I never knew you, Depart from me!

[HannibalFlavius]

To Hannibal , where are your scripture verses to prove your points? There are none. Please provide them . You mentioned that you do not believe that ones salvation not the most important thing in a person's walk. How do you get this? This is what God wants, that everyone would come to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. God wants us to extend the great commission to a lost and dying world! Read the book of Acts. What is important to Him should be important to us. Anyways, if one is not saved, what could be worse ! Think about that .

I understand that everyone needs salvation but salvation is not reward. Moses was warned to build the tabernacle exactly how the instruction are given because it represents the kingdom of heaven. The temple is in 3 sections and the outer court is filled with people who are saved but these people did not make it in the temple proper because they did not become Israel.

The language of the outer court is found in many saying of Jesus. When people are sent to outer darkness where they weep and gnash their teeth, this outer darkness is the outer court where there is only sunlight, but the light in the temple is the light of God.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. This life word is ,'' Zoe.'' a more abundant life.

The way is the entrance into the outer court where there is salvation at the brazen alter. But a person must progress into the Holy place of TRUTH where there is bread and the Menorah for truly learning who God is. Then a person needs to continue to the last entrance where there is life.

That's why Ezekiel says,'' Show the temple to the children of Israel so that they may be ashamed of their sins.'' Show them the comings and goings of the Temple.

Anyone who knows the design of the temple knows that the people in the outer court are gentiles needing to become Israel.

People often claim to be the temple but yet they know nothing of the comings and goings of the Temple or that the temple is in 3 parts and this is a shame, its a shame because a person needs to know that there are 3 parts in order to progress to Israel.

 

[Strong in Him]

I Never Knew You

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!


This scripture says so much about the law, and it looks real clear to me what Jesus is saying.

Is there something I am missing?

Is lawlessness lawlessness?

Is it supposed to mean something else?

I say that I know Jesus and I know him through the law and temple design.

I know him through the 7 feasts of the Messiah, I know him in a way that only comes from meditating on the Torah night and day.

He is the law, He is the word.

Yes, Jesus is the Messiah prophesied in Scripture.
You are displaying the flag of Israel, so are you Jewish? If so, Jesus told the Jews that he had come to fulfil the law, not to abolish it. He told the couple on the road to Emmaus that the law and the prophets all spoke of his coming. Christ, the anointed One, is the fulfilment of the law and prophets. He has fulfilled the Jewish law; all has been finished and completed in him.

However, I am not a Jew, and the law was not given at Sinai to Gentiles. I am not under the law and never have been.
Christ is my all. He is the Word, the alpha and Omega, the beginning and the nd, the author and perfector of my faith. I have been saved through him, been reconciled to God by his death and through him have EVERY spiritual blessing. So I, and other gentiles, am not commanded to keep the law.

Jesus told us to do the will of his heavenly Father. What is that?
"For I have come down from heaven, not to do my will, but to do the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose none of those he has given me ........ For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him, shall have eternal life." John 6:38-40.

Other Scriptures say it is God's will that we should be holy (1 Thess 4:3); that it is his will that we should rejoice always, pray continually and give thanks in all circumstances (1 Thess 5:16-18), and that we should be transformed by the renewing of our minds, if we want to know God's good, perfect and pleasing will.

God does have a plan for our lives and does want us to do good - but his will is far more than doing.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

. He has fulfilled the Jewish law; all has been finished and completed in him.

No he has not, all is not finished and completed.

How in the world could you say that all is complete when it IS NOT.

Example---- Zechariah 14 says that the whole world will have to keep the feast of Tabernacles.

Do you say that this has already happened?

Many prophecies are yet unfulfilled.

Ephraim has not become with Judah, and nobody even knows where Ephraim Ephraim is, Joseph is lost.

The wealth of the nations has not come to Israel either, 10 men will come from every nation and grasp hold of a Jew saying,'' Let us go up to the mountain of the Lord with you.'' This is a gentile begging a Jew to teach him. Hasn't happened because gentiles are not gathered to Jews and they have not become one with Jews.

Zechariah says that when the children of Joseph have been found, Joseoh and Judah combine and together they swoop down on the gentile nations. Not happened.

Zechariah says the Lord will come to Judah first so that the inhabitants of Jerusalem and the house of David cannot boast about Judah and later the house of David become like God, like the angel of the Lord standing before God. Has not happened.

Jesus say that not a jot or tittle will pass from the law unless the sun refused to shine and the we have a new heaven. He says that all must be fulfilled and all has not been fulfilled.

The coming of the Lord is as the rain. There are two comings of rain in Israel. Jesus came during the spring rains for Passover and Pentecost, but the fall rains go unfulfilled, and we know this because you have no sukkot covering, you have no incorruptible body, and the whole world is in fact, NOT KEEPING THE FEAST OF TABERNACLES....

Do you keep the feast of Tabernacles Strong?

If not, then why not?

You say that all is fulfilled, then are you and all your fellows keeping Tabernacles?

NO, your aren't are you?

You think you don't have to don't you?

And how can all things be fulfilled if you yourself will not fulfill them?

 

[Strong in Him]

No he has not, all is not finished and completed.

Jesus said that he had come to fulfil the law and the prophets (Matt 5:17.) And on the cross he said, "it is finished" (John 19:30).

There are some things that will not be finished until he comes again - i.e, his kingdom is here now now; it will not be fully here until he returns. Suffering, pain and death will also one day be completely wiped out.
But everything needed for salvation has already been done

Do you keep the feast of Tabernacles Strong?

If not, then why not?

Because I'm not a Jew, do not have Jewish ancestors and have not been instructed, or commanded, to keep it.

Lev 23 gives instructions about the feast of Tabernacles. Verses 42-43 say;
"Live in booths for 7 days. All native born Israelites are to live in booths so that your descendants will know that I made the Israelites live in booths when I brought them out of Egypt. I am the Lord your God."

I am not a native born Israelite. My ancestors were not brought out of slavery in Egypt. What's more, I do not have any animals that I can sacrifice to the Lord as an offering, by fire, (Lev 23:33-36). We don't do these things here; I'd probably be prosecuted by the RSPCA if I attempted it.

I HAVE been rescued from slavery - slavery to sin; through the Son of God, the Messiah, who became flesh and "tabernacled among us" (John 1:14, Greek interlinear NT). I have accepted Jesus as my Saviour. I live in him and he lives in me. Jesus told us to do something to remember his death on the cross - and that was to take bread and wine. The bread, his body, the bread of life; the wine symbolic of the fact that Christ, the true vine, shed his blood for us. We do this at our services of holy communion.

NO, your aren't are you?

You think you don't have to don't you?

I don't have to - Scripture says I don't, (see above.)

And how can all things be fulfilled if you yourself will not fulfill them?

If God gives a prophecy, God will fulfill it and in fact it is up to him to do so. Otherwise that would mean that some of God's prophecies - things that he has said WILL happen - would be dependant on the will and whim of men and some of them would never happen.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

This is what I say to God's people today, be of good cheer!
20th of AV




יב. וְהָיָה | עֵקֶב תִּשְׁמְעוּן אֵת הַמִּשְׁפָּטִים הָאֵלֶּה וּשְׁמַרְתֶּם וַעֲשִׂיתֶם אֹתָם וְשָׁמַר יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ לְךָ אֶת הַבְּרִית וְאֶת הַחֶסֶד אֲשֶׁר נִשְׁבַּע לַאֲבֹתֶיךָ: יג. וַאֲהֵבְךָ וּבֵרַכְךָ וְהִרְבֶּךָ וּבֵרַךְ פְּרִי בִטְנְךָ וּפְרִי אַדְמָתֶךָ דְּגָנְךָ וְתִירשְׁךָ וְיִצְהָרֶךָ שְׁגַר אֲלָפֶיךָ וְעַשְׁתְּרֹת צֹאנֶךָ עַל הָאֲדָמָה אֲשֶׁר נִשְׁבַּע לַאֲבֹתֶיךָ לָתֶת לָךְ: יד. בָּרוּךְ תִּהְיֶה מִכָּל הָעַמִּים לֹא יִהְיֶה בְךָ עָקָר וַעֲקָרָה וּבִבְהֶמְתֶּךָ: טו. וְהֵסִיר יְהֹוָה מִמְּךָ כָּל חֹלִי וְכָל מַדְוֵי מִצְרַיִם הָרָעִים אֲשֶׁר יָדַעְתָּ לֹא יְשִׂימָם בָּךְ וּנְתָנָם בְּכָל שׂנְאֶיךָ: טז. וְאָכַלְתָּ אֶת כָּל הָעַמִּים אֲשֶׁר יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ נֹתֵן לָךְ לֹא תָחוֹס עֵינְךָ עֲלֵיהֶם וְלֹא תַעֲבֹד אֶת אֱלֹהֵיהֶם כִּי מוֹקֵשׁ הוּא לָךְ: יז. כִּי תֹאמַר בִּלְבָבְךָ רַבִּים הַגּוֹיִם הָאֵלֶּה מִמֶּנִּי אֵיכָה אוּכַל לְהוֹרִישָׁם: יח. לֹא תִירָא מֵהֶם זָכֹר תִּזְכֹּר אֵת אֲשֶׁר עָשָׂה יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ לְפַרְעֹה וּלְכָל מִצְרָיִם: יט. הַמַּסֹּת הַגְּדֹלֹת אֲשֶׁר רָאוּ עֵינֶיךָ וְהָאֹתֹת וְהַמֹּפְתִים וְהַיָּד הַחֲזָקָה וְהַזְּרֹעַ הַנְּטוּיָה אֲשֶׁר הוֹצִאֲךָ יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ כֵּן יַעֲשֶׂה יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ לְכָל הָעַמִּים אֲשֶׁר אַתָּה יָרֵא מִפְּנֵיהֶם: כ. וְגַם אֶת הַצִּרְעָה יְשַׁלַּח יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ בָּם עַד אֲבֹד הַנִּשְׁאָרִים וְהַנִּסְתָּרִים מִפָּנֶיךָ: כא. לֹא תַעֲרֹץ מִפְּנֵיהֶם כִּי יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ בְּקִרְבֶּךָ אֵל גָּדוֹל וְנוֹרָא: כב. וְנָשַׁל יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ אֶת הַגּוֹיִם הָאֵל מִפָּנֶיךָ מְעַט מְעָט לֹא תוּכַל כַּלֹּתָם מַהֵר פֶּן תִּרְבֶּה עָלֶיךָ חַיַּת הַשָּׂדֶה: כג. וּנְתָנָם יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ לְפָנֶיךָ וְהָמָם מְהוּמָה גְדֹלָה עַד הִשָּׁמְדָם: כד. וְנָתַן מַלְכֵיהֶם בְּיָדֶךָ וְהַאֲבַדְתָּ אֶת שְׁמָם מִתַּחַת הַשָּׁמָיִם לֹא יִתְיַצֵּב אִישׁ בְּפָנֶיךָ עַד הִשְׁמִדְךָ אֹתָם: כה. פְּסִילֵי אֱלֹהֵיהֶם תִּשְׂרְפוּן בָּאֵשׁ לֹא תַחְמֹד כֶּסֶף וְזָהָב עֲלֵיהֶם וְלָקַחְתָּ לָךְ פֶּן תִּוָּקֵשׁ בּוֹ כִּי תוֹעֲבַת יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ הוּא: כו. וְלֹא תָבִיא תוֹעֵבָה אֶל בֵּיתֶךָ וְהָיִיתָ חֵרֶם כָּמֹהוּ שַׁקֵּץ | תְּשַׁקְּצֶנּוּ וְתַעֵב | תְּתַעֲבֶנּוּ כִּי חֵרֶם הוּא:


א. כָּל הַמִּצְוָה אֲשֶׁר אָנֹכִי מְצַוְּךָ הַיּוֹם תִּשְׁמְרוּן לַעֲשׂוֹת לְמַעַן תִּחְיוּן וּרְבִיתֶם וּבָאתֶם וִירִשְׁתֶּם אֶת הָאָרֶץ אֲשֶׁר נִשְׁבַּע יְהֹוָה לַאֲבֹתֵיכֶם: ב. וְזָכַרְתָּ אֶת כָּל הַדֶּרֶךְ אֲשֶׁר הוֹלִיכְךָ יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ זֶה אַרְבָּעִים שָׁנָה בַּמִּדְבָּר לְמַעַן עַנֹּתְךָ לְנַסֹּתְךָ לָדַעַת אֶת אֲשֶׁר בִּלְבָבְךָ הֲתִשְׁמֹר מִצְו[bless and do not curse]ֹתָיו אִם לֹא: ג. וַיְעַנְּךָ וַיַּרְעִבֶךָ וַיַּאֲכִלְךָ אֶת הַמָּן אֲשֶׁר לֹא יָדַעְתָּ וְלֹא יָדְעוּן אֲבֹתֶיךָ לְמַעַן הוֹדִיעֲךָ כִּי לֹא עַל הַלֶּחֶם לְבַדּוֹ יִחְיֶה הָאָדָם כִּי עַל כָּל מוֹצָא פִי יְהֹוָה יִחְיֶה הָאָדָם: ד. שִׂמְלָתְךָ לֹא בָלְתָה מֵעָלֶיךָ וְרַגְלְךָ לֹא בָצֵקָה זֶה אַרְבָּעִים שָׁנָה: ה. וְיָדַעְתָּ עִם לְבָבֶךָ כִּי כַּאֲשֶׁר יְיַסֵּר אִישׁ אֶת בְּנוֹ יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ מְיַסְּרֶךָּ: ו. וְשָׁמַרְתָּ אֶת מִצְוֹת יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ לָלֶכֶת בִּדְרָכָיו וּלְיִרְאָה אֹתוֹ: ז. כִּי יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ מְבִיאֲךָ אֶל אֶרֶץ טוֹבָה אֶרֶץ נַחֲלֵי מָיִם עֲיָנֹת וּתְהֹמֹת יֹצְאִים בַּבִּקְעָה וּבָהָר: ח. אֶרֶץ חִטָּה וּשְׂעֹרָה וְגֶפֶן וּתְאֵנָה וְרִמּוֹן אֶרֶץ זֵית שֶׁמֶן וּדְבָשׁ: ט. אֶרֶץ אֲשֶׁר לֹא בְמִסְכֵּנֻת תֹּאכַל בָּהּ לֶחֶם לֹא תֶחְסַר כֹּל בָּהּ אֶרֶץ אֲשֶׁר אֲבָנֶיהָ בַרְזֶל וּמֵהֲרָרֶיהָ תַּחְצֹב נְחשֶׁת: י. וְאָכַלְתָּ וְשָׂבָעְתָּ וּבֵרַכְתָּ אֶת יְהֹוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ עַל הָאָרֶץ הַטֹּבָה אֲשֶׁר נָתַן לָךְ:

If anybody was wondering about this, its easy to figure out.

This is the Torah portion for the 20th of Av, and its the way to watch at all times.

When Jesus stood up and read Isaiah 61, it was because that was the Torah Portion for that day, it puts an exact date on many sayings.

There are exact prayers on exact days and when you find a prayer or Torah portion being read, you know exactly what day it is and exctly what is happening.

For instance, Revelation shows a prayer saying,'' The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord and his God.''

This prayer is said on an exact date every single year, and so we know the exact date of this occurrence in Revelation and we know what is taking place.

There are many, many saying and prayers and dates that come together as a science, the Torah begins and ends on Simchat Torah and we are told to watch, this is the way you are to watch, through the Torah portions continuously watching the Hebrew date and keeping track of all the Holy days and fasts, and the prayers and scriptures that accompany them.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

Jesus said that he had come to fulfil the law and the prophets (Matt 5:17.) And on the cross he said, "it is finished" (John 19:30).

There are some things that will not be finished until he comes again - i.e, his kingdom is here now now; it will not be fully here until he returns. Suffering, pain and death will also one day be completely wiped out.
But everything needed for salvation has already been done



Because I'm not a Jew, do not have Jewish ancestors and have not been instructed, or commanded, to keep it.

Lev 23 gives instructions about the feast of Tabernacles. Verses 42-43 say;
"Live in booths for 7 days. All native born Israelites are to live in booths so that your descendants will know that I made the Israelites live in booths when I brought them out of Egypt. I am the Lord your God."

I am not a native born Israelite. My ancestors were not brought out of slavery in Egypt. What's more, I do not have any animals that I can sacrifice to the Lord as an offering, by fire, (Lev 23:33-36). We don't do these things here; I'd probably be prosecuted by the RSPCA if I attempted it.

I HAVE been rescued from slavery - slavery to sin; through the Son of God, the Messiah, who became flesh and "tabernacled among us" (John 1:14, Greek interlinear NT). I have accepted Jesus as my Saviour. I live in him and he lives in me. Jesus told us to do something to remember his death on the cross - and that was to take bread and wine. The bread, his body, the bread of life; the wine symbolic of the fact that Christ, the true vine, shed his blood for us. We do this at our services of holy communion.



I don't have to - Scripture says I don't, (see above.)



If God gives a prophecy, God will fulfill it and in fact it is up to him to do so. Otherwise that would mean that some of God's prophecies - things that he has said WILL happen - would be dependant on the will and whim of men and some of them would never happen.

Now see these are the words of a true gentile standing in the gentile court.

To begin with, the gentile nations ARE demanded to keep God's feasts, they are not Jewish feasts, they are God's feasts, and all people experience the coming out of Egypt, and the Passover lamb and Sukkot Bull are specifically why you think you have salvation although you obviously deny Christ in them.

You talk of Communion and this is the Passover seder, But Paul told us to keep the Passover in truth and in spirit. Here's what so crazy Strong, Your going to try and tell a non believer that you have a Passover lamb but I don't believe you at all.

You may try and tell a non believer that you have a sukkot bull, again, I don't believe you because you prove yourself wrong from jump street.

And how will you witness to a non believer saying that you have a Passover lamb when you reject the Passover?
And how will you even talk about your salvation in a thing which you yourself reject saying,'' Those things are not for me.

The prophets speak of a Passover for all the nations and Egypt and Assyria wander 40 years{a time of trial}. The prophets say that all people will keep the Passover and the feast of Tabernacles, but I suppose that you would also deny the truth of the prophets?


Let me tell you something Strong, There were once honorable gentiles who believed in Christ so much that they went to their death being tortured simply because they rejected their ancient Saturnalia, and accepted God's Passover.

These righteous gentiles who lived in Pagan Rome grew up in Paganism and the worship of all Gods.

They altogether came up for the Saturnalia, but then these brave righteous gentiles stopped keeping the Saturnalia, and they accepted Jesus alone, and they told everyone that there was only one son of God.

So these righteous gentiles went to their deaths because they refused their old ways and took on the ways of the Jewish Messiah and of his being THEIR PASSOVER.

I say,'' THEIR'' because they were not ashamed, and they were so in love with Christ that they died rather than refusing his Passover.

But now you say, that the Passover is not for you, I say you speak the truth.

 

[Interplanner]

Actually if you read Rom 14, when the evicted Jews of Rome (Acts 18) came back, there wasn't so much adoption of Jewish practices; Paul called the issues debatable.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

Actually if you read Rom 14, when the evicted Jews of Rome (Acts 18) came back, there wasn't so much adoption of Jewish practices; Paul called the issues debatable.

What in the world?

Interplanner, Christianity was a legal religion under state law because Christianity resided under the tent of Judaism. The gentile Christians were flooding the Synagogues and many Jews didn't like it, That just goes to show you how gentiles converted to Judaism and they attended the synagogues of the Jews, and they kept all the feasts of God, and the Sabbath along with Jews.

Acts 18:2 Claudius had commanded all Jews to depart from Rome. This imperial edict was issued in A.d. 50.

There was a great deal of Anti-Jewish feeling among Greeks.

Judaism was a licensed religion under Roman law. Christianity could take advantage of this protection as long as it sheltered itself under the tent of Judaism. The Jews who didn't believe in Jesus COMPLAINED that these Christians were not a division or sect of Judaism, But Gallio refused to take the side of these Jews trying to rid themselves of synagogues filled with gentile believers in Christ.

This ruling that Gallio made was important for the spread of the gospel because if the Jews had their way, Christianity would have become illegal and everyone in Christianity would be sentenced to death for practicing an illegal religion.

So Christianity went on legally under the tent of Judaism and the gentile converts still flooded the Synagogues and this wouldn't change for another 85 years.

The Jews who did not want these new gentile Jesus believer converts finally got them out of their synagogues when the great synagogue was burned 135.


But you want to show Acts 18: 17 about Greeks beating the ruler of a synagogue?

These Greeks beat Sosthenes because they were anti-semites.

Sosthenes was the head of a PRO_PAULINE faction in the synagogue and a Jew.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

This is the thing that I don't get among Christians.

Christianity was a Jewish sect under law, and all the gentile converts went to synagogues with Jews for over a 100 years after Jesus died.

ALL the first gentile believers has the exact same Sabbaths and feast days in common with Jews, but nobody judged nobody to who kept all the details of a Holy day. Nobody was judged if Pentecost came and went and you didn't keep all the requirements of the law because we are not to judge people in Holy days in respect to keeping them.

But now we have gentile believers in Christ who did away with the feasts of Christ and took on ancient Pagan feasts of other Gods, and they want to apply these scriptures about judging one another according to keeping Holy days.

We aren't to judge the people of God who have converted to God's ways if they don't keep all the laws of Sabbaths, But to bring in another worship system and a new invented set of Holy days, and a new Sabbath HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH JUDGING OTHERS IN KEEPING A HOLY DAY OF GOD...

I don't judge people if they don't always keep the Sabbath and laws of the Sabbath, But I AM going to say something to the person who brings Pagan Sabbaths and feasts to the Temple and then asks me not to judge them cause Paul said not to judge people in Holy days.

Paul never meant anything to the people who invented their own Holy days, he is not talking to those people, they have a different worship system. Paul is talking to Jews and gentiles who have converted to a sect of Judaism.

Nobody judges a gentile if he doesn't keep all the laws of the Sabbath, But don't let the gentile bring Pagan festivals and the replacement of God's Sabbath saying,'' Don't judge me.''

Cause I'm going to judge you if you try and say that Pagan festivals are of Jesus, This has nothing to do with judging a person for not keeping all the laws of the Sabbath.

 

[Dwylcs]

It's so important how we treat one another.


The Lord so completely and thoroughly identifies himself with the most impoverished of hearts, those even the Church often despise.

The Jews waited thousands of years for their Messiah, and the first thing he mentions in the Sermon on the Mount, is the 'poor in spirit, that 'theirs is the kingdom of God'.

"In as much as you have done it unto the least you have done it unto me." < this says a lot.
It's so important how we treat each other, especially the weak, the poor of heart who are easily despised - but to this man the Lord looks, who trembles at His word etc.

Does the Lord know us through the weakest, the least - the prime focus of His heart?
This is the critical question for us all.


…

 

[Stephen Kendall]

I Never Knew You

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!




Can somebody explain that Jesus is not talking about the keeping the commandments of God?

It is interesting how I get from the Scripture a different message than you, mostly because we need to see what Jesus taught during his ministry on Earth. Jesus' commandments were simpler and seemingly less than the 10 stated to someone seeking to be saved, yet when he included the give all away law, the tone changed and he passed by the mere 10. The Pharisees did the 10 with their own traditions added to please God. The were lawless though. Many so called Christians do the 10 and yet fail also. Yet, if you do the 5 or 6 with the added give it all away, you win. So the winners are the ones who know truly what the will of God is, the teachings an commandments of Jesus Christ during his ministry (the complete Gospel). Otherwords Jesus will know you if you know him.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

It is interesting how I get from the Scripture a different message than you, mostly because we need to see what Jesus taught during his ministry on Earth. Jesus' commandments were simpler and seemingly less than the 10 stated to someone seeking to be saved, yet when he included the give all away law, the tone changed and he passed by the mere 10. The Pharisees did the 10 with their own traditions added to please God. The were lawless though. Many so called Christians do the 10 and yet fail also. Yet, if you do the 5 or 6 with the added give it all away, you win. So the winners are the ones who know truly what the will of God is, the teachings an commandments of Jesus Christ during his ministry (the complete Gospel). Otherwords Jesus will know you if you know him.

Maybe you get a different meaning because you are making a different message up.

Why not just believe what it says?

A Tree and its Fruit
(Matthew 12:33-37; Luke 6:43-45)
15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16You shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree brings forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree brings forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that brings not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Why by their fruits you shall know them.
21Not every one that said to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name have cast out devils? and in your name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity.
The House on the Rock
(Luke 6:46-49)
24Therefore whoever hears these sayings of mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man, which built his house on a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat on that house; and it fell not: for it was founded on a rock. 26And every one that hears these sayings of mine, and does them not, shall be likened to a foolish man, which built his house on the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat on that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.



''Therefore whoever hears these sayings of mine, and does them''


What saying of his?

He just gave a long list of sayings, and here are a couple.

17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. 18For truly I say to you, Till heaven and earth pass, one stroke or one pronunciation mark shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19Whoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Then Jesus explains how he makes the law harder to keep, and says we better keep it better than the Pharisees.
25Therefore I say to you, Take no thought for your life, what you shall eat, or what you shall drink; nor yet for your body, what you shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment? 26Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much better than they? 27Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit to his stature? 28And why take you thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: 29And yet I say to you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30Why, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? 32(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knows that you have need of all these things. 33But seek you first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added to you


We don't have to get a different meaning, we just have to believe what is written..


When Jesus is speaking about commandments, he is speaking of his fathers commandments and will.

Iniquity and sin is breaking any of the commandments.


I suppose you would get a different meaning when Jesus says that whoever doesn't keep the least of the commandments and teaches others the same will be called the least in the kingdom of heaven?



..

 

[Bible2]

HannibalFlavius said in post 32:

17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.

Matthew 5:17-18 means that Jesus came the first time not to abolish the prophecies in the Mosaic law and the Old Testament prophets regarding the Christ's first coming, but to fulfill all those prophecies (Luke 24:44-48; e.g. Acts 3:22-26, Isaiah 53). Matthew 5:17-18 can't mean that Jesus came not to abolish the letter of the commandments of the Old Covenant Mosaic law, for he did come to do that, on the Cross (Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14-17, Romans 7:6; 2 Corinthians 3:6-18, Hebrews 7:18-19). Also, Matthew 5:17-18 can't mean that Jesus came to fulfill the letter of all the Old Covenant Mosaic law's commandments, for he couldn't possibly have done that. For example, some of those commandments applied only to women after childbirth (Leviticus 12:4-8), or to wives suspected of adultery by their husbands (Numbers 5:19-31).

As the Christ (Matthew 5:17, Luke 24:44-46), the mediator of the New Covenant (Matthew 26:28, Hebrews 12:24, Hebrews 7:22, Hebrews 8:6-9), Jesus had the divine authority to contradict the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law's commandments and replace them with his own, even better, New Covenant commandments (Matthew 5:38-44, Matthew 19:7-9, John 8:5-7), such as those he gave in the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 5:19 to 7:29) and in the epistles of Paul the apostle (1 Corinthians 14:37; 1 Thessalonians 4:2). And as the Christ, Jesus had the divine authority to allow his disciples to break the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law's commandments (Matthew 12:1-8).

HannibalFlavius said in post 32:

18For truly I say to you, Till heaven and earth pass, one stroke or one pronunciation mark shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Matthew 5:18 doesn't mean that heaven and earth have to pass away before the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law's commandments can be abolished, but that Jesus had to fulfill the Old Testament prophecies regarding the Christ's first coming (Luke 24:44-46; e.g. Acts 3:22-26, Isaiah 53), before he could abolish the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law's commandments on the Cross (Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14-17, Romans 7:6; 2 Corinthians 3:6-18, Hebrews 7:18-19).

HannibalFlavius said in post 32:

19Whoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:19-20 refers to the New Covenant/New Testament commandments/sayings (Matthew 5:19, Matthew 7:24-29) which Jesus, as the Christ (Matthew 5:17b, Luke 24:44-46), was just about to give in the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 5:19 to 7:29), and which New Covenant commandments "exceed in righteousness" (Matthew 5:20 to 7:29) the (now) abolished letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law's commandments (Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14-17, Romans 7:6; 2 Corinthians 3:6-18, Hebrews 7:18-19).

HannibalFlavius said in post 32:

Then Jesus explains how he makes the law harder to keep, and says we better keep it better than the Pharisees.

Jesus shows in the Sermon on the Mount how his New Covenant, Christian commandments are stricter than the letter of the commandments of the Old Covenant Mosaic law. For the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law forbade murder (Matthew 5:21, Exodus 20:13), whereas Jesus' New Covenant law forbids even calling people names (Matthew 5:22). And the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law forbade adultery (Matthew 5:27, Exodus 20:14), whereas Jesus' New Covenant law forbids even looking at another woman with lust (Matthew 5:28). And the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law permitted divorce and remarriage (Matthew 5:31, Deuteronomy 24:1-2), whereas Jesus' New Covenant law forbids it (Matthew 5:32, Mark 10:11-12, Luke 16:18), except for a single exemption granted only to husbands who discover that their newlywed wife isn't a virgin, but had committed fornication (Matthew 19:9).

Jesus also shows in the Sermon on the Mount that while his New Covenant, Christian law is stricter than the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law, at the same time it's also more merciful. For the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law required taking an eye for an eye (Matthew 5:38, Deuteronomy 19:21), whereas Jesus' New Covenant law requires turning the other cheek (Matthew 5:39). And the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law required hatred for one's enemies (Matthew 5:43, Deuteronomy 23:6), whereas Jesus' New Covenant law requires love for one's enemies (Matthew 5:44). And the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law, the ministration of death (2 Corinthians 3:7), required, for example, that adulterers be put to death (Leviticus 20:10), whereas Jesus showed mercy to the woman caught in adultery (John 8:4-11). And, for another example, the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law required that anyone who does any work on the sabbath is to be put to death (Exodus 31:14, Numbers 15:32-36), whereas Jesus allowed his disciples to work on the sabbath and said they were guiltless (Matthew 12:1-8), just as Jesus himself worked on the sabbath (John 5:17-18).

So in obeying Jesus' New Covenant commandments (Matthew 5:19 to 7:29, John 14:15; 1 Corinthians 14:37), believers, whether Jews or Gentiles, are both more merciful and loving, and they also exceed in righteousness those who try to keep the abolished letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law (Matthew 5:20-48, Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14-17, Romans 7:6; 2 Corinthians 3:6-18, Hebrews 7:18-19).

HannibalFlavius said in post 32:

Iniquity and sin is breaking any of the commandments.

Iniquity and sin isn't breaking any of the letter of the commandments of the Old Covenant Mosaic law. For on Jesus' cross, for both Jews and Gentiles (John 11:51-52), of all times, the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law was abolished (Ephesians 2:15-16, Colossians 2:14-17; 2 Corinthians 3:6-18), disannulled (Hebrews 7:18), rendered obsolete (Hebrews 8:13, Galatians 3:2-25, Galatians 4:21 to 5:8), taken away and replaced (Hebrews 10:9) by the better hope (Hebrews 7:19), the better covenant (Hebrews 7:22, Hebrews 8:6-12), the 2nd covenant (Hebrews 8:7, Hebrews 10:9), of Jesus' New Covenant law (Galatians 6:2, John 1:17, Matthew 26:28, Hebrews 12:24, Hebrews 9:15), so that the law was changed (Hebrews 7:12).

All believers, both Jews and Gentles, of all times, are delivered from the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law and shouldn't keep it (Romans 7:6; 2 Corinthians 3:6-18, Galatians 2:11-21) or have any desire to keep it (Galatians 4:21 to 5:8, Galatians 3:2-25). Believers keep the spirit of the Old Covenant Mosaic law (Romans 7:6) by loving others (Galatians 5:14, Romans 13:8-10), by doing to others as they would have others do to them (Matthew 7:12).

The New Covenant is a new law (Hebrews 7:12,18,19, Hebrews 10:1-23), consisting of Jesus' New Testament commandments (John 14:15), such as those he gave in the Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 5:19 to 7:29) and in the epistles of Paul the apostle (1 Corinthians 14:37). These commandments exceed in righteousness the abolished letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law (Matthew 5:20-48). So there's no reason why any believer should ever want to go back under the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law (Galatians 3:2 to 5:26). It was just a temporary schoolmaster (Galatians 3:24-25), a temporary shadow (Colossians 2:16-17), which God set up because of sins long after he'd set up the original promise of the Abrahamic Covenant, and long before he brought that promise to fulfillment in Jesus' New Covenant (Galatians 3:16-29, Matthew 26:28).

The letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law has been made obsolete by the New Covenant (Hebrews 8:13). For example, the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law required an Aaronic priesthood (Exodus 30:30), whereas the New Covenant replaced the Aaronic priesthood with the Melchisedechian priesthood (Hebrews 7:11-28). Also, the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law required animal sacrifices (e.g. Leviticus 23:19), whereas the New Covenant replaced those with the one-time sacrifice of Jesus (Hebrews 10).

The letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law is the Hagar to the New Covenant's Sarah (Galatians 4:22-25), so that those people, whether Jews or Gentiles, who try to keep the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law are like Ishmael, while those people, whether Jews or Gentiles, who keep the New Covenant are like Isaac (Galatians 4:22-31).

The letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law (including the letter of the 10 commandments), written and engraven in stones (2 Corinthians 3:7, Deuteronomy 4:13, Deuteronomy 27:8), was the ministration of death and condemnation (2 Corinthians 3:7,9). For example, see Leviticus 20:10, Exodus 31:14, and Numbers 15:32-36; and contrast these with the New Covenant's John 8:4-11 and Matthew 12:1-8. The letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law has been done away (2 Corinthians 3:11), abolished (2 Corinthians 3:13b). But it's still able to spiritually blind some people as with a veil from beholding Jesus (2 Corinthians 3:14-16), whereas the New Covenant is the ministration of the spirit and righteousness (2 Corinthians 3:6,8,9b), which remains (2 Corinthians 3:11b), and which permits believers to remove the veil and to behold Jesus (2 Corinthians 3:16-18, Mark 15:38, Hebrews 7:18-19, Ephesians 2:15-18, Colossians 2:14-17).

But a mistaken spirit of Pharisaism can still sometimes deceive even Christians into thinking that they must keep the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law in order to be saved (Acts 15:1,5), or in order to become perfect (Galatians 3:2 to 5:26). This is a false, cursed gospel (Galatians 1:6-9). For if any believers are keeping any part of the letter of the Old Covenant Mosaic law, thinking that they must do so in order to be saved, or in order to become perfect, then Jesus will profit them nothing; they have fallen from grace (Galatians 5:2-8).

 

[Strong in Him]

Now see these are the words of a true gentile standing in the gentile court.

I AM a gentile so I don't see why that would surprise you.

To begin with, the gentile nations ARE demanded to keep God's feasts, they are not Jewish feasts, they are God's feasts,

They were given to Israelites and most of them commemorate the exodus; when God brought the Israelites out of Egypt.
That was a great event, God performed many miracles and showed his mighty power, and his patience and mercy, but it is not part of my history or heritage.

Where does it say in Scripture that I, a gentile and foreigner, HAVE to keep something which has nothing to do with me and was not given to me?

and all people experience the coming out of Egypt, and the Passover lamb and Sukkot Bull are specifically why you think you have salvation although you obviously deny Christ in them.

I have salvation because Christ - the Passover lamb (1 Cor 5:7), the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world (John 1:29) - died, sacrificed himself for me. I am saved through Christ alone. We are all saved through Christ alone - not Christ AND law/church ritual/works etc etc; ONLY Christ.

Yes of course Christ came as a Jew, and Christianity started off as a Jewish sect. Yes, we share some of the Jewish Scriptures. But we are NOT under the law which was never given to us in the first place. We have Christ, and only Christ. HE is our Saviour, our light, the way to the Father. HE has reconciled us to God and makes us holy and righteous. He IS the Alpha and the Omega, the author and perfector of our faith (Heb 12:2).

You talk of Communion and this is the Passover seder, But Paul told us to keep the Passover in truth and in spirit. Here's what so crazy Strong, Your going to try and tell a non believer that you have a Passover lamb but I don't believe you at all.

Doesn't matter if you believe me or not. I have Christ, he is our Passover Lamb.

You may try and tell a non believer that you have a sukkot bull, again, I don't believe you because you prove yourself wrong from jump street.

I don't know what a Succoth bull is, so I wouldn't claim to have one. I haven't been told I need one in any case. I have Christ.

And how will you witness to a non believer saying that you have a Passover lamb when you reject the Passover?

If I was witnessing to a non believer I wouldn't mention Passover at all; I'd talk only about Jesus. I might at some point need to explain the language of Scripture and meaning of the Jewish references. So I'd tell them the story of the exodus; how the Israelites had to put lamb's blood over the door of their houses in order to be saved from the angel of death, how a lamb was killed, and eaten, for the Passover meal, how Jesus celebrated the Passover for the last time with his friends before HE was killed, and how HIS blood saves us from eternal death - everyone who is under the blood of the Lamb of God is saved.
But I don't have to celebrate the Jewish Passover myself in order to know about these things. What do you commemorate in the Passover? Is it not the time when you were slaves in Egypt and the Lord rescued you? I was not a slave in Egypt, but I HAVE been rescued from the slavery of sin by Christ. HE is the one I follow and believe in.

And how will you even talk about your salvation in a thing which you yourself reject saying,'' Those things are not for me.

I was not saved by the law; by observing it or the Jewish feasts. I was saved by Jesus.

These righteous gentiles who lived in Pagan Rome grew up in Paganism and the worship of all Gods.

They altogether came up for the Saturnalia, but then these brave righteous gentiles stopped keeping the Saturnalia, and they accepted Jesus alone, and they told everyone that there was only one son of God.

So these righteous gentiles went to their deaths because they refused their old ways and took on the ways of the Jewish Messiah and of his being THEIR PASSOVER.

Yes, you've just said it yourself; Christ was their Passover. Christ is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world and the Passover lamb who was slain for us. It wasn't keeping the Jewish Passover which saved them, it was having accepted Christ as their Saviour and Passover lamb; the One who died for them, in their place.

But now you say, that the Passover is not for you, I say you speak the truth.

The Passover is not for me because I am not commanded to keep it. That doesn't mean that I can't believe in Jesus, who was a Jew and became the Passover lamb - I do. It doesn't mean that I can't read about the Passover, learn from it and understand how the various elements of it were fulfilled in Christ. Last Maudy Thursday a local church had a Passover meal and short service, which I led. I explained, and taught about, the first Passover and what the various elements of the meal meant. I said that Jesus was the Lamb of God - the Passover lamb - and talked about the last time he celebrated the Passover with his friends, before he was killed. It was a lovely occasion and I learnt a lot through reading about the Passover.

So when I say, "it's not for me", I don't mean that I have never read about it, or think it is untrue or nonsense. I don't - but neither do I celebrate it as the Jews do. I have Christ, and I regularly celebrate holy communion.

 

[HannibalFlavius]

I AM a gentile so I don't see why that would surprise you.



They were given to Israelites and most of them commemorate the exodus; when God brought the Israelites out of Egypt.
That was a great event, God performed many miracles and showed his mighty power, and his patience and mercy, but it is not part of my history or heritage.

Where does it say in Scripture that I, a gentile and foreigner, HAVE to keep something which has nothing to do with me and was not given to me?



I have salvation because Christ - the Passover lamb (1 Cor 5:7), the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world (John 1:29) - died, sacrificed himself for me. I am saved through Christ alone. We are all saved through Christ alone - not Christ AND law/church ritual/works etc etc; ONLY Christ.

Yes of course Christ came as a Jew, and Christianity started off as a Jewish sect. Yes, we share some of the Jewish Scriptures. But we are NOT under the law which was never given to us in the first place. We have Christ, and only Christ. HE is our Saviour, our light, the way to the Father. HE has reconciled us to God and makes us holy and righteous. He IS the Alpha and the Omega, the author and perfector of our faith (Heb 12:2).



Doesn't matter if you believe me or not. I have Christ, he is our Passover Lamb.



I don't know what a Succoth bull is, so I wouldn't claim to have one. I haven't been told I need one in any case. I have Christ.



If I was witnessing to a non believer I wouldn't mention Passover at all; I'd talk only about Jesus. I might at some point need to explain the language of Scripture and meaning of the Jewish references. So I'd tell them the story of the exodus; how the Israelites had to put lamb's blood over the door of their houses in order to be saved from the angel of death, how a lamb was killed, and eaten, for the Passover meal, how Jesus celebrated the Passover for the last time with his friends before HE was killed, and how HIS blood saves us from eternal death - everyone who is under the blood of the Lamb of God is saved.
But I don't have to celebrate the Jewish Passover myself in order to know about these things. What do you commemorate in the Passover? Is it not the time when you were slaves in Egypt and the Lord rescued you? I was not a slave in Egypt, but I HAVE been rescued from the slavery of sin by Christ. HE is the one I follow and believe in.



I was not saved by the law; by observing it or the Jewish feasts. I was saved by Jesus.



Yes, you've just said it yourself; Christ was their Passover. Christ is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world and the Passover lamb who was slain for us. It wasn't keeping the Jewish Passover which saved them, it was having accepted Christ as their Saviour and Passover lamb; the One who died for them, in their place.



The Passover is not for me because I am not commanded to keep it. That doesn't mean that I can't believe in Jesus, who was a Jew and became the Passover lamb - I do. It doesn't mean that I can't read about the Passover, learn from it and understand how the various elements of it were fulfilled in Christ. Last Maudy Thursday a local church had a Passover meal and short service, which I led. I explained, and taught about, the first Passover and what the various elements of the meal meant. I said that Jesus was the Lamb of God - the Passover lamb - and talked about the last time he celebrated the Passover with his friends, before he was killed. It was a lovely occasion and I learnt a lot through reading about the Passover.

So when I say, "it's not for me", I don't mean that I have never read about it, or think it is untrue or nonsense. I don't - but neither do I celebrate it as the Jews do. I have Christ, and I regularly celebrate holy communion.

I must be doing everything wrong.

What are the holy days for gentiles since I'm a gentile too, and shouldn't be doing Jewish stuff.

So what do gentiles do?

 

[Strong in Him]

What are the holy days for gentiles since I'm a gentile too, and shouldn't be doing Jewish stuff.

I don't think we have any, as such, although churches follow what is known as a lectionary; readings for each Sunday are based on various aspects of Jesus' life and teachings. So we have Lent, which leads up to Easter, when we remember Jesus' temptations in the wilderness; the last week of this is Holy Week when we remember his riding into Jerusalem and going to the cross. The weeks leading up to Christmas are advent, when we remember that Jesus has come once, and will come again.

But not all churches follow this cycle, and it is not compulsory. Everything has changed since Christ and his death and resurrection. At the final meal that he shared with his disciples he said that his blood was of the New Covenant. Salvation is now through Him, not the blood of sacrificed animals. Because he died, we now have reconciliation with God, our Father, and peace with him. Because Jesus was raised nd ascended back to the Father, he sent his Spirit to live in us.
God himself now lives, or can live, IN each one of us. We don't have to go to a temple, or church, to find him; Paul said that our bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit. It is Christ, and his Spirit in us, who makes us holy. So ANY day which is dedicated to Jesus, is holy.

So what do gentiles do?

Christians believe in Jesus; that he was God, that he came to live among us - in our world - and gave his life for sinners. We believe that he was who he said he was, and follow his teachings and example. NOT in order to be saved; a person who accepted Christ on their death beds would be saved, but because we love him and want to serve him.

 

[Stephen Kendall]

Maybe you get a different meaning because you are making a different message up.

Why not just believe what it says?

A Tree and its Fruit
(Matthew 12:33-37; Luke 6:43-45)
15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16You shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree brings forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree brings forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that brings not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Why by their fruits you shall know them.
21Not every one that said to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven.

22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in your name? and in your name have cast out devils? and in your name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess to them, I never knew you: depart from me, you that work iniquity.
The House on the Rock
(Luke 6:46-49)
24Therefore whoever hears these sayings of mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man, which built his house on a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat on that house; and it fell not: for it was founded on a rock. 26And every one that hears these sayings of mine, and does them not, shall be likened to a foolish man, which built his house on the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat on that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.



''Therefore whoever hears these sayings of mine, and does them''


What saying of his?

He just gave a long list of sayings, and here are a couple.

17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill. 18For truly I say to you, Till heaven and earth pass, one stroke or one pronunciation mark shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19Whoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Then Jesus explains how he makes the law harder to keep, and says we better keep it better than the Pharisees.
25Therefore I say to you, Take no thought for your life, what you shall eat, or what you shall drink; nor yet for your body, what you shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment? 26Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much better than they? 27Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit to his stature? 28And why take you thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: 29And yet I say to you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30Why, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? 32(For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knows that you have need of all these things. 33But seek you first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added to you


We don't have to get a different meaning, we just have to believe what is written..


When Jesus is speaking about commandments, he is speaking of his fathers commandments and will.

Iniquity and sin is breaking any of the commandments.


I suppose you would get a different meaning when Jesus says that whoever doesn't keep the least of the commandments and teaches others the same will be called the least in the kingdom of heaven?



..

We are suppose to live in peace with one another and also realize that God has unique relationships with his churches as illustrated in the writings of Paul and also with their unique convictions. Please live quietly and in peace with your convictions. Because of the strength of them, I barely qualify to be your brother, but I am honored to such.

It is better to love one another as to obey Christ and thus find our pathway to the Father. Your personal convictions you must attain to and follow. Perhaps your faith that you share and the Gospel that you give are wrapped up in them and so you feel led to preach them. I understand. I am starting to understand the mind of denominations through our conversations here.

I never knew that it was all that complicated, the reason for denominations. Now, I am having my questions about this to God answered better. Thank you for sharing.