SDAs like to use translations that purposely perpetuate this falsehood.

“… that certain [men] which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment. Acts 15: 24

“the law” they are referring to is the “law of Moses” which includes the 7th day Sabbath. This was alluded to in verse 6 by the Pharisee sect who were responsible for sending out the spies to whom the church elders "gave no such commandment":

“But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.” Acts 15: 6

The law of Moses includes the 7th day Sabbath.

Acts 15 is irrefutable. This debate was settled almost 2,000 years ago. The falsehood perpetuated regarding Act 15 voids any benefit one may believe they obtain by observing the 7th day Sabbath.