eSports has a racism problem

Gadarene

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I doubt what you're saying because often times when a marginalized group is attacked excessively, there is someone that always wants to say, "Me too!" The "me too" group wants to complain and claim everyone is a victim. I might not dismiss such comments if the me too crowd was also also not insistent dismissing the issue in the first place. Everyone can be a victim, but everyone is not victimized equally, and it's that disproportionate treatment that is a cause for concern.

For instance, women making fun of men who game, like they attack you for liking women? Let's just say this person existed, the ratio of women that attack a man for being heterosexual versus a men sexually harassing women is a large difference, it's not 50-50, it's not 60-40, it's not even 80-20. How many other Twitch players had racist insults levied toward them? It appears only racial minorities are treated that way.

This is when you start setting a minimum amount of offence taken by a group to justify taking their offence seriously but not the offence suffered by another group.

It's pretty arbitrary and it leads to you shrugging at or outright denying racist and sexist prejudice in some circumstances, which undermines your stance somewhat.

The problem is this inconsistency, not the people pointing out the issue is broader than you give it credit for.
 
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Gadarene

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The "me too" crowd sounds a lot like men that complain about street harassment. As a male I have been harassed while walking and running by women, young and old. However, I know that doesn't compare to women that endure a lot more street harassment. We all know men can harassed, but women are harassed disproportionately more. And the issue is not trash talking, the issue is racist, homophobic and misogynistic language directed at gamers. There's a big difference between calling someone a 30-year old virgin and saying a woman's place is on her knees.

Another thing, someone calling you gay online is a homophobic slur, it is not an attack on heterosexuality or masculinity. The user is using "gay" as perjorative.
Same problem here. You object to something based on nebulous standards of frequency. We object to this stuff in principle in any circumstance. Our opinion means we are not hypocritically dismissing the same sort of experiences suffered by other groups.
 
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Vylo

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Something I find interesting is that outside of MOBA and console multiplayer games I don't see much abuse.

I think the last time I saw someone flinging insults at someone else was in Team Fortress 2.. someone put their turret in a spot someone didn't like and the person being critical and the engineer insulted each other back and forth for 10 minutes while we lost the match.
See it a lot in FPS as well.

Overwatch so far has been blissfully free of 12 year olds telling me what animals to have intercourse with or stringing together as many racial slurs as they possibly can into one sentence.
 
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TerranceL

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oV8zin.jpg


The upper picture: People obsessed with getting more diversity in the gaming community.
The lower picture: The gaming community.
 
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TerranceL

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See it a lot in FPS as well.

Overwatch so far has been blissfully free of 12 year olds telling me what animals to have intercourse with or stringing together as many racial slurs as they possibly can into one sentence.
I only played the open beta. Thought it was fun but I can only be on a team that loses so badly before I'm done for a while.

That said the whole time I played I never saw anybody type anything outside of the hotkeyed comments. One consistent thing I've heard about the game is that nobody talks. Not even in the voice chats apparently, and if anybody is talking they are talking to themselves or passing out orders with nobody responding.
 
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TerranceL

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XOXO is a gaming festival? I suspect this is one of those images mischaracterized to say something untrue.
Where was the claim that it was a gaming festival? It's a festival for hipsters. They have been known to give talks on the need for more "diversity" in gaming. They themselves have little to no actual diversity.
 
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SummerMadness

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Where was the claim that it was a gaming festival? It's a festival for hipsters. They have been known to give talks on the need for more "diversity" in gaming. They themselves have little to no actual diversity.
What makes them obsessed with the gaming community then?

No argument with me about hipsters, although I would disagree with hipsters being concerned with diversity, their actions when moving in to poorer communities often demonstrates that. They often move into communities, start a "neighborhood group" (which only consists of themselves and other hipsters), then start campaigns against local businesses so the owner is driven out so a hipster-friendly establishment can take its place. "I'm just looking for a place for my kale!"
 
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TerranceL

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What makes them obsessed with the gaming community then?
It was one of the many talks at the conference in question. It looks like over the past few years more and more of the presentations there have been geared towards gaming, either making games or showcasing them.

No argument with me about hipsters, although I would disagree with hipsters being concerned with diversity, their actions when moving in to poorer communities often demonstrates that. They often move into communities, start a "neighborhood group" (which only consists of themselves and other hipsters), then start campaigns against local businesses so the owner is driven out so a hipster-friendly establishment can take its place. "I'm just looking for a place for my kale!"
Do you happen to have an example of that? I don't doubt it, it just immediately made me angry.
 
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SummerMadness

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It was one of the many talks at the conference in question. It looks like over the past few years more and more of the presentations there have been geared towards gaming, either making games or showcasing them.
I see this particular photo being circulated from a Google search, then I saw the surname Sarkeesian. After that it's apparent that the furor is from Gamergate.

Do you happen to have an example of that? I don't doubt it, it just immediately made me angry.
I recently moved to a city where neighborhood segregation is rather stark. The biggest problem arises from universities (you know, those pillars of liberal tolerance) that seek to expand their territory (but that's another subject). What also happens is an influx of young, white hipsters and yuppies that want to buy the beautiful, historic homes in the area. However, being in a neighborhood that is mostly black, they're not too keen on patronizing their establishments. One such business was a bar that started receiving noise complaints. More noise complaints, more inspections, eventually the place closed down (owner moved elsewhere), but this left that place open. What followed was a bar that had a hipster-style name, menu, etc.

My office mate was couchsurfing when he first came to the city looking for housing and said he stayed with a professor at the university, and the professor highlighted how they "got them," and referenced other businesses they wanted to target. The businesses, small local beer shops (they also contain seating for patrons, but they're not a bar). The clientele are mostly poor, working-class racial minorities, but they're not desirable members of the community. Unlike the bar, these places don't get loud since they're essentially liquor stores (so they're closed at night), but that doesn't stop them from being targets.

What's funnier is these are the same people that will likely post on Facebook voicing their disapproval of an online racist because that's easy. Talking about systemic issues is more difficult and complex. It's hard to talk about gentrification, how instead of enhancing businesses, they supplant them with something more familiar to themselves, or the influx of wealthier residents brings a private security patrol and increased police presence (where were you guys before?).
 
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Trogdor the Burninator

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Something I find interesting is that outside of MOBA and console multiplayer games I don't see much abuse.

1)Log on to the Russian World of Tanks server
2)Identify yourself as an American

It's worth doing even if you're not actually American - just for the laughs
 
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TerranceL

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I see this particular photo being circulated from a Google search, then I saw the surname Sarkeesian. After that it's apparent that the furor is from Gamergate.

I recently moved to a city where neighborhood segregation is rather stark. The biggest problem arises from universities (you know, those pillars of liberal tolerance) that seek to expand their territory (but that's another subject). What also happens is an influx of young, white hipsters and yuppies that want to buy the beautiful, historic homes in the area. However, being in a neighborhood that is mostly black, they're not too keen on patronizing their establishments. One such business was a bar that started receiving noise complaints. More noise complaints, more inspections, eventually the place closed down (owner moved elsewhere), but this left that place open. What followed was a bar that had a hipster-style name, menu, etc.

My office mate was couchsurfing when he first came to the city looking for housing and said he stayed with a professor at the university, and the professor highlighted how they "got them," and referenced other businesses they wanted to target. The businesses, small local beer shops (they also contain seating for patrons, but they're not a bar). The clientele are mostly poor, working-class racial minorities, but they're not desirable members of the community. Unlike the bar, these places don't get loud since they're essentially liquor stores (so they're closed at night), but that doesn't stop them from being targets.

What's funnier is these are the same people that will likely post on Facebook voicing their disapproval of an online racist because that's easy. Talking about systemic issues is more difficult and complex. It's hard to talk about gentrification, how instead of enhancing businesses, they supplant them with something more familiar to themselves, or the influx of wealthier residents brings a private security patrol and increased police presence (where were you guys before?).

That's weird. I've never thought of moving into a neighborhood then seeking to change it.
 
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ChristsSoldier115

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eSports has a racism problem/
Yep, nothing new, I remember when I used to play games, racism and sexual harassment were rampant. At that time disparaging the LGBT community was considered the norm, homophobia was supposed to make you angry. Many of us eventually normalize the experience to "nothing new," but it's also the reason many of us have little issue when we eventually walk away from gaming.
I play online video games, and I honestly turn off my mic or hearing their voice also, because the stuff some of these kids say is disgusting and disturbing. The stuff they say is more or less expected realy. it is a part of the "gaming culture" whether we chose to accept it or not.
 
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SummerMadness

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I realize something, perhaps we're discussing the wrong subject (although heavily related), but I think this topic is really focused on eSports, not just gaming in general. The amount of racism, misogyny and homophobia that is displayed during events creates a barrier for some players. Should a player have to mute their mic during a tournament (although I'm sure tournament rules would control that kind of activity among players)? Should a player have to ignore any media or interview coverage of an event because people are flooding chat streams with racist comments? Imagine if you will, they had an interview where they allow interaction with the public after a round and the chat stream is filled with racist comments.

I think it becomes clearer that there needs to be an environment that is accessible to more players, and moderators need to be properly trained to police such events, we already see such policing in other media (e.g., taped delays of live events). On that same note, it is obvious this is heavily related to gaming culture at large, which despite claims that "everyone gets it," everyone does not get it. Frequency does matter; for example, street harassment affects men and women, but who is it largely a problem for? Women. All street harassment is bad, but clearly women are the primary target (and likely targeting of men does not rise above random chance). With gaming, it has been demonstrated, for example, that the mere voice or notion that a female is present increases the level of harassment over three times what you would expect for anyone. That matters and that's what needs to change.

It's easy to tell people to suck it up when you do not experience the same thing ("Bleh, I've been attacked before!" Right, if you magnified your harassment, you might have a different opinion). Unrelated, but still related, I wonder how men would feel if they endured a year of street harassment.
 
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TerranceL

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It's easy to tell people to suck it up when you do not experience the same thing ("Bleh, I've been attacked before!" Right, if you magnified your harassment, you might have a different opinion).

And you continue to erase the experiences of people whom you have little sympathy for.

PI_2014.10.22__online-harassment-03.png


The majority of the victims of online harassment are male.

About 5 years ago I had a guy who traced my IP to my town and threaten to come and beat me to death with a bat. As you can see in the above chart, this isn't uncommon for men to face.
 
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SummerMadness

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And you continue to erase the experiences of people whom you have little sympathy for.

PI_2014.10.22__online-harassment-03.png


The majority of the victims of online harassment are male.

About 5 years ago I had a guy who traced my IP to my town and threaten to come and beat me to death with a bat. As you can see in the above chart, this isn't uncommon for men to face.
This is not a helpful graphic, your source refers to online harassment, not gaming.
 
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