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Windows Vista

raphink

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what if the hardware you use - is adsl modems etc say they don't support Linux - then what you so apart from buying new hardware?
Now there's a big difference between having to get new hardware because the OS requires more powerful one, and having to get other hardware because the one you have is not supported.

On Linux, contrarily to Windows, the older the hardware is, the more likely it is to work, so you
can get old stuff that nobody wants and it's likely to work ;)
 
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peepnklown

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Fly said:
I'm sticking with Linux

Can we please focus on the issue at hand without Linux propaganda?
Gnasher said:
we tried a version of the basic as a trial on 512meg and it really struggled

A lot of ‘other’ factors play into performance…I am not saying you should upgrade, I am just saying that you don’t need 1GB of RAM…of course, the full visual features will have to be tamed.
87 said:
Please people.

I concur…
 
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Les Grands Pieds

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Every version of Windows is just slower and more processor intensive than that last. Vista requires like 500 MB of RAM before you even open anything. Tiger, before anything is opened, requires only 50 MB of RAM. There's a reason Tiger leaves Vista in the dust, it's a much lighter load. It's also important to realize that Tiger can run quite well on a 5 year old machine and still give you almost all the sweet graphical effects.

Vista basically requires a new machine, and not a low-end one, either. If you spend less than $500 on your machine, even today, it's likely Vista will crawl on it. Don't think it's going to improve, either, Vista will become far more demanding over time. Vista has tons of other problems right now, too.

Besides, Vista can't run iTunes yet, and I hate Windows Media Player with a passion. Piece of junk if I've ever seen one.

If you're interested in Vista, chances are you'll need a new machine. I can't think of a better time to get a Mac! If you ever wanted to, all the intel Macs are fully capable of running Vista. Of course, the ones with integrated graphics might be a bit less impressive.

I have a theory about these dual boot machines though. I believe running Windows on your Mac could easily open you up to viruses that could penetrate your machine. I think the first Mac virus will probably come while you're using Boot Camp to run Windows.
 
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pgp_protector

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Every version of Windows is just slower and more processor intensive than that last. Vista requires like 500 MB of RAM before you even open anything. Tiger, before anything is opened, requires only 50 MB of RAM. There's a reason Tiger leaves Vista in the dust, it's a much lighter load. It's also important to realize that Tiger can run quite well on a 5 year old machine and still give you almost all the sweet graphical effects.

Vista basically requires a new machine, and not a low-end one, either. If you spend less than $500 on your machine, even today, it's likely Vista will crawl on it. Don't think it's going to improve, either, Vista will become far more demanding over time. Vista has tons of other problems right now, too.

Besides, Vista can't run iTunes yet, and I hate Windows Media Player with a passion. Piece of junk if I've ever seen one.

If you're interested in Vista, chances are you'll need a new machine. I can't think of a better time to get a Mac! If you ever wanted to, all the intel Macs are fully capable of running Vista. Of course, the ones with integrated graphics might be a bit less impressive.

I have a theory about these dual boot machines though. I believe running Windows on your Mac could easily open you up to viruses that could penetrate your machine. I think the first Mac virus will probably come while you're using Boot Camp to run Windows.
Yea, and the Amiga OS could be ran from a floppy and provide a full multi taxing OS with over 4K colors, but this is NOT A WINDOWS BASHING THREAD.

Thank you for observing that.
 
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Sketcher

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I have a theory about these dual boot machines though. I believe running Windows on your Mac could easily open you up to viruses that could penetrate your machine. I think the first Mac virus will probably come while you're using Boot Camp to run Windows.

The first Mac virus already came.

http://antivirus.about.com/od/macintoshresource/Macintosh_Viruses_and_Mac_Virus_Resources.htm

If Macs were half as popular as PCs, we would see thousands more viruses for the Mac. The reason that most of the hacks and viruses are geared at Windows is because Windows has 90-some percent market share, so that's where the big payoff of hacking is most likely to be. The same goes for Linux.
 
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Sketcher

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If anyone is thinking of getting it, perhaps it is better to wait for the service packs first.

Yes. Not only will Vista be better then, but better hardware will be cheaper, and there will be more software and driver support.
 
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zoziw

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Every version of Windows is just slower and more processor intensive than that last. Vista requires like 500 MB of RAM before you even open anything. Tiger, before anything is opened, requires only 50 MB of RAM. There's a reason Tiger leaves Vista in the dust, it's a much lighter load. It's also important to realize that Tiger can run quite well on a 5 year old machine and still give you almost all the sweet graphical effects.

I had to upgrade my 256mb Mac Mini to 512mb in order to get Tiger running smoothly. The system requirements call for at least 256mb. 50mb of RAM for Tiger sounds low.

I do agree that Tiger runs nicely on older machines as long as you have sufficient RAM and that the Aqua UI is very nice and requires far less system resources than Vista does to run.

Vista basically requires a new machine, and not a low-end one, either. If you spend less than $500 on your machine, even today, it's likely Vista will crawl on it. Don't think it's going to improve, either, Vista will become far more demanding over time. Vista has tons of other problems right now, too.

I had the chance to play around with some laptops in that price range with 512MB of RAM running Vista Home Basic. For general stuff like internet browsing and email, it wasn't bad. Took a bit longer to load the programs than XP did, but they worked fine once open.

Still, there was a performance hit from XP and Home Basic lacks most of the new stuff that Vista offers, so I'd still recommend getting XP on a low end system.

I upgraded to Vista on Tuesday and while the upgrade process was horrendous, the OS is so far stable and faster than XP (my system has an AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor at 4600+; GeForce 7300 LE 256MB; 2 gigs of RAM).

The Vista upgrade is not without problems, at least for me. Here is what happened:

The installation failed 3 times the first time I installed it. Due to bad advice from a Microsoft tech, I had to reinstall a few days later because Vista would not activate because of the way the tech told me to install Vista (I told him several times I had the upgrade version, but after two failures he told me to boot from the installation DVD and worry about the product key afterwards...big mistake).

I had to reinstall XP from my restore disk and then upgrade to Vista again. The installer failed the next 4 times I attempted to upgrade, all at different stages, but finally worked on the 5th attempt.

Windows Activation went fine but on a reboot Vista forgot that I had activated it and wouldn't let me activate it again without a phone call. They've patched that now but the patch failed in Windows Update and I had to manually download it to get it working.

Also, my graphic drivers failed to initialize the first four times I tried to boot to Vista after the install resulting in a BSOD.

Again, Vista is working great now, just a really rough upgrade.

Besides, Vista can't run iTunes yet, and I hate Windows Media Player with a passion. Piece of junk if I've ever seen one.

iTunes will work on Vista right now for many standard computers. Apple is advising people to wait for an upgrade to iTunes coming in the next few weeks to ensure that they don't run into problems.

There is also a iTunes Repair Tool for Vista that can fix some problems people might encounter.

If you're interested in Vista, chances are you'll need a new machine. I can't think of a better time to get a Mac! If you ever wanted to, all the intel Macs are fully capable of running Vista. Of course, the ones with integrated graphics might be a bit less impressive.

Macs are great, I own two, but one of the more common media types on the net these days is Windows Media which Microsoft no longer supports for the Mac. Instead, you have to download the Flip4Mac program that doesn't always read streaming media properly, like at www.ctv.ca

XP SP2 is a solid OS and is probably the one I would recommend for most people right now.


The first Mac virus already came.

http://antivirus.about.com/od/macint..._Resources.htm

If Macs were half as popular as PCs, we would see thousands more viruses for the Mac. The reason that most of the hacks and viruses are geared at Windows is because Windows has 90-some percent market share, so that's where the big payoff of hacking is most likely to be. The same goes for Linux.

So far there have only been "proof-of-concept" viruses for the Mac with nothing propagating in the wild. In short, there are not viral or malware threats that you can get from the internet for Mac OS X.

The other thing to remember is that this is not because Macs only have a 5% marketshare, but rather because the core of OS X is BSD (Unix) which was built from the ground up to be a secure, multi-user environment OS.

Trust me, with all of the bragging and bravado coming from the Mac camp about there not being any viruses for OS X, if someone could develop one that worked they would gain much more fame and noteriety than from any virus they could build for Windows.

The fact it hasn't been done yet shows just how difficult it is.

If anyone is thinking of getting it, perhaps it is better to wait for the service packs first.

That is probably sound advice. Vista is stable on my HP tower (which is labelled Vista Capable) but HP got a bunch of Vista patches out on January 30 to make sure things worked.

I'm really impressed with the job HP did with this, I am less impressed with Microsoft's installer.
 
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Qyöt27

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I have a theory about these dual boot machines though. I believe running Windows on your Mac could easily open you up to viruses that could penetrate your machine. I think the first Mac virus will probably come while you're using Boot Camp to run Windows.
The ability to do so is very prohibitive, and would require someone with enough skills that they'd probably already have a job doing security programming and working to fix such holes - fixing it is much more lucrative and productive than attempting to destroy whatever system it's aimed at, at least for those with that kind of expertise. The uptake on fixes for those kinds of problems is also much higher on open source platforms like Darwin (OS X's base) and Linux.

The biggest obstacle there is that the XP installation would have to have a driver capable of writing to HFS/HFS+ volumes rather than simply reading them. If one is inside OS X, the only thing that can be harmed by any sort of future malware would be the user's own files rather than the entire system. This is also true of Linux as well - for things to penetrate and infect the entire system users would need to give the offending program root access themselves, which is disabled by default (and it would need an additional layer of cloaking to be able to trick such users into giving their passwords away to do so - otherwise it would be clear that some foreign program is trying to mess with your system). Most Windows attacks are propagated as fast as they are because of the fact that by default, users are given Administrator accounts, which gives the programs uninhibited root access. This is what Vista's User Access feature or whatever it's called aims at correcting - whether it delivers on that is probably up for debate; supposedly it is much better than XP's managing of privileges, though.
 
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intricatic

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what if the hardware you use - is adsl modems etc say they don't support Linux - then what you so apart from buying new hardware?
No such thing as an adsl modem that doesn't support linux. That's what the manufacturers of mine said, but the modem itself is running a linux (busybox) core that I can log into using telnet. :p
 
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zoziw

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Most Windows attacks are propagated as fast as they are because of the fact that by default, users are given Administrator accounts, which gives the programs uninhibited root access. This is what Vista's User Access feature or whatever it's called aims at correcting - whether it delivers on that is probably up for debate; supposedly it is much better than XP's managing of privileges, though.

So far, the big problem I am seeing with this is that even though you get a warning something is trying to run or install itself, because users default to Admins, all you have to do is click "yes" and your in trouble again.

IOW, someone who doesn't know what they are doing is going to be running with the default admin account and probably click "yes" through those annoying system locking prompts.

All Microsoft needs to do now is find some kind of dummy-proof way to control the human/social side of the problem (although they might have done that via Protected Mode and Defender which I mention further down).

However, if a tech savy person sets up other user accounts as "standard", then it will prompt them for the Admin password before they can install a program...allowing the Admin to review anything trying to get onto the computer.

I'm not really sure how well IE7's Protected Mode works but it is supposed to prevent anything from getting out of IE and onto your computer. Combining this with Windows Defender might just knock off the social aspect of malware...even for people who don't know better.

At the present time I am not running anti-virus software on my Vista box.
 
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I would personally wait and just stay with XP. Let them get the bugs out first...lots of security issues right now.

Yes, I agree! This is the best they can come up with.

Are you familiar with Sophos, Sunbelt or Invisus Direct?
 
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