Wicca, How do we as Lutherans respond

[Christopher Range]

I fully acknowledge the possibility, that. The title may seem ignorant, and that there is an easy answer.

Here is the situation.

I am involved in a weekly ZOOM 'medical'(we all have brain aneurysms') group. There are members from the US, UK, Canada n' AUS. The member from Australia recently said she is Wicca. She is a former Christian. I was taken aback.

Now, Does that mean I am afraid of becoming a Wiccan, no. Because there is only one God and, that is Jesus Christ, The Only Son, Our Lord.

I am wary of getting into a theology debate during weekly ZOOM.

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

[timothyu]

Think of it this way. God is at the top of the ladder and the world is at the bottom. There are many aspects when seeking God. Some reach the pinnacle, some remain still of the flesh or of the world as another way of putting it. This not only involved self help or knowing who we are by ways of addressing our place in the world as some religions do (including Christianity in loving all as self) , but also by being in touch with the very foundation of our world, nature (of which we are a part). This supposedly is where the wiccan mentality is at. Oneness with nature and what it has to offer. Practical yes, but a far distance from God on a different plane at the top of the ladder. Is it evil? IMO, no. Merely a first step in the search for God, a part of the whole. From oneness with nature to oneness with the universe, to oneness with God, and understanding our place with each.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Don't debate theology and let Jesus within you speak of Himself without you trying.

To some you have a fragrance of life to life.

 

[Christopher Range]

Think of it this way. God is at the top of the ladder and the world is at the bottom. There are many aspects when seeking God. Some reach the pinnacle, some remain still of the flesh or of the world as another way of putting it. This not only involved self help or knowing who we are by ways of addressing our place in the world as some religions do (including Christianity in loving all as self) , but also by being in touch with the very foundation of our world, nature (of which we are a part). This supposedly is where the wiccan mentality is at. Oneness with nature and what it has to offer. Practical yes, but a far distance from God on a different plane at the top of the ladder. Is it evil? IMO, no. Merely a first step in the search for God, a part of the whole. From oneness with nature to oneness with the universe, to oneness with God, and understanding our place with each.

Yes, They have mentioned nature a number of times.

 

[Christopher Range]

Don't debate theology and let Jesus within you speak of Himself without you trying.

To some you have a fragrance of life to life.

Thank you

 

[timothyu]

Yes, They have mentioned nature a number of times.

That is all they stand for. This isn't about demonology or hallowe'en costumes. Are you uncomfortable going into a health food store?

 

[GenemZ]

I fully acknowledge the possibility, that. The title may seem ignorant, and that there is an easy answer.

Here is the situation.

I am involved in a weekly ZOOM 'medical'(we all have brain aneurysms') group. There are members from the US, UK, Canada n' AUS. The member from Australia recently said she is Wicca. She is a former Christian. I was taken aback.

Now, Does that mean I am afraid of becoming a Wiccan, no. Because there is only one God and, that is Jesus Christ, The Only Son, Our Lord.

I am wary of getting into a theology debate during weekly ZOOM.

Any advice would be appreciated.

When I lived in another state I saw in a local news paper an invite to the public to hear a lecture given by witches. I believe Wiccan was included.
It was given in the evening in a student lounge at a college up the road from me.

Well I found the place. Took a seat. And, listened. I looked around in the audience and noticed what I would call 'normal' souls also there to learn something.

I found myself reassured having inner peace in their presence. I found myself not getting angry about certain things said that would have upset certain believers I knew.

The main speaker wanted to stress that the males did not like being called a 'warlock', but preferred to be called a witch. He held up a Bible and declared that ... "we do not believe this book."

I held my peace, and I noticed someone else there in the audience also to be in a same state of mind.

Then suddenly... The main speaker shut up. He could not speak. After a pause, he quietly said he can not continue speaking. He then gathered in a circle with his compatriots with bowed heads. He kept looking back over his shoulder as they stayed in prayer... Finally, calling it a night and ended the "sermon from hell.'

Our position here on earth is to remain always in a state of seeking and finding - to be growing in truth by grace. God will always supply. If we do? God does the work if we do that. If we grow as it pleases God? We will find peace where there should be no peace....

grace and peace .........

 

[Daniel9v9]

I'm going to have to disagree with most of what timothyu wrote above. Wicca, like any religion, philosophy or worldview outside of the one true faith, while they may be peaceful and strive for some good, is in reality evil. They are evil precisely because they deny our Lord Jesus Christ by what they claim, teach, and do. So they are absolutely not morally neutral. Furthermore, humans do not climb up to heaven, so to speak, but rather, Christ descends to us. And this is the thing that separates the Christian faith from all other religions or worldviews.

Now that being said, I think in this situation, rather than falling into a theological debate, it could perhaps be more profitable to share the joy we have in Christ if the circumstances allow for it. Or to confess the truth in simplicity. And if a debate were to be rising, I think the mature way to handle it is to say that you'd be glad to have a proper conversation with the Wiccan and anyone else who is interested outside of the meetings. Unless everyone has the time and interest, that is.

If you were to have a discussion about faith, good questions to ask could for example be: "Are morals absolute or subjective?", "How do you know what is good and true and what is evil and false?" and "Who is Jesus?". Questions like these will strike right at the foundation of their beliefs and cut through a lot of the fluff on top. That is, both Wiccans and Christians can talk about how we care about the environment, but in this, we're not really dealing with underlying faith.

Anyway, it certainly calls for patience, wisdom and grace. And I think we'll do well to always work towards framing things in Law and Gospel.

 

[Tolworth John]

Yes, They have mentioned nature a number of times.

It depends on the situation and how the meeting is going, but if they are making statements about nature, links to nature, how nature helps etc you can do one of two things, either say that this isbeside the point, that you are not there to discuss wiican practises.
or you can be les confrontational and make a statement about how Jesus being the only way to God helps you.

It isreally about whether you want to rock the boat a little bit in order to show that there is a different view, or to stay silent.

 

[Christopher Range]

That is all they stand for. This isn't about demonology or hallowe'en costumes. Are you uncomfortable going into a health food store?

What is the analogy(if there is one)?

 

[Christopher Range]

It depends on the situation and how the meeting is going, but if they are making statements about nature, links to nature, how nature helps etc you can do one of two things, either say that this isbeside the point, that you are not there to discuss wiican practises.
or you can be less confrontational and make a statement about how Jesus being the only way to God helps you.

It is really about whether you want to rock the boat a little bit in order to show that there is a different view, or to stay silent.

There is a lot of laughing. I don't want to 'rock the boat'. But I do feel like I need to say something. I think I will have a chat with the 'Senior' Admin about it, and get her advice. Maybe she can talk to the other woman. To see if the woman can tone down 'espousing' her Wiccan statements.

 

[timothyu]

What is the analogy(if there is one)?

Simply that the nature aspect is one of a natural connection with nature, be it healing or ceremonies such as harvest, etc. How is that different from buying natural organic foods, medicines, or even celebrating Thanksgiving? They chose to remain earthbound, while others of us go further to seek the spiritual. Wiccans seem to chose to remain true to their roots of what we call pagan, while Christianity simply gave their festivals new names and purpose

 

[GenemZ]

Think of it this way. God is at the top of the ladder and the world is at the bottom. There are many aspects when seeking God. Some reach the pinnacle, some remain still of the flesh or of the world as another way of putting it. This not only involved self help or knowing who we are by ways of addressing our place in the world as some religions do (including Christianity in loving all as self) , but also by being in touch with the very foundation of our world, nature (of which we are a part). This supposedly is where the wiccan mentality is at. Oneness with nature and what it has to offer. Practical yes, but a far distance from God on a different plane at the top of the ladder. Is it evil? IMO, no. Merely a first step in the search for God, a part of the whole. From oneness with nature to oneness with the universe, to oneness with God, and understanding our place with each.

Oneness with God is not achieved like ascending a ladder. No matter how high up the rungs one may go? It will keep getting further and further away from the lowest point that is needed.

The Cross.

If something is said to be good by human standards?
And, if it keeps one from facing the need for the Cross? By insinuating that they are good?

Its fruit is evil, even though thought of as good by men.

Hell is going to be filled with (humanly speaking) good people. Nice people even.

The search for God does not make one closer in each step. Its only a matter of eliminating alternatives until the field is cleared to see the horizon. And, only if each alternative is rejected. Clearing the way does not make them closer to God. It only makes what is needed to be accepted, to be saved, clearer to see. Just the same, ex searchers reject God and are without excuse. They climbed to the last rung, and found only emptiness to grab onto. They really needed to look down to see the Cross. Instead, they kept elevating themselves in their own eyes..... finding only emptiness on a starry night.

 

[timothyu]

Oneness with God is not achieved like ascending a ladder.

My reference to ladder is about all the different trails people take in life seeking God. They need not be Christian or even God of Abraham related. Some stop at a specific rung, while other find there is something more.

But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you (Mt 6:33).

 

[GenemZ]

My reference to ladder is about all the different trails people take in life seeking God. They need not be Christian or even God of Abraham related. Some stop at a specific rung, while other find there is something more.

But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you (Mt 6:33).

I understand... for a while there, I was all over the place. Many dead ends.

But, I was not considering Christianity as a possible answer.

One day I was invited over for a Bible study at my sister's house. Like the apostle Paul was not looking to Christianity as an answer. The answer was finding him!

Sometimes, God needs to trap those He knows is one of his sheep. They were not looking for Him to be an answer, though they may have believed in Jesus at one point, simply because it was something they wanted to do.


grace and peace ........