Why tithing has not improved my finances

[annafullofgrace]

Giving is more than money...give with time and talents and use your money to get back on track. And then you can give monetary again.

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

Being disabled I take 10% right off my first check of the month because thats what I believe I should do. And I take joy in doing so. I never expect my financial life to improve constantly. After all God never said if you tithe you will have some amazing life. Sin exists, so therefor trials exist. If you believe your life should improve since you tithe then you may be confusing God for genie who grants every wish you want. I say this as someone who used to sort of think like that years ago. I used to think if I pleased God then He would give me anything I wanted. >.<

 

[Sketcher]

I believe that we should give 10% of our income, OT rules or not. I live in America. For me to not give 10% would be sad. I don't give for better finances. I give because I am thankful for the job I have, and that those like me with jobs should give so that the church has resources to assist those in hard times.

That said, a loss of income means that you would be giving less anyway. No income of course would mean no tithe. Either way though, my advice to those who are in tough financial straits is to give something to the church, working your way up to 10% as you pay off debt. This is a general principle, without knowledge of your personal financial details. Is there a way that can work for you?

 

[Paxton25]

I have been an eager at tithing for at least 2 years at a Church I go to. I give at least 10% of the income I earn to the church. Yet for most of that time my financial situation has not improved and been constantly in debt. I currently getting deeper in debt as I just lost my job. Where is God? God says he will bless each giver and I heard that in Church. In addition due to my current financial situation I not able to afford to continue to give 10% of my income to the church.

Does any Christians experience no improvements in their debt levels even if they tithe?

If you truly are a Christian (one who belongs to Christ), everything you possess belongs to Christ; you are merely the steward.

You say you faithfully gave 10% of your income to your church. What did they do with the money? Are they investing in heavenly treasures, or does the money get wasted by the administration? A good steward spends his Lord's money wisely.

If you were going into debt to tithe, you were not spending your Lord's money wisely. Debtors charge interest on money owed, leaving less money for you to invest in heavenly treasures.

Go to the elders of your church and tell them your job/financial situation. Ask them to pray for you, so that the Lord may give you the wisdom and the means to repay your debtors.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+25:14-30&version=NIV

 

[parsley]

everything you possess belongs to Christ; you are merely the steward.

When we give, we acknowledge that everything came from God in the first place. Not just the earth we live on, but the way He helps us daily. The water and sun He created to nourish the fields. It is like asking a blessing on our food, which we shopped for and prepared-- but the way the nutrients benefit our bodies was designed by Him.

The earth is His, and what we use while we live on it, is a loan. Or a gift to us from Him. So giving back to Him is a gesture of remembering that it came from Him in the first place. We are stewards in the vineyard.

If that is a struggle to admit, then we have to check our own faith.
We will resist and say, "I worked hard for this!" Or "I am not sure we will get through retirement." But if we remind ourselves that God promised to give us our daily bread, and thank Him for what He has already given, then we do not let fear control us.

Money is just legal tender. It comes, it goes. It can improve quality of life -- but other things can too.

 

[Johnnz]

Tithing was only commanded under the Mosaic covenant, which has come to an end. And the blessings of tithing were promised only as part of a much wider law keeping context where social justice was a major consideration.

There is much erroneous teaching about tithing, usually from its principal beneficiaries.

John
NZ

 

[BornAgainBrian]

Tithing was only commanded under the Mosaic covenant, which has come to an end. And the blessings of tithing were promised only as part of a much wider law keeping context where social justice was a major consideration.

There is much erroneous teaching about tithing, usually from its principal beneficiaries.

John
NZ

This is 100% true.

But I think that 10% is a decent guideline for giving, at least for me. I cringe when I hear preachers make people believe it's some kind of command though.

 

[Mister_Al]

Tithing was only commanded under the Mosaic covenant, which has come to an end. And the blessings of tithing were promised only as part of a much wider law keeping context where social justice was a major consideration.

There is much erroneous teaching about tithing, usually from its principal beneficiaries.

John
NZ

And the only ones that were under the Mosaic covenant were the Jewish people. The gentiles never were under the Law and were never expected to tithe. So, how can anybody try and hold us to a covenant we were never a part of?

Also, because you were never under the command to tithe, God isn't obligated by any covenant promise to bless you if you do.

Ephesians 2:11-12 (Amplified)

11 Therefore, remember that at one time you were Gentiles (heathens) in the flesh, called Uncircumcision by those who called themselves Circumcision, [itself a mere mark] in the flesh made by human hands.
12 [Remember] that you were at that time separated (living apart) from Christ [excluded from all part in Him], utterly estranged and outlawed from the rights of Israel as a nation, and strangers with no share in the sacred compacts of the [Messianic] promise [with no knowledge of or right in God's agreements, His covenants]. And you had no hope (no promise); you were in the world without God.

Blessings,

Alan

 

[AvilaSurfer]

Tithing = Old Testament. OK. New Testament = Jesus said "Sell it all and follow me." I'd rather tithe.

 

[BornAgainBrian]

It's interesting to note that money (or caught fish for that matter) wasn't included in the tithing Law. They were very specific rules on what exactly got tithed.

Lev 27:32 says that "every tenth" animal that passes under the herder's staff shall be holy to the Lord, and not "a tenth". To me, this clearly teaches that it wasn't the first tenth, as preachers say today for money, but the tenth tenth. In other words, if you only have nine cows, you keep them. If you have nineteen, you give one.

 

[Mister_Al]

Tithing = Old Testament. OK. New Testament = Jesus said "Sell it all and follow me." I'd rather tithe.

The young ruler that Jesus told that to was also under the Law at the time.

Blessings,

Alan

 

[Gottservant]

Tithing teaches you to value your money, so that when it is time to pay your debts you are as prepared as possible to pay it.

You may need to be more intentional in your attempts to make friends with your money, as Jesus said.

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

you have to look at what Jesus said next:

Mar 10:17-31 KJV
(17) And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life?
(18) And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
(19) Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
(20) And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
(21) Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
(22) And he was sad at that saying, and went away grieved: for he had great possessions.
(23) And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
(24) And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
(25) It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
(26) And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
(27) And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
(28) Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
(29) And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
(30) But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
(31) But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

Jesus wasn't telling the man that He wanted Him to be penniless - He was telling the man how to increase a hundredfold...

 

[charles at doctrineprimer]

I have been an eager at tithing for at least 2 years at a Church I go to. I give at least 10% of the income I earn to the church. Yet for most of that time my financial situation has not improved and been constantly in debt. I currently getting deeper in debt as I just lost my job. Where is God? God says he will bless each giver and I heard that in Church. In addition due to my current financial situation I not able to afford to continue to give 10% of my income to the church.

Does any Christians experience no improvements in their debt levels even if they tithe?

In every aspect of giving that we see in the New Testament, it was always in regards to meeting someone's specific need. However today, churches teach that 10% should come to them because that is what is required by the individual to give back to God. I understand the church has needs that need to be met, but the church has no business telling its people that they are obligated to give a certain amount to them; that simply is unbiblical. If the church has needs then let them ask for the financial help that they need to fill those needs and then trust the Lord that the funds come in.
One point though, what is the church? Is not the church nothing more than the people who make it up? Are you not a part of the church? Let the church know of your needs and see if they will help you, if not, don't give another dime of your money again to that church body.

 

[aiki]

Matthew 5:42
42 Give to him who asks you, and from him who wants to borrow from you do not turn away.

Luke 6:38
38 Give, and it will be given to you: good measure, pressed down, shaken together, and running over will be put into your bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you."

Acts 20:35
35 I have shown you in every way, by laboring like this, that you must support the weak. And remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He said, 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.' "

Proverbs 19:17
17 He who has pity on the poor lends to the Lord, And He will pay back what he has given.

2 Corinthians 9:6-7
6 But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully.
7 So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

Ephesians 4:28 (NKJV)
28 Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need.

It is...disturbing how many posts in this thread take pains to remind us that tithing is not commanded of NT believers. The purpose seems to be to alleviate the believer of any pressure of conscience about their giving of their resources to others. But whether a person gives 10% to the church or a dollar to the homeless guy on the street, it is all supposed to be given "as unto the Lord." (Matt. 25:40) And when believers give this way, it is both the promise of Scripture and the testimony of my own experience that God is never my debtor. I have experienced the truth of Luke 6:38 and Proverbs 19:17. God has rewarded my giving. And if it is wrong to anticipate that He will, why does He give us such explicit promises in His Word to "pay back what was given"?

Giving of my resources reminds me that my resources are not my own, but God's. And when I give out of diminished resources, I put myself in a place where I can more clearly see and more keenly appreciate the fulfillment of God's promise to repay my generosity in the same measure in which I extended it.

Also, I don't see in Scripture that generosity is an option. The verses above clearly institute generosity as an expected norm of the Christian life. And being poor myself does not exempt me from giving. I see that no where encouraged in Scripture, but I do see instances in Scripture of God's children giving from their poverty. (Mk. 12: 41-44; 2Cor. 8:1-4) And this they do in imitation of their Saviour:

2 Corinthians 8:9
9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.

Selah.

 

[charles at doctrineprimer]

Matthew 5:42
42 Give to him who asks you, and from him who wants to borrow from you do not turn away.

Luke 6:38
38 Give, and it will be given to you: good measure, pressed down, shaken together, and running over will be put into your bosom. For with the same measure that you use, it will be measured back to you."

Acts 20:35
35 I have shown you in every way, by laboring like this, that you must support the weak. And remember the words of the Lord Jesus, that He said, 'It is more blessed to give than to receive.' "

Proverbs 19:17
17 He who has pity on the poor lends to the Lord, And He will pay back what he has given.

2 Corinthians 9:6-7
6 But this I say: He who sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and he who sows bountifully will also reap bountifully.
7 So let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.

Ephesians 4:28 (NKJV)
28 Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need.

It is...disturbing how many posts in this thread take pains to remind us that tithing is not commanded of NT believers. The purpose seems to be to alleviate the believer of any pressure of conscience about their giving of their resources to others. But whether a person gives 10% to the church or a dollar to the homeless guy on the street, it is all supposed to be given "as unto the Lord." (Matt. 25:40) And when believers give this way, it is both the promise of Scripture and the testimony of my own experience that God is never my debtor. I have experienced the truth of Luke 6:38 and Proverbs 19:17. God has rewarded my giving. And if it is wrong to anticipate that He will, why does He give us such explicit promises in His Word to "pay back what was given"?

Giving of my resources reminds me that my resources are not my own, but God's. And when I give out of diminished resources, I put myself in a place where I can more clearly see and more keenly appreciate the fulfillment of God's promise to repay my generosity in the same measure in which I extended it.

Also, I don't see in Scripture that generosity is an option. The verses above clearly institute generosity as an expected norm of the Christian life. And being poor myself does not exempt me from giving. I see that no where encouraged in Scripture, but I do see instances in Scripture of God's children giving from their poverty. (Mk. 12: 41-44; 2Cor. 8:1-4) And this they do in imitation of their Saviour:

2 Corinthians 8:9
9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.

Selah.

Excuse me. For you to claim that those who speak against the tithe is giving men an excuse not to give to God is just plain rubbish, and it is those kind of accusations that preachers have used for so long in order to swindle 10% of their congregants income for their personal ministry.

The Word of God is very clear that the Christian is to give and there is no refuting that and those who believe otherwise are dead wrong. What the Bible does not teach, is that Christians are to give at least 10% of their personal wages to the church (aka Storehouse Tithing). Storehouse tithing is a doctrine of man straight from the pit of hell and Satan himself. It is not a practice taught or encouraged by the Apostles and if you want us to believe that tithing is a part of the Christian walk then you need to provide your Scripture from the Word of God to prove your position.

All of the Scripture in the New Testament that dealt with giving, did so with the intent on encouraging believers to give to others to meet specific and legitimate needs. Not the needs of the lazy or the needs of a widow that had children who could support her, but legitimate needs, such as those in Jerusalem who were suffering persecution.

The Bible says that we are to bear one another's burdens and when we do, it fulfills the Law of Christ. The Apostles did not teach that we are to pay 10% to our pastoral staff in order to fulfill the Law of Christ, although your pastor is probably teaching that lie.

Telling believers today that they are bound to the law of the tithe is a doctrine of devils and unless you have Scripture to show otherwise, then you are a liar.

The Bible says in Acts 17:11, "These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so."

Sir, I have searched the Scriptures and there is no place in the Scriptures where Christians are commanded to give their first 10% (tithe) to anyone. Tons of Scripture to support Christian giving to meet the needs of the brethren, but absolutely none to support writing a blank check to my church to use in any manner they see fit. If my church has a specific and legitimate need then they can petition the believers for the amount that they need, but to boldly come out and say that Christians are to give 10% of their income to them automatically is a bold face lie from hell.

So again, please provide Scriptural proof that Christians are to tithe otherwise get on your knees and confess your sin to God and ask Him forgiveness and then do the same here for ours.

 

[aiki]

Excuse me. For you to claim that those who speak against the tithe is giving men an excuse not to give to God is just plain rubbish, and it is those kind of accusations that preachers have used for so long in order to swindle 10% of their congregants income for their personal ministry.

Well, you're entitled to your opinion. I get the distinct sense that some people (not all) in this thread want to justify a lack of generosity by claiming liberty from the law. Your excessively aggressive response to my post suggests maybe I've hit a nerve.

The Word of God is very clear that the Christian is to give and there is no refuting that and those who believe otherwise are dead wrong.

Yes, I know.

What the Bible does not teach, is that Christians are to give at least 10% of their personal wages to the church (aka Storehouse Tithing). Storehouse tithing is a doctrine of man straight from the pit of hell and Satan himself.

I don't think I stated anywhere in my last post that one must give a 10% tithe. And the "pit of hell and Satan himself" stuff is just silly.

It is not a practice taught or encouraged by the Apostles and if you want us to believe that tithing is a part of the Christian walk then you need to provide your Scripture from the Word of God to prove your position.

See, you're so busy freaking out about a perceived slight against your beliefs you haven't taken time to actually read what I wrote. Take a deep breath, calm yourself, and read again what I wrote.

The Bible says that we are to bear one another's burdens and when we do, it fulfills the Law of Christ. The Apostles did not teach that we are to pay 10% to our pastoral staff in order to fulfill the Law of Christ, although your pastor is probably teaching that lie.

No, in fact, he is not.

Telling believers today that they are bound to the law of the tithe is a doctrine of devils and unless you have Scripture to show otherwise, then you are a liar.

Now, look, state your perspective, but this ad hominem business you can leave in that sour part of yourself that spawned it. Sheesh.

Sir, I have searched the Scriptures and there is no place in the Scriptures where Christians are commanded to give their first 10% (tithe) to anyone. Tons of Scripture to support Christian giving to meet the needs of the brethren, but absolutely none to support writing a blank check to my church to use in any manner they see fit. If my church has a specific and legitimate need then they can petition the believers for the amount that they need, but to boldly come out and say that Christians are to give 10% of their income to them automatically is a bold face lie from hell.

Yes, yes, lie, pit of hell, Satan - you seem rather too pent-up about this issue. Why is that, I wonder...?

So again, please provide Scriptural proof that Christians are to tithe otherwise get on your knees and confess your sin to God and ask Him forgiveness and then do the same here for ours.

LOL! Are you a troll? You sure sound like one! Before I beg your mercy and forgiveness please show me from my last post anywhere where I say that one must tithe 10% of their income to the church. Go ahead. Show me.

Selah.

 

[charles at doctrineprimer]

Well, you're entitled to your opinion. I get the distinct sense that some people (not all) in this thread want to justify a lack of generosity by claiming liberty from the law. Your excessively aggressive response to my post suggests maybe I've hit a nerve.

Yes, I know.

I don't think I stated anywhere in my last post that one must give a 10% tithe. And the "pit of hell and Satan himself" stuff is just silly.

See, you're so busy freaking out about a perceived slight against your beliefs you haven't taken time to actually read what I wrote. Take a deep breath, calm yourself, and read again what I wrote.

No, in fact, he is not.

Now, look, state your perspective, but this ad hominem business you can leave in that sour part of yourself that spawned it. Sheesh.

Yes, yes, lie, pit of hell, Satan - you seem rather too pent-up about this issue. Why is that, I wonder...?

LOL! Are you a troll? You sure sound like one! Before I beg your mercy and forgiveness please show me from my last post anywhere where I say that one must tithe 10% of their income to the church. Go ahead. Show me.

Selah.

Troll huh, What that is in reference to, I have no idea. The problem I had with your reply was over your accusation of those who oppose the tithe and being individuals not wanting to give to God and that is exactly the same garbage that spews from many so-called pastors mouths who are asked to defend their position on the tithe.

My beliefs have nothing to do with my position. The Word of God is clear about giving and tithing is not a part of it for the believer. There is no passage in Scripture supporting the tithe for Christians and no pastor or any other man promoting it has ever brought up a passage in the New Testament that calls for the Christian to tithe.

Am I passionate about this, yes I am. Why am I, because I grew up under this law and I had pastors in the Baptist Church suggest to my mother to leave my father over his so-called unfaithfulness to the practice. So, am I wrong in calling it a lie from Satan? Absolutely not. It is a law not preached by the Apostles and it is an attempt by cunning men of Satan to destroy the church.

 

[aiki]

Troll huh, What that is in reference to, I have no idea.

A troll posts comments that are intended to be inflammatory and offensive. They just want to excite a reaction from others - the angrier, the better.

The problem I had with your reply was over your accusation of those who oppose the tithe and being individuals not wanting to give to God and that is exactly the same garbage that spews from many so-called pastors mouths who are asked to defend their position on the tithe.

You didn't, I see, find a single statement in my post where I say that people ought to pay a tithe. I indicated that some of those who were opposing tithing seemed, in doing so, to be justifying being ungenerous. I was not critical of opposing tithing, however, but of discouraging generosity. You seem to have a bit of a hair-trigger when it comes to the idea of tithing. It appears to have gone off here - though not exactly accidently.

My beliefs have nothing to do with my position.

Really? Do you not believe the things that constitute your position? If not, why, then, is it your position?

The Word of God is clear about giving and tithing is not a part of it for the believer.

Which is something you believe, right? If you didn't believe it, you wouldn't offer it as a fact, would you?

There is no passage in Scripture supporting the tithe for Christians and no pastor or any other man promoting it has ever brought up a passage in the New Testament that calls for the Christian to tithe.

Scripture includes the Old Testament, which does speak of tithing. The letter of the law concerning tithing is set aside in the New Testament, but the spirit of it has not.

Am I passionate about this, yes I am. Why am I, because I grew up under this law and I had pastors in the Baptist Church suggest to my mother to leave my father over his so-called unfaithfulness to the practice. So, am I wrong in calling it a lie from Satan? Absolutely not.

The pastors of this church were not representing the Word of God faithfully and in so doing were not of God. But was their teaching from Satan? Maybe. Maybe not. The only thing you know for sure is that they ought not to have said what they did to your mother. The pastors could have been merely avaricious, looking out for their own interests. This sort of selfishness is common to all of us, though, and is not necessarily of the devil. He may provoke our selfishness, but our selfishness is quite our own.

It is a law not preached by the Apostles and it is an attempt by cunning men of Satan to destroy the church.

See above.

I notice that the making of an apology, which you so vehemently demanded of me, you are careful now to avoid though it is clear that you misread my post and badly over-reacted. Interesting, that.

Selah.

 

[charles at doctrineprimer]

A troll posts comments that are intended to be inflammatory and offensive. They just want to excite a reaction from others - the angrier, the better.

You didn't, I see, find a single statement in my post where I say that people ought to pay a tithe. I indicated that some of those who were opposing tithing seemed, in doing so, to be justifying being ungenerous. I was not critical of opposing tithing, however, but of discouraging generosity. You seem to have a bit of a hair-trigger when it comes to the idea of tithing. It appears to have gone off here - though not exactly accidently.

Really? Do you not believe the things that constitute your position? If not, why, then, is it your position?

Which is something you believe, right? If you didn't believe it, you wouldn't offer it as a fact, would you?

Scripture includes the Old Testament, which does speak of tithing. The letter of the law concerning tithing is set aside in the New Testament, but the spirit of it has not.

The pastors of this church were not representing the Word of God faithfully and in so doing were not of God. But was their teaching from Satan? Maybe. Maybe not. The only thing you know for sure is that they ought not to have said what they did to your mother. The pastors could have been merely avaricious, looking out for their own interests. This sort of selfishness is common to all of us, though, and is not necessarily of the devil. He may provoke our selfishness, but our selfishness is quite our own.

See above.

I notice that the making of an apology, which you so vehemently demanded of me, you are careful now to avoid though it is clear that you misread my post and badly over-reacted. Interesting, that.

Selah.

I am sorry, I did not notice an apology with the remark of being some kind of a troll.