Xbox 360 Cafee/Bar (I cant make this stuff up)

[Hitokiri Battousai]

I dont want to be part of a faith that makes me reject who I am

ok..whats going on?
What are you guys talking about? each tell your part of the story. please ()

 

[JacobsDream]

I dont want to be part of a faith that makes me reject who I am

What you are is not whats best for you.


Hitokiri, YGPM.

 

[Helo]

What you are is not whats best for you.

Says who??

 

[JacobsDream]

Just curious, what is it that you are that is best for you. What is the best thing for you that you will compromise by accepting Jesus?

 

[christianity101]

You can not simply let another person read and expect to become a christian it has to be said.

 

[Helo]

Just curious, what is it that you are that is best for you. What is the best thing for you that you will compromise by accepting Jesus?

I dont understand what your asking

 

[ozanaki tori]

I've only read like the first couple of pages, but I want to post here anyway.
I lived in Japan for a couple of years, and I must say that I find Japanese people attractive (because I sexually matured there, 12-15, they were all I knew when I started noticing girls in a major way), but by my standards they could use some dental help. But it's not a big deal, I'm not a big tooth person.
I've been called an egg before, but my personal culture and style and everything formed in those years I spent in Japan.
I only ever saw maybe 4 anime shows on TV in Japan, and buying it is expensive.
Everything's pretty expensive.

But, I'd move back there in an heartbeat. Bad teeth, good teeth, cheap stuff, expensive stuff..there's a lot of racism in Japan, they're not a perfected people, but I prefer it to the cultures of the other places I've been.
It has its problems, many and many, but I think it's on the right track.
I do, however, see a return to nationalism or even State Shinto as being in the future.
And you really can't get the kind of good Japanese food there as you can here in the states. I've yet to find a good yakisoba, and I've been back for 5 years, nigh on 6, that beats even the warm-up stuff you get at 7/11.

Now, I'm off to run around the house in my UniQlo jeans

 

[ozanaki tori]

I dont understand what your asking

I take it to mean what do you have that is better than Jesus.

Personally, I find the Hellenic pantheon much more rewarding, and the teachings of the Buddha have helped me in ways Christianity never did.

Edit: After reading more of the thread, perhaps he's asking what it is about yourself that Christianity would make you reject/abandon/whatever.

 

[Helo]

I take it to mean what do you have that is better than Jesus.

Hmmm...I have me.

 

[Hitokiri Battousai]

I am some one that needs to see proof of some thing before i think it's true.
I know people have froun the ark. i know about the terent with a unverted photo of jesus in it and how it was made in the days of jesus and no one to this vary day can make such a thing not with all we know. and i know about how god asked his people to wash thare hands witch was a first back then. so i know the bible is not a fony so i am a christian.

 

[Breetai]

It depends WHERE you stab, a few inches one way or the other makes a difference. Ive been stabbed in the side with an ice-pick and I bled out but it was not an un-surviveable wound. My lungs and heart were un-punctured.[/font]

An ice pick isn't exactly much like a spear that is aimed at vital organs... Where do you think those soldiers would've aimed?

I still dont trust it, its like a game of telephone, the message deteriorates as it gets passed down from person to person, generation to generation, they all put thier own spin on it.

This is not like a game of telephone. These are well documented scriptures that have been shown, with evidence, not to change for approximately 1900 years now. You can not trust if it you want, but then you're ignoring evidence.

For starters, sin. I believe that to hold natural human behaviors and desires as evil is bad. I dont see lust as a bad thing, sex is not wrong as long as its consentual.

Natural human behavior and desire isn't bad, but how you use those things can be. Everything has a place. Lust is not always a bad thing, but it is when you're lusting after something that isn't yours. Sex is not wrong when used the right way, but it certainly can be used wrongly (is adultery right?).

Something else Im not too fond of, is the claim that Christendom has the truth, the absolute and whole truth. That just...doesnt square, it doesnt make sense

Why doesn't that seem possible to you? Of course, Christianity doesn't know everything, but it does teach about the being that does; God.

The idea that human beings are born fundamentally flawed I also dont agree with.

Why not? (feel free to answer in the philosophy forum)

That marraige is only between a man and a woman

Marriage was origianally a religious institution. You can go by the secular definition. Then marriage is between whatever your country decides that it's between. That still doesn't change the facts of what marriage originally was. It's a religious covenant.

These are things that I fundamentally hold dear. If I was to convert to Christianity, I would have to disagree with these things, thus denying who I am and like I said, Id rather burn for telling the truth than exalt for lying.

If you are referring to things like sex, drugs and rock and roll (you know what I mean), well I like those things too. They're fun. But, if there's a God that has shown himself to be real and has shown you something better than those things, then it's not so hard to give them up. I don't even desire the things that I used to any more. It's really no big deal.

Actually, you'd probably be surprised at what doesn't conflict with Christianity.

 

[Breetai]

I take it to mean what do you have that is better than Jesus.

Since this thread has turned into basically a free thread for random debate (in a games forum! Awesome!), I'll address you too.

Personally, I find the Hellenic pantheon much more rewarding, and the teachings of the Buddha have helped me in ways Christianity never did.

The Hellenic pantheon might provide some more interesting reading than the Bible...

How though, is the Greek family of God more rewarding than the Christian God?

About Buddha; a lot of Jesus teachings were very similar in many areas. Buddha offers no hope though. Only dispair, or at best, indifference.

I do really like Buddha though. I'm actually a regular visiter to a temple near where I live (called Tongdosa). I actually think it's possible to be a Buddhist-Christian.

 

[Helo]

An ice pick isn't exactly much like a spear that is aimed at vital organs... Where do you think those soldiers would've aimed?

The Roman spear that Jesus was stabbed with had a head of about 5 or 6 inches in length. The ice-pick was most DEFINATELY aimed at vital organs and was 7 inches 12cm in length. Jesus was held ABOVE the soldier's head so he would have stabbed upwards into Jesus' chest, probably hoping to puncture a lung and his blow, Id be willing to bet, landed maybe 5 or so inches down from his arm-pit. Too low for the heart and a blow in that area, even by a substantial weapon, can still miss the lungs as I very well know.

Annother explanation I have heard was that Jesus was stabbed with the Roman pilum, a short wooden spear with a metal shank about 60cm long made of iron. The pilum was an infantry weapon designed to be thrown by an advancing army into the ranks of the enemy. The iron would lodge in a shield or person and bend, making it useless as a weapon to be used in hand to hand combat or thrown back. An infantryman would usually carry one or two of these spears into combat. The soldier that stabbed Jesus wasnt in a combat situation so its un-likely that he would have been armed with a pilum, that plus the soft iron head of the pilum would make it wasteful to just stick one person with it and have it bent out of shape.

This is not like a game of telephone. These are well documented scriptures that have been shown, with evidence, not to change for approximately 1900 years now. You can not trust if it you want, but then you're ignoring evidence.

Words can be changed, even accidentally, through mis-translation. One language could have a word that means "follow", a person could translate that into annother language, but in his language, the word that meant "follow" in the first language could mean "lead". Thus you've changed the dynamics of the text.

Why doesn't that seem possible to you? Of course, Christianity doesn't know everything, but it does teach about the being that does; God.

For starters, almost EVERY religion claims to know everything and have the absolute truth, why should I believe Christianity over Islam or Judiaism?

Why not? (feel free to answer in the philosophy forum)

It doesnt make sense, just by being BORN your flawed? And isnt there a bible verse that says the son shall not suffer for the sins of the father?

If you are referring to things like sex, drugs and rock and roll (you know what I mean), well I like those things too. They're fun. But, if there's a God that has shown himself to be real and has shown you something better than those things, then it's not so hard to give them up. I don't even desire the things that I used to any more. It's really no big deal.

I believe in asking questions, I believe that sex outside of marraige (As long as its smart and willing) is ok, I believe homosexuality (Sex, love, and marraige) is a good thing, I believe you dont need people telling you what a deity is saying, I believe that anything created by man with the goal to be religious (The bible) is suspect, I believe if you kill someone well then you should earn yourself a bullet to the brain, I believe that you should not have to fear a deity you worship, I believe that you shouldnt have to surrenduer yourself completely to a deity.

Actually, you'd probably be surprised at what doesn't conflict with Christianity.

Try me.

How though, is the Greek family of God more rewarding than the Christian God?

I am a worshiper and follower of Athena. Times are rough right now but over-all theyve been pretty good, my life has DEFINATELY improved since I took up worship of her. I went from wanting to (And almost succeding, faulty firing pins can be a blessing in disguise) eat a gun to a life I can actually live through

 

[ozanaki tori]

Since this thread has turned into basically a free thread for random debate (in a games forum! Awesome!), I'll address you too.
The Hellenic pantheon might provide some more interesting reading than the Bible...

How though, is the Greek family of God more rewarding than the Christian God?

About Buddha; a lot of Jesus teachings were very similar in many areas. Buddha offers no hope though. Only dispair, or at best, indifference.

I do really like Buddha though. I'm actually a regular visiter to a temple near where I live (called Tongdosa). I actually think it's possible to be a Buddhist-Christian.

I was a Buddhist-Christian for a time.

It's not about a more interesting read. Hermes is a very fitting deity for me, as I am almost always travelling around and moving and also in a more internal sense I'm always changing and growing.
That is for this life, day-to-day.
Also, I call on Athena (not in the way of hubris, though) for my family members as for the past couple of years at least one of them has been in Iraq, usually two at a time, in war.

It's better for me to have specific deities upon which to focus.
And also, I don't mean any offense by this at all, but the Christian God is a lot like a child to me. A selfish, powerful child.
Since my childhood he has been a friend to me and I still have a close bond with him - but my worship goes elsewhere because I simply cannot bring myself to accept his ideas. The teachings of his son are all well and good, but he would not condemn his father's justness.
I'd rather something unjust and crazy than just to the point of the Christian God.
It's just what fulfills me more.

As for Buddhism, I'd rather reach enlightenment than go to heaven. If I reach enlightenment, I won't want to go to heaven. I won't need hope, I will be above it.

Edit to add: after giving this some thought, I figured I should point out: I'm not here to debate. At all. I joined these forums while still a Christian and started back posting because I found out a friend of mine posts here.

 

[JacobsDream]

And also, I don't mean any offense by this at all, but the Christian God is a lot like a child to me. A selfish, powerful child.
Since my childhood he has been a friend to me and I still have a close bond with him - but my worship goes elsewhere because I simply cannot bring myself to accept his ideas. The teachings of his son are all well and good, but he would not condemn his father's justness.

You can always ask questions. Why is my worship going elsewhere? Does me not accepting Him make another alternative superior to him? How do I know my worship is going elsewhere?
You had that point of view as a child like you said and I don't see the selfishness you are saying (not when Jesus died for us). I too knew him from childhood and as I've grown, I have understood him more. I certainly didn't know or understand everything as a child. Why would Jesus condemn his father's justness? The whole thing (no offence) doesn't make sense to you, thats why we inquire and not make assumptions based on the much we understand, if you know what I mean.

I hope you see where I'm comming from by my comments.
Like you said, you are not here to argue or debate so don't bother replying. You can pm me or start another thread where I can answer any questions you have.
We are not here to shove Jesus down anybody's throat but to give enough clarification about christianity for us to make the choicethat is best, so that we are not making assumptions.

 

[Breetai]

I am a worshiper and follower of Athena.

Yeah, there's lots of evidence for her existence out there...

Why would you go though all of the trouble of trying to debunk the Christian God, who actually has substantial evidence to His credit, to worshipping Athena?
In your own words, "that makes no sense". It's hypocritial as well.



I'm probably not going to respond to this thread any further.

 

[Helo]

Yeah, there's lots of evidence for her existence out there...

Enough for me to worship her

It's hypocritial as well.

No actually it isnt. I rejected God because of negative personal experiences with him. He felt...cold and distant. Athena was the opposite, she has given me strength and wisdom but also left me alone to learn on my own when I need to. She doesnt carry me on her back, but she lends a hand when she feels its appropriate, and who am I to argue?