FLAT EARTH.

[Commander Xenophon]

Can you prove any of what you have said, either from scripture, or using science? If the answer is no, you're not really thinking, but just reciting the fables disguised as science that you have been taught in school.

It could just as easily be argued the Earth is flat, the sun spirals around it once every 24 hours, and approximately every 365.25 days, a complete circuit is made by the sun (close to North, further from the North, and back closer to the North again).

Not if you have flown in a high altitude aircraft and viewed the curvature of the planetary surface, or indeed, navigated via the Great Circle Route.

If the Earth is moving, why do scientific tests designed to detect this movement fail to detect any (look up the Michelson Morley experiment), and why can't we feel it (acceleration can be felt by man at less than 5mm per second)?

The Earth is orbiting the sun at a constant rate; it is neither accelerating nor decelerating. There is a difference between the motion of two bodies relative to each other, and acceration. Look up "delta V" sometime.

If it is Earth moving, rather than the stars, why did the "Airy's failure" experiment and similar ones demonstrate the opposite?

The Earth, the planets and the stars are all in motion relatove to each other. Indeed, this entire galaxy is in motion relative to the other galaxies; eventually, this galaxy will collide with Andromeda, and then aeons later all of the galaxies of the local group cluster will converge.

Scripture does not require a moving Earth,

It does, actually, because if the earth were not rotating on its axis the sun would not rise in the East nor set in the West.

and neither does real science.

Real science really requires a moving Earth, otherwise, the communications antennae on deep space probes like the Pioneer series, Voyager 1 and 2, and most recently, the thrilling New Horizons mission to Pluto, which gave us beautiful images of Pluto's surface and priceless information about the atmosphere of that strange tiny little world, and also as a special bonus, a series of photos showing the massive planetary volcano on Io exploding, would not be pointed at Earth, and we would never have received all of the data and telemetry from those spacecraft, since naturally a major function on these spacecraft is keeping the antennae aimed at Earth so we get a signal.

Which takes many hours from the outer solar system. Flight controllers don't work in anything close to real time on those missions.

 

[Commander Xenophon]

Not at all. Simply a case of neither the article nor you providing evidence of such a claim. Beliefs are not facts, religion is not science, make-believe is not truth.

Indeed. Therefore let us bask in the certainty that the spherical Earth God has given us rotates on its axis roughly every 24 hours and orbits the sun roughly every 365.25 days.

 

[Joshua_5]

Not if you have flown in a high altitude aircraft and viewed the curvature of the planetary surface, or indeed, navigated via the Great Circle Route.



The Earth is orbiting the sun at a constant rate; it is neither accelerating nor decelerating. There is a difference between the motion of two bodies relative to each other, and acceration. Look up "delta V" sometime.



The Earth, the planets and the stars are all in motion relatove to each other. Indeed, this entire galaxy is in motion relative to the other galaxies; eventually, this galaxy will collide with Andromeda, and then aeons later all of the galaxies of the local group cluster will converge.



It does, actually, because if the earth were not rotating on its axis the sun would not rise in the East nor set in the West.



Real science really requires a moving Earth, otherwise, the communications antennae on deep space probes like the Pioneer series, Voyager 1 and 2, and most recently, the thrilling New Horizons mission to Pluto, which gave us beautiful images of Pluto's surface and priceless information about the atmosphere of that strange tiny little world, and also as a special bonus, a series of photos showing the massive planetary volcano on Io exploding, would not be pointed at Earth, and we would never have received all of the data and telemetry from those spacecraft, since naturally a major function on these spacecraft is keeping the antennae aimed at Earth so we get a signal.

Which takes many hours from the outer solar system. Flight controllers don't work in anything close to real time on those missions.

No need to indoctrinate me on the heliocentric theory. I know what heliocentrists believe.

If on the other hand, you have actual science demonstrating it to be true, rather than just-so stories which either one of us can make up to "prove" his theories, come back and present your proofs.

You also need to read up on the heliocentrist theory of gravity. If Earth is not indeed accelerating around the sun as stated, heliocentric theory (a circular or elliptical orbit of Earth about the sun) is impossible. Enjoy your re-education.

 

[Open Heart]

Beliefs are not facts, religion is not science, make-believe is not truth.

Listen to yourself.

 

[LostMarbels]

what are you thoughts on the biblical explanation of the flat earth?

I find it to be a counterproductive argument, or distraction to our true calling of preaching the gospel. This does not affect an individual's ability to accept Christ, or becoming saved in any way shape or form. It is a belief or a standpoint on either side, but not realy pressing from any christian standpoint. It simply doesn't matter. Jesus Christ is still lord... flat earth, or round.

 

[Joshua_5]

I find it to be a counterproductive argument, or distraction to our true calling of preaching the gospel. This does not affect an individual's ability to accept Christ, or becoming saved in any way shape or form. It is a belief or a standpoint on either side, but not realy pressing from any christian standpoint. It simply doesn't matter. Jesus Christ is still lord... flat earth, or round.

Some say the same about Creation/Evolution. Its not a salvation issue, but if it weren't true, it wouldn't be in the scriptures.

 

[mmksparbud]

Some say the same about Creation/Evolution. Its not a salvation issue, but if it weren't true, it wouldn't be in the scriptures.

But it's not, it's being interpreted that way without it ever saying that the earth is flat.

 

[LostMarbels]

Some say the same about Creation/Evolution. Its not a salvation issue, but if it weren't true, it wouldn't be in the scriptures.

Not exactly true. The argument you highlighted brings into question God's ability, and or 'power' to create all that is without the help of his creation. For God to have created all that is in existence, known and even unknown to man; shows God's immutable authority over all that is created. Reasoning being, that if all that is, is created by God, nothing that is created is higher than, nor equal to the creator.

 

[Joshua_5]

Not exactly true. The argument you highlighted brings into question God's ability, and or 'power' to create all that is without the help of his creation. For God to have created all that is in existence, known and even unknown to man; shows God's immutable authority over all that is created. Reasoning being, that if all that is, is created by God, nothing that is created is higher than, nor equal to the creator.

For God not to have known the shape of the Earth He created, or for His scriptures to imply it is flat when it is a ball, suggests He didn't create it at all (which is the very reason the ball-Earth theory was created). Your argument goes both ways.

 

[Cowboy88]

Isaiah 40:22
22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Job 26:10
10 He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end.

The word compassed (Hebrew khug) means to be made spherical, referring to the shape of the earth

 

[Open Heart]

Isaiah 40:22
22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Job 26:10
10 He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end.

The word compassed (Hebrew khug) means to be made spherical, referring to the shape of the earth

This is what is called phenomenological language. It means to describe something how it LOOKS or is EXPERIENCED (not how it objectively is). For example, the Bible also talks about the sun "rising" and "setting." We know the sun does move up and down below the horizon. Even flat earthers here in this forum believe the sun circles above the disk.

 

[Cowboy88]

This is what is called phenomenological language. It means to describe something how it LOOKS or is EXPERIENCED (not how it objectively is). For example, the Bible also talks about the sun "rising" and "setting." We know the sun does move up and down below the horizon. Even flat earthers here in this forum believe the sun circles above the disk.

The two don't even compare. Is it not said or thought of to be romantic watching the sun set with a spouse? Or beautiful to watch the sun rise in the morning?

 

[Jezmeyah]

The earth is 99.9% flat.

The earth is not as flat as a piece of paper on a flat surfaced desk. The idea is illogical to observational view when mountains and hills are taken into account.

But if you live in a reasonably level land area, then your perspective is as limited as your extended view.
Man is too close to the earth to state with any accuracy that the earth is all but 1 percent flat. The word 'flat' is tremendously inaccurate in describing the rolling land of the earth.

To declare that the earth is flat according to one's personal level of height and sight range of the eye, is like the blind person saying that there is no light, and no color simply due to their limited view. What sighted person believes that the blind people are right?

Christians must rely on God who's perspective is a farther distance away. The scripture verse that states that God is enthroned on the circle or sphere or globe of the earth, wasn't written by NASA.

Most our maps are flat.

Our globes are round, but flat maps can be folded and kept in the glove compartment of our cars, or fit into a ladies purse. While a globe.. can be stuffed under a shirt so that man or woman will look pregnant, but at least it's easily available to check where you are on that globe.

We currently refer to "sunrise and sunset" which shows that scientists at Nasa today think the sun is orbiting earth.

The common phrase is observational to the person on the earth.

You, not they, think that the sun is orbiting the earth. NASA uses multiple scientific methods to tell us that the earth is orbiting the sun. I am inclined to believe them rather than you with your illogical statements.

To observe the round moon, and the round sun with the unaided eye, and by Hubble to observe the round planets beyond our earth then say that the earth is flat as a pizza (taking into account the liberal sprinkling of sausages and onions that represent it's not entirely flat status) is not in keeping with the rest of the uniformity of shapes in the cosmos. A flat earth is not in keeping with the consistent observational view.

Or it's possible that language and illustrations are useful first, accurate second.

Even as you think that your language is useful first, and accurate second.

 

[LostMarbels]

For God not to have known the shape of the Earth He created, or for His scriptures to imply it is flat when it is a ball, suggests He didn't create it at all (which is the very reason the ball-Earth theory was created). Your argument goes both ways.

Did God create the Earth? The answer to that is the only one that matters.

 

[Joshua_5]

Did God create the Earth? The answer to that is the only one that matters.

Actually, the answer to the question "Who can take away my sin?" is the only one that matters.

 

[FredVB]

For God not to have known the shape of the Earth He created, or for His scriptures to imply it is flat when it is a ball, suggests He didn't create it at all (which is the very reason the ball-Earth theory was created). Your argument goes both ways.

That's not true, God knew it all. But it was not needed to be shown, the essential things were. There were things hinted at that could be realized later, that God knew.

 

[Open Heart]

For God not to have known the shape of the Earth He created, or for His scriptures to imply it is flat when it is a ball, suggests He didn't create it at all (which is the very reason the ball-Earth theory was created). Your argument goes both ways.

The Bible uses phenomenological language, which means that it describes things as they appear. It is accurate so far as the author is not lying and being accurate as to how things do indeed look. Examples are: the sun rising, the earth being flat.

 

[FredVB]

That is just it. Too much information would not help with what was essential for being made known to people, including reconciliation with Yahweh God, and the controversy with what could not yet be proved could really detract from that. There was the hint of things God knew for when more would be discovered, when it was possible.

 

[Imagican]

If the Bible said that the Earth is 'flat', then it would state a LIE. the FACT that there are mountains and elevated Earth would make a 'flat Earth' a LIE.

My wife, her sister and our brother in law, walked out a few weeks ago and watched the International Space Station pass over from horizon to horizon.

We live in Orlando and can SEE anything launched from Kennedy from our FRONT yard. I have seen more shuttle launches and other rockets than I can remember. From our front yard. Not counting the numerous times we've been to Cocoa or Canveral to watch the launches. And I have been surprised by a number of them while driving around town. Especially those 'night' launches that light up the sky like the SUN coming up. And in EVERY launch, you can clearly see them CURVE in order to follow the curvature of the EARTH.

Ever been in the ocean far enough away from land for it to disappear? in Florida, when you begin to approach the land from sea, it is PERFECTLY obvious that you begin to see the TOPS of structures FIRST and then the closer you get the base of objects. Clearly demonstrating the CURVATURE of the Earth.

The first conception of the world around them, men assumed that their world was 'flat'. That if one traveled far enough in the same direction eventually they would come to the END of their world. And they believed this UNTIL they were able to travel in the same direction long enough to end up back where they started.

There are websites that you can go to that keep track of all the satellites circling our world. It's amazing. From space, our planet must look like a JUNK YARD. These satellites are tracked in REAL TIME. Look it up.

And then there is Google Earth. Having traveled to and lived in other countries, I have often used it to re-visit the foreign lands we've visited. It is amazing. Just go Google Earth and you can clearly see that our Earth is spherical. And ACCURATE. For it was created by actual PHOTOGRAPHS of the planet from satellites orbiting the planet.

The Bible does NOT teach us of a FLAT Earth. If you interpret it correctly, it tells us long before we could PROVE it that the Earth is ROUND.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[JackRT]

If the Bible said that the Earth is 'flat', then it would state a LIE. the FACT that there are mountains and elevated Earth would make a 'flat Earth' a LIE.

My wife, her sister and our brother in law, walked out a few weeks ago and watched the International Space Station pass over from horizon to horizon.

We live in Orlando and can SEE anything launched from Kennedy from our FRONT yard. I have seen more shuttle launches and other rockets than I can remember. From our front yard. Not counting the numerous times we've been to Cocoa or Canveral to watch the launches. And I have been surprised by a number of them while driving around town. Especially those 'night' launches that light up the sky like the SUN coming up. And in EVERY launch, you can clearly see them CURVE in order to follow the curvature of the EARTH.

Ever been in the ocean far enough away from land for it to disappear? in Florida, when you begin to approach the land from sea, it is PERFECTLY obvious that you begin to see the TOPS of structures FIRST and then the closer you get the base of objects. Clearly demonstrating the CURVATURE of the Earth.

The first conception of the world around them, men assumed that their world was 'flat'. That if one traveled far enough in the same direction eventually they would come to the END of their world. And they believed this UNTIL they were able to travel in the same direction long enough to end up back where they started.

There are websites that you can go to that keep track of all the satellites circling our world. It's amazing. From space, our planet must look like a JUNK YARD. These satellites are tracked in REAL TIME. Look it up.

And then there is Google Earth. Having traveled to and lived in other countries, I have often used it to re-visit the foreign lands we've visited. It is amazing. Just go Google Earth and you can clearly see that our Earth is spherical. And ACCURATE. For it was created by actual PHOTOGRAPHS of the planet from satellites orbiting the planet.

The Bible does NOT teach us of a FLAT Earth. If you interpret it correctly, it tells us long before we could PROVE it that the Earth is ROUND.

Blessings,

MEC

I agree with you completely about the reality of a spherical earth but there is also another reality. The people who wrote the bible really did hold a flat earth cosmology. That is how they understood their world. That really should not be a problem for Christians today. Today we have the value added benefit of another 20 to 30 centuries of observation and experiment.