Is celebrating xmas a sin??

[pat34lee]

You're right, the Bible never contradicts itself but the New Testament completes what God started in the Old Testament. You either accept that the New Covenant makes the old Covenant obsolete or you ignore the New Testament altogether. What will it be?

What it is, is that you are wrong, and teaching false doctrine as I
already showed you. Plus you are teaching that false doctrine in
the wrong denomination, as you are not messianic.

The new covenant is not in effect yet. Do you need the proof again?

 

[gadar perets]

There was a temple then right?

Yes, but the temple is not needed to keep the Feast Days.

1 Corinthians 5:7 speaks of Christ our Passover ... Which is the feast he was referring to...Which is the lords supper or communion if you will, that is what we should keep .. Not keeping the old leaven which is the old covenant... As I understand it

Your understanding is not correct. Yes, Messiah is our Passover, but he died on Abib 14. The "feast" Paul spoke of started on the next day, Abib 15 which is day one of the seven day Feast of Unleavened Bread. We keep the "Lord's Supper" on the night in which he was betrayed (Abib 14). We keep the "feast" the following night.

We know Jesus will return and rebuild a temple and establish tabernacles, but until then we honor Christ through keeping the feast of unleaven bread through communion (not in a catholic sense) but through brotherhood remembering what the lord has done for us.

Our brotherhood and honoring of Messiah takes place 365 days a year. YHWH desires for us to keep the FOUB for seven days to;

1) remember what He did for Israel in bringing them out of Egyptian slavery
2) remember what He has done for us in bringing us out of slavery to sin
3) to remind us to continually get the leaven of sin, hypocrisy, false doctrine, etc., out of our lives.​

If Christ was our Passover then sacrifices to the temple were no longer needed to be observed which was the proper way to keep Passover in those days

We no longer need to sacrifice a Passover lamb since Yeshua fulfilled that aspect of Abib 14. We remember his death through the bread and cup, but we remember to live as he lived (unleavened) through keeping the Feast of Unleavened Bread from Abib 15-21.

 

[gadar perets]

As far as being in the wrong group is concerned, I would say calling yourself a non-trinitarian Messianic, excludes you from this group more than me. Why don't we let the mods decide?

I think you have pat34lee (Messianic) confused with me (non-trinitarian Messianic)

 

[StanJ]

I think you have pat34lee (Messianic) confused with me (non-trinitarian Messianic)

Oops sorry.

 

[pat34lee]

You haven't shown anything, although I keep asking. Assertions mean nothing. You have to first prove your initial point by showing it in Scripture and then you have to prove that what I said from scripture is wrong.

Tell you what. Ask one question with scripture and I'll answer
if you answer one back. Directly, no evading.

 

[StanJ]

Tell you what. Ask one question with scripture and I'll answer
if you answer one back. Directly, no evading.

Is the following link correct or not?
http://www.accordingtothescriptures.org/prophecy/353prophecies.html

 

[pat34lee]

Is the following link correct or not?
http://www.accordingtothescriptures.org/prophecy/353prophecies.html

353 Prophecies. Correct.

 

[StanJ]

353 Prophecies. Correct.

So look at 295 and tell me why you were saying it is incorrect?

 

[pat34lee]

So look at 295 and tell me why you were saying it is incorrect?

First, we have to look at the prophecy itself. What is one thing
rarely spoken about it? (in bold)

Next, notice the bold italics.

Jeremiah 31:31-34 (KJV)
31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

This covenant, like most of the others is ONLY with Judah and Israel, the 12 tribes.
Gentiles are only added on by faith in Jesus, and adoption into Israel, the nation.
As you said, Judah rejected the covenant and Israel didn't accept either. Not yet.
So, no covenant.

Jesus is the fulfillment, but 'after those days' is always the end times in scripture.

Even in Hebrews 8:13 it says this is future, not past or present.

13 In speaking of a new covenant, He has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.…

As for obsolete, my computer is obsolete, but it still runs.

The following article may be clearer, and explains in detail.
http://www.lightofmashiach.org/newcovenant.html

 

[xpower]

You know there are people out there who can't celebrate their (or there child's) birthday on the exact day they were born all the time. Most likely because they couldn't afford it that time so they celebrated it some days or even a week later. What I'm getting at is you don't have to celebrate somebody's birthday on the exact day they were born, based on my experience.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

Is the following link correct or not?
http://www.accordingtothescriptures.org/prophecy/353prophecies.html

I’m curious, where in scripture is 353 the magic number for determining who a messiah is? I mean, I fulfilled quite a few of the prophesies too. I am asking because that list looks odd on what some people would consider as a true “prophecy”. Have a mom, check. Step on a snake, check…

 

[gadar perets]

Jeremiah 31:31-34
31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

This covenant, like most of the others is ONLY with Judah and Israel, the 12 tribes.
Gentiles are only added on by faith in Jesus, and adoption into Israel, the nation.
As you said, Judah rejected the covenant and Israel didn't accept either. Not yet.
So, no covenant.

Not true. The New Covenant was dedicated with the blood of Yeshua (Matthew 26:28; Hebrews 9:14-20). The New Covenant has not been entered into by unbelieving Judah and Israel, but it has been entered into by believers in Messiah Yeshua who comprise the true Israel of YHWH. We partake of the New Covenant by partaking of Yeshua’s blood, not only symbolically through the cup of the Master’s Supper, but through his shed blood that continually cleanses us upon confession of sin. Unbelieving Judah and Israel may choose to enter the NC in the future when their veil of blindness is lifted.

Jesus is the fulfillment, but 'after those days' is always the end times in scripture.

I agree concerning “AFTER those days”, but “those days” also refers to Yeshua’s first coming (Jeremiah 33:15). So, if “those days” can refer to the time when Yeshua was growing up as the “Branch of righteousness”, then “after those days” would refer to a time after his first coming. The New Covenant will be made with the House of Judah and the House of Israel in the end times, but it was already made and dedicated during Yeshua’s first coming. Anyone choosing to enter it by receiving Yeshua as their Master and Savior and appropriating his shed blood to themselves begin to enjoy the blessings of the NC immediately. Those blessings would include a better sacrifice in the blood of Messiah Yeshua vs. animal blood, a better mediator in Messiah vs. Moses, a better ministration in the spirit vs. the letter, a better High Priest in Yeshua vs. Aaron, a better priesthood after the order of Melkizedek vs. Levi, better promises based on the eternal rather than the temporal, and a better tabernacle made without hands.

Even in Hebrews 8:13 it says this is future, not past or present.

13 In speaking of a new covenant, He has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.…

As for obsolete, my computer is obsolete, but it still runs.

Why is your computer obsolete? Because newer and better ones are available for anyone who desires to discard their old ones and use the new ones. Why is the first covenant “obsolete”? Because the NC has come. Yes, the OC is obsolete, and yet, it is still in effect, but only for unbelieving Judah and Israel. They are still living under the OC. Believers in Messiah Yeshua are living under the NC. Saul of Tarsus, for example, was of the tribe of Benjamin and living under the OC. When he was converted to Yeshua, the OC became obsolete for him and he began enjoying the blessings of the NC. His unbelieving peers remained under the OC.

Paul wrote the following in 2 Cor.3:6-11:

"Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament (covenant); not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
But if the ministration of death [OC], written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
How shall not the ministration of the spirit [NC] be rather glorious?
For if the ministration of condemnation [OC] be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness [NC] exceed in glory. For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth. For if that which is done away was glorious [OC] , much more that which remaineth is glorious [NC]."​

Believers in Messiah Yeshua are “ministers of the New Covenant”.

Paul also wrote an allegory of the two covenants in Galatians 4:22-31. His conclusion is this:

Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son [OC]: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free [NC]. Galatians 4:30-31​

All believers in Messiah Yeshua are to cast out the Old Covenant and become children of the New Covenant.

The following article may be clearer, and explains in detail.
http://www.lightofmashiach.org/newcovenant.html[/QUOTE]

This article is a false.

 

[gadar perets]

You know there are people out there who can't celebrate their (or there child's) birthday on the exact day they were born all the time. Most likely because they couldn't afford it that time so they celebrated it some days or even a week later. What I'm getting at is you don't have to celebrate somebody's birthday on the exact day they were born, based on my experience.

I agree. If anyone desires to celebrate Messiah's birth, why choose December 25 knowing it's pagan roots go back to Mithraism and the Saturnalia/Brumalia festivals? If someone didn't know that, but later found out about it, they should look into it and then choose a more correct date in the Fall. Its great that many believers are putting away all the pagan trappings of modern xmas celebrations, but they need to go a step further and change the entire season they celebrate it.

 

[Albion]

I agree. If anyone desires to celebrate Messiah's birth, why choose December 25 knowing it's pagan roots go back to Mithraism and the Saturnalia/Brumalia festivals?

I realize that it's far back in this thread's list of posts by now, but what you ask was answered in post #39.

 

[pat34lee]

Not true. The New Covenant was dedicated with the blood of Yeshua (Matthew 26:28; Hebrews 9:14-20). The New Covenant has not been entered into by unbelieving Judah and Israel, but it has been entered into by believers in Messiah Yeshua who comprise the true Israel of YHWH.

Not much point in the rest when you start by adding to scripture here.
That is a no-no. What is your scriptural basis for a covenant with gentiles
that is not to the Jew and Israel first? Matthew is just him and Jewish disciples.

 

[danny ski]

I’m curious, where in scripture is 353 the magic number for determining who a messiah is? I mean, I fulfilled quite a few of the prophesies too. I am asking because that list looks odd on what some people would consider as a true “prophecy”. Have a mom, check. Step on a snake, check…

Lol! Don't even waste your time on that list. Those are just random, out of context snippets of the Tanakh that don't survive even a cursory examination.

 

[gadar perets]

Not much point in the rest when you start by adding to scripture here.
That is a no-no. What is your scriptural basis for a covenant with gentiles
that is not to the Jew and Israel first? Matthew is just him and Jewish disciples.

Nice try at avoiding the rest of my post. What have I added? That Gentiles cannot be part of the New Covenant? Were they permitted to be part of the Old Covenant? Yes.

Exodus 12:49 One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourns among you.​

Isaiah 56:6 Also the sons of the stranger, that join themselves to YHWH, to serve Him, and to love the name of YHWH, to be His servants, every one that keeps the Sabbath from polluting it, and takes hold of my covenant;​

If they can be part of the OC by becoming a proselyte, serving and loving YHWH, then they can be part of the NC by doing the same. The way a Gentile becomes part of Israel is by being grafted in through faith in Yeshua. It does not matter if a person is an adopted son or a natural born son. They both partake of YHWH's covenants.

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Messiah: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believes; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
​

The Gospel of Messiah includes entering into the New Covenant through the blood of Messiah. It was available to the Jew first. When they thought themselves unworthy of everlasting life under the New Covenant, it was opened to the Greeks/Gentiles as well (Acts 13:46).

 

[pat34lee]

Lol! Don't even waste your time on that list. Those are just random, out of context snippets of the Tanakh that don't survive even a cursory examination.

Those were accepted prophecies long before Yeshua came
to fulfill the first set, and they still will when he fulfills the rest.

 

[pat34lee]

I’m curious, where in scripture is 353 the magic number for determining who a messiah is? I mean, I fulfilled quite a few of the prophesies too. I am asking because that list looks odd on what some people would consider as a true “prophecy”. Have a mom, check. Step on a snake, check…

When you get to 100 then you're getting somewhere.
All of scripture was written for a purpose. And it was
written in particular ways for a reason.

 

[pat34lee]

Nice try at avoiding the rest of my post. What have I added? That Gentiles cannot be part of the New Covenant? Were they permitted to be part of the Old Covenant? Yes.

The old covenant was made with Israel first. You are having the gentiles
steal the new covenant, which is not in effect with Israel. That is replacement
theology (church replaces Israel in God's heart and takes their covenants.)

To the Jew first, then the gentile. ALWAYS. Not just available to.
If Judah and Israel are not signed up, nobody is.

Care to try answering the unanswerable if the new covenant is
in effect? If God wrote his laws on your inward parts, what are
the laws (word for word), and why do you continue to sin? No
fair looking online or reading anything for answers.