Creational Perception Ratio

[Hallstone]

Do you have a source?

Gen 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, on the seventeenth day of the month, on the same day all the fountains of the great deep burst open, and the floodgates of the sky were opened.

 

[Hallstone]

I doubt there were any tectonic plates prior to the Flood.

ya I considered that too, interesting to think that it may have been the beginning of the tectonic process, also it had never rained before that, also there may not have been the high mountains yet either.

 

[Jimmy D]

ya I considered that too, interesting to think that it may have been the beginning of the tectonic process, also it had never rained before that, also there may not have been the high mountains yet either.

You're happy to accept this unfounded nonsense and speculation but refuse to accept evidence about the Earth that can be tested, repeated and verified by anyone with an actual understanding of the Earth sciences (including you if you bothered to get an education on a subject before you declared it wrong).

Do you actually realize what's wrong with that? Does it ever occur to you that it might be your beliefs that are incorrect? I don't mean your Christianity (which seems to be a very positive thing for most people of that persuasion), I mean your irrational belief that Genesis is a literal description of the creation of the Earth when academic research from history, theology, biology, the Earth sciences have shown for over a century that it isn't.

 

[Ophiolite]

Repeating the same mistakes over and over again, is the definition of insanity.

Absolutely true, but forum rules prohibit suggesting other members are insane, so I kept my mouth shut.

The point of the OP, however, is that there are experts...and then there are experts, and that if you choose an expert because they suit your agenda, then you would be following the wrong expert and be just as wrong as they are.

I choose my experts on the basis of their recognition, use and interpretation of evidence. I value professionalism, integrity and open-mindedness. I expect my experts to reflect the same values.

 

[Ophiolite]

ya I considered that too, interesting to think that it may have been the beginning of the tectonic process, also it had never rained before that, also there may not have been the high mountains yet either.

Perhaps the only good thing to come out of this post is that I elected to pray to your God to lift the blinkers from your eyes. Jimmy D described your post as unfounded nonsense and speculation. I suspect he was using euphemisms in order not to scare the children.

 

[essentialsaltes]

And that is why we no longer participate in the Organizations.

But you saw fit to quote from Creation Ministries International, an organization that literally defines young earth creationism to be correct, regardless of evidence. "By definition, therefore, no interpretation of facts in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the scriptural record."

This is the darkest of glasses through which to look.

 

[Hallstone]

But you saw fit to quote from Creation Ministries International, an organization that literally defines young earth creationism to be correct, regardless of evidence. "By definition, therefore, no interpretation of facts in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the scriptural record."

This is the darkest of glasses through which to look.

I quoted creation ministries to show that there are people that are looking at these things from a different point of view, I didn't say that I agreed with them, I said that I would not make snap decisions on anything, nevertheless I do believe in the biblical literal narrative, that's my faith, so anything that counters that must be scrutinized thoroughly. I have an open mind, but from my personal experience I do not readily trust Orgs because of their agendas (meaning their quests for power, prestige, political and financial gain).

 

[Hallstone]

Absolutely true, but forum rules prohibit suggesting other members are insane, so I kept my mouth shut.

I choose my experts on the basis of their recognition, use and interpretation of evidence. I value professionalism, integrity and open-mindedness. I expect my experts to reflect the same values.

Yes, everyone chooses their experts, in fact life is made up of choices, and it is wise to choose the information that you believe to be correct, and that you trust, and I am doing the same and I seem to be a fool because I choose to believe the things that you think are foolish, but my God tells me that people will react that way to the truth so your reactions are perceived as a natural response to the truth, and you are simply proving the written word to me. But I also practice tolerance, so I also believe that it is ok to disagree, and I am enjoying all of these discussions.

 

[Hallstone]

You're happy to accept this unfounded nonsense and speculation but refuse to accept evidence about the Earth that can be tested, repeated and verified by anyone with an actual understanding of the Earth sciences (including you if you bothered to get an education on a subject before you declared it wrong).

Do you actually realize what's wrong with that? Does it ever occur to you that it might be your beliefs that are incorrect? I don't mean your Christianity (which seems to be a very positive thing for most people of that persuasion), I mean your irrational belief that Genesis is a literal description of the creation of the Earth when academic research from history, theology, biology, the Earth sciences have shown for over a century that it isn't.

My Choice

 

[ScottA]

Sorry, but making up stories does not make contradictory evidence go away.

Do you really think a criminal can make all of the forensic evidence go away by claiming that Leprechaun's planted it?

The error is in thinking that stories in books make evidence go away.

So...books, talk, and leprechauns are not allowed? That, pretty much eliminates science then.

On the contrary, eye witness testimony and first hand encounters, are ironclad.

 

[46AND2]

So...books, talk, and leprechauns are not allowed? That, pretty much eliminates science then.

On the contrary, eye witness testimony and first hand encounters, are ironclad.

Why do so many Christians have difficulty determining the difference between eyewitness and hearsay testimony?

 

[Ophiolite]

Why do so many Christians have difficulty determining the difference between eyewitness and hearsay testimony?

Why would anyone in their right mind place any significant value on eyewitness testimony? It has been clearly established that eyewitness testimony is unreliable. To base decisions on what someone said they heard someone saw is about as sensible as using cyanide as a sugar substitute in baking.

 

[AV1611VET]

Why would anyone in their right mind place any significant value on eyewitness testimony? It has been clearly established that eyewitness testimony is unreliable. To base decisions on what someone said they heard someone saw is about as sensible as using cyanide as a sugar substitute in baking.

How many killers have been caught because they were in a bar bragging about it?

 

[Ophiolite]

Yes, everyone chooses their experts, in fact life is made up of choices, and it is wise to choose the information that you believe to be correct,

I don't choose the information I believe to be correct. I choose the information that is most likely to be correct because it is based on replicated and validated evidence.

 

[46AND2]

Why would anyone in their right mind place any significant value on eyewitness testimony? It has been clearly established that eyewitness testimony is unreliable. To base decisions on what someone said they heard someone saw is about as sensible as using cyanide as a sugar substitute in baking.

Yes, indeed. And hearsay is less reliable still...

But that's beside the point, really. One of the biggest claims of evidence of the resurrection is of eyewitness testimony. Yet, they fail even that burden, since their claimed eyewitness testimony is actually hearsay

 

[46AND2]

How many killers have been caught because they were in a bar bragging about it?

Dunno. Got a count? A point?

 

[AV1611VET]

Dunno. Got a count? A point?

If I was a police chief and gave a press conference and asked ANYONE who has ANY information, NO MATTER HOW SMALL, on the abduction of little Suzie; and I heard my deputies talking like this, they'd be pushing pencils.

 

[46AND2]

If I was a police chief and gave a press conference and asked ANYONE who has ANY information, NO MATTER HOW SMALL, on the abduction of little Suzie; and I heard my deputies talking like this, they'd be pushing pencils.

Cool story, bro.

Why do you always give up when we get down to the important questions? I gave you a list of very simple things which would help to sustain my faith, and you completely ignored the whole post.

I also implied that Hovind was no different from faith healers, yet you have continually shown your support for him.

I'll tell you why. It's because you have no answers for my questions. Nobody (in my 21 years of Christianity, nor my 7 years of atheism) has had the answers...

 

[AV1611VET]

I'll tell you why. It's because you have no answers for my questions. Nobody (in my 21 years of Christianity, nor my 7 years of atheism) has had the answers...

That's because you've sewn yourself up in a cocoon that no one but God can enter.

You want God to come to you, and to come to you on your terms.

You're a one-man seance.

 

[bhsmte]

Why do so many Christians have difficulty determining the difference between eyewitness and hearsay testimony?

Because, they really, really, really need to believe it is legit eye witness testimony?