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Many eminent theologians from different denominations have all come down on the side of the belief in the Trinity. Throughout history this has been a massive belief of the Christian populous. You are just one individual who has come up with his own ideas, who also states that he is a Christian but fails to believe in the Trinity!
You have twisted scripture to fit in with your narrow view of Christianity! You have twisted Holy Scripture to how 'you' 'think' it should read! You have done exactly as Jesus said people would do! Can you not see that?
I cannot understand how you come to the views you do on the 'evidence' you claim to put forward? It just does not add up buddy.
You really need to seek spiritual advice and help as it seems to me that you could be being manipulated by evil forces intent on destroying the true meaning of scriptural texts!
Well then if I am the only person left on the earth, then so be it. I prefer to be the only one that believes the truth than the majority that believes lies.
Thats the "everyone else is out of step" argument.Waw, that is quite a statement buddy. Looks like you are the new Prophet of our times then! To think, all those hundreds of people throughout history have been so wrong on the Trinity!! Waw!!
Well then if I am the only person left on the earth, then so be it. I prefer to be the only one that believes the truth than the majority that believes lies.
Thats the "everyone else is out of step" argument.
HOLD THE PRESSES!!!Must be. To think, cgaviria is the only man 'in the know'. Do you think the Vatican knows this? History will have to be rewritten!
Since when what the majority believe what is true? Is the way to life not a narrow gate...
And is the entire world not intoxicated with the wine of false doctrines of the great prostitute of Babylon?
So to suggest that a doctrine is true by the basis of popular belief is already an erroneous argument.
Yes I'm sure you do, but I asked if you could stop quoting yourself and provide some theological teachers and church leaders who believe this doctrine to be false; it seems you can't do that.AI cover both these angles in my study. http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2016/01/08/why-the-trinity-is-a-false-doctrine/ .
but this is not a matter I am going to endlessly argue.
Once you accept the truth, hit me up, and we can progress to discuss other matters,
and this isn't even the only matter most of you people are in error in.
Well then if I am the only person left on the earth, then so be it. I prefer to be the only one that believes the truth than the majority that believes lies.
Well then if I am the only person left on the earth, then so be it. I prefer to be the only one that believes the truth than the majority that believes lies.
I cannot understand why you think the Trinity is false when all Christian faiths believe this? Does it mean that one should have a different 'belief' system other than the 'normal' Christian one? Do you think that one has to believe in the Trinity to be a Christian cgaviria?
I see you label yourself as Christian but surely that is wrong if you dont believe in the Trinity?
Nicene Christians may not accuse non-Nicene, unorthodox Christian members of not being Christians. This is a place for Nicene Christians to explain why they hold controversial unorthodox theologies to be in error, and for non-Nicene Christians to defend and explain their unorthodox Christian beliefs. Discussion and debate which points out why controversial Christian theological beliefs are in error in the context of an explanatory post in a civil, but potentially forthright way, is not considered a violation of the no flaming or goading rule.
Jesus was not a Trinitarian. In the book of John, Jesus calls himself "the son of man" many times. He also calls himself a man. "As it is, you want to kill me, a man who has told you the truth as I have heard if from God." John 8:40
He does not claim to be God whom he calls "the one who alone is God," in John 5:44. "How can you believe when you accept glory from one another and do not seek the glory that comes from the one who alone is God?" If God is "the only true God," as Jesus prayed, then Jesus cannot be that only true God or 'true God of true God,' as the creed formulated in the 4th century CE puts it.
But he said that he was one with the Father, John 10:30, and said that if anyone had seen him, they had seen the Father, John 14:9-10. He also said that after he had left them he would send the Holy Spirit to them. He said, "all that belongs to the Father is mine ........ the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you", John 16:15.Jesus was not a Trinitarian.
He also said that no one has ever been to heaven except the one who came from it - the Son of Man, John 3:13, and said that God the Father had given the Son of Man authority to judge, John 5:27.In the book of John, Jesus calls himself "the son of man" many times.
Well he did actually; when he forgave sins, Mark 2:7, when he used the name of God - I am, revealed to Moses, Exodus 3:14, and claimed to be equal with God. The Jews believed he was claiming to be God, that's why they picked up stones to kill him, John 5:18, 8:59.He does not claim to be God
He does not claim to be God whom he calls "the one who alone is God," in John 5:44. "How can you believe when you accept glory from one another and do not seek the glory that comes from the one who alone is God?" If God is "the only true God," as Jesus prayed, then Jesus cannot be that only true God or 'true God of true God,' as the creed formulated in the 4th century CE puts it.
The teaching of the trinity skews the understanding of certain basic truths, and they are the following,
Jesus Christ, birthed in the beginning of creation, which is why he is called a "son", by the Father, whose identity is I AM, as the Father does not have a name, as he is not created as we are to have name, and was said to be "engendered" today, which was day one of creation. A son does not precede a father nor does a son come at the same time as a father, but a father comes first, then a son, and since the father never began, therefore the son did indeed begin, as that is the next natural order of precedence. Jesus Christ is also said to be "only son", and this is because he was the only being created directly by the Father, and then all life came into existence through Jesus.
Before Jesus Christ began speaking things into existence, the Father created first, which included preparing the heavens, founding the earth which had water, and bringing forth the spirit of God that bore upon the water. When these things came into existence, day one had begun, and in that same day, Jesus Christ then uttered his first words, "let there be light".
Jesus Christ was the spirit of God that bore upon the water, and this is the evidence of his pre-existence in the Genesis account, and the identity of this spirit was a mystery until his name was revealed thousands of years later, as Jesus, which is when he became incarnate of a virgin. This spirit of God, is also the one who started speaking, hence why Jesus Christ is also called the word of God, because he spoke things into existence, which included all life.
On day four of creation, when Jesus Christ spoke the luminaries of the heavens into existence, is the first day other living beings came forth into existence, which were angels. Of these angels, the angel YHWH became revealed, which was the name revealed to Moses when the angel YHWH gave his own name to Moses in a burning bush, and this was name that the Hebrews used to seek God in the old covenant until much later we were given a new name, for a new covenant, which is the name of Jesus Christ, which is even higher than the name of YHWH, and by whom only in the name of Jesus can a man now be saved. This angel named YHWH was the being Jesus Christ then spoke to on day six of creation, which is why Jesus said, "Let us...", as he was not speaking to the Father, as the Father already gave Jesus words to speak, but instead, it was Jesus speaking to this angel. This angel, was indeed a holy spirit, that then breathed into man the breath of life, as commanded, and thus demonstrated that life not only came by the utterances of Jesus Christ, but also by holy spirit giving forth breath to bring forth life. And this same type of life giving holy spirit, is the same kind of spirit that is said to raise Jesus Christ from the dead, and also all who are believers and sons of the resurrection as well, as it is holy spirit inside each that brings forth life.
There is not just one holy spirit, but many. Each believer receives a distinct holy spirit, which is indeed an angel given to each believer to inhabit the body of each believer, that is sent from heaven to guide, teach, reveal things of the future, give power, sanctify, and perfect.
For a deeper study on these topics, I recommend reading the following studies,
http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2016/01/08/why-the-trinity-is-a-false-doctrine/
http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2015/12/1...-also-began-only-the-father-has-no-beginning/
http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2015/12/2...ng-that-lives-in-us-that-is-sent-from-heaven/
http://www.wisdomofgod.co/2016/01/15/the-power-of-the-spirit-and-being-baptized-in-holy-spirit/
But he said that he was one with the Father, John 10:30, and said that if anyone had seen him, they had seen the Father, John 14:9-10. He also said that after he had left them he would send the Holy Spirit to them. He said, "all that belongs to the Father is mine ........ the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you", John 16:15.
He also said that no one has ever been to heaven except the one who came from it - the Son of Man, John 3:13, and said that God the Father had given the Son of Man authority to judge, John 5:27.
Son of man is a title used in Daniel 13:7. I am pretty sure the Jews would have recognised this when they heard it, and known the passage and the context in which it was used. I think it might have been another title for their Messiah.
Well he did actually; when he forgave sins, Mark 2:7, when he used the name of God - I am, revealed to Moses, Exodus 3:14, and claimed to be equal with God. The Jews believed he was claiming to be God, that's why they picked up stones to kill him, John 5:18, 8:59.
Yes he can, because the Father and the Son both God but they are not separate, independent Gods; they are ONE. So Jesus is truly and fully God, and he came from the Father, who is also truly and fully God.
True God - Jesus, because he was truly divine - from true God; the Father. Jesus, God, was sent from the Father, who is truly divine; truly God.
This is such a tired and worn out argument....There are many words not found in the bible but that does not mean they are not true or do not exist. You need to do a whole lot better than that.....the words "trinity" and "triune" even do not exist in the Bible,
Then who is Jesus if he is not God?....or maybe what is he if not God?"The Father is greater than I"
"I can do nothing by myself."
Jesus was dependent on the One God.
Then who is Jesus if he is not God?....or maybe what is he if not God?
This is such a tired and worn out argument....There are many words not found in the bible but that does not mean they are not true or do not exist. You need to do a whole lot better than that.....
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