William Barr: Mueller clears Trump in Russia probe

[Gigimo]

But I thought accurately determining it was a witch hunt and vocalizing that conclusion in itself is considered to be obstruction?

(I'd really like to know what dictionary these folks get their definitions from)?

 

[Bobber]

I don't think so, the investigation is going to be used politically to great effect. He will continue to call it a witch hunt but it wasn't, there are still questions about why he is so cozy with Russia.

Come on what do you mean cozy with Russia? Because he was wanting to seek to talk to them in a cordial way to enhance the ability to have peace? And President incoming like to try to start off on a good foot and seek to establish a working relationship. Gosh look at the left with Hill and Bill wanting to do a reset and Bill's nice kickback from doing speeches. Or Obama caught saying into a hot mic that once he's elected he'll be able to have policy more in tune with Moscow's desire. If Trump would have said that impeachment proceedings would have been well under way.

 

[mark kennedy]

Come on what do you mean cozy with Russia? Because he was wanting to seek to talk to them in a cordial way to enhance the ability to have peace? And President incoming like to try to start off on a good foot and seek to establish a working relationship. Gosh look at the left with Hill and Bill wanting to do a reset and Bill's nice kickback from doing speeches. Or Obama caught saying into a hot mic that once he's elected he'll be able to have policy more in tune with Moscow's desire. If Trump would have said that impeachment proceedings would have been well under way.

I don't know how closely you follow current events but lets start with Helsinki:

Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) called the U.S.-Russia summit in Helsinki “a tragic mistake” and faulted President Trump for “naiveté” and “egotism” in meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

He also labeled Trump's press conference with Putin as “one of the most disgraceful performances by an American president in memory.”

McCain, a frequent critic of Trump's who has often blasted the president for not being tougher with Russia, criticized him for failing to believe the findings of U.S. intelligence agencies that Russia interfered in the 2016 presidential election over Putin’s denial.

“President Trump proved not only unable, but unwilling to stand up to Putin,” McCain said in a statement. (McCain: Trump performance 'disgraceful’. The Hill)
​

Trump is harder on NATO then he is Russia and North Korea, he believes Putin over our own intelligence community. Disgraceful indeed!

 

[Bobber]

I don't know how closely you follow current events but lets start with Helsinki:

Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) called the U.S.-Russia summit in Helsinki “a tragic mistake” and faulted President Trump for “naiveté” and “egotism” in meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

He also labeled Trump's press conference with Putin as “one of the most disgraceful performances by an American president in memory.”

McCain, a frequent critic of Trump's who has often blasted the president for not being tougher with Russia, criticized him for failing to believe the findings of U.S. intelligence agencies that Russia interfered in the 2016 presidential election over Putin’s denial.

“President Trump proved not only unable, but unwilling to stand up to Putin,” McCain said in a statement. (McCain: Trump performance 'disgraceful’. The Hill)
​

Trump is harder on NATO then he is Russia and North Korea, he believes Putin over our own intelligence community. Disgraceful indeed!

Sorry I don't take anything too seriously that the late John McCain said about the issue and won't. I won't get into the weeds of discussing why here but I don't

Trump is harder on NATO then he is Russia and North Korea, he believes Putin over our own intelligence community. Disgraceful indeed

Trump harder on NATO? That sounds like a talking point on CNN. So why? Because he told them they needed to pay their share?

 

[mark kennedy]

Sorry I don't take anything too seriously that the late John McCain said about the issue and won't. I won't get into the weeds of discussing why here but I don't



Trump harder on NATO? That sounds like a talking point on CNN. So why? Because he told them they needed to pay their share?

Because he told NATO to pay their share, give Russia a pass on the election interference and oh yea, stopped further sanctions on North Korea. McCain wasn't the only Republican that was harsh over Trump's inability to stand up to Russia, but NATO, no problem. I think this guy has some very serious baggage.

 

[The Barbarian]

But I thought accurately determining it was a witch hunt and vocalizing that conclusion in itself is considered to be obstruction?

As the man said, "if it's a witch hunt, it was the most successful witch hunt in history." A witch hunt would be (for example) the Benghazi hearings, which spent huge sums of money, with no actual crimes discovered. The numerous Trump henchmen who were indicted, convicted, or plead guilty pretty much shows the difference between a legitimate investigation and a political vendetta.

Obstruction would be something like a president asking the FBI director to "go easy" on a criminal like Michael Flynn, or a president hinting at a pardon for a criminal who might testify against him.

 

[Bobber]

Because he told NATO to pay their share,

Yes and why is that not fine?

give Russia a pass on the election interference

From what I understand it was relatively a small amount of money spent on a few social media sites some of which even criticized Trump. That's a far cry from trying to get into computer systems to change votes as what was talked about at the time. But you sure you really want to go their to condemn nations who perhaps in a minor way seek to influence voters? Everybody in the world has opinions and don't hesitate to share them yes on FB or wherever. Plus the United States sought to influence the elections in Israel under Obama by putting money into a work to something to oust PM Netanyahu and in England with Brexit publicly warning the nation would be put on the bottom of the pack when it'd come to trade? That's not seeking to influence?

and oh yea, stopped further sanctions on North Korea.

Trump talked more tough to NK than any President for years and I believe he has been put them in check for the time being. And things are being monitored always on that file. I think McCain was just seeking to make political hay. If he had been in office do you really think he would have been as bold with NK as he said Trump should be? I think not.

McCain wasn't the only Republican that was harsh over Trump's inability to stand up to Russia, but NATO, no problem. I think this guy has some very serious baggage.

And it's easy to assert strong opinions when they're not the one who has to bear the blunt of wrong decisions. One wise will think through on the matter.

 

[Sistrin]

But I thought accurately determining it was a witch hunt and vocalizing that conclusion in itself is considered to be obstruction?

(I'd really like to know what dictionary these folks get their definitions from)?

Typically it is the Urban Dictionary. Which is, of course, not really a dictionary at all. On all other occasions it is the Double-Speak volume 1984, meaning the words employed mean whatever they want them to mean on that particular day.

Alternative Prosecution Methods...holy cow.

 

[The Barbarian]

From what I understand it was relatively a small amount of money spent on a few social media sites some of which even criticized Trump.

Russia's influence campaign during the 2016 presidential election was a sophisticated and multifaceted effort to target the African-American community and sow political division among the public across social media platforms, according to new reports produced for the Senate Intelligence Committee.

One report, which is 100-pages long, provides new context and details regarding the large scope of the multi-year Russian operation and the nefarious tactics it employed to exploit divisions along race and political ideology in the U.S. on a range of social media platforms, including Google-owned YouTube, Facebook, Twitter, and on Facebook-owned Instagram. The shadowy effort aimed to support the Trump campaign, denigrate Hillary Clinton, suppress the vote, sow discord and attack various public figures.

According to the report released on Monday, the massive operation reached 126 million people on Facebook, posted 10.4 million tweets on Twitter, uploaded over 1,000 videos to YouTube, and reached over 20 million users on Instagram. The report states that roughly 6 percent of tweets, 18 percent of Instagram posts and 7 percent of Facebook posts mentioned Trump or Clinton by name. However, Trump was mentioned roughly twice as often as Clinton on most platforms. The report, titled "The Tactics and Tropes of the Internet Research Agency," warns that the manipulation of U.S. political discourse continues in 2018.

The report, which was commissioned by cybersecurity firm New Knowledge, Canfield Research and Columbia University's Tow Center for Digital Journalism, reveals that the Internet Research Agency (IRA), a Russian company owned by a businessman who is reportedly a close ally of Russian President Vladimir Putin, hit on a range of themes and social issues over and over again across multiple online platforms, including Muslim culture, black culture, gun rights, LGBT issues, patriotism, Tea Party issues, veterans' rights, pro-Bernie Sanders and Jill Stein content, Christian culture and Southern culture and American separatist movements.
Shocking scale of Russia’s sinister social media campaign against US revealed

 

[Gigimo]

The numerous Trump henchmen

Don't these people know Obama and a lot of Democrat politicians too? Doesn't this make them their henchmen too or do they get a free pass because they are of the "correct" political ideology? (DC Is a small town swamp incest is rampant, just ask Comey or Mueller).

You seem to forget (or purposely ignoring) the last administration knew of these issues and ignored them, why?

 

[The Barbarian]

Don't these people know Obama and a lot of Democrat politicians too?

But they were working for Trump when they committed felonies. Which is what matters. If they know Obama, it doesn't mean very much.

Doesn't this make them their henchmen too

No.

or do they get a free pass because they are of the "correct" political ideology?

Because they didn't have felons for employess.

(DC Is a small town swamp incest is rampant, just ask Comey or Mueller).

Feel free to show what you have.

[quote[You seem to forget (or purposely ignoring) the last administration knew of these issues and ignored them[/quote]

Show us that.

why?

Because you need more than imagination to make your case.

 

[mark kennedy]

Yes and why is that not fine?



From what I understand it was relatively a small amount of money spent on a few social media sites some of which even criticized Trump. That's a far cry from trying to get into computer systems to change votes as what was talked about at the time. But you sure you really want to go their to condemn nations who perhaps in a minor way seek to influence voters? Everybody in the world has opinions and don't hesitate to share them yes on FB or wherever. Plus the United States sought to influence the elections in Israel under Obama by putting money into a work to something to oust PM Netanyahu and in England with Brexit publicly warning the nation would be put on the bottom of the pack when it'd come to trade? That's not seeking to influence?



Trump talked more tough to NK than any President for years and I believe he has been put them in check for the time being. And things are being monitored always on that file. I think McCain was just seeking to make political hay. If he had been in office do you really think he would have been as bold with NK as he said Trump should be? I think not.



And it's easy to assert strong opinions when they're not the one who has to bear the blunt of wrong decisions. One wise will think through on the matter.

I can't believe the GOP of today is the party of Reagan and Nixon, Ronald Reagan must be turning over in his grave. Imn a rare display of solidarity the Congress voted for veto proof sanctions against Russia. So this isnt McCain shooting his mouth off, Trump knows Russia interferred in our election. If it weren't for that and the Comey email surprise Trump would have lost hands down. I've never seen a more a more vulgar pandering then Helzinki.

The thing about McCain that the Trumsters dont get is, the unfashionable burden of a life of survice and honor. Trump can mock our war heros and you guys sing his praises, condone our enemies crimes and its nothing a oarty line can't bury.

This isn't the GOP I used to know, oppose the agenda but respect the conviction. There is nothing of the sort here, neither you nor Trump believe Russia is innocent, yet you persist.

 

[Bobber]

The thing about McCain that the Trumsters dont get is, the unfashionable is the burden of a life of survice and honor. Trump can mock our war heros and you guys sing his praises, condone our enemies crimes and its nothing a oarty line can't bury.

McCain most certainly for that period of his life deserves honor and stop suggesting Trump supporters don't recognize that! And yes I'd say if there was any one thing Trump supporters if they were polled what would be the one thing you don't agree with him on it would probably be his comments about McCain as a prisoner of war. So you can claim Trump supporters don't think honorable towards one's military service but you'd be spouting off ignorance.

 

[The Barbarian]

McCain most certainly for that period of his life deserves honor and stop suggesting Trump supporters don't recognize that!

Even Trump won't admit that. Cadet Bones Spurs detests McCain, primarily because McCain, whose life was largely one of honor and sacrifice is a permanent rebuke to Trump's veniality and lack of patriotism.

And yes I'd say if there was any one thing Trump supporters if they were polled what would be the one thing you don't agree with him on it would probably be his comments about McCain as a prisoner of war.

“He’s dying anyway”: the Trump right’s hate for John McCain, explained
On May 9th, Arizona Sen. John McCain announced his opposition to President Donald Trump’s nominee to run the CIA, Gina Haspel.

On May 10th, White House special assistant Kelly Sadler reportedly reacted by saying of McCain, who is fighting brain cancer, “It doesn’t matter, he’s dying anyway.”

She has since left the White House — not because of what she said about John McCain, but because she told Trump that communications staffer Mercedes Schlapp may have leaked her comments.

Sadler’s reaction is not unique among the Trumpian right, whose outright hatred of McCain has resurfaced as McCain’s illness has progressed. (The feeling is mutual. McCain reportedly told friends a week ago that he doesn’t want Trump at his funeral.)

It’s also not new. When Trump delivered the infamous line during the 2016 campaign, “I like people that weren’t captured” — a comment the mainstream press was sure would cross a line with his followers — they not only didn’t care but started a bizarre meme bashing McCain.

The hate dates back to John McCain’s own run for the White House in 2007 and 2008, and even to his service during the Vietnam War, during which he was held as a prisoner of war for more than five years and tortured for information.

And the vitriol has escalated so much in recent days, swerving into old conspiracy theories and jokes about torture, that Fox News banned a Trump supporter and longtime contributor from appearing on its networks again. When it’s too much for Fox, it’s really too much.
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/5/11/17345060/trump-mccain-2016-2018-right-wing

So you can claim Trump supporters don't think honorable towards one's military service but you'd be spouting off ignorance.

They honor a draft dodger who paid off a doctor to diagnose "bone spurs" that magically disappeared after the draft ended, while hating a real hero who put himself in harm's way for America. That's all we need to know about that.

 

[The Barbarian]

But as former CIA Deputy Director Michael Morell, who now hosts the Intelligence Matters podcast, told me, “We still do not understand why President Trump has this affinity for Putin. What happened yesterday is Mueller took one possibility off the table—that there was a criminal conspiracy. But we still don’t know what is going on between these two leaders, and what is driving this relationship.”

It would once have been unthinkable to even contemplate that a sitting president was putting the interests of a hostile foreign power above those of the United States. But Trump’s consistent praise of Putin, his pursuit of a massive real-estate deal in Moscow while Russia was waging a hacking and disinformation campaign against the United States in 2016, and the secrecy that continues to surround his conversations with his Russian counterpart have given some in the national-security community, including many leading Democrats, pause.

Trump took the extraordinary step of confiscating his interpreter’s notes after his first private meeting with Putin in Hamburg, Germany, in 2017, according to The Washington Post, and demanded that the interpreter refrain from discussing the meeting with members of his own administration. In Helsinki, Finland, one year later, Trump insisted on meeting with Putin with no American advisers or aides present.
The Critical Part of Mueller’s Report That Barr Didn’t Mention

 

[mark kennedy]

McCain most certainly for that period of his life deserves honor and stop suggesting Trump supporters don't recognize that! And yes I'd say if there was any one thing Trump supporters if they were polled what would be the one thing you don't agree with him on it would probably be his comments about McCain as a prisoner of war. So you can claim Trump supporters don't think honorable towards one's military service but you'd be spouting off ignorance.

Trump certainly hasn't expressed those sentiments and denying Russia's interference seems disingenuous at best. I must admit though, I see some merit in how he is handling North Korea. He hasn't made the old mistake of loosening sanctions, he just stopped new ones from being added, a possible goid faith gesture if not a bit overly optimistic.

However McCain was a man of honor, his reasons for voting against repeal and replace were ligitimate. McConnell stopped any deliberation, no one was even allowed to read it. McCain represents an old school conservative element of the GOP I have opposed but respected. Trump is a political animal of another stripe, I have no confidence in his ability to be candid or straightforward with the facts. He embarrased his country at Helsinki, I firmly believe he has ulterior notives and do not believe he is sincere when he says he sees no reason it was them.

 

[The Barbarian]

Though President Donald Trump has claimed "complete and total exoneration" based on Attorney General William Barr's summary of special counsel Robert Mueller's report on Russian interference in the 2016 election, the American public disagrees, according to a new CNN Poll conducted by SSRS.
A majority (56%) says the President and his campaign have not been exonerated of collusion, but that what they've heard or read about the report shows collusion could not be proven. Fewer, 43%, say Trump and his team have been exonerated of collusion.
Although Mueller could not establish Trump or his campaign "conspired or coordinated with" the Russian government, according to Barr's letter, the poll finds the American people continue to view the issue through partisan lenses.
RELATED: Full poll results
Republicans and Democrats are on opposite sides of this question: 77% of Republicans say the President has been exonerated, 80% of Democrats say he has not. Independents break against exoneration -- 58% say the President and his campaign were not exonerated.
...
The 43% overall in the new poll saying the President has been exonerated is about the same as the 42% who said in a CNN poll earlier this year that Trump's campaign did not collude with the Russian government to help get Trump elected. That suggests the summary letter released Sunday did little to move public opinion on this matter.
And most feel the investigation ought not to end with that letter.
Nearly 6 in 10 Americans want to see Congress continue to pursue hearings into the findings of Mueller's report. Just 43% feel Congress ought to end the investigation completely following the release of Barr's summary of Mueller's findings.
CNN Poll: Majority says Trump not exonerated of collusion after Barr's summary - CNNPolitics