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This canard is tried over and over again by those promoting gay causes to scare away and silence anyone trying to protect fellow Christians from the GLBT culture and community. It's interesting that the technique is tried seeing that reinforces the repugnance aspect of homosexuality.
Of course this nonsense means that Jesus secretly wanted to be a sinner. Also, anyone wanting a crime free neighborhood also secrectly desires to be the local burglar.
Well I recall hearing something about this "hate the sin, not the sinner" idea. It sounds rather intriguing.
You make the idea of a gay agenda sound very bad. Like a conspiracy theory. But really all movements have "agendas" don't they? The Christian agenda? The liberal agenda? Etc etc.
Gays want their unions to be state recognized. And they would like it if they could maybe discriminated against less? It's all legal, not really much to with religion in general, although I'm sure there are many who would like gays and Christian movements to one day get along.
This is "ethics and morality" by the way. Although it is on Christian Forums, the name of the subsection we are in is not "Christian ethics ans morality as dictated by the bible" so I guess really your scripture, while logical from a religious perspective, is not really going to do a lot of good in convincing people.
I should again note that I am pro-crazy-sex first, and pro-gayness second. At the moment. This is really all just a set of beliefs I am making up to contrast your posts. Although that does not mean that it's all been false. Just pieces of it maybe.
Well yes I guess homophobia is a new word, or at least it is a word with a new connotation. I mean, I thought that thing happened all the time in language.
On your Jesus must have wanted to be a sinner point, again, of course, we are generalizing. I made that clear, I hope, in my previous post. There is a correlation. I hardly mean to imply that everyone against something secretly longs to do that thing. My apologies if it came out wrong.
I am going to be honest here though Poly. I completely fail to see any reason for your presence here beyond giving gays and gay sympathizers someone to rally against. The only way I can make sense of you is unbelievable naivety, or a strawman come to life.
What ever happened to that tenth commandment?Jealosy is not a sin
Agreed.
And one might take it even further to have them say:
"I'm scared of God because I read the bible literally, so even though I know deep down that I am gay, I must repress that so God won't smite me. And since I'm not being true to myself, none of y'all get to be true to yourselves either."
I'll own up. I spent the majority of my life acting exactly this way. Of course I didn't really feel at the time that that's what I was doing but, y'know, repressing and all thatThe day that I finally stopped pretending to myself that I was something I knew I wasn't and said out loud to another person "I'm gay" was one of the most liberating and wonderful days of my life. So too will it be for those stuck in the same pit, many of whom I'm certain haunt these threads
edit: For the record though, I was never anywhere near as virulently opposed as we find in these forums.
So very true.The irony is that there would probably be far less of an "LGBTQ lifestyle" or "culture" or "agenda" if LGBTQ people weren't demonised in the first place.
I don't understand.
A bunch of men are about to stone a woman to death, victimizing the woman while trying to entrap Jesus.
Jesus tells the man who is without sin to cast the first stone. None can.
Then, Jesus, who is without sin, does not cast any stones, but forgives, and then tells her that she is free, and not to sin no more.
And all that you got out of that was that he told her not to do it again?
You missed the grace? You missed the forgiveness? You missed how Jesus put the men who were trying to entrap him, the son of God, in their place by humbling him?
All you take away is, "He also said, "Go and sin no more"?
You think that was the point of the story?????
Polycarp_fan is right, you know.
The irony is that there would probably be far less of an "LGBTQ lifestyle" or "culture" or "agenda" if LGBTQ people weren't demonised in the first place.
What I find fascinating is that these debates always focus purely on the buttsecks. There is rarely any talk of love, long term relationships or even lesbians.
It's always about the buttsecks.
Though I find some Christians obsession with sex in general unhealthy, this focus in the gay debate seems very telling.
Apparently finding something "icky" is grounds for moral denunciation.
I recall that about 5 years ago, I accepted without question that homosexuality was absolutely sinful, unnatural and wrong. I remember telling someone with complete sincerity that homosexuality was a choice in the vast majority of cases.
The problem was that I never took the time to think about the person who is homosexual.
I have slowly started to think about those who are homosexuals, and I have to say that my attitudes are certainly starting to change.
Today I do believe that there are people who for whatever reason do make the choice to engage in a homosexual lifestyle. That aside, I am certain that absolute vast majority of people who engage in a homosexual lifestyle, were in fact born that way.
I recently watched an episode of ' Intervention' where a woman who is a lesbian was also a drug addict. Her entire family was telling her that her ' lifestyle' was unacceptable, sinful and wrong in the eyes of God. What her family called a lifestyle, was in fact who she was, a person who always knew they were a lesbian. You could see the terrible pain that woman's eyes that her family didn't accept her and they believed that God didn't accept her....yet, she also knew she was physically attracted to women. Clearly, a light bulb went off in my head and I started to think things through.
I know personally a female who is married to a female....one of the partners used to be married to a man and had children. These two women by all accounts, are in a committed relationship and are legally married( Canada). I also know a female who is married to another woman and they have an adopted 4 year old...they have willingly adopted an abandoned baby from ( most likely) a heterosexual.
Coincidentally, I also work with quite a few lesbians ( I work in a large place) and they all seem pretty normal....some of them are " tougher" than most women....but they all seem like normal people....just that they are attracted to the same sex.
Lastly, I used to think that homosexuality was unnatural, but then I found out that there are quite a few homosexual animals in the animal kingdom that engage in this behaviour...( just visit National Geographic...and no it's not a Gay conspiracy!)
Do I work with Gay men? Probably, but if I do, they are still in the closet. It seems more socially acceptable for a woman to come out of the closet than a man...but that's just my observation.
So, all of this to say....it is not as clear cut as one may believe.
Did I mention that the father in the Intervention episode, he left his wife in an affair, although he was disgusted by his daughter's sin....he seemed Ok with his sin...
Why do you notice the splinter in your brother's eye, but do not perceive the wooden beam in your own eye?
This is what I am starting to try and do....but I admit, it is very hard....old prejudices are hard to shake off.
What I find fascinating is that these debates always focus purely on the buttsecks. There is rarely any talk of love, long term relationships or even lesbians.
It's always about the buttsecks.
Though I find some Christians obsession with sex in general unhealthy, this focus in the gay debate seems very telling.
Apparently finding something "icky" is grounds for moral denunciation.
Again, with equating homosexuals with pedophiles. Why does this even happen anymore? With all the proof there is out there that states unequivocally that most pedophiles are actually heterosexual, if they have an orientation towards adults at all.Let's substitute the word "adulterer" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "fornicator" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "pedofile"everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Sin is not sin because of how one "feels" concerning such and such. Sin is sin because that is what GOD labelled it. Yes, it is not right to point out the issues of others when one has a load of their own; however, once that beam is removed from one's own eye, one can clearly see that sin is not about "feelings" nor "excuses."
Let's substitute the word "adulterer" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "fornicator" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "pedofile"everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Sin is not sin because of how one "feels" concerning such and such. Sin is sin because that is what GOD labelled it. Yes, it is not right to point out the issues of others when one has a load of their own; however, once that beam is removed from one's own eye, one can clearly see that sin is not about "feelings" nor "excuses."
Well yes, most people understand that. But the anti-gay crowd only focus on the man-man sex issue (or at least rarely on anything else). That was my point. They betray themselves so frequently on this topic. Their unfounded and immoral proclamations rest solely on the fact that they find man-man sex "icky". It's playground stuff."homosexuality" is a generic term that includes "lesbians." Morality is what GOD says it is and not what society determinds it it be.
'Obsession' in quote marks because I don't want to cause offence.
Sorry to start yet another homosexuality thread on this board! I'm genuinely looking for an explanation here, not just trying to anger the "phobes" as they are so lovingly called.
Basically, I just can't see the Biblical support for protesting against/trying to combat homosexuality moreso than other sins. What makes it so much worse than jealousy, idolatry, or all of the other unholy things that many of us engage ourselves in?
As far as the tale of Sodom and Gomorrah is concerned, I don't personally interpret and believe that the cities were punished for homosexuality, but I'll accept that it could be used to answer my question, as it could be seen to highlight the severity of homosexuality (if interpreted that way) in comparison to other sins.
But really. Help me out here.
Let's substitute the word "adulterer" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "fornicator" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "pedofile"everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Sin is not sin because of how one "feels" concerning such and such. Sin is sin because that is what GOD labelled it. Yes, it is not right to point out the issues of others when one has a load of their own; however, once that beam is removed from one's own eye, one can clearly see that sin is not about "feelings" nor "excuses."
Let's substitute the word "adulterer" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "fornicator" everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Let's substitute the word "pedofile"everywhere you typed "homosexual."
Sin is not sin because of how one "feels" concerning such and such. Sin is sin because that is what GOD labelled it. Yes, it is not right to point out the issues of others when one has a load of their own; however, once that beam is removed from one's own eye, one can clearly see that sin is not about "feelings" nor "excuses."
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