Working out our own salvation

[least]

“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12)

As I am studying this passage (Philippians 2:12-18) God is speaking to me about diligence in working in the salvation that he has given me. This verse does not say that we are obtaining our salvation by our works, but rather that we are to work out of the salvation given to us by God through Christ. We are to work at it with fear and trembling (Strong’s definition says the word is “used to describe the anxiety of one who distrusts his ability completely to meet all requirements, but religiously does his utmost to fulfil his duty”). Fortunately for us, verse 13 encourages us with the knowledge that it is God who empowers us to do all that he calls us to do!

I thought it would be interesting to see what some of you guys do to intentionally work out your salvation. The disciplines of prayer and bible study notwithstanding, what do you do each day to ensure you are working to add to your faith (2 Peter 1:5-8)?

 

[Bluelion]

I am still working on loving everyone. I read the Bible and keep an eye out for what God says to do to make it easier to Love. Two things I have been working on from James, listening to other before being listen to, and controlling my tongue.

I have a question for you, the text you quoted speaks of fear of God. There is a movement among people that says you are not suppose to fear God that Love does not fear, and that God never meant for us to fear Him. I know God was clear fear of Him is healthy many times he says this in the Bible, but what do you say to this new camp of people in the world. How would you address such issues? Can such a person be saved if they have no fear of God?

 

[least]

This is a great question, because for a long time I assumed that fear of God meant "a reverence or respect", which in fact it often does mean that. This passage uses the word fear in the sense of terror or dread (see Vine's Dictionary, or Strong's). The Greek word is Phobos, and that is where we get our word phobia from. Peter says we are to "fear God" (1 Peter 2:17). When we are doing well we are warned to "take heed" so that we do not fall (1 Corinthians 10:12). This is because we sometimes rest in our salvation when we ought to be working in it. "It is a terrifying thing to fall into the hands of the living God" (Hebrews 10:31)

When John writes "there is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love," he is speaking of the fear of judgment. Romans 8:1, "Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." We are not to fear the judgment of the unbeliever; but that doesn't mean we are not to fear God.

I think the answer to the question of fear is much like that of other emotions, that is to say, we need to have a healthy balance. In reference to our discussion, it is important that we have a true fear of God when deciding what course of action to take each day. What if, when I wake up in the morning, it take no thought of how I am going to "work out my salvation"? Obviously, I am not going to do a thing towards growing in my walk. I show by that action that the things of God are not important to me; I show no fear of God's presence in my life (why should I, he'll just forgive me?); I show that I am not interested in doing God's will because I don't care enough to be intentional about it. But read what Paul says to the Corinthians,

"Therefore we also have as our ambition, whether at home or absent, to be pleasing to Him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad." (2 Corinthians 5:9-10)

I think we had better think again if we assume that we are not to have a fear of God in our lives. Perhaps that is why the Church is so weak and apathetic today, because we don't realize that God is going to judge us based on our actions. True, we have no condemnation in Christ, that is to say, we need not fear eternal punishment, but we are still going to one day stand before the Judge of all the earth--and a healthy dose of fear will make that day go a lot better!

 

[Bluelion]

This is a great question, because for a long time I assumed that fear of God meant "a reverence or respect", which in fact it often does mean that. This passage uses the word fear in the sense of terror or dread (see Vine's Dictionary, or Strong's). The Greek word is Phobos, and that is where we get our word phobia from. Peter says we are to "fear God" (1 Peter 2:17). When we are doing well we are warned to "take heed" so that we do not fall (1 Corinthians 10:12). This is because we sometimes rest in our salvation when we ought to be working in it. "It is a terrifying thing to fall into the hands of the living God" (Hebrews 10:31)

When John writes "there is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love," he is speaking of the fear of judgment. Romans 8:1, "Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." We are not to fear the judgment of the unbeliever; but that doesn't mean we are not to fear God.

I think the answer to the question of fear is much like that of other emotions, that is to say, we need to have a healthy balance. In reference to our discussion, it is important that we have a true fear of God when deciding what course of action to take each day. What if, when I wake up in the morning, it take no thought of how I am going to "work out my salvation"? Obviously, I am not going to do a thing towards growing in my walk. I show by that action that the things of God are not important to me; I show no fear of God's presence in my life (why should I, he'll just forgive me?); I show that I am not interested in doing God's will because I don't care enough to be intentional about it. But read what Paul says to the Corinthians,

"Therefore we also have as our ambition, whether at home or absent, to be pleasing to Him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad." (2 Corinthians 5:9-10)

I think we had better think again if we assume that we are not to have a fear of God in our lives. Perhaps that is why the Church is so weak and apathetic today, because we don't realize that God is going to judge us based on our actions. True, we have no condemnation in Christ, that is to say, we need not fear eternal punishment, but we are still going to one day stand before the Judge of all the earth--and a healthy dose of fear will make that day go a lot better!

This is interesting. I hope to escape judgement as I am afraid of God judging me. I almost dared turn away from my calling a second time because I know God will judge those who preach more harshly. The way I came to terms is a i prayed for help for God to keep me from harsh judgement to let me be guiltless. This is a healthy fear though because i take what I am doing seriously. I take God seriously.

Jesus said do not fear men who can kill the body, but fear God who can destroy both body and soul in hell. That is a pretty clear statement He spoke for our own good to help us stand against the world. If we are more afraid of God then the world we will always do God's will over what the worldly things.

People don't like to be afraid, they spent their whole life creating a world they think they control so they do not have to be afraid. Wars are started out of Fear. There is healthy fear when we have it in God. We should never be so afraid we turn from God or hide from Him like Adam did. But we should be afraid when we start to go down the wrong path, As Adam should have been before the eating the fruit, but He found his fear after eating.

I think people who do not fear God do not understand Him. I was accused of preaching a weak God in another thread because i focused on His love, but I am well aware of the great flood, of Sodom, about the history of Israel, about Egypt. God is fast to correct His children and you don't want to be corrected, its like a kid getting grounded, no fun, and for the unbelievers it is the end in most cases when God has had enough. I believe in a God of Love, and I try to focus on His Love because fear often makes people run, but I am aware God does enact justice. The Love and fear work together, we fear when we go down the wrong path, but Love brings us to our needs and even though afraid we come to God and pray and beg for mercy. Love and fear go together. look at a child, children fear their parents, and good thing because it protect them. My dog fears me and obeys, and good thing because I keep her safe. So Love and fear work together when done in Christ.

 

[least]

I think the bottom line is that we who are saved do not have to fear the judgment of unbelievers. However, we must stand before God and give an account for our works as his children.

"For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for those who do not obey the gospel of God?" -1 Peter 4:17, ESV

Perhaps we may see love for God and fear of God as two sides of the same coin. Consider Hebrews 4:16, "Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need." On the side of love, we may confidently draw near to God, for the Lord Jesus has torn the veil that separates us. On the flip side of the coin we must remember, though we may draw near to his throne, it is very much still a throne; on it sits the God of creation, the Lord of lords, the I AM that I AM. Again, on one side we see mercy and grace; on the other we realize we must receive it and he must give it, that is to say, we depend on him and not he on us.

 

[Bluelion]

i agree,however, no man comes to the father except through the son. Jesus is the door to The Father and Heaven, when we past through Him we are washed in His blood and are clean, It is only because we must past through Jesus to The Father that we are even able to approach The Throne of God.

 

[least]

i agree,however, no man comes to the father except through the son. Jesus is the door to The Father and Heaven, when we past through Him we are washed in His blood and are clean, It is only because we must past through Jesus to The Father that we are even able to approach The Throne of God.

And that, my friend, is the good news of Jesus Christ!

 

[MrJim]

A lot of this "working out" and the consequences of failing can be found in the Gospel parable of the sower..

 

[least]

A lot of this "working out" and the consequences of failing can be found in the Gospel parable of the sower..

Hi MrJim, I am not sure I see a connection with Philippians 2:12-13, which speaks of "working out" our own salvation (again, not "for" our salvation) and the Parable of the Sower found in Matthew 13:1-9, 18-23. I would love for you to elaborate on it; thanks!

 

[Bluelion]

And that, my friend, is the good news of Jesus Christ!

Always a pleasure conversing with you least. Are you starting school this fall again or have you finished.

 

[least]

I have to take a prerequisite to College Algebra this semester (woe is me!); If I take one class at a time I should finish my Bachelor's by the end of next fall. How about you, how are your classes coming?

 

[98cwitr]

Which I could say that this verse applied to me. The "fear and trembling" part has yet to come in a form that I would associate with building faith. Actually, the whole reason I believe in God is actually due to the lack of fear :shrug: Perfect Love drives out fear 1 John 4

 

[Avid]

“Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12)

... that we are to work out of the salvation given to us by God through Christ...

It seems like a good conversation started, but be careful not to add words to the scriptures to fit our understanding. Rather, add to our understanding from the scriptures.

There is a Doctrine stating that you cannot WORK to earn your salvation. We can be sure that this does not mean that, but some of what we hear developed from that is not scriptural. Don't extend that to mean there is nothing for you to do. There is much for us to do. If we shrug our shoulders, and say that Jesus paid it all, and do nothing beyond that, we have not shown even a desire to find the truth, and gain the salvation of our souls.

All your powers and faculties are so corrupt in your natural state that, except you be purged from dead works, you cannot serve the living God.
Joseph Alleine (1634−1668)

Whatever makes Christ's Gospel palatable to the carnal nature does this by mixtures that are adulterations.
Arthur T. Pierson (1837−1911)​

A significant part of coming to Christ for salvation is turning from the world (even the religious world,) and turning to the truth in the scriptures. God's Holy Spirit uses the Word of God to teach us of God the Father, of His Son Jesus Christ, and of His mercy and grace. Many seek this, but few people ever find the Strait Gate and the Narrow Way that leads to life. (Matthew 7:14, Luke 13:24) Most will never enter at the Door of the sheepfold. (John 10:1−14)

There is a significant thing that most people just will not do, and that is to turn from the things that have held them, and turn to God. The world is against anyone who would try to do this, and many obstacles are placed in the path of the people who try to turn from the world, worldly pleasure, worldly pursuits, worldly companions, worldly glory, etc. If these do not entice the seeking sinner away from that true path, threats and penalties are imposed.

When Jesus was hanging on the cross, He was told to come down from the cross. The process of crucifying the flesh is similar, in that the world will tell you not to be so serious, you do not need to abandon your worldly friends - just come down from the cross.

These scriptures, and quotes from old preachers show that there is a significant effort involved in entering at the STRAIT GATE.

Matthew 11
12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

Hold as hard as you can, you shall be forced to let go your hold of the world at length.
Thomas Boston (1676−1732)

Leaving of all is a hard matter; yea, a harder matter than many are aware of.
John Bunyan (1628−1688)

There are innumerable difficulties in the way; such as few conquer: most of them that try have not resolution, courage, earnestness, and constancy enough; but they fail, give up, and perish. The difficulties are too many and too great for them that do not violently press forward. They never get along, but stick by the way; are turned aside, or turned back, and ruined. Matt. vii. 14.
Jonathan Edwards (1703−1758)

Proverbs 3
11 My son, despise not the chastening of the LORD; neither be weary of his correction:
12 For whom the LORD loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

Matthew 7
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Luke 13
24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

All the world is against him that shall be saved.
John Bunyan (1628−1688)

​

 

[Bluelion]

I have to take a prerequisite to College Algebra this semester (woe is me!); If I take one class at a time I should finish my Bachelor's by the end of next fall. How about you, how are your classes coming?

taken Romans and Acts this fall with Phil course and global studies. I too should have my B.A. at the end of fall next year, then on to masters.

 

[least]

Which I could say that this verse applied to me. The "fear and trembling" part has yet to come in a form that I would associate with building faith. Actually, the whole reason I believe in God is actually due to the lack of fear :shrug: Perfect Love drives out fear 1 John 4

I can certainly see the challenge with dealing with the word "fear". On the one hand, 1 John 4:18 says, "There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves punishment, and the one who fears is not perfected in love." And so we come to understand--in this context--that love casts out the fear of condemnation, because their is "now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus" (Romans 8:1).

On the other hand, however, we find that we will indeed stand before the judgment seat of Christ and give an account of every work we have done, whether good or bad (2 Corinthians 5:10). Read what Paul writes next,

"Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade men..." (v11).

Why does Paul passionately tell others about Jesus? Because he knows his works will be held accountable by Jesus. Of course, this is not the only motive; later he says that the love of God controls (compels) him to share the gospel. But we must understand that, while love does overcome fear, the Bible still demonstrates we are to have a righteous fear of God (1 Peter 2:17).

It is kind of hard for me not to read a little pride into your comment (forgive me if I am wrong, it's just the way it comes across). You alluded that Philippians 2:12-13 doesn't apply to you and you don't see how it associates with building faith. It may be that you only differ in your interpretation of the passage; if that is so, why not present your understanding of it instead of shrugging. While I am pretty solid on my understanding, I am open minded to what you have to say.

 

[least]

It seems like a good conversation started, but be careful not to add words to the scriptures to fit our understanding. Rather, add to our understanding from the scriptures.

There is a Doctrine stating that you cannot WORK to earn your salvation. We can be sure that this does not mean that, but some of what we hear developed from that is not scriptural. Don't extend that to mean there is nothing for you to do. There is much for us to do. If we shrug our shoulders, and say that Jesus paid it all, and do nothing beyond that, we have not shown even a desire to find the truth, and gain the salvation of our souls.

All your powers and faculties are so corrupt in your natural state that, except you be purged from dead works, you cannot serve the living God.

Hi Avid, thanks for your comment. I would never intentionally add to the Scriptures and if it has appeared that I have done so, then I ask everyone's forgiveness, especially the Lord's, for not being more clear. To be fair, when I quote Scripture I always add the quotation marks; the part you have highlighted is my explanation that Paul is in no way saying that we are working for our salvation, but that we are working out (of, in, through, etc) our salvation.

I agree wholeheartedly with your comment, "There is much for us to do." That is the whole point of the thread. Having been purchased, we are now his people and he has called us to do many things, including building our faith, evangelizing and making disciples, and caring for one another.​

 

[Avid]

... Having been purchased, we are now his people and he has called us to do many things, including building our faith, evangelizing and making disciples, and caring for one another.

This is not saying that. It is saying that YOU and I are responsible for getting on top of what ever is needed to be sure we enter in at the strait gate, and that we are not climbing up some other way. (John 10:1)

There is much that happens, and that must be done BEFORE we can claim that God has saved us. Many people will do some act in Church that convinces all around them that they are saved. Nothing in the scriptures to support that (in my knowledge.)

We are required to stop loving ourselves supremely, and love God supremely. That cannot be done by the methods we hear about from most professing "Christians." They have some day or moment that they point to when they say they DECIDED to become a Christian. There is a religious world full of this kind of people, and they go to our churches.

.

 

[least]

This is not saying that. It is saying that YOU and I are responsible for getting on top of what ever is needed to be sure we enter in at the strait gate, and that we are not climbing up some other way. (John 10:1)

There is much that happens, and that must be done BEFORE we can claim that God has saved us. Many people will do some act in Church that convinces all around them that they are saved. Nothing in the scriptures to support that (in my knowledge.)

We are required to stop loving ourselves supremely, and love God supremely. That cannot be done by the methods we hear about from most professing "Christians." They have some day or moment that they point to when they say they DECIDED to become a Christian. There is a religious world full of this kind of people, and they go to our churches.

.

I don't know if I am following what you are saying; are you saying that we are working for our salvation? (I don't think it is, but..?).

I maintain that this passage speaks of believers working out their salvation. It is not saying work for it. If I am off track please expound on your interpretation of the passage.

most respectively

 

[Avid]

... There is a Doctrine stating that you cannot WORK to earn your salvation. We can be sure that this does not mean that, but some of what we hear developed from that is not scriptural. Don't extend that to mean there is nothing for you to do. There is much for us to do. If we shrug our shoulders, and say that Jesus paid it all, and do nothing beyond that, we have not shown even a desire to find the truth, and gain the salvation of our souls.

It is very plain that I am not saying that anyone can or should work to EARN Salvation. Doctrine is important, but I see people taking their doctrine in one area, and extending it to cover things never intended by that doctrine.

We cannot not EARN salvation of our souls (it is a work of the LORD,) but we are REQUIRED to do certain things. Do not extend the doctrine that rejects "Salvation by Works," to also mean, nothing is required of you. One thing we MUST do, that is plainly stated in scripture, is CRUCIFIXION OF THE FLESH.

The scriptures tell us that we must crucify the FLESH with the AFFECTIONS and LUSTS, and that we must, by the Spirit, mortify the deeds of the body. That means we are not right with God unless and until this is done. The works of the flesh must cease, or we remain in our sins. This is NOT a natural act of man. How can it be?

It is by the crucifixion of SELF and the FLESH (the EGO of man) that allows us to enter into His rest. (Hebrews 4:10) Only as we are submitted to God in this specific thing can our lives please the LORD.

Mark 10
21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.

Romans 8
8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Hebrews 4
10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his. ​

Objection: "It sounds like we cannot be pleasing to God as long as there is life and breath in us. Does it mean we need to be in the grave for us to please God?"

Answer: Perish that thought, because, if it were like that, ALL THE DEAD would be pleasing to God, and none of the living would be pleasing to Him. It must mean something other than that... There are two specific things referenced as FLESH in scripture. We are told of things pertaining to physical bodies of people and animals that have muscles and organs, and that are nourished by the blood. There is another use of that word, however, that is clearly different.

Romans 8
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Mere outward reformation differs as much from regeneration as white−washing an old rotten house differs from pulling it down and building a new one in its place.
Augustus M. Toplady (1740−1778) ​

There is a CARNAL MIND (the spirit we are born with.) This refers to the fallen nature of man (the EGO.) It is our FALLEN NATURE we inherited from "Adam the First" that must be crucified according to the scriptures. Until the flesh is crucified, we are CARNAL and FLESHLY.

Romans 8
13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

Galatians 5
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Colossians 3
5 ¶ Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
6 For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
7 In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
8 ¶ But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds; ​

This will seem strange to someone who has not heard it preached at any time. The goal of the Devil (Satan and all his followers,) is to suppress and even eliminate the preaching that actually makes people deal with God on His terms. If we can be reduced to a few convenient doctrines or slogans, we can be kept from God.

As long as the OLD MAN is still in charge, we have something to do! We cannot do this in our own power, but if we are not willing and trying, we will not get anywhere with God. Here is a good old sermon on the subject of What Can a Sinner Do to be Saved. There are things we MUST Do, but are incapable of performing, but there are things we CAN do, and even should do in seeking God.

What can a Sinner Do? - aChristianSpirit

I hope this shows you that being obedient to God is NOT the same as trying to EARN salvation of your soul.

.

 

[least]

Thank you for your clarification, Avid, it looks like we are saying the same thing. As Paul said in the Passage, "Work out your salvation with fear and trembling." Crucifying the flesh (Colossians 3:1-11) would certainly be a part of that, as well as putting on those things that please God (Colossians 3:12-17). I think what a lot of folks miss (including me sometimes) is that we have to be intentional about this. It's like you say, people shrug their shoulders and say Jesus paid it all and pretty much sit around waiting for God to zap them with holiness.

With that said, the next verse (Phil. 2:13) says, "It is God who is at work in you, both to will and to work for His good pleasure." While we are to work out our salvation, God is working in us (empowering us) so that we me may be able to do these things.

Here again is the question of my thread; what are some things that you do to be intentional about working out your salvation. Obviously, prayer and Bible study are fundamental; but do you have something intentional that helps you apply what you learn from God's word?

Again, thanks for your clarification!