CLEEB said:

I see you have understanding. I am interested.

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The Spiritual anointing is a very interesting subject.

It's like The LORD poured a sort of heavy, warm, oil upon your head that over time tends to slowly drip down upon your shoulders and body. That Spiritual oil contains healing as well as holiness.

It's the very thing that satan fights against the most. He was the anointed cherub, so he understands how critical it is to GOD's people operating in power.


As was stated by the OP,....

"When John refers to an Anointing from the Spirit, he is referring to our Fellowship, not to any individual,..."

This is a position of ignorance and non-experience that many people on here share.

Peace in Christ.

Jesus is being sought in the man-based churches where He is not.

The man-based churches are places where His manifest life is being denied. The Holy One and the Just is being denied. The Lord of glory who has already been raised from the dead to glory is being crucified among the man-based churches where they are “voting” to crucify Him rather than "release" Him in their own lives so that they may live.

He is not there among the dead man-based churches for He IS RISEN. He is alive now so that we may also live now and not mortally die.

Why seek the Living One among the graves of the dead man-based churches where they have crucified the Lord of glory (and are keeping Him that way)?
They are denying the Holy One in their lives so that His life is never made manifest in their mortal flesh. No flesh is being saved among them. They are instead mortally perishing...and they know not what they are doing as they lack understanding of the gospel of the glory of the Lord Jesus. In ignorance do they do it.

Mat 28:5-6 KJV
(5) And the angel answered and said unto the women, Fear not ye: for I know that ye seek Jesus, which was crucified.
(6) He is not here: for he is risen, as he said. Come, see the place where the Lord lay.

When we number/reckon/estimate/count Him among the man-based churches...the gathering of the transgressors (where He is not), then we are taking part in a "vote" in the crucifying the Lord of glory out of our own lives. We "vote" for their "another jesus"....a jesus the barabbas ... whom they are preaching (the jesus who is the antichrist) instead of Jesus the true Christ.

But to those who shall overcome them, He will give us the hidden manna....the hidden wisdom of God ...that is being hidden from the "princes of this age" who are crucifying the Lord of glory....and persuading a multitude to vote to do the same. They know not what they do.

Our Lord will also give us a stone…a white (LIGHT) stone…to vote with. We choose light instead of darkness We are given a new “name”…that is, a new authority to release Jesus in our lives instead of crucifying the Lord of glory out of it. We vote for the true Jesus who is the Christ and who is innocent.

The word for “stone” here in Revelation 2:17 is the Greek word “psēphos” = From the same as G5584; a pebble (as worn smooth by handling), that is, (by implication of use as a counter or ballot) a verdict (of acquittal) or ticket (of admission); a vote: - stone, voice.

Rev 2:17 KJV
(17) He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth it.

We are given the hidden manna...the hidden wisdom of God...and a white stone to “vote” for the release of Jesus in our own lives…a new authority given by Him to us.

Joh 19:10-11 KJV
(10) Then saith Pilate unto him, Speakest thou not unto me? knowest thou not that I have power to crucify thee, and have power to release thee?
(11) Jesus answered, Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above: therefore he that delivered me unto thee hath the greater sin.

The “chief priests and the elders” of the man-based churches want you to choose their “another jesus”….their jesus the “Barabbas”….which means “son of the father.” They are persuading a MULTITUDE of people to “vote” for the “jesus” of the church fathers that is being preached. When we choose their “jesus” the son of the church fathers, we are choosing to destroy the Jesus out of our own lives.

Mat 27:20-23 KJV
(20) But the chief priests and elders persuaded the multitude that they should ask Barabbas, and destroy Jesus.
(21) The governor answered and said unto them, Whether of the twain will ye that I release unto you? They said, Barabbas.

When we vote for their “another jesus,” we are then choosing to crucify the true Jesus which is the Christ out of our own lives. His life is not being made manifest in our mortal flesh. They "vote" with their "voice" and ALL say unto him "let Him be crucified."

(22) Pilate saith unto them, What shall I do then with Jesus which is called Christ? They all say unto him, Let him be crucified.
(23) And the governor said, Why, what evil hath he done? But they cried out the more, saying, Let him be crucified.

Act 26:10 KJV
(10) Which thing I also did in Jerusalem: and many of the saints did I shut up in prison, having received authority from the chief priests; and when they were put to death, I gave my voice (Greek: psēphos - pebble for voting) against them.

We are denying the Holy One and the Just when we choose their “jesus” the Barabbas….the “jesus” of the church fathers that is being preached by the church rulers…the chief priests and elders. The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob has ALREADY GLORIFIED HIS SON JESUS....so why crucify the Lord of glory out of our own lives? He is risen.

The true witness of the apostles have been silenced.

Act 3:13-15 KJV
(13) The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
(14) But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
(15) And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.

And yet the false witnesses are persuading MULTITUDES to choose their “another jesus” that is being preached in the man-based churches where His resurrected life is not being found as it is being denied by them in their “vote” against Him. The true witnesses...the true apostles... preached the true Jesus and not "another jesus" and is being currently preached by the false apostles...the falsely sent. Jesus was "silent" during the trial of the false accusers which signified the silence of the true witnesses during this time.

2Co 11:3-5 KJV
(3) But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
(4) For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
(5) For I suppose I was not a whit behind the very chiefest apostles.

But in ignorance do we do crucify the Lord of glory (who has already been raised to glory)…as do our church rulers who have persuaded us to do so.

Act 3:17 KJV
(17) And now, brethren, I wot that through ignorance ye did it, as did also your rulers.

The church rulers…the princes of this age…are in ignorance of what they are doing… for if they knew the hidden wisdom (the hidden manna) of God, then they would not crucify the Lord of glory whom God has ALREADY raised from the dead. He has already been raised to glory as He currently sits at the right hand of God. They are keeping Him crucified in their churches.

1Co 2:7-8 KJV
(7) But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
(8) Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.

Satan’s seat…His throne…is there where he is presiding over this “trial” that is being conducted….in the man-based churches where they are voting to crucify the Lord of glory rather than release Him in their own lives.

False witness have come forth in this trial to persuade the multitudes to vote against Him (to DENY Him) and the pile of stones used to vote to crucify Him has gotten high. “Pergamos” = height, elevation. Truth has perished and is cut off from their mouths. There is no true witness being heard in this "trial". We are only hearing false witnesses.

Rev 2:12-13 KJV
(12) And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write; These things saith he which hath the sharp sword with two edges;
(13) I know thy works, and where thou dwellest, even where Satan's seat is: and thou holdest fast my name, and hast not denied my faith, even in those days wherein Antipas was my faithful martyr, who was slain among you, where Satan dwelleth.

Satan's throne ...the false accuser's seat...is presiding over this "trial"

No wonder that Pilate sat down in the judgment seat in a place called the “Pavement”…that is, Lithostrotos which means “stones strewn”.

The stones that are being strewn are the votes to crucify the Lord of glory rather than release Him in our lives and the pile of stones has gotten high (Pergamos = height) from the multitude who are choosing "another jesus" an antichrist rather than Jesus who is the true Christ.

When we vote for their “another jesus” the son of the church fathers, we crucify the true Christ out of our own lives instead of releasing Him so that His life shall be manifest in our mortal flesh so that we may shine His glory.

In Hebrew, it is called “Gabbatha”…which means “elevation, height, knoll” and signifies the mounting elevation of the pile of stones that has been strewn to vote to crucify the Lord of glory. This is what “Pergamos” also means: elevation, height. A MULTITUDE has chosen (in ignorance) to crucify the Lord of glory.

Joh 19:13 KJV
(13) When Pilate therefore heard that saying, he brought Jesus forth, and sat down in the judgment seat in a place that is called the Pavement, but in the Hebrew, Gabbatha.

To those who overcome, He will give a white stone to vote to release Jesus who is the true Christ and overcome the "vote" for "jesus" the barabbas.

Mat 27:17 KJV
(17) Therefore when they were gathered together, Pilate said unto them, Whom will ye that I release unto you? Barabbas, or Jesus which is called Christ?

The christian world we living in today doesn’t seem to understand what type of works this is. The Faith without works is concerning your works, not the works of others. It’s starts off with repentance, that’s one of the first thing Jesus says when he got started in his ministry, Jesus says in Luke 5:32 I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
When people see works in the Bible spoken by Paul and they see law, being put together, they assume that’s talking about the Royal law (Commandments).

The works of the law was nail to the cross, and that works were animal sacrificial laws. Let’s first take a look at this law that was nail to the cross that Paul explains in Hebrews 10: (v.1) For the law (what law, the law of animal sacrifice?) having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect. (v.9) Then said he, (Jesus) Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first that he may establish the second. (v.10) By which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

When Jesus died on the cross that was the end of the first covenant, which consisted of the blood of animals and the keeping of God’s commandments. And his death also brought in the second covenant, which consist of the blood of Jesus and the keeping of God’s commandments. (v.18) Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin. In other words, no more animals are going to die for your sins.

GoldenKingGaze said:

Can Porneia at any point be called love, unrequited love, love at first sight, and contain or lead to eros, and agape?

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This might be helpful to you. There are four different words for love in the NT. They all mean something different.

Blaming news is antiquated and those young fellas aren't watching as much news as commentary online.

It's the talking heads that are really doing a number on male youth right now.

4 fewer storms and 4 fewer hurricanes than the April prediction, but correct on the 4 major hurricanes, including 3 category 5's of which Melissa topped out at 185 mph winds, making it one of the strongest hurricanes ever recorded. [Melissa] also generated the highest wind gust ever recorded by dropsonde data, with a wind gust of 252 mph (406 km/h) at an altitude of 657 ft (200 m), exceeding the record set by Typhoon Megi in 2010.

From a USAnian perspective, a fortunate year with no landfalls of any hurricanes.

When I was preparing my recent article about the Little Vespers of the Byzantine Office, I had a chat with one of the wise men I consult about such things, and we got to talking about the length of the service known as All-night Vigil. As previously noted, the term “all” in “All-night” is something of a rhetorical exaggeration, but in large monasteries such as the great houses on Mt Athos, not by much, and this was his description of the order of services for a patronal feast which he attended at one of them.



“Ninth Hour, Small Vespers, dinner in the refectory with solemn procession from the church and then back afterwards.

Break for confessions

Beginning of All-Night Vigil proper

– Vespers with Artoklasia (4 hours; the troparia at the artoklasia took 30 minutes with the terirems, Psalm 103 took 1.5 hours)

Reading of the Saint’s Life (around midnight)

Orthros

After the Kontakion of the Sixth Ode they passed to a full Akathistos (I went to sleep at that point) (Presumably) First, Third, and Sixth Hours, Divine Liturgy
Then procession with water blessing.

Lunch”

Me: “Terirems?” (This word struck me not only because I had never heard it before, but also because it doesn’t sound Greek at all.)

The wise man explained to me that terirems are nonsense syllables added to the liturgy, which were originally spontaneous expressions of joy added to the texts when sung. Over time, they came to be completely scripted, and it is considered part of Byzantine musical formation to study the codified ones. Not at all surprisingly, theological pseudo-explanations have been created to explain them, e.g., that they are words that the angels sing in heaven, or of a lullaby which the Virgin Mary sang to Christ. There is very little information about them available on the internet, but some of the very few references I was able to find say that they were also used to cover the gaps in the music if the clergy hadn’t finished what they were doing. (The syllables te-, ri-, -rem are not the names of notes, by the way.)

Here are a few of examples. You can find more on YouTube by searching in various languages; in Greek, the word is τεριρεμ, in Slavonic and its derivatives, терирем.

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The Academy became the model for what a real university should be: a place of honest inquiry, moral formation, and resistance to every ideology, as thinkers from antiquity to Newman have affirmed.

I begin my Introduction to Philosophy course by reading Socrates’ defense of the philosophical way of life. Democratic Athens had found him guilty of corrupting the youth, of making the weaker argument defeat the stronger, of not believing in the gods of the city. These are serious charges, but as Plato later argued, they were sham charges designed to hide the shame of all those whose errors were revealed by the Socratic art of question and answer.

In our own day, Charlie Kirk inspired the wrath against him because, like Socrates, he challenged conventional wisdom through the power of public debate. (A wise person welcomes correction, but most of us resent it.)

Now at his trial, Socrates foretells that should the powers set against him succeed in killing him, they would only unleash dozens more Socrates. Go ahead and sentence me to death, he said, but in doing so, you won’t silence the philosophical voice of conscience: It will only grow louder and more persuasive.

What happened, however, was even more powerful than Socrates guessed. Whereas Socrates wandered about the marketplace and questioned people, Plato set down roots and established a school, called the “Academy,” which worked out answers — a move that was so significant for Western culture that to this day the name of his school has been equated with the highest enterprise of learning.

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For nearly three hundred years, “The Shepherd of Hermas” gave instruction to the members and catechumens of the early Church. It taught them the Christian virtues and called for repentance. After being left out of the cannon of the New Testament, however, “Hermas” faded in popularity and use.

So when “the Lord of the flocks comes, He may rejoice concerning you. And He will rejoice, if He find all things sound, and none of you shall perish. But if He find any one of these sheep strayed, woe to the shepherds! And if the shepherds themselves have strayed, what answer will they give Him for their flocks? Will they perchance say that they were harassed by their flocks?”[1]

The Shepherd of Hermas is an inspiring combination of instructions for living the Christian life and an apocalyptic vision of the saved and the damned. At the most basic level, it is “an uncomplicated guide for repentance and moral living that will lead mankind to justification in the sight of God.”[2] Using parables and allegories, the author instructs the early Church so that its members may lead lives pleasing to God.

This work had great authority in the early Church. According to Carolyn Osiek, “No other noncanonical writing was as popular before the fourth century as the Shepherd of Hermas. It is the most frequently attested postcanonical text in the surviving Christian manuscripts of Egypt well into the fifth century.”[3] It was greatly admired by several of the early Church fathers. “Eusebius tells us that it was publicly read in the churches, and that while some denied it to be canonical, others ‘considered it most necessary’. Saint Athanasius speaks of it, together with the Didache, in connection with the deuterocanonical books of the Old Testament, as uncanonical yet recommended by the ancients for the reading of catechumens.”[4] Irenaeus, Bishop of Lyons, about A.D. 185 “proclaimed the book was inspired by divine intercession.”[5] This text was cited, either as scripture or as inspired, by Irenaeus, Tertullian, Clement and Origen.[6] Still, it was not included in the canon due to its lack of apostolic origin.

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Some chilling warnings to the faithful from Caesarius of Heisterbach's hagiographical compendium, including a whispering ghost girl, hellbound jousters, and other tormented souls​

Caesarius of Heisterbach (d. 1240) was one of the most popular hagiographers of the Middle Ages. The prior of the Cistercian Heisterbach Abbey, he’s most famous for his Dialogue on Miracles, which was rivaled only by the Golden Legend in popularity. Over the course of a dozen thematic books, Caesarius tells hundreds of miracle stories categorized by themes like Contrition, Confession, Demons, and so on, but the final chapter is what concerns us today: “Of the Punishment and the Glory of the Dead.”

Some glory. Mostly punishment.

These stories are shaped as exemplum: short anecdotes with a pithy moral to them. The telling varies, with most offering simple pious lessons. For instance:

After a deacon had read the gospel for confessors, that is, “Watch, for ye know not at what hour your Lord will come,” in Aulne, a house of our Order, as he finished those words, a monk in the choir fell down and expired. And all were afraid considering the effect of the Lord’s words. There-fore, brothers, because we know not at what hour our Lord will come, let us watch faithfully, let us watch while working that when he comes and shall afflict us with death, we may at once open to Him. May our Lord Jesus Christ deign to grant us that, who will come to judge the living and the dead and the world by fire. Amen.

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Useful information! As a Deacon I’ll keep in mind to be prepared should I drop dead after proclaiming the word.

Some, however, are remarkably vivid. To wit:

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9Rock9 said:

So, since this is the moderate forum, I must ask, what makes you a moderate?

I'm personally starting to think I am a moderate, but I also kinda wary of the label due to fear of drifting towards progressive Christianity and theological liberalism.

I come from a conservative evangelical background, so I saw moderates as a slippery slope towards apostasy.

Now, though, I am not sure if I am a conservative anymore. I still hold conservative viewpoints on Nicene orthodoxy and LGBT related issues pertaining to weddings and ordination, but I think I am moderate on most other issues.

I think the Bible is infallible when it comes to matters of faith and practice, and its purpose is to point the reader to salvation. It's not meant to be a science textbook nor an exhaustive source of all knowledge.

I lean towards a complementarian stance on women's ordination, but I also now know there's more nuance to the issue than I had initially assumed. Aside from thinking the office of pastor should be reserved for men only, I think I am a believer in gender equality in all other areas of life.

I guess I realize that some initial assumptions I held were wrong, and I think I am closer to moderate viewpoints, but I worry about drifting towards liberalism.

A minor thing, but I have been told mainline denominations might be a better fit for me, even though I still think of myself as an Evangelical, though that's likely due to the stereotype of mainline = liberal.

What about you? Anyone else have similar concerns?

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I don't think 'moderate' is really the term you're looking for in relation to being reasonable about your faith. I only use moderate when referring to politics.

zoidar said:

Most of what you have quoted is true of believers, but not true concerning all Jesus atoned for, since he atoned for everyone, not just believers.

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It's true for all whom Christ died for which causes believers.

Singer, rapper, and songwriter, Jelly Roll, whose real name is Jason Bradley DeFord, credited God for his success after receiving three Grammy nominations for 2026.

On Nov. 7, it was announced that Jelly Roll and Christian musician Brandon Lake were nominated for Best Contemporary Christian Music Performance/Song for their collaboration on Lake’s “Hard Fought Hallelujah.” Jelly Roll was also nominated for Best Contemporary Country Album for “Beautifully Broken,” and Best Country Duo/Group Performance for “Amen.”

The nominations came as a shock to Jelly Roll, who shared his excitement in a social media video. He said he first learned of the nominations while in Australia and described the moment as “probably the craziest thing that’s ever happened” in his life.

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Hi all! Wow, I haven’t posted here in over a year! Just an update that now I have an almost 1 year old daughter!! She’s such a cutie, loves to point at everything, stand up, wave at everyone, and call me Dada! Lol. Hope you all are doing great, looks like this place is still pretty slow, haha.

Rescued One said:

Be compassionate to those who have PTSD and terminal illnesses insread of judgmental. Jesus wept.

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A mind-blowing passage from the Scriptures reminds us that if we care for these, it’s like we’re caring for Jesus (“you did it unto me”)!

Guojing said:

When you say Acts 21 is no longer possible, are you answering yes to my clarifying question? I just want to understand where you are coming from.

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Historical context: occurs after Jesus resurrection with primarily cultural Jews around the 40’s ad. James, the brother of Christ, is the head of the Jerusalem church which is composed of primarily cultural Jews that have embraced Jesus as their messiah but still retain the law because the temple is the center of their culture and activities. They are not willing to give that up. Paul comes to visit with some gentiles to bring tithes to the church. The Jews believe that Paul is teaching other Jews to forsake the law and that he invited a gentile into the temple which would have defiled the temple. The Jews try to kill Paul and the centurion saves him when Paul reveals his Roman citizenship.

Physical context: Paul, along with eight gentiles arrive in Jerusalem. They are welcomed initially and go to James house were the elders were also present. The next day Paul purifies himself at one of the purification pools and goes to the temple were there was a large crowd and they seize Paul. They take him out of the temple and shut the doors so that the temple would not be defiled. They beat Paul outside of the temple among the large crowd until the Roman soldiers arrive so this is still outside of the temple. The soldiers took him toward the barracks with the crowd following where Paul addresses the crowd outside of the barracks.


Cultural context: there is a lot to cover here but I’m going to just summarize. Jerusalem is the center of life for the Jews including the temple were they would congregate along with other Jews from other cities that would travel to Jerusalem to worship or attend special days or festivals. This was the center of cultural Israel. The Jews were cultural people whose life revolved around the Torah and the Law. The law had been given to Moses to give to Israel because they were God’s chosen people so it made them unique among the rest of the people inhabiting the Lavant. The Jews considered preaching against the law to be a capital offense so James had to thread lightly when teaching the Jewish converts about salvation by faith without the works of the law.

On the other hand, the churches that Paul planted were primarily gentile that also included Jews. Paul could teach salvation by faith without the treat of death but with opposing groups of Jewish converts promoting the law. Apparently the problem was particularly problematic in the Galatian church. The rest of the Apostles that left Jerusalem were also able to teach salvation by faith. BTW- based on accounts by early church fathers James was eventually martyred (stoned) for his Christian believes.

Situational context: the events of Acts 21:27-40 happened because of the clash of Christian doctrine of salvation by faith apart from the works of the law and the converted Jews that refused to give up what their ancestors had believed for 15 centuries.

A proper exegesis of all the elements of context would not be possible in this platform since it would take many pages to unpack it but this will do as a summary. As you can see the cultural Jews in Jerusalem still attended all events in the Temple and the Temple still ruled their lives. The law, among the Jews, continued for his reason. James had to be careful of what and how he preached the gospel of good news. A few years later, and prophesied by Jesus in Matt. 24, the temple will be destroyed and the Jews would be expelled from Jerusalem ending the temple life and dispersing the Jews.

The events of Acts 21 cannot happen again because all if its context can not be repeated. The cultural Jew in Jerusalem and the temple are no longer there. The law among the gentiles was never a problem because the apostles ruled in the council of Jerusalem that they are not under the law. The problem of continuing under the law was a problem unique to the converted Jews which Paul argues against in his epistles to the churches.

I hope this helps and clears my position. You do with this as you will. I have stated my case.

Personally, I wish our street preacher would pick a different verse to put on his sign. Many of the festival attendees grew up in churches, and they've already heard the message that God doesn't want them. The preacher is reinforcing that message.

But the first amendment to the US Constitution firmly protects our sign-carrying preacher, both as freedom of speech and freedom of religion.

Post #17 not valid but a result of my clumsy fingers. and tired eyes.