Need some opinions on the "Unpardonable Sin".

[Avid]

Refusal to give your life to Jesus (or "ask Jesus into your heart" as some say) is the only unforgivable sin. I simply use today's language to get the point across. You cannot name any other unforgivable sin.

It was not me, but it was our LORD Jesus Christ who named the ONLY unforgivable sin. He was careful to state that ALL MANNER OF SIN could be forgiven. That includes the sin of REFUSING, REBELLING, NOT SURRENDERING and UNBELIEF in the LORD Jesus Christ as our only Savior.

Matthews 12
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
​

These are the words of Jesus Christ our LORD. It is not my assertion, nor is it my opinion that is being discussed. It is the very words of the Son of God. This IS EXACTLY what your post indicated could not be given, yet here it is given by Christ Jesus.

To say that the words of Jesus Christ are not true is an unorthodox position. Are you aware this is a Baptist sub-forum, and the words of Christ are included in the orthodox beliefs of Baptists in general?

 

[MWood]

The verse said," Speaketh against the Holy Spirit."

 

[revrobor]

It was not me, but it was our LORD Jesus Christ who named the ONLY unforgivable sin. He was careful to state that ALL MANNER OF SIN could be forgiven. That includes the sin of REFUSING, REBELLING, NOT SURRENDERING and UNBELIEF in the LORD Jesus Christ as our only Savior.

Matthews 12
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
​

These are the words of Jesus Christ our LORD. It is not my assertion, nor is it my opinion that is being discussed. It is the very words of the Son of God. This IS EXACTLY what your post indicated could not be given, yet here it is given by Christ Jesus.

To say that the words of Jesus Christ are not true is an unorthodox position. Are you aware this is a Baptist sub-forum, and the words of Christ are included in the orthodox beliefs of Baptists in general?

You must have trouble with the English language. The blasphemy Jesus is talking about is refusal to believe when the Holy Spirit calls you to salvation. That is calling the Holy Spirit a liar and thus blaspheming Him.

 

[Avid]

The verse said," Speaketh against the Holy Spirit."

You must have trouble with the English language. The blasphemy Jesus is talking about is refusal to believe when the Holy Spirit calls you to salvation. That is calling the Holy Spirit a liar and thus blaspheming Him.

Be careful. I have a sufficient understanding of English. Take note of what the scriptures say, and compare that to what your post has claimed...

Matthew 12
22 ¶ Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw.
23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of David?
24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.
25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:
26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?
27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.
28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.
29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.
30 He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.
31 Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
​

In the context of the paragraph, we see that belief in Jesus as Savior was not the issue, but that there were people saying the work of God's Holy Spirit is the work of Satan's "Prince," and they would not be forgiven for that particular sin.

 

[Avid]

Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is refusing to surrender to Jesus when the Spirit calls you. It is calling the Spirit a liar and is the only unforgivable sin.

Please provide a scripture passage that mentions "unbelief," "surrender" or "refusing" in conjunction with the condition of being an "unforgivable" sin.

Am still waiting for some passage of scripture that shows where this doctrine originates or how it is justified. Where does the Bible mention that "calling the Spirit a liar" is worse than any person lying to say the work of God's Holy Spirit is the work of the devil's "Prince" as pointed out in Matt.12 ???

 

[Avid]

The verse said," Speaketh against the Holy Spirit."

Thank you for speaking the truth in this perverse world. May we all gain yet more understanding into God's holy word, and have His truth in our hearts.

 

[revrobor]

Am still waiting for some passage of scripture that shows where this doctrine originates or how it is justified. Where does the Bible mention that "calling the Spirit a liar" is worse than any person lying to say the work of God's Holy Spirit is the work of the devil's "Prince" as pointed out in Matt.22 ???

OK. Name the only unforgivable sin and be specific. "Blasphemy" is too broad a term. Name the only sin for which people are condemned to Hell.

 

[Avid]

OK. Name the only unforgivable sin and be specific. "Blasphemy" is too broad a term. Name the only sin for which people are condemned to Hell.

"Blasphemy" is a broad term. The passage distinguishes "Blasphemy" in general with a particular blasphemy. Please read the passage...

31 ... All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him
​

 

[revrobor]

You need to get yourself a modern translation of the Bible. In the NIV that verse reads "....but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven." Name that blasphemy.

 

[Avid]

In your post it seems there is an attempt to argue the validity of the King James Version of the Holy Bible. This is not the place for that, for it only calls into question the validity of holy scripture as a whole. An earlier post of yours called into question the testimony of Jesus Christ, Himself, in the subject at hand. This thread is about a particular sin that is described in detail as given in my earlier posts.

Your posts are suggesting that there is a meaning not given in the scriptures, or that one verse should be pitted against the adjacent verse in order to call into question the validity of the scriptures as a whole.

Please refrain from posting these unorthodox views, and apply your time to the question in the OP, and an expounding of the verses in Matt.12 that describe the "UNPARDONABLE SIN," as some call it.

What does your version of the Bible say in verses 31 & 32 of that chapter? I mean to ask for the whole passage, and not simply the part supposedly adds some credence to this error that your post suggests.

 

[Bluelion]

You need to get yourself a modern translation of the Bible. In the NIV that verse reads "....but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven." Name that blasphemy.

NIV is not the best translation. The ASB is the most literal and the KJV.

The sin is speaking against The Holy Spirit. like the Pharisees did calling Good evil

 

[Avid]

OK. Name the only unforgivable sin and be specific. "Blasphemy" is too broad a term. Name the only sin for which people are condemned to Hell.

Your post asks a question concerning an absolute about sin. The subject of this thread is a specific and particular sin that Our LORD Jesus Christ Himself described and decreed as having a singular status.

The answer to the concern of the OP has been stated, and quoted from the words of the LORD Jesus Christ himself. Many times it has been shown.

Matthew 12
31 Wherefore I say unto you,All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
​

Please show how Jesus could say in verse 31 that, "All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men:" but in your post, blasphemy is UNPARDONABLE?

After that statement in Matt.12:31, the LORD Jesus gets specific as to what particular form of blasphemy He is saying would not be forgiven. He even shows that is has to do with SPEAKING. Read the post above that dealt with the TONGUE, and quotes a few verses from James 3. This is a sin, not a sin of thought, but of speech. It is a sin committed by a small member of the body of man that is "set on fire of hell," and kindleth "a great matter."

It was after this particular SIN, being committed by certain Pharisees, that Jesus no longer spoke plainly to the people, but only spoke in parables. It is a great matter indeed that was kindled by the TONGUE in this instance.

 

[Bluelion]

Your post asks a question concerning an absolute about sin. The subject of this thread is a specific and particular sin that Our LORD Jesus Christ Himself described and decreed as having a singular status.

The answer to the concern of the OP has been stated, and quoted from the words of the LORD Jesus Christ himself. Many times it has been shown.

Matthew 12
31 Wherefore I say unto you,All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men.
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
​

Please show how Jesus could say in verse 31 that, "All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men:" but in your post, blasphemy is UNPARDONABLE?

After that statement in Matt.22:31, the LORD Jesus gets specific as to what particular form of blasphemy He is saying would not be forgiven. He even shows that is has to do with SPEAKING. Read the post above that dealt with the TONGUE, and quotes a few verses from James 3. This is a sin, not a sin of thought, but of speech. It is a sin committed by a small member of the body of man that is "set on fire of hell," and kindleth "a great matter."

It was after this particular SIN, being committed by certain Pharisees, that Jesus no longer spoke plainly to the people, but only spoke in parables. It is a great matter indeed that was kindled by the TONGUE in this instance.

was it Paul or Peter who would not even name it for fear people would do it? and he said that is why he would not name it?

 

[Avid]

NIV is not the best translation. The ASB is the most literal and the KJV.

The sin is speaking against The Holy Spirit. like the Pharisees did calling Good evil

Thank you for that. The subject is a particular thing, that is only a thing at all because Jesus Christ Himself said so. It is about the eternal status of anyone doing the particular thing, as you clearly stated in your post. the Law Giver Himself stated the

The posts seem to make the validity of Jesus' own words the object of the discussion, and now, the validity of the scriptures in general. Though it is couched in a call for MODERNITY, it is about the validity of the holy scripture for a certainty.

 

[revrobor]

NIV is not the best translation. The ASB is the most literal and the KJV.

The sin is speaking against The Holy Spirit. like the Pharisees did calling Good evil

You are mistaken and with your interpretation you create two unpardonable sins. It is obvious throughout the entire new testament that failing to accept God's free gift of salvation sends someone to Hell.

 

[Avid]

was it Paul or Peter who would not even name it for fear people would do it? and he said that is why he would not name it?

I am dancing all around this to refrain from naming Satan's "Prince." I don't wish much or ANY mention of these things beyond what scripture says.

You know, in a different Christian website, I was quoting scripture, and the whole long post vanished as I tried posting it, because the STATUS of a product of a particular sin was mentioned in the passage.

We should be mindful of these things, and beware unnecessarily repeating such things. Here, there was a person concerned about the sin, and having a detailed description showed him whether this had been done or not. I am very concerned about the souls of men, and the truth of the scripture given to convict us and to lead us to salvation.

 

[Bluelion]

Thank you for that. The subject is a particular thing, that is only a thing at all because Jesus Christ Himself said so. It is about the eternal status of anyone doing the particular thing, as you clearly stated in your post. the Law Giver Himself stated the

The posts seem to make the validity of Jesus' own words the object of the discussion, and now, the validity of the scriptures in general. Though it is couched in a call for MODERNITY, it is about the validity of the holy scripture for a certainty.

 

[Bluelion]

You are mistaken and with your interpretation you create two unpardonable sins. It is obvious throughout the entire new testament that failing to accept God's free gift of salvation sends someone to Hell.

No I am not Those are the words of Christ not mine.

Not excepting Christ is not an unforgivable sin because at any time a person can repent and be saved. However if The Holy Spirit is speaking through a person and you say it is satan as the Pharisees did, you are damn to hell from that point on whether you repent or not, in fact you can not repent at that point it is impossible you become a son of perdition.

 

[Avid]

You are mistaken and with your interpretation you create two unpardonable sins. It is obvious throughout the entire new testament that failing to accept God's free gift of salvation sends someone to Hell.

What your post tries to show is an error. This was detailed for all to see in my previous dozen posts (a baker's dozen!) Even Blasphemy of our LORD Jesus Christ can be forgiven. It is stated right in those verses. Do you see the scripture that is defied by your posts?

It is not merely Bluelion, MWood or Avid stating that there is a difference with this particular sin. It was Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God. Hear ye Him!

 

[Bluelion]

I am dancing all around this to refrain from naming Satan's "Prince." I don't wish much or ANY mention of these things beyond what scripture says.

You know, in a different Christian website, I was quoting scripture, and the whole long post vanished as I tried posting it, because the STATUS of a product of a particular sin was mentioned in the passage.

We should be mindful of these things, and beware unnecessarily repeating such things. Here, there was a person concerned about the sin, and having a detailed description showed him whether this had been done or not. I am very concerned about the souls of men, and the truth of the scripture given to convict us and to lead us to salvation.

You make a valid point. devil worshipers might read it and do it out of anger and rebellion but later on wish to be saved but it would be to late. Also it could be used as acceptance in such circles. There is a reason it is not plainly written.