[MOVED from Married Couples]I feel racist toward black men now after my husband

[RDKirk]

I feel racist toward any black men now after years of being in an abusive, controlling, relationship with my black husband.

I am white and have always had a preference towards black men until now.

I feel resentful that whenever i was with a black male- he was often abusive or controlling or violent or a cheater.

am I wrong for now being racist toward black men?

I do not like black men at all now and feel disgusted when I hear and see the typical behaviors come out of most of the black men I have ever known.

am I considered a full blown racist now that I no longer am attracted to black men and now that I see most black males as "ghetto" and abusive?

You have not said anything about him in this or your other threads that thousands of white women are not saying about white husbands.

 

[DZoolander]

Some people speak "well" and some do not however that has nothing to do with being accepted. There are other aspects that should be included. Was he cool?

"Cool" is pretty subjective...lol Actually this happened to a couple of my black friends - and I'd say that they had varying levels of "cool-ness".

What I noticed about the kids that were bused in was that there was a clear distinction that could be drawn between the girls and the boys. I was in music - so I got to know a lot of the kids from dance (which included a lot of the girls that were bused in). I made friends with a lot of them - found them all to be really friendly - and actually quite a few of them keep in contact with me to this day (mostly now on FB).

The guys, however, were kinda a different story. They made no real effort to integrate into "our" part of the student body...although in fairness I will also say that not much of a hand was extended to them either (with HS being as clique-ish as it is). Basically there were the kids that grew up in our area - and we occupied one part of the school quad/etc...and then there were the kids that were bused in - who occupied their part of the quad/area around the football field/etc.

I can't think of a single guy I knew from that group/that time - but the girls - yeah - quite a few.

 

[Hetta]

If what you are looking out for is skin color, then expect to find yourself in an abusive relationship with a pale-face man in the near future.

The truth.

These kind of behaviors are not limited to one race. People from every race can be abusive.

Closing the door to members of one race because of a bad experience is your option entirely (to the OP), but if you become verbally abusive towards members of that race, that would be over the line. Also, if you have kids, who would be mixed race, I hope that you keep your opinions to yourself.

TBH, I can't see the point in giving up on a whole race because of one bad apple.

 

[bluegreysky]

I feel racist toward any black men now after years of being in an abusive, controlling, relationship with my black husband.

I am white and have always had a preference towards black men until now.

I feel resentful that whenever i was with a black male- he was often abusive or controlling or violent or a cheater.

am I wrong for now being racist toward black men?

I do not like black men at all now and feel disgusted when I hear and see the typical behaviors come out of most of the black men I have ever known.

am I considered a full blown racist now that I no longer am attracted to black men and now that I see most black males as "ghetto" and abusive?

Well, you're not wrong for being angry with your husband for mistreating you, and I think it's pretty normal for a person to stop liking a certain type of people when someone from that category mistreats them... be it a certain race, a certain personality type, a certain social class.... It happens to alot of people. I dont' know if biblically it is right, because God calls us to forgive. But I can relate...
not with the black men, but I dated briefly..uh twice... a man who was a "bad boy". He was white but he was tattooed, into skulls and dark things, had a pess-poor attitude about life and drank and smoked and may have also done drugs. I went through a phase at 20 and 21 where I was rebellious and I wanted to go slummin' it on the wild side I guess... lol
No one liked him for me and were all happy when we broke up. He lied constantly, possibly was seeing more than one other women but I'm not sure. He used me. He got me into bad things. And guilty by association, I lost alot of respect from people. And of course I was very far from caring about God.
After he was gone and I came down from my dillusional state of thinking he was good for me or that he was worth my time, I started to hate "his kind". Basically, any lower income lower quality individual who hangs out in bars, is covered in tattoos and has a trash mouth.
people agree with me that I don't belong around those kinds of people.
But slowly I am learning not to hate.... I don't like them. Would never be friends with them...but I am learning to instead of hating pray for them because every so often one of them is redeemed to Christ.
My husband, a military veteran who also got burned by a female version of what I dated, came to hate that type of people too. while we dated and even after we got married, As soon as he saw one in the store with us or walking our way down the sidewalk, he tensed up.
"oh no... a tattooed punk!" And soon I would tense up too.
Then at my bank teller job, I met a few.
Most of the time, these types don't get a bank account for obvious reasons (they are into disreputable things that involve laundering money). But there are a couple of men and a woman who do have one with us
and they appear rough and punky... but they are decent people.
They work hard at real jobs, make a living, pay the bills. When they come in and you get to talking with them, they talk about their children whom they adore and about wanting to get into a better situation.
My point is.... not everyone who looks a certain way IS a certain way.
In time, as the past gets further away,
you may come to see that.

 

[Hetta]

If a man mistreats you - whatever race - why wouldn't you just dislike men, period, rather than men of that race? Race just seems like a random category to me.

 

[Hetta]

My point is.... not everyone who looks a certain way IS a certain way.
In time, as the past gets further away,
you may come to see that.

What a very wise post and what a great truth.

 

[bluegreysky]

Yeah I can think of 3 specifically... if you lined them up on the street and you didn't know them, you might take one look and say "trash"
but I know a little bit about them and one guy works overtime at his plumbing job even though he has a back injury because he wants to pay the child support for his little girl because he adores her.
The other guy doesn't have kids but he loves his grandma and he's very intelligent for a grown man who is a surfer/skater... those are great hobbies but often the people who are into that for a living get classified as "bums" and he looks like one but he also works hard and is very polite and can talk for hours about history and science
The woman is a bar tender at a shady bar, looks and talks like one... lol but she has I think 2 kids and a husband and works hard to help support them.

*of course I don't know if they go home and mistreat people, do illegal drugs or lie but I used to assume everyone who looked that way did all those things + didn't work and didn't care about their families and were dumb. God taught me otherwise.

 

[Inkachu]

If a man mistreats you - whatever race - why wouldn't you just dislike men, period, rather than men of that race? Race just seems like a random category to me.

FWIW when you've been abused by someone, anyone else who physically resembles that person can be a trigger for flashbacks and anxiety. My ex had red hair and freckles; sometimes if I see a man with similar features, even though I haven't seen my ex for about 13 years, my breath catches, my heart starts pounding, and my insides turn into a knot. It's completely involuntary. Obviously, my brain knows that not all men with red hair and freckles and a goatee and baseball cap will be buttholes who hurt women. It's not like I scream and run to the other side of the street. I just take a deep breath and remind myself that that's NOT my ex. But I still sometimes have that instinctive reaction. Who knows if it'll ever go away? It is what it is.

 

[DZoolander]

If a man mistreats you - whatever race - why wouldn't you just dislike men, period, rather than men of that race? Race just seems like a random category to me.

Well, yes, and no (I think).

Race is kind of random - I agree - to the extent that there really ain't a lot of difference between me as a white guy and black guy except for amount of skin pigmentation. Fundamentally/biologically we're pretty much exactly the same.

Culture - however - is a far different story...and often culture is fairly assumed to be tied into race.

For example - my thing about never wanting to date an Asian girl again when I was single. It was based upon a feeling that I believe to be pretty darn accurate about Asian culture and how Asian families interact with each other/their expectations of each other/etc.

Was it necessarily true? No. Of course there are mitigating factors that influence how strong a cultural influence remains. I suppose I could have gone through some lengthy interviewing process where I asked pertinent questions like "How many generations has your family been in America? etc - in order to try and ascertain how removed they were from "the homeland" in order to gauge how Westernized they had become/etc...but why bother?

To me - it was far easier to just say "No more Asians."

 

[Inkachu]

If someone has traumatized you, you're going to have a reaction to someone who looks similar to that person. It's just how our brains work. I guess it's some kind of primitive survival technique; you learn to be on alert for anyone resembling your attacker. The messages your brain is receiving about your environment during the abuse (what you see, hear, smell, taste, etc) are turned into warnings and alarms, to try and help you avoid it in the future. I heard of a woman who spent her entire life despising the color blue, but she never knew why until she underwent hypnotic therapy. Once she was taken back to the time of childhood abuse, she was able to remember that she was wearing blue panties when it happened. We can't always control the deep, primitive, reactive portions of our brains, especially if we aren't actively conscious of what's happened. I may not ever be able to make my heart stop skipping a beat when I see someone who resembles my ex, but I can do my best to live in spite of it and not let it affect me too deeply.

 

[seeingeyes]

If someone has traumatized you, you're going to have a reaction to someone who looks similar to that person. It's just how our brains work. I guess it's some kind of primitive survival technique; you learn to be on alert for anyone resembling your attacker. The messages your brain is receiving about your environment during the abuse (what you see, hear, smell, taste, etc) are turned into warnings and alarms, to try and help you avoid it in the future. I heard of a woman who spent her entire life despising the color blue, but she never knew why until she underwent hypnotic therapy. Once she was taken back to the time of childhood abuse, she was able to remember that she was wearing blue panties when it happened. We can't always control the deep, primitive, reactive portions of our brains, especially if we aren't actively conscious of what's happened. I may not ever be able to make my heart stop skipping a beat when I see someone who resembles my ex, but I can do my best to live in spite of it and not let it affect me too deeply.

That's very true. It's a phobia that needs to be addressed.

 

[Avniel]

"Cool" is pretty subjective...lol Actually this happened to a couple of my black friends - and I'd say that they had varying levels of "cool-ness".

What I noticed about the kids that were bused in was that there was a clear distinction that could be drawn between the girls and the boys. I was in music - so I got to know a lot of the kids from dance (which included a lot of the girls that were bused in). I made friends with a lot of them - found them all to be really friendly - and actually quite a few of them keep in contact with me to this day (mostly now on FB).

The guys, however, were kinda a different story. They made no real effort to integrate into "our" part of the student body...although in fairness I will also say that not much of a hand was extended to them either (with HS being as clique-ish as it is). Basically there were the kids that grew up in our area - and we occupied one part of the school quad/etc...and then there were the kids that were bused in - who occupied their part of the quad/area around the football field/etc.

I can't think of a single guy I knew from that group/that time - but the girls - yeah - quite a few.

I think in general people expect the black community to want to be with them. They can't understand the Latoya and the Ishas as a name and can't comprehend why blacks wouldn't pick a "proper" name for their children. I think the reality there are blacks that want to take part in the mainstream culture in america. However the more educated black men and women don't want to take part in the mainstream culture in america. I don't know any Elvis songs, I don't know any country singers except for Taylor Swift and that's because of Kanye West.

I think the reality is a good deal of black males automatically assume that they will be looked down on. I think in America, I don't want to say the world but I have been places that have had 100 times better race relations, the black american culture is seen as inferior. I have a friend on facebook he wrote that there are so many better countries for black americans to live in. It is the truth, there are places that treat black men and women 10 times better than they get treated in america. There are too many bright black men and women that use your tax dollars and get the furtherest education and leave this country for the highest bidder. In general there is no loyalty within the community towards the country.

I think the reality is black men in particular have been looked at as people that were "bused" in. We are not a part of the american culture in sense.

 

[DZoolander]

Whereas I look at it kind of like...

I don't really care if his/her name is Marty, John, Frank, Susan, Mary or Shaquille, Latoya, LaQuanda or whatever. I'll address each of them the same.

What I will say about that, however, is that it looks to me as if the name choice is a choice *on their part* to stand apart. The action segregating "them" from the group in such choices is made by them - not by me (as a white).

I don't know any country music singers, either, except maybe Garth Brooks...and only because that name was just so unavoidable back in the 90's...or the Dixie Chicks.. But - it ain't like I'm aware of them due to being cognizant of their music and/or listening to it. Rather - it was some other social thing going on (like the Dixie Chicks criticizing Bush about the war/etc). To me - country music is left to white folks sitting in their trailers, eating white-bread mayonnaise sandwiches...which I have no part of/no interest in.

The thing that's interesting to me in reading what you say - is that you almost sort of assume there's some sort of kin-ship between white folks. There really isn't. There's a huge percentage of people that I (perhaps ignorantly so) consider white trash - that I have no kin-ship or interest in beyond just a humanitarian level. Some guy shows up at my door smelling of Milwaukee's Best with a stained wife-beater, a broken down rusted out pickup, and missing a few teeth...it ain't like I'm embracing that guy and saying "my brother".

Ya know? lol

 

[RDKirk]

I think in general people expect the black community to want to be with them. They can't understand the Latoya and the Ishas as a name and can't comprehend why blacks wouldn't pick a "proper" name for their children. I think the reality there are blacks that want to take part in the mainstream culture in america. However the more educated black men and women don't want to take part in the mainstream culture in america. I don't know any Elvis songs, I don't know any country singers except for Taylor Swift and that's because of Kanye West.

I think the reality is a good deal of black males automatically assume that they will be looked down on. I think in America, I don't want to say the world but I have been places that have had 100 times better race relations, the black american culture is seen as inferior. I have a friend on facebook he wrote that there are so many better countries for black americans to live in. It is the truth, there are places that treat black men and women 10 times better than they get treated in america. There are too many bright black men and women that use your tax dollars and get the furtherest education and leave this country for the highest bidder. In general there is no loyalty within the community towards the country.

I think the reality is black men in particular have been looked at as people that were "bused" in. We are not a part of the american culture in sense.

Avniel, back in the late 50s in Oklahoma, I was a little kid in Enid, Oklahoma, watching the annual town parade with my mother.

The Enid High School marching band went past. My youngest aunt played clarinet in the Booker T Washington High School marching band, and I waited for them to see her...but the BTW band never went by.

I asked my mother why they weren't in the parade, and she answered, "We can't be in this parade. This is the white folks' parade."

We couldn't go to their schools, we couldn't go to their move theaters, we couldn't go to their restaurants, we couldn't be members of their churches, we couldn't join their social clubs, we couldn't march in their parades.

Black people were not part of white American culture. Even though black people tried hard to assimilate into white American culture, they made sure we realized "assimilation is futile."

So I adjusted to that fact, and by the time I was a teenager, I realized that white American culture was deeply flawed in many ways, and that I didn't want to be part of it.

I fled that to the military, which is a different culture--a superior culture. Yes, there was certainly racism in the military, but at least the professed cultural norm was that race was irrelevant and we were all equally part of the culture. At least I could go to the military clubs and theaters and march in the military parades.

I'm back in the civilian world now, after a long military career, and I find very little truly changed in civilian culture. The old divide is still there, but there are some small new ones. The white American culture is still just as deeply flawed--more so in many ways--and won't acknowledge its flaws. What is presented as the "African-American culture" is broken and can't be fixed because that culture as well won't acknowledge its flaws.

Sadly, being a middle-class black in America is to be invisible. Incredibly, neither blacks nor whites really believe a black middle class exists, not in their guts where they make their political and economic decisions.

When they see us standing in front of them, they see only their own stereotypes. My suit and tie and laptop case are irrelevant. We're not members of either culture.

I seek desperately for the culture I read about in the New Testament, the culture of Acts 2 and Acts 4, that Body of Christ Paul spoke of with its members all working together in common cause, that Nation of God and "house of living stones" that Peter wrote about. I know it exists--I've found it in other countries where Christianity isn't the "default" and Christians must necessarily cling to one another.

But I'm still not finding it in the United States. It seems like Christians in America would rather cling to the cultural divisions of Anerica than to be members of the culture of the kingdon of Heaven.

 

[DZoolander]

Just out of curiosity, where do you live?

 

[RDKirk]

Just out of curiosity, where do you live?

Texas right now, moved from Illinois. However, I've also spent time in Nebraska and DC. Most of my military time was in the Far East.

 

[DZoolander]

I remember a few years back - I had this girlfriend who was black (not girlfriend as in dating - but rather just a friend who was a girl...) who lived in a pretty rural area of Colorado. She kept complaining to me that nobody wanted to date her - that she felt like sort of the odd man out - etc...and that she was really lonely.

My advice to her was...."what the heck do you expect? You're living in rural Colorado. I'd guess you're probaly the only black face in town. Want to date/have a happy life in that respect - you should move."

She hated that advice - and vehemently argued with me about it... "That's not how it should be. Why should I have to move?"

Why...? Because you want something that the area you are living in is incapable of providing for you. It's up to you to decide what you want in your life. Do you want to be the social warrior - fighting for future people(s) to maybe have a better time than you did by pushing boundaries until it becomes the norm - or do you want to have a happy contented life for yourself at the moment.

You can have either - but you can't have both.

Now, honestly, if I were a black guy looking to minimize the effects of racism - I dunno if living in an ex confederate state or living in places like Nebraska/Oklahoma would be the choice I would make. I think certain areas of the country just have too much baggage associated with it (and it also really can't be nailed down to a "North/South Civil War" type thing either - because some of the northern states have an equal amount of nonsense going on).

Rather - if I were a black guy wanting to make a go of it - I'd move to the west coast that wasn't a part of any of that nonsense. Maybe San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, San Diego, certain parts of LA, etc.

But that's just me.

 

[puppii]

and by the way....i do know I will be banned after this thread for sure!!! since its a very racist , honest post and guess what???

I do not CARE!

I find this forum filled with very drama filled, un-helpful, christian people---(MINUS- the FEW who know who they are, who have helped me and have given me info in there posts or private messages)

You guys who helped no who you are

thanks again.


I am lined up with my new apartment.AWAY FROM my abusive, money controlling husband-who allowed me nothing more than a few iced coffees at dunkin donuts monthly!

Im done with that crap

I'm sorry for your bad experiences here as well as in your personal life. I hope it gets better for you. I'll pray for you.

 

[RDKirk]

You can have either - but you can't have both.

Now, honestly, if I were a black guy looking to minimize the effects of racism - I dunno if living in an ex confederate state or living in places like Nebraska/Oklahoma would be the choice I would make. I think certain areas of the country just have too much baggage associated with it (and it also really can't be nailed down to a "North/South Civil War" type thing either - because some of the northern states have an equal amount of nonsense going on).

Rather - if I were a black guy wanting to make a go of it - I'd move to the west coast that wasn't a part of any of that nonsense. Maybe San Francisco, Seattle, Portland, San Diego, certain parts of LA, etc.

But that's just me.

I've spent some time on the west coast, too, although not more than a few months. It's not Paradise. I've lived in Hawaii for a number of years, too...the racism there is quite different from anywhere on the Mainland and easily more acceptable.

But you miss my point. When I spent time in fellowship with Christians who were born in Japan and Korea, I was with people who were as different from me in terms of the cultures we were born into as people could be.

But in terms of the culture we were born again into...man, we saw eye-to-eye on it all. It was incredible. It made me realize, this guy is my true fellow countryman. We could discuss good, bad, right, wrong, love, hate, honor, dishonor, justice, injustice, and we're right on the same page. This guy eats fish heads and spoiled cabbage, but he is my true kinsman. Most importantly, I was not a black American to him...I was a fellow Christian.

Then I come back to the States and talk to someone who was born and raised (the first time) right where I was, someone who by all appearances should be just like me...but he seems like an alien. Maybe we both like steak and baked potato, but in every important way, we're from different worlds.

He was different from me because he was not a Christian. But something is very, very wrong when people who are supposed to be Christian put the culture they were born into the first time ahead of the culture they were born again into.

Now, to bring this back to the topic, the issue for choosing a mate is not color or culture, it's finding a person who is also in Christ. We make a mistake when we are attracted--or disaffected by cultures we were born into the first time, either as attractions or as disaffections.

 

[DZoolander]

Which is just absolutely bizarre for me to read - because it's always been my experience that Asians are hands down the MOST racist people I've ever come across. Heck - look at the word Gaijin. It doesn't really simply mean "outsider" or "foreigner" - it has the meaning of Barbarian that comes along with it.

Koreans are kinda the same. Heck - asians are even racist amongst their own groups. On the top of the totem are the Japanese - after that the Koreans (except the Koreans would disagree, and think they're on the top) - after that the Chinese - going all the way down until you get to the Cambodians and purebred Indonesian - who are generally considered the bottom rungs (and not coincidentally - because they're the darkest). Pretty much all Asian groups accept that ranking.

In contrast, as a white guy - who grew up in Southern California - I can honestly say that in my whole life I've only known one white guy that ever dared use the word (n-word). One guy - out of 44 years - and heard him use the word once. And it wasn't even like he was a cool or accepted kid. Rather - he was kind of a cross eyed social pariah.

Then I remember who I've known that was most prolific with it's use...my ex-wife's family (Chinese/Indonesian).

When my ex-wife's sister was going to UCLA - I remember she had a black friend she used to study with. One night she invited him over to study at their house...and her mom flipped her lid. She wouldn't even come out of her room - and sat there from across the house screaming at whomever may listen "What's that nnnnnnnn doing in my house?????" until the guy got so uncomfortable he had to leave...and I felt compelled to apologize to the guy - simply by virtue of being there.

Later - the mom came up to me and said "Talk to her - tell her not to date black guys."

My response was "You know there are pockets of white trash out there that would look at me dating your Asian daughter and think it was akin to race mixing/an abomination/me being a race traitor, right?"

"Yes"

"How's this any different?"

"Don't tell her that."

...and I'm the white guy.

Truthfully - every white guy I know feels exactly the same way. Now - I didn't grow up in the backwoods of Mississippi - or some other such God forsaken place - but - at least within the realm of my experience I can say the attitude that I expressed is the majority attitude.

...and of the Asians I know - my wife's family's attitude was the majority attitude.

So I'm curious - this "world without race utopia" you found in Japan - let me ask you. How do you think they would've reacted if you'd said you wanted to marry their daughter?