Works

[Lulav]

Oh and G-d does not call his instructions 'works', they are the way to walk before him uprightly.

 

[mercy1061]

From "Bible Doctrine" by Wayne Grudman, glossary:

"election. An act of God before creation in which he chose some people to be saved, not on account of any foreseen merit in them, but only because of his sovereign good pleasure."

You are reciting to me the doctrines of men. I do not need a definition of "election" mixed with men's doctrines. It is effective to use a simple dictionary to define the election process. In modern Israel, her government performs an election process.

Election:

1. the selection of a person or persons for office by vote.

2. a public vote upon a proposition submitted.

3. the act of electing.



Although elections are performed by men; G-d's purpose in election might stand, "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated". Isaac loved Esau more than Jacob; so Esau was given the "birthright" from their father Isaac. We know Esau left his mother's womb first; Isaac had a taste for game; Esau worked or "game" out in the field to please his father Isaac.

Gen 25
28 Yitz’chak favored ‘Esav, because he had a taste for game; Rivkah favored Ya‘akov.

From "Jewish New Testament Commentary" by David H. Stern, pge 390:

"... standing with God doesn't depend on human desires or efforts, God does nevertheless have mercy and does show pity."

Election has nothing to do with man. It is solely an act of Gd. That is the point being made.

You use "commentary" to define election; public elections are performed by men; men vote into Public Office their political leader or party. Israel and the United States perform public elections; elections or the voting process is performed by men to select a political leader for a nation; but G-d's purpose inside election "might" stand.

If "elections are performed by men" then we'd have salvation by works.

No! Since elections are performed by men; we have elections performed by men, but G-d's purpose in election "might" stand; that is "Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated" although Esau is regarded as the firstborn by men when G-d created Jacob first inside his mother's womb.

We need to get the terms straight or any discussion is meaningless. So, what did you mean by the statement "elections are performed by men"?

What nation do you live? If you live in Israel or the US; you should be familiar with the election process. I understand England has a royal family in power.

 

[mercy1061]

The topic is faith vs. works, and in that context vis asked "Where does the law have an arrival spot?"

It seems here you are now arguing for works, not just faith. How, if at all, do you think trust fits into the picture?

Dan C

Esau worked for his father's favor; G-d created Jacob first. So you have not been carefully listening to my words. You have listed James in your arguments to somehow argue against "faith alone"; James says show me your faith without works and he would show you his faith by his works.

 

[visionary]

Oh and G-d does not call his instructions 'works', they are the way to walk before him uprightly.

Torah was not merely given “from” Heaven, instead the Torah is considered to actually “be” Heaven. In other words, HaShem “gives Himself” in His Torah (Proverbs 8; Psalm19:8-13).

 

[dnc101]

You are reciting to me the doctrines of men. I do not need a definition of "election" mixed with men's doctrines. It is effective to use a simple dictionary to define the election process. In modern Israel, her government performs an election process.

Election:

1. the selection of a person or persons for office by vote.

2. a public vote upon a proposition submitted.

3. the act of electing.

...

You are kidding, right?



Probably not ...

(button, button ... wereizzit ...)

 

[Lulav]

Torah was not merely given “from” Heaven, instead the Torah is considered to actually “be” Heaven. In other words, HaShem “gives Himself” in His Torah (Proverbs 8; Psalm19:8-13).

Yes, it is the way to be one with him as Yeshua spoke of in John, I and the Father are one.