You all need to stop.

[eastcoast_bsc]

You didn't understand the concept of those verses.

Indeed I did. Sometimes when we are confronted with ourselves we become haughty and deny. The scripture can be used as a mirror. I am aware of my spiritual poverty, are you ?

 

[Uphill Battle]

Mercy is right, this is an infestation getting into our churches. And taking the hippie lets love everyone but not correct them read will not help them. We must fight this, and IT IS CHRIST LIKE TO FIGHT THIS since Christ would never permit this in his church.

there is also an infestation of loose morals regarding heterosexuallity. There is also an infestation regarding legalism. an infestation of bigotry.

yet you are mute on that, and stick to poking the homosexuals with tired hate filled tirades.

Nobody stated you have to condone what they do. I certainly don't. I just don't believe the self righteous bovine droppings that you guys spread around like so much odiferous peanut butter does anything other than prove a lack of Christ likeness in your own conduct.

 

[GwynApNudd]

So those verse had nothing to do with what I said...so what?

Of course He was with sinners. After all everyone is a sinner. Even the Pharisees in those verses. Even though they didn't think so.

IT IS CHRIST LIKE TO FIGHT THIS since Christ would never permit this in his church.

If Christ would not allow a person into His Church because he is a sinner, then there could be no Church because no one would be allowed.

Just because he was with sinners that dosn't imply that you allow sin. BIG DIFFERENCE.

Nothing was said about "allowing sin." Where did I say anything about allowing sin?

But since you bring it up, are you claiming that you were able to rid your life of all sin? Even before accepting the gift of salvation? If you are that's a rather bold claim. If you aren't, then what is your point?

Sinners are not only allowed into the Church while still in their sinful state, they are called while still in their sinful state. (see Romans 5:8 and Romans 10:13-14)

 

[Floatingaxe]

there is also an infestation of loose morals regarding heterosexuallity. There is also an infestation regarding legalism. an infestation of bigotry.

yet you are mute on that, and stick to poking the homosexuals with tired hate filled tirades.

Nobody stated you have to condone what they do. I certainly don't. I just don't believe the self righteous bovine droppings that you guys spread around like so much odiferous peanut butter does anything other than prove a lack of Christ likeness in your own conduct.

What do you know about our sanctification? If you read the Word more closely, Jesus tells us that when we have our own splinters removed, we CAN then be able to point out that splinter in our brothers and sisters and help bring them to wholeness.

So far, I see a lot of people who come from freedom in this area of homosexuality, attempting to offer the truth and point out that these homosexuals are shipwrecks-in-the-making, and they are rebuffed. Typical. A drowning man drowns his saviour, doesn't he?

NewGuy is right. We must fight for purity in the Church. Jesus would have it no other way. It is being invaded by a weeping, infected cancer. The Holy Spirit is with those who are His, and as long as we put on the whole armour of God each day, our prayer will be powerful to counteract this onslaught of immorality.

 

[ReformedChapin]

there is also an infestation of loose morals regarding heterosexuallity. There is also an infestation regarding legalism. an infestation of bigotry.

yet you are mute on that, and stick to poking the homosexuals with tired hate filled tirades.

Nobody stated you have to condone what they do. I certainly don't. I just don't believe the self righteous bovine droppings that you guys spread around like so much odiferous peanut butter does anything other than prove a lack of Christ likeness in your own conduct.

No one is being self-rightous, there is a difference between fighting the sin. No church should accept any of those either, my church certainly fights adultary and any other abomination.

 

[GwynApNudd]

What do you know about our sanctification? If you read the Word more closely, Jesus tells us that when we have our own splinters removed, we CAN then be able to point out that splinter in our brothers and sisters and help bring them to wholeness.

Please. I missed the verse wher Jesus says that after you perfect yourself you are encouraged to berate others. Where can I find it?

Apparently Paul missed it as well:
[BIBLE]Romans 3:27[/BIBLE]
[BIBLE]Ephesians 2:1-9[/BIBLE]

 

[Uphill Battle]

What do you know about our sanctification? If you read the Word more closely, Jesus tells us that when we have our own splinters removed, we CAN then be able to point out that splinter in our brothers and sisters and help bring them to wholeness.

So far, I see a lot of people who come from freedom in this area of homosexuality, attempting to offer the truth and point out that these homosexuals are shipwrecks-in-the-making, and they are rebuffed. Typical. A drowning man drowns his saviour, doesn't he?

NewGuy is right. We must fight for purity in the Church. Jesus would have it no other way. It is being invaded by a weeping, infected cancer. The Holy Spirit is with those who are His, and as long as we put on the whole armour of God each day, our prayer will be powerful to counteract this onslaught of immorality.

prayer, sure. Prayer is good. continue to do so. That, is one thing. Browbeating is another.

And perhaps a splinter has been removed. What then, of all the other splinters? Can you see all the more clearly, having one of a multitude removed?

No one is being self-rightous, there is a difference between fighting the sin and being a total prick about it. No church should accept any of those either, my church certainly fights adultary and any other abomination.

no-one self righteous considers themselves such.

 

[TheFathersDaughter]

Hush now you guys. You're attacking Uphill as if he was coming at you with a mallet. And more so, you're proving his opinion true. I understand that you DON'T want that to be the impression, so ACT ON IT.

 

[Floatingaxe]

prayer, sure. Prayer is good. continue to do so. That, is one thing. Browbeating is another.

And perhaps a splinter has been removed. What then, of all the other splinters? Can you see all the more clearly, having one of a multitude removed?


no-one self righteous considers themselves such.

Matthew 7:3-5
And why worry about a speck in your friend’s eye when you have a log in your own? How can you think of saying to your friend, ‘Let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,’ when you can’t see past the log in your own eye? Hypocrite! First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend’s eye.



When a believer has strength and freedom in an area of his or her life, it behooves another believer to heed what he says about the subject...otherwise, be noted as a rebellious one, and unteachable.

 

[ReformedChapin]

Of course He was with sinners. After all everyone is a sinner. Even the Pharisees in those verses. Even though they didn't think so.

If Christ would not allow a person into His Church because he is a sinner, then there could be no Church because no one would be allowed.

Ok lets use your logic, lets allow people who continue to kill in the church and if they kill a Christian or two it's perfectly fine.

Nothing was said about "allowing sin." Where did I say anything about allowing sin?

Allowing homosexuality in the church, that's the point in the first place. No one would stop a repentant homosexual from going to church.

But since you bring it up, are you claiming that you were able to rid your life of all sin? Even before accepting the gift of salvation? If you are that's a rather bold claim. If you aren't, then what is your point?

Again, fighting sin vs allowing sin? That's the point.

Sinners are not only allowed into the Church while still in their sinful state, they are called while still in their sinful state. (see Romans 5:8 and Romans 10:13-14)

Repentant sinners should be allowed in the church.

 

[ReformedChapin]

no-one self righteous considers themselves such.

So it could be anyone, even the homosexual left. What's your point?

 

[Floatingaxe]

Hush now you guys. You're attacking Uphill as if he was coming at you with a mallet. And more so, you're proving his opinion true. I understand that you DON'T want that to be the impression, so ACT ON IT.

With that character, it seems to be turning out to be an UPHILL BATTLE! LOL

 

[GwynApNudd]

Matthew 7:1-5
Do not judge so that you will not be judged. For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. And why worry about a speck in your friend’s eye when you have a log in your own? How can you think of saying to your friend, ‘Let me help you get rid of that speck in your eye,’ when you can’t see past the log in your own eye? Hypocrite! First get rid of the log in your own eye; then you will see well enough to deal with the speck in your friend’s eye.[/QUOTE]

When you quote a passage, consider the context. Jesus is not giving anyone permission to berate other sinners. He is calling them out if they try.

See also:
[BIBLE]Luke 18:9-14[/BIBLE]
[BIBLE]Romans 2:1-3[/BIBLE]
[BIBLE]Matthew 5:22-26[/BIBLE]

In fact, I have heard case made that Matthew 5:22 specifically prohibits gay-bashing insults.

When a believer has strength and freedom in an area of his or her life, it behooves another believer to heed what he says about the subject...otherwise, be noted as a rebellious one, and unteachable.

I assume that you are trying to reference James' advice:
[BIBLE]James 5:16[/BIBLE]

But don't forget that in the same letter, James wrote:
[BIBLE]James 3:1-18[/BIBLE]

 

[Floatingaxe]

Floatingaxe:
When a believer has strength and freedom in an area of his or her life, it behooves another believer to heed what he says about the subject...otherwise, be noted as a rebellious one, and unteachable.

GwynApNudd:I assume that you are trying to reference James' advice:
James 5:16Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.

Ummm, no. I am speaking about how we are to emulate our leaders, and listen to our elders in the Lord. When a believer has mastered an area of life we may struggle in or have a misunderstanding of, it is a wise thing to learn from that Christian. That is one thing that Jesus is telling us in my posted scripture reference. Get your freedom, then you can help someone with their "speck". Good principle. It's good discipling, and you are called to be a good disciple as well as a good discipler.

 

[GwynApNudd]

Even your brief description seems at odds with what you are actually doing. In your description, you are saying that if I am struggling with an issue I should find someone who has had the same struggle and overcome it.

So unless you are now coming out as a lesbian, and people in this sub-forum have asked you to counsel them in their struggle, what you are doing has nothing to do with what you claim you are doing.

And your "posted scripture reference" (I presume that you mean the Matthew 7 reference) does not authorize us to take it on ourselves to tear down others. It exhorts just the opposite. That we must examine our own motives and actions.

 

[furry001]

Allowing homosexuality in the church, that's the point in the first place. No one would stop a repentant homosexual from going to church.

Repentant sinners should be allowed in the church.

In my experience, it is the unrepentent sinners who would come to church in the first place. In ours, we have a meeting on Sunday evenings where they are most welcome. At that meeting, we preach the gospel in an attempt to show them the error of their ways. We do not expect them to come in repentant. They probably wouldn't know the meaning of the word repentant.

Why would you not allow an unrepentant sinner to enter into your chuch building? How are you able to show them the love of God (ie, He sent His Son to die on the cross that we might live) if they are unwelcome.

 

[IamRedeemed]

You are right. But the folks in here claim to already have been there done that. But this is one area of sin they are unwilling to yield to the Lord and are willing to kill other Christians to keep.

If I was a married prostitute and I said I am a Christian and am heaven bound, and I told you that I am not sinning, that there is nothing you can say that will convince me otherwise what would you say to me?

In my experience, it is the unrepentent sinners who would come to church in the first place. In ours, we have a meeting on Sunday evenings where they are most welcome. At that meeting, we preach the gospel in an attempt to show them the error of their ways. We do not expect them to come in repentant. They probably wouldn't know the meaning of the word repentant.

Why would you not allow an unrepentant sinner to enter into your chuch building? How are you able to show them the love of God (ie, He sent His Son to die on the cross that we might live) if they are unwelcome.

 

[IamRedeemed]

And the people that love the Lord and His good Word said

And yes, Uphill battle I am with Mercy Burst on this,

1) you said gay sex is sin. Do you care to prove that with a bible? Let's see you be the guy that does it right since nobody else can.[mercyburst]

I would like to see you put your money where your mouth is on this. Please show us how to do it right.

This debate is about one issue: is the bible we read an authority or not?


A couple of major reasons. First of all the gays say it is not sin.

Secondly, if you've been reading the news, it's splitting christendom in two pieces. Sooner or later you must choose which side you are on, because the views are totally incompatible in the church.



Many gays tell everyone that repentence is not necessary. What do you think about that? Do you think that's a good message to preach?



ok let's see you debate the gays here on the point you've already made:

1) you said gay sex is sin. Do you care to prove that with a bible? Let's see you be the guy that does it right since nobody else can.



He mentioned Sodom and Gomorrah in the day of judgment on several occassions, and it wasn't good:

Matthew 11:24But I say unto you, That it shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom in the day of judgment, than for thee.

The souls in Sodom are burning in hell today according to Jude, as an eternal example. We should learn from it.






He didn't condemn any sin that I recall except blasphemy against the holy spirit. He didn't have to prioritize sin. That was already done in the OT law, which Jesus came to fulfil.




THey focus on the poor and needy as well. I think most churches have a very balanced perspective on things myself.



I'm sure the internet cannibal would be proud of some people here as well.



I'm not looking for someone to love me when I tell them they are a sinner. I rather expect retribution myself.



So has your church split over gay sex yet?

 

[IamRedeemed]

And the people that love the Lord and His good Word said

Mercy is right, this is an infestation getting into our churches. And taking the hippie lets love everyone but not correct them read will not help them. We must fight this, and IT IS CHRIST LIKE TO FIGHT THIS since Christ would never permit this in his church.

 

[IamRedeemed]

You do not know what you are talking
about and are not even close. Evidence was
requested, evidence was received. End of story.

OH PS: I think quite of few of the usual suspects, are boycotting the sandbox, because of the new rules changes. So you might not experience the full wrath and fury. They have taken their shovels and pails, and now they only lurk on the forums.